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#827 Mar 17 2016 at 10:30 AM Rating: Good
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Maybe if he manages to stay even with every other primary for the next two months.
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#828 Mar 17 2016 at 10:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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So the plan is to keep losing or barely breaking even in meaningful primaries until June and then assume that Sanders wins the state by 20 points?

So, uh, good luck with that.

Edit: I'm looking at the remaining blue states and trying to figure out where Sanders is going to close this gap. New York? New Jersey? Pennsylvania? Wisconsin? Washington? Maryland? Sanders isn't going to blow out any of those. Clinton has a very real chance to get some big grabs from them (polling +26 in New York based on 3/11 poll). If anything, Sanders might have a better chance in red "labor" states like Kentucky and West Virginia though those aren't going to be delegate rich even if he managed to score big victories there (and I'm skeptical that would be the case but it's a better argument than New York or Pennsylvania).

Sure, Sanders might do well in the remaining small New England states but no one cares if he sweeps Delaware or Connecticut. Where else?

Edited, Mar 17th 2016 11:50am by Jophiel
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#829 Mar 17 2016 at 11:07 AM Rating: Decent
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Canada. We'd eat that old man like groceries.
#830 Mar 17 2016 at 11:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yodabunny wrote:
Canada. We'd eat that old man like groceries.
All our sane and reasonable candidates seem to poll so well up north. Then again, I wouldn't want to live next to a nutjob either.
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#831 Mar 17 2016 at 11:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hey, if we can give non-EC territories like Guam and the NMI delegates, why not Canada?
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#832 Mar 17 2016 at 11:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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someproteinguy wrote:
Then again, I wouldn't want to live next to a nutjob either.

Which explains why they sent Cruz out of Canada and down to Texas, as far from Canada as they could get him before starting a war with Mexico.
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#833 Mar 17 2016 at 11:25 AM Rating: Good
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We got Texas after a war with Mexico, so I'm sure we're not in the market to lose that badly again.
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#834 Mar 17 2016 at 11:44 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm sure Chihuahua can't have anywhere near the same number of problems as Texas, right?

Smiley: um
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#835 Mar 17 2016 at 1:04 PM Rating: Good
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someproteinguy wrote:
I'm sure Chihuahua can't have anywhere near the same number of problems as Texas, right?

Smiley: um
Just the one big one. Juarez.
#836 Mar 17 2016 at 2:08 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
So the plan is to keep losing or barely breaking even in meaningful primaries until June and then assume that Sanders wins the state by 20 points?

So, uh, good luck with that.

Edit: I'm looking at the remaining blue states and trying to figure out where Sanders is going to close this gap. New York? New Jersey? Pennsylvania? Wisconsin? Washington? Maryland? Sanders isn't going to blow out any of those. Clinton has a very real chance to get some big grabs from them (polling +26 in New York based on 3/11 poll). If anything, Sanders might have a better chance in red "labor" states like Kentucky and West Virginia though those aren't going to be delegate rich even if he managed to score big victories there (and I'm skeptical that would be the case but it's a better argument than New York or Pennsylvania).

Sure, Sanders might do well in the remaining small New England states but no one cares if he sweeps Delaware or Connecticut. Where else?

Edited, Mar 17th 2016 11:50am by Jophiel


This. The only states that he appears to have a double digit lead are the ones with small delegates. Michigan was just as a moral victory to Sen. Sanders as Missouri was to Sec. Clinton. I understand the paid staffers being in denial on TV, but it's time for the voters to accept reality. The gap wasn't this large in 2008.
#837 Mar 17 2016 at 2:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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Worth noting as well that there's no way for Sanders to "stop" Clinton from getting enough delegates without winning them himself. It's a two person race and the first person to get 2,383 of the available 4,765 delegates wins. Unlike the GOP side, there's no brokered conventions or delegate trading at stake here, just one winner and one loser.
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#838 Mar 17 2016 at 2:35 PM Rating: Good
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Yep, mostly from here on out Sanders people will just be sad that there aren't enough Liberals.

2 Authortarian moderates it is, then.
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#839 Mar 17 2016 at 5:12 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't understand how this delegate thing works. You get to vote who the leader of your party is? So you all have to register with a party?
#840 Mar 17 2016 at 5:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Boy, there's no easy way to explain it.

Essentially, there's no such thing as political parties in the Constitution and no rules surrounding them. So each party has sort of come up with its own similar, but different, methods of selecting their candidate for the general election. In general terms, they hold primaries to (in some fashion) select delegates who will go to the nominating convention that summer and vote for the candidate in question. So a citizen's vote for Clinton isn't a direct vote for Clinton but rather a vote to send a certain number of Clinton delegates to the convention.

Once at the convention, the delegates are bound by their party rules to initially vote for the candidate they were elected to represent. Whichever candidate gets a real majority (not a plurality) of the votes is the nominee for that party. If no candidate received 50%+ of the vote, there is a second ballot where -- depending on the rules -- delegates can choose to switch candidates. This is where the whole idea of trading and deal-making comes in. Ideally, you'd want someone to just win outright on the first ballot so there's fewer upset voters down the line but you need to get 50% somehow.

Makes all sorts of sense, right? In a sense, it's not TOO different from the general election where you are technically voting on electoral college members who will, in turn, cast a vote for who actually becomes president.

Edit: I could have peppered that with a dozen more "generally"s and caveats and asterisks but I'm trying to keep it simple.

Edited, Mar 17th 2016 6:29pm by Jophiel
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#841 Mar 17 2016 at 5:54 PM Rating: Good
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Also there are coin tosses.
#842 Mar 17 2016 at 6:32 PM Rating: Decent
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Shall we even delve into caucuses?

Edited, Mar 18th 2016 12:14am by Debalic
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#843 Mar 17 2016 at 6:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Debalic wrote:
Shall we even delve into caususes?

The principle is the same as primary voting even if it's a hundred times more cumbersome and stupider. Show up and get head-counted or write a name on some paper at the appointed time. I think most times state parties have them because they're much cheaper than a state-wide primary election. Iowa has theirs because it allows them to share "first voting state" space with New Hampshire (which has a state constitutional requirement to hold the first primary).

For a more conspiratorial view, caucuses aren't generally under the purview of the state board of elections so you can get more... creative... with things and the state party holding it exerts more control.
Yodabunny wrote:
So you all have to register with a party?

I forgot to answer this. It depends. Some states have closed primaries where you have to be a registered member of the party to vote on their ballot. Other states, mine being one, have open primaries where you show up and ask for a Democratic or Republican ballot and can change your selection each time you vote. You can also ask for a nonpartisan ballot if you only want to vote on referendums or third party ballot if you're just there to waste everyone's time . Caucuses typically (I think always) require you to register with the party.

That's only to vote in the primary. There's no party affiliation required for voting in the general election.

Edited, Mar 17th 2016 7:46pm by Jophiel
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#844 Mar 17 2016 at 7:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
[Caucuses typically (I think always) require you to register with the party.

That's only to vote in the primary. There's no party affiliation required for voting in the general election.
That's how it works in Canada, essentially as well. It's just that no one bothers to register and vote when parties are selecting candidates to run in each riding.
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#845 Mar 17 2016 at 7:26 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Worth noting as well that there's no way for Sanders to "stop" Clinton from getting enough delegates without winning them himself. It's a two person race and the first person to get 2,383 of the available 4,765 delegates wins. Unlike the GOP side, there's no brokered conventions or delegate trading at stake here, just one winner and one loser.


I would start praying for indictment if I was more religious.
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#846 Mar 17 2016 at 7:32 PM Rating: Good
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Sen. Sanders is arguing that one of the reasons why he should stay in is because he is gathering a large number of voters under 30 who represents the future. I find it interesting that a 74 year old candidate for president is arguing that the youth outweighs the elderly.
#847 Mar 17 2016 at 7:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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Eh, I don't really care if he stays in it. He just ain't gonna win. But the race hasn't been particularly contentious (2008 was far worse) and hasn't made the Democratic side looks like a bunch of ass-monkeys unlike some races I could mention so whatever. Honestly, most people inclined to vote Democratic would likely be fine with voting for either person. Certainly over the other choices.
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#848 Mar 18 2016 at 7:50 AM Rating: Good
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Don't forget the part about brokered conventions, where the points voter's choice don't matter. That's right, the voters are just like the plot of a porn. They just don't matter.

Edited, Mar 18th 2016 9:51am by lolgaxe
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#849 Mar 18 2016 at 7:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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OMG POST 840
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#850 Mar 18 2016 at 8:01 AM Rating: Good
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What about superdelegates?!
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#851 Mar 18 2016 at 8:03 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
OMG POST 840
It didn't have a Whose Line quote in it. Smiley: glare
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