I think GMO foods are a necessity. At some point it's going to become difficult to feed our populations effectively so we need to create more efficient crops.
That being said I have concerns about the effects on crops down the road. Given that 90% of corn grown (I'm taking this stat from this thread so I won't vouch for it's accuracy) is now controlled by one company and the fact that cross pollination will pass the GMO genes on to other sub species of the same species I think we may be crowding out the diversity of certain foodstuffs. This may not be an issue now, but what happens when some corn plague comes through that just flat out decimates all corn with a certain gene we've introduced that has now been passed on from the 90% to the 10% through natural processes, or when Monsanto goes bankrupt, stops selling seeds but still has all of the patents, or when a "pest" is wiped out as a result killing of some beneficial predator of said pest? These may be unlikely to happen but sometimes a slight risk isn't worth an overwhelming consequence and I can conceive a lot of mini-doomsday scenarios with thinning out the gene pool of portions of the food chain.
When I go to the grocery store I can buy clearly labelled "Organic" apples so why can't I buy "Non-GMO" apples? I wouldn't because I'm cheap, but I should be able to regardless of my perception or understanding of the safety of GMO foods.
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Smasharoo wrote:
Wait, what do you think it's for now? Do you think labeling bags of sugar as "fat and gluten free!" is helping someone??
100% sugar! contains no fat!
Still there are people out there who didn't want to buy sugar "because of all the fat in it." Because, you know people...
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
I was commenting about the oatmeal labeled gluten free in the organic food section of the grocery store and how I thought it was ridiculous to label a food that never had gluten in it to be free from it. The woman I was chatting with however is presumably very sensitive to gluten. She said she buys the oatmeal that is labeled gluten free, and willingly pays more for it to know that it's not processed or potentially contaminated with gluten.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
Yodabunny wrote:
I think GMO foods are a necessity. At some point it's going to become difficult to feed our populations effectively so we need to create more efficient crops.
We just need to stop feeding other populations. And put giant death robots on all the borders.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Jophiel wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
I think GMO foods are a necessity. At some point it's going to become difficult to feed our populations effectively so we need to create more efficient crops.
We just need to stop feeding other populations. And put giant death robots on all the borders.
As others have pointed out here - the biggest problem with feeding the world is distribution, not production.
Edited, Sep 20th 2013 6:33pm by Elinda
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
Elinda wrote:
One of the main points being that 'feeding the world' has gotten to be a moral catch phrase to allow farmers to use whatever technologies they want to grow more stuff faster.
To be fair, that was the foundation of the original green revolution.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Elinda wrote:
I was commenting about the oatmeal labeled gluten free in the organic food section of the grocery store and how I thought it was ridiculous to label a food that never had gluten in it to be free from it. The woman I was chatting with however is presumably very sensitive to gluten. She said she buys the oatmeal that is labeled gluten free, and willingly pays more for it to know that it's not processed or potentially contaminated with gluten.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
I'd imagine it depends on how bad your allergy is. If trace amounts could trigger it, you're likely to be confident that the oats are sourced from gluten-free providers, and the actual product is processed on machinery that doesn't handle the allergen.
Right now, there is very little legislation governing the terminology. But you won't typically see people claiming the allergen-free tag unless they've made an attempt to ensure that. Trace amounts could be grounds for a class-action lawsuit or worse.
I just looked up Quaker oats, and they only have one product they endorse as Gluten-free (meaning they test the product to ensure it doesn't contain gluten), and they disclose that the suppliers for their other products may also handle wheat and they cannot guarantee no cross-contamination.
I honestly have no clue how serious gluten allergies can be. Most of the people I've met with them just have some stomach trouble if they have it (though a former boss's niece who came into the store all the time carried an epi-pen for hers).
That said, I have a friend whose aunt has a gluten allergy, and she was livid when the no-gluten craze started, because it led to a lot of products that weren't doing their due diligence for using the label. Which is why the FDA finally issued standards for certifying something "gluten free" in the past month or two.
TL;DR: Just because the actual intended ingredients don't contain gluten doesn't mean the manufacturing process doesn't include a high probability of contamination. Typically, companies only claim the "free" tag if they're confident of that. For a shop I used to work in, I compiled a master list of all the allergen warnings for our 100+ products. The vast majority of them stated they were manufactured in a facility that also handled <allergen>, some said they were manufactured on equipment that handled <allergen>, and very, VERY few actually stated they were allergen free (with gluten and dairy being the main ones there).
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
I just assume everyone is overstating their allergies because they're pussies. If anyone is going to die from having a peanut thrown at them, we need to get them out of the gene pool anyway.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
The woman I was chatting with however is presumably very sensitive to gluten
She almost certainly isn't. People don't understand allergies. There's a reason MDs smear peanut butter on the arms of kids with peanut allergies in front of their parents.
She almost certainly isn't. People don't understand allergies. There's a reason MDs smear peanut butter on the arms of kids with peanut allergies in front of their parents.
Disclaimer:
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
Smasharoo wrote:
The woman I was chatting with however is presumably very sensitive to gluten
She almost certainly isn't. People don't understand allergies. There's a reason MDs smear peanut butter on the arms of kids with peanut allergies in front of their parents.
She almost certainly isn't. People don't understand allergies. There's a reason MDs smear peanut butter on the arms of kids with peanut allergies in front of their parents.
Sensitivity doesn't mean touching it will kill you. The most misunderstood aspect of allergens is how quickly the symptoms may be onset. An MD smearing peanut butter on someone's skin is far different from having the child ingesting peanut butter and it's FAR different from doing it outside of a controlled environment where they may promptly treat any reaction before it really starts.
That doesn't mean the symptoms themselves can't be extremely serious. It just means you probably have enough time to get to a hospital before you're in danger, unless you live somewhere like North Dakota.
That said, I don't doubt that the period of risk can be much smaller in the serious cases, and the most serious reactions go well beyond the discomfort that most people are going to experience. I don't know much about gluten allergies, specifically, though.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
Sensitivity doesn't mean touching it will kill you. The most misunderstood aspect of allergens is how quickly the symptoms may be onset. An MD smearing peanut butter on someone's skin is far different from having the child ingesting peanut butter and it's FAR different from doing it outside of a controlled environment where they may promptly treat any reaction before it really starts.
That doesn't mean the symptoms themselves can't be extremely serious
No, it does, actually in this case. Celiac disease doesn't present significant symptoms from small amounts of gluten, pretty much ever. She could have a wheat allergy, maybe, where she might react to small amounts of wheat. She'd probably be dead by now however, if she were equating that with gluten. BY FAR the most likely case is that she has no sensitivity to either. Certainly possible she's the one person in 3 billion who is, somehow, "allergic" to gluten and risks anaphylactic shock by ingesting even a tiny amount. Seems unlikely, though.
Edited, Sep 20th 2013 1:52pm by Smasharoo
That doesn't mean the symptoms themselves can't be extremely serious
No, it does, actually in this case. Celiac disease doesn't present significant symptoms from small amounts of gluten, pretty much ever. She could have a wheat allergy, maybe, where she might react to small amounts of wheat. She'd probably be dead by now however, if she were equating that with gluten. BY FAR the most likely case is that she has no sensitivity to either. Certainly possible she's the one person in 3 billion who is, somehow, "allergic" to gluten and risks anaphylactic shock by ingesting even a tiny amount. Seems unlikely, though.
Edited, Sep 20th 2013 1:52pm by Smasharoo
Disclaimer:
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
Wheat allergies are rare, but they are distinct from Celiac's Disease.
If we're talking about Elinda's friend, specifically, sure - the chances of her having Celiac's are FAR higher than the chances that she has a wheat allergy, statistically speaking. But that seems like wonky logic to me. Or maybe just an overreaching application of skepticism?
Sure, it's fully possible the woman is full of crap. It's also fully possible she has a severe wheat allergy.
/shrug
Either way, I'm not entirely sure what we could gain from that discussion. At the end of the day, it's hearsay regarding someone not involved in the conversation.
If we're talking about Elinda's friend, specifically, sure - the chances of her having Celiac's are FAR higher than the chances that she has a wheat allergy, statistically speaking. But that seems like wonky logic to me. Or maybe just an overreaching application of skepticism?
Sure, it's fully possible the woman is full of crap. It's also fully possible she has a severe wheat allergy.
/shrug
Either way, I'm not entirely sure what we could gain from that discussion. At the end of the day, it's hearsay regarding someone not involved in the conversation.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
idiggory wrote:
At the end of the day, it's hearsay regarding someone not involved in the conversation. irrefutable evidence.
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
I am very very familiar with allergies.
Most people misunderstand allergies. I'm allergic to a very long list of things, all tested so I'm not just "making it up" and it's not "in my head" as so many people (who don't have allergies) seem to think. Different allergies trigger different symptoms, some are immediate, some are delayed, some are manageable, some are potentially fatal.
I have a severe cat allergy, for example, that doesn't mean I suddenly drop dead when I walk into a home with a cat. It means I begin having minor breathing difficulty (asthma is triggered) and then itchy eyes, congestion etc within a few minutes. I can stay in this state for probably 30 mins to an hour depending on the cat and I'll survive though it's extremely uncomfortable. Then I step outside. Once I hit the fresh air my throat swells and lungs shut up nice and tight. I've spent many a night in the hospital because of this. If I leave within a few minutes it's not nearly as severe, what does happen however is I effectively have a cold for the next few days (obviously an allergy can't give me a cold but symptoms are there) and my breathing is labored so I can't sleep because I tend to stop breathing as I'm falling asleep due to the effort required. Also, labored breathing is ridiculously draining over long periods of time. SO I avoid cats like the plague.
My mother has what I like to call an unapparent allergy to gluten. This is when you don't actually know it's an issue until you stop using it because the symptoms can be attributed to other things. She's had joint issues all of her life. She was born with one leg shorter than the other and was in a cast waist down for a year due to corrective surgery so the issues were always attributed to that. Then she joined this ridiculous no gluten fad, she's been pain free for 2 years, she can run, she doesn't limp anymore. If, however, she accidentally ingests some gluten through cross contamination at a restaurant (using the same fryer for gluten free foods as the battered shrimp for example) she's sore for a few days.
Now, the vast majority of the "gluten free" crowd are likely just a bunch of idiots, but there are people out there who have these allergies, they're generally not life threatening but they can be serious quality of life issues and when you feel like crap for days after slipping up you're damn sure to read the labels on the stuff you buy.
It's like being lactose intolerant. You can still drink a big glass of milk, if you want to sit on the can for two days.
Most people misunderstand allergies. I'm allergic to a very long list of things, all tested so I'm not just "making it up" and it's not "in my head" as so many people (who don't have allergies) seem to think. Different allergies trigger different symptoms, some are immediate, some are delayed, some are manageable, some are potentially fatal.
I have a severe cat allergy, for example, that doesn't mean I suddenly drop dead when I walk into a home with a cat. It means I begin having minor breathing difficulty (asthma is triggered) and then itchy eyes, congestion etc within a few minutes. I can stay in this state for probably 30 mins to an hour depending on the cat and I'll survive though it's extremely uncomfortable. Then I step outside. Once I hit the fresh air my throat swells and lungs shut up nice and tight. I've spent many a night in the hospital because of this. If I leave within a few minutes it's not nearly as severe, what does happen however is I effectively have a cold for the next few days (obviously an allergy can't give me a cold but symptoms are there) and my breathing is labored so I can't sleep because I tend to stop breathing as I'm falling asleep due to the effort required. Also, labored breathing is ridiculously draining over long periods of time. SO I avoid cats like the plague.
My mother has what I like to call an unapparent allergy to gluten. This is when you don't actually know it's an issue until you stop using it because the symptoms can be attributed to other things. She's had joint issues all of her life. She was born with one leg shorter than the other and was in a cast waist down for a year due to corrective surgery so the issues were always attributed to that. Then she joined this ridiculous no gluten fad, she's been pain free for 2 years, she can run, she doesn't limp anymore. If, however, she accidentally ingests some gluten through cross contamination at a restaurant (using the same fryer for gluten free foods as the battered shrimp for example) she's sore for a few days.
Now, the vast majority of the "gluten free" crowd are likely just a bunch of idiots, but there are people out there who have these allergies, they're generally not life threatening but they can be serious quality of life issues and when you feel like crap for days after slipping up you're damn sure to read the labels on the stuff you buy.
It's like being lactose intolerant. You can still drink a big glass of milk, if you want to sit on the can for two days.
idiggory wrote:
Elinda wrote:
I was commenting about the oatmeal labeled gluten free in the organic food section of the grocery store and how I thought it was ridiculous to label a food that never had gluten in it to be free from it. The woman I was chatting with however is presumably very sensitive to gluten. She said she buys the oatmeal that is labeled gluten free, and willingly pays more for it to know that it's not processed or potentially contaminated with gluten.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
I think she might be full of it, but, meh, her diet not mine. She's a pretty smart lady in most things.
I'd imagine it depends on how bad your allergy is. If trace amounts could trigger it, you're likely to be confident that the oats are sourced from gluten-free providers, and the actual product is processed on machinery that doesn't handle the allergen.
Right now, there is very little legislation governing the terminology. But you won't typically see people claiming the allergen-free tag unless they've made an attempt to ensure that. Trace amounts could be grounds for a class-action lawsuit or worse.
I just looked up Quaker oats, and they only have one product they endorse as Gluten-free (meaning they test the product to ensure it doesn't contain gluten), and they disclose that the suppliers for their other products may also handle wheat and they cannot guarantee no cross-contamination.
I honestly have no clue how serious gluten allergies can be. Most of the people I've met with them just have some stomach trouble if they have it (though a former boss's niece who came into the store all the time carried an epi-pen for hers).
That said, I have a friend whose aunt has a gluten allergy, and she was livid when the no-gluten craze started, because it led to a lot of products that weren't doing their due diligence for using the label. Which is why the FDA finally issued standards for certifying something "gluten free" in the past month or two.
TL;DR: Just because the actual intended ingredients don't contain gluten doesn't mean the manufacturing process doesn't include a high probability of contamination. Typically, companies only claim the "free" tag if they're confident of that. For a shop I used to work in, I compiled a master list of all the allergen warnings for our 100+ products. The vast majority of them stated they were manufactured in a facility that also handled <allergen>, some said they were manufactured on equipment that handled <allergen>, and very, VERY few actually stated they were allergen free (with gluten and dairy being the main ones there).
Edited, Sep 20th 2013 10:45pm by Elinda
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
Quote:
I had always, maybe wrongly assumed, that gluten was more of an intolerance issue. Like it was more of an irritant than an allergen affecting digestion for the most part. I mean even wheat can be prepared for consumption without it making gluten. Which is perhaps why I'd be less concerned about oats being labeled as gluten free. I spose though that if someone has a physical condition, an allergy or whatever, in which they do want to insure that level of protection from gluten and a manufacturer goes the extra bit to insure x-contamination in other grains - then cool. Label it as such.
Well, they make allergen-free peanuts now. So there's that.
The irony here being that it's a genetically modified product.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
My mother has Celiac Disease. It's an auto immune disorder. The gluten gets into your gut and your immune system attacks your intestines, causing in mild cases slight discomfort and gas. In more extreme cases depending on the severity, it can cause lacerations and ulcers, internal bleeding, etc. My mom's went on unchecked (undiagnosed) for a while, it caused some nasty ulcers and bleeding in her intestines.
The levels of gluten required to trigger the response varies person to person. Some won't trigger unless you consume actual gluten products. Some people can have triggers from eating foods prepared in or handled on stuff that processed gluten containing foods.
The idea that wheat can be made without gluten, I'm pretty sure is false. Gluten is a protein that exists in Wheat. The gluten forming you are probably thinking of is when you knead dough, the gluten comes out of the wheat and expands, giving it the chewy texture. Not kneading your dough as much or at all reduces that, like in in biscuits. You don't knead those at all to keep them fluffy and flaky, but the gluten is still there. It's just in its default compact form, still bad for people with Celiac Disease.
The levels of gluten required to trigger the response varies person to person. Some won't trigger unless you consume actual gluten products. Some people can have triggers from eating foods prepared in or handled on stuff that processed gluten containing foods.
The idea that wheat can be made without gluten, I'm pretty sure is false. Gluten is a protein that exists in Wheat. The gluten forming you are probably thinking of is when you knead dough, the gluten comes out of the wheat and expands, giving it the chewy texture. Not kneading your dough as much or at all reduces that, like in in biscuits. You don't knead those at all to keep them fluffy and flaky, but the gluten is still there. It's just in its default compact form, still bad for people with Celiac Disease.
Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
Elinda wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
I'm not so much concerned with cancer as I am with ten foot tall ears of carnivore corn.
Saute us in butter and whip us at carbs.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
Then she joined this ridiculous no gluten fad, she's been pain free for 2 years, she can run, she doesn't limp anymore. If, however, she accidentally ingests some gluten through cross contamination at a restaurant (using the same fryer for gluten free foods as the battered shrimp for example) she's sore for a few days.
Gluten isn't causing the pain in her legs. She sounds like a fucking lunatic.
Also, I should remember to log Nexa out next time.
Edited, Sep 21st 2013 8:12am by Nexa
Gluten isn't causing the pain in her legs. She sounds like a fucking lunatic.
Also, I should remember to log Nexa out next time.
Edited, Sep 21st 2013 8:12am by Nexa
“It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes. But a half-wit remains a half-wit, and the emperor remains an emperor.â€
― Neil Gaiman, The Sandman, Vol. 9: The Kindly Ones
― Neil Gaiman, The Sandman, Vol. 9: The Kindly Ones
Smash the all knowing wrote:
Gluten isn't causing the pain in her legs. She sounds like a fucking lunatic.
Well, she is a bit of a lunatic these days, but yes, gluten is causing pain in her legs, along with all of her other joints due to the swelling induced by her allergy.
@DavidFrum wrote:
The attack on GMO foods is McCarthyism. Jenny McCarthyism.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
My perspective is not exactly typical, so I am not sure if anyone will be able to relate to my 2c's worth.
I did not grow up on a farm. Yes, we had an orchard. Yes, we had some chickens. Yes, we had some sheep. But it was not a farm. Not in the way Americans see farms anyway.
I think my biggest beef with GMO is that the genes are not altered to make it taste better, to have more nutrients, or some other benefit to the consumer. No. They are altered to last longer, so that it has a longer shelf life in the store. They are altered to be more consistent in the way they look ( tomatoes ). They are altered so that they kill the bugs that dare to eat them.
Minor diversion here, try a tomato, organic vs GMO one. The difference in taste alone should convince you not to buy GMO.
The personal beef I have with GMOs is that I used to be able to eat normal food. And now, that normal food is considered "premium", "organic" that only, according to my gf's brother, hippies want. Not to mention, it has gotten rather hard to distinguish between gmos and non-gmo precisely because of the reasons mentioned already in this thread.
The unspoken beef is that the long term effects are largely unknown. We, as a species, have absolutely no idea what the long term effects of ******* with our food chain are. And food chain is kinda like the environment; you **** with it too much and it might kill you in return. I am not saying it causes cancer. These days, the jokes goes, what does not? I am saying, food is a little too important to just experiment on the entire populace. Then again, we do the same with cosmetics, so maybe we, as a species, have an affinity for self-destruction.
And before you go in saying stuff about green revolution, yield, subsidies and how would I like to pay 10$ for gallon of milk cost, I say **** off. In reality, you are already paying. Just not at the register.
I did not grow up on a farm. Yes, we had an orchard. Yes, we had some chickens. Yes, we had some sheep. But it was not a farm. Not in the way Americans see farms anyway.
I think my biggest beef with GMO is that the genes are not altered to make it taste better, to have more nutrients, or some other benefit to the consumer. No. They are altered to last longer, so that it has a longer shelf life in the store. They are altered to be more consistent in the way they look ( tomatoes ). They are altered so that they kill the bugs that dare to eat them.
Minor diversion here, try a tomato, organic vs GMO one. The difference in taste alone should convince you not to buy GMO.
The personal beef I have with GMOs is that I used to be able to eat normal food. And now, that normal food is considered "premium", "organic" that only, according to my gf's brother, hippies want. Not to mention, it has gotten rather hard to distinguish between gmos and non-gmo precisely because of the reasons mentioned already in this thread.
The unspoken beef is that the long term effects are largely unknown. We, as a species, have absolutely no idea what the long term effects of ******* with our food chain are. And food chain is kinda like the environment; you **** with it too much and it might kill you in return. I am not saying it causes cancer. These days, the jokes goes, what does not? I am saying, food is a little too important to just experiment on the entire populace. Then again, we do the same with cosmetics, so maybe we, as a species, have an affinity for self-destruction.
And before you go in saying stuff about green revolution, yield, subsidies and how would I like to pay 10$ for gallon of milk cost, I say **** off. In reality, you are already paying. Just not at the register.
Your soul was made of fists.
Jar the Sam
Jar the Sam
angrymnk wrote:
My perspective is not exactly typical...
The typical thing about your perspective is that you think it is unique, which you think makes you unique. Which is pretty typical.
Guess again, buttercup, to quote Lolgaxe
Also, you used the word beef a lot for a thread about plants
(The biggest beef, the personal beef, the unspoken beef) [:cow:]Dandruffshampoo wrote:
Curses, beaten by Professor stupidopo-opo.
Annabella, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Stupidmonkey is more organized than a bag of raccoons.
Professor stupidmonkey wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
My perspective is not exactly typical...
The typical thing about your perspective is that you think it is unique, which you think makes you unique. Which is pretty typical.
Guess again, buttercup, to quote Lolgaxe
Also, you used the word beef a lot for a thread about plants
(The biggest beef, the personal beef, the unspoken beef) [:cow:]Deep down, I was hoping someone would bring up Oprah's beef with beef.
Your soul was made of fists.
Jar the Sam
Jar the Sam
angrymnk wrote:
Professor stupidmonkey wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
My perspective is not exactly typical...
The typical thing about your perspective is that you think it is unique, which you think makes you unique. Which is pretty typical.
Guess again, buttercup, to quote Lolgaxe
Also, you used the word beef a lot for a thread about plants
(The biggest beef, the personal beef, the unspoken beef) [:cow:]Deep down, I was hoping someone would bring up Leonard Part 6.
Shaowstrike (Retired - FFXI)
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"We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."
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