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#527 Mar 22 2013 at 5:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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Please explain what you mean. Because this makes no sense to me.

Welcome to how everyone else feels about the last 4 pages of this thread.
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#528 Mar 22 2013 at 5:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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#529 Mar 22 2013 at 5:31 PM Rating: Default
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#530 Mar 22 2013 at 6:20 PM Rating: Decent
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So, why does it matter if I'm referring to *** and/or gender.
Because they are two completely different, unrelated things.

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Does your "widespread" rule only apply to one and not the other? If not, then it's irrelevant.
It applies to words, not the concepts those words refer to.

Edited, Mar 22nd 2013 8:23pm by Rachel9
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#531 Mar 22 2013 at 6:51 PM Rating: Default
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#532 Mar 22 2013 at 7:21 PM Rating: Decent
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If I define myself as a "car", then as long as it's widely accepted, then I am a car.
Correct, but you are not the same thing as is described at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car . You'd be something completely different that happens to also be called a "car".
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That's why we have dictionaries, to prevent such nonsense from occurring.
No it's not.

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It sounds like you're upset because transgenders are being treated as their biological *** and not some random gender/*** that they want to be. However, you have stated that you support widespread definitions. In this situation, it is widespread to label a transgender as their biological *** and not what they want to be. So, I ask again, what's your beef? What rights?
Until you clarify wtf you're talking about, specifically the first sentence, i cannot respond to it.

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WTF? Please expound the differentiation of a defined word in a dictionary and the concept of the aforesaid word.
For example, if all of society decided to go along with your new definition of the word "car", we could add "Almalieque" as one of the definitions for the word car in all of our dictionaries, and refer to you simply as "car". However, this doesn't change who, or what you are. You still the same person, regardless of whether we call you Almalieque, car, or anything else. Words are just labels. The thing, or concept that those labels refer to does not change just because the label does. See: thousands of different languages using different words to refer to the same thing.

More examples: This and this are both called the same thing. They are obviously very different things, we just happen to use the same word to refer to them.

Edited, Mar 22nd 2013 9:43pm by Rachel9
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#533 Mar 22 2013 at 8:07 PM Rating: Default
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Does your "widespread" rule only applies to one and not the other? If not, then it's irrelevant. According to your logic, as long as it's wide spread, then it's an official definition as opposed to official sources such as dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc..

Almalieque wrote:
That's why we have dictionaries, to prevent such nonsense from occurring.
Rachel wrote:
No it's not.
Rachel wrote:
Correct, but you are not the same thing as is described at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car . You'd be something completely different that happens to also be called a "car".

Contradict much?

Rachel wrote:
Until you clarify wtf you're talking about, specifically the first sentence, i cannot respond to it.

Almalieque wrote:
Rachel wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Rachel wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
So, it's settled. You have no issue with defining a *** by their genitalia, because it's widespread.
That's correct.

So WTF have you been arguing the contrary this whole time or would you like to expound on your problem?

Transgender rights
what's your beef? What rights?


What part of that don't you understand?

Rachel wrote:
However, this doesn't change who, or what you are. You still the same person, regardless of whether we call you Almalieque, car, or anything else. Words are just labels. The thing, or concept that those labels refer to does not change just because the label does. See: thousands of different languages using different words to refer to the same thing.

More examples: This and [url=http://i.imgur.com/ThfyRA1.pngthis[/url] are both called the same thing. They are obviously very different things, we just happen to use the same word to refer to them.


So your argument is that we can create labels for things "all willy nilly", but it doesn't change the actual definition? Welcome to my point. Just because you call yourself a woman, doesn't make you a woman. So, I ask again, what exactly is your beef?
#534 Mar 22 2013 at 8:22 PM Rating: Good
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#535 Mar 22 2013 at 8:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Does your "widespread" rule only applies to one and not the other? If not, then it's irrelevant. According to your logic, as long as it's wide spread, then it's an official definition as opposed to official sources such as dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc..
It applies to all words.
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Contradict much?
Uh, how?

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So your argument is that we can create labels for things "all willy nilly", but it doesn't change the actual definition?
I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.
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#536 Mar 23 2013 at 6:34 AM Rating: Decent
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If you don't mind me asking, are you over 18?

Rachel wrote:
It applies to all words.


If it applies to all words, then why do you care that I'm using "***/gender"? It doesn't matter if they are two different concepts, because they are both applicable to the concept of widespread acceptances. Furthermore,both concepts are relevant to the topic of conversation.

Rachel wrote:
Uh, how?


My argument has been that we use official documents such as dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. to determine official definitions of words. While in casual conversation, society can create slang words to mean anything they want, the definition isn't official until officially recognized by credible sources. Else, mass confusion would occur in contracts, laws, rules, etc., when people can create and/or infer their own meanings of words. To prevent that chaos from happening, we have official definitions as standards. "this isn't a 'gun', it's a 'toaster'! That's what we call it back at home!"

You said that wasn't the purpose of dictionaries. However, when I said that I'm defined as a car, you used an encyclopedia to counter my definition. You did exactly what I said dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. are used for, while denying the same exact purpose.

Rachel wrote:
I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.


For example, if all of society decided to go along with your new definition of the word "car", we could add "Almalieque" as one of the definitions for the word car in all of our dictionaries, and refer to you simply as "car".

Here you stated that we could add the definition "Almalieque" to the word "car" in all of our dictionaries simply because society decided to go along with it. That equals "creating labels for things all 'willy-nilly'". That is, unless you have a logical connection between "almalieque" and "car"?

You still the same person, regardless of whether we call you Almalieque, car, or anything else. Words are just labels. The thing, or concept that those labels refer to does not change just because the label does

Here you state that regardless if I'm called "Almalieque", "car" or anything else, those are just labels and the actual thing doesn't change. That equals "not changing the actual definition".
Maybe "definition" was a poor word to use. So, let me rephrase it.So your argument is that we can create labels for things "all willy nilly", but it doesn't change the thing or concept that the labels refer to?

The next logical question goes back to who defines that "thing" or "concept". How does one label outweigh another label? You're simply going in circles to avoid conceding your point.

So, I ask again, what's your beef? What rights?
#537 Mar 23 2013 at 8:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Yes, i am.

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My argument has been that we use official documents such as dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. to determine official definitions of words. While in casual conversation, society can create slang words to mean anything they want, the definition isn't official until officially recognized by credible sources. Else, mass confusion would occur in contracts, laws, rules, etc., when people can create and/or infer their own meanings of words. To prevent that chaos from happening, we have official definitions as standards. "this isn't a 'gun', it's a 'toaster'! That's what we call it back at home!"

You said that wasn't the purpose of dictionaries. However, when I said that I'm defined as a car, you used an encyclopedia to counter my definition. You did exactly what I said dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. are used for, while denying the same exact purpose.
I didn't use it as an official irrefutable source. Wikipedia is wrong all the ******* time. I used it because i didn't feel like describing a car. Would you be happier if i had used a picture instead? Dictionaries and encyclopedias are very useful, even if they aren't the official word of god. I can confirm that the article does in fact refer to exactly what i was thinking of. While it's possible for Wikipedia to be wrong, i can confirm that in this case, it's not.

Quote:
Here you stated that we could add the definition "Almalieque" to the word "car" in all of our dictionaries simply because society decided to go along with it. That equals "creating labels for things all 'willy-nilly'". That is, unless you have a logical connection between "almalieque" and "car"?
There's just as much of a logical connection between this and "car". All words are just made up at some point. That's kind of how it works.

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Here you state that regardless if I'm called "Almalieque", "car" or anything else, those are just labels and the actual thing doesn't change. That equals "not changing the actual definition".
How? That's exactly what we've done in that case.
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Maybe "definition" was a poor word to use. So, let me rephrase it.So your argument is that we can create labels for things "all willy nilly", but it doesn't change the thing or concept that the labels refer to?
You basically just quoted what i said, so yes, i agree.
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#538 Mar 23 2013 at 9:05 AM Rating: Default
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If opinion applies to all words, then why do you care that I'm using "***/gender"? It doesn't matter if they are two different concepts, because they are both applicable to the concept of widespread acceptances. Furthermore,both concepts are relevant to the topic of conversation.
Rachel wrote:
You basically just quoted what i said, so yes, i agree.


So, I ask again, what's your beef? What rights?

Rachel wrote:
I didn't use it as an official irrefutable source. Wikipedia is wrong all the @#%^ing time. I used it because i didn't feel like describing a car. Would you be happier if i had used a picture instead? Dictionaries and encyclopedias are very useful, even if they aren't the official word of god. I can confirm that the article does in fact refer to exactly what i was thinking of. While it's possible for Wikipedia to be wrong, i can confirm that in this case, it's not.


Your opinion of wikipedia's accuracy is not the point. My argument is that we use sources such as dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. to determine standards on definitions. Else, mass confusion would occur in contracts, laws, rules, etc., when people can create and/or infer their own meanings of words. To prevent that chaos from happening, we have official definitions as standards. "this isn't a 'gun', it's a 'toaster'! That's what we call it back at home!"

You said that wasn't the purpose of dictionaries. However, when I said that I'm defined as a car, you used an encyclopedia to counter my definition. You did exactly what I said dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. are used for, while denying the same exact purpose.

#539 Mar 23 2013 at 9:11 AM Rating: Decent
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You said that wasn't the purpose of dictionaries. However, when I said that I'm defined as a car, you used an encyclopedia to counter my definition.
lol, no i didn't. I never even said you couldn't be called a "car".

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If opinion applies to all words, then why do you care that I'm using "***/gender"?
Because i have no idea what you mean. If your intention is to ask two separate questions, then please, for the sake of clarity, split them into two sentences.

Edited, Mar 23rd 2013 11:13am by Rachel9
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#540 Mar 23 2013 at 9:47 AM Rating: Default
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Rachel wrote:
Because i have no idea what you mean. If your intention is to ask two separate questions, then please, for the sake of clarity, split them into two sentences.


If "a" is your solution for problem "x", and "a" is your solution for problem "y", then why do you care if "x" and "y" are listed independently or jointly as "x/y"? Your solution will always be "a". That notation represents that the problem can be either "x" and/or "y", where "a" will be your solution.

You're going in circles to prevent admitting defeat.

Rachel wrote:
lol, no i didn't. I never even said you couldn't be called a "car".

You stated that I could be called a car, but that doesn't change what I am. That's what I've been arguing for the entire time.

So, I ask again, what's your beef? What rights?
#541 Mar 23 2013 at 9:55 AM Rating: Decent
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If "a" is your solution for problem "x", and "a" is your solution for problem "y", then why do you care if "x" and "y" are listed independently or jointly as "x/y"? Your solution will always be "a". That notation represents that the problem can be either "x" and/or "y", where "a" will be your solution.
Huh? My answer will be very different for each question.


Quote:
You stated that I could be called a car, but that doesn't change what I am. That's what I've been arguing for the entire time.
Oh, it is? I thought you have been arguing that if god doesn't approve of a definition, then it can't be used at all. At least that would explain why you are still refusing to call trans women women.
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#542 Mar 23 2013 at 10:13 AM Rating: Good
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For the love of god Rachel, stop arguing with that moron.
You're never going to convince him of anything because he's too stupid to grasp even the most simple of concepts and you're only getting dumber by arguing with him.
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#543 Mar 23 2013 at 10:14 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm bored :(
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#544 Mar 23 2013 at 10:23 AM Rating: Default
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Rachel wrote:
Huh? My answer will be very different for each question.


You said that the concept of labels apply to all words. Now you are saying that it doesn't? Which one is it?

Rachel wrote:
Oh, it is? I thought you have been arguing that if god doesn't approve of a definition, then it can't be used at all. At least that would explain why you are still refusing to call trans women women.


I never mentioned God, that was you. I admitted to the evolution of words and language, but that evolution doesn't take away from current meanings. Just because the definition of a word might change in the future, doesn't mean that there is no definition standard. Else, mass confusion would occur in contracts, laws, rules, etc., when people can create and/or infer their own meanings of words. To prevent that chaos from happening, we have official definitions as standards. "This isn't a 'gun', it's a 'toaster'! That's what we call it back at home!"

You said that as long as the definition was wide spread, then it is acceptable. Well, it is widespread that a man with a wig and women's clothing acting like a woman is a man with a wig and women's clothing acting like a woman, not a woman. By your own philosophy, you agree with me. So, I asked you what have you been arguing about and you said "transgender rights"; however, you have refused to expound on what "transgender rights" you are referring to or the overall problem.

By your own philosophy, you are wrong. If we are free to create and use any label as we see fit, then what is your beef?
#545 Mar 23 2013 at 10:31 AM Rating: Good
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Rachel9 wrote:
I'm bored :(
There's better ways to waste time.
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Theophany wrote:
YOU'RE AN ELITIST @#%^ AETHIEN, NO WONDER YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS AND PEOPLE HATE YOU.
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Aethien you take more terrible pictures than a Japanese tourist.
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One day, Maz, you'll learn not to click on anything Aeth links.
#546 Mar 23 2013 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
For the love of god Rachel, stop arguing with that moron.
You're never going to convince him of anything because he's too stupid to grasp even the most simple of concepts and you're only getting dumber by arguing with him.


You're not helping Rachel at all by bolstering that nonsense. If you're too invidious towards me to admit that she has done nothing but create a circle of contradictions, you're better off remaining silent. Your silence (along with the thread) is evident that you agree with me, else I would have had several people responding. This forum isn't that serious where you would rather come off as a grade A douche than to accept the fact that your own beliefs maybe flawed.
#547 Mar 23 2013 at 10:45 AM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Your silence (along with the thread) is evident that you agree with me
Smiley: lolSmiley: laugh
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Theophany wrote:
YOU'RE AN ELITIST @#%^ AETHIEN, NO WONDER YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS AND PEOPLE HATE YOU.
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Aethien you take more terrible pictures than a Japanese tourist.
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One day, Maz, you'll learn not to click on anything Aeth links.
#548 Mar 23 2013 at 10:47 AM Rating: Decent
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You said that the concept of labels apply to all words. Now you are saying that it doesn't? Which one is it?
That is not at all what i am saying.

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"This isn't a 'gun', it's a 'toaster'! That's what we call it back at home!"
That's fine, but everywhere else it's known as a gun. So you can continue calling it a toaster, but you can't say it's not a gun. Because it is. Being a "toaster" doesn't prevent it from also being a "gun".

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that evolution doesn't take away from current meanings. Just because the definition of a word might change in the future, doesn't mean that there is no definition standard.
Yes, i have said just as much before.

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You said that as long as the definition was wide spread, then it is acceptable.
Correct.

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Well, it is widespread that a man with a wig and women's clothing acting like a woman is a man with a wig and women's clothing acting like a woman, not a woman.
This is...not true. For example:

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If you're too invidious towards me to admit that she has done nothing but create a circle of contradictions
All i had to do was change my name, and say i'm a woman now, and what do you know, even you will refer to me as "she".

Edited, Mar 23rd 2013 1:00pm by Rachel9
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#549 Mar 23 2013 at 10:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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toaster


Oh, are we there already?

Eske's Law. Thread lock plz.
#550 Mar 23 2013 at 10:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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#551 Mar 23 2013 at 10:57 AM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Quote:
toaster


Oh, are we there already?

Eske's Law. Thread lock plz.
Wait a bit, I predicted 17 pages of stupidity and we're not quite there yet.
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Theophany wrote:
YOU'RE AN ELITIST @#%^ AETHIEN, NO WONDER YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS AND PEOPLE HATE YOU.
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Aethien you take more terrible pictures than a Japanese tourist.
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