The large majority of us, at least, have experienced High School. I was doing random searches on Google this evening, while I was sipping a beer and playing WoW.
All of us are intelligent enough to know that our upbringing effects who we become. It's interesting, in one aspect of that, to see how the atmosphere of our schooling affects how we turn out.
Many kids, as they go to school are concerned with "fitting in" or being popular. This applies to everyone, regardless of what clique they fit in. In my school, which was very small by most standards, getting good grades and being intelligent was encouraged. Many of the most popular kids in school were those who were on the honor roll, they took the AP courses, and they were the ones who were eventually awarded various academic scholarships. This was a rare Socialogical event, at least as I have witnessed. Many of the folks I ended up meeting later on described the stereotypical High School. The jocks and preps were the most popular people, the nerds and studious types were largely ignored.
Looking back on High School, I find myself amazed that the social hierarchy was organized the way that it was. I'm not sure when it began, I just know that it was that way when I attended, and it lasted at least as long as my younger brother. Who is 10 years my junior. He has now been out of HS for about 5 years at least, and I'm unaware of what the social situation is now. But I think it's safe to assume that it hasn't changed.
The most interesting aspect, at least to me, is looking up all those kids that I went to school with and seeing where they are at now. Many of the kids I went to school with are in highly respectable positions. Accountants, investment brokers, professors, lawyers, etc. These are all kids that were in my class, considering that was a class numbering 44, that's impressive at least to me. I have ex-girlfriends who are college proffesors and State DA's. One of my best buds has a doctorate and is working for a well known finance company. It wouldn't terribly surpise me to see him run for office some time soon.
I see these people, and it impresses apon me how important the attitude of a school is in determining the path of it's students. My school was no private, exclusive school. It was simply a public school with a proud history. One of it's alumni became very successful financially, and left a large sum of money for a scholarship fund for the school. When I graduated, I was awarded one of these scholarships. As a result of that and other financial aid I was pretty much self-supporting in college. My folks paid for my car insurance and chipped in for my books and that was it. All told they were out maybe 3 or 4 hundred per year.
Reflecting on all this, I see the results of local schools in the area I am in now. One of my friend's nephews dropped out of HS and got his GED. There were quite a few friends of his who also dropped out. This isn't some inner city situation, this is Colorado, where it's predominately white, and a pretty prosporous area. In the years since I left HS I have seen that my experience is a rare one. I see the "success" of many of the friends I went to school with and I wonder why? Where did this mentality come from, and how was it perpetuated till it was accepted as the "in" thing to do. The popular kids when I went to school were the ones who got good grades, and also included the ones who got decent grades but busted their *** to do so.
The only other place I've seen this type of socialogical hierarchy is in private schools. Which literally cost thousands of dollars to attend. I see the kids that I attended school with attaining the success that typically only private schools produce, and it gives me a measure of pride. Yet it also disturbs me. Because I've seen it work in the humblest of circumstances, and I find it difficult to see why it doesn't occur in other areas.
One of the reasons I am proud of where I come from, is because of the pride of the schools that I attended, and because of the success of the folks I went to school with. I see my little brother paving a way to success. He is about to finish his Master's in Architecture, and he has a start up business in the works. I have no doubt that he will succeed in this venture. Because I know where he came from. And failure is not common there.
I wish more of America's cities and towns had that type of positive influence on their young. If that were so, we really would be living in the modern day Rome.
In stead, I sit back and see the schools around me struggle. And I wish I knew what the difference was between these schools and the one I attended. I know the dichotomy is there, but I don't know why. So I sit and see our public schools produce students with minimal dedication, at best. And all too often they produce the modern day teenage angst MTV/IPOD generation. Struggling to find their identity, and often realizing what's important only after they have dug themselves a hole.
Or maybe it's just the beer talking.
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A venture into PhilosophyFollow
Some people are like slinkies, they aren't really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.
Kakar the Vile wrote:
So I sit and see our public schools produce students with minimal dedication, at best. And all too often they produce the modern day teenage angst MTV/IPOD generation.
I won't argue that there's things to be discussed about modern education but it seems unfair to claim that the schools "produce" these students, much less are responsible for angsty kids with iPods.
Anyway, I can't explain exactly why your school was so successful at lauding academic achivements and spinning that into peer acceptance but I'm sure a lot of instructors would love to know the secret. It's hard enough to keep students interested in course material without the "good grades = dork" stigma.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
It has been sometime since I attended high school, however things have changed from 1980's h/s flix, at least in the urban aspect. I attended high school in Colorado Springs, class of 1999. It wasn't that the jocks beat up the nerds, but more inline with the Bloods beat up the Crips, or the Peckerwoods beat up the Bloods, or the Mexican Mafia beat up on some Peckerwoods and so on. Gangs, violence, drugs, single parenthood, and racial distrust plague my generation. Much more than the public schools, public media, and admin boards were willing to admit. In other parts of the city gang related homicide was not all that uncommon among kids attending h/s. Harrison High had at least 5 gang related murders during my junior year alone.
The "nerds" of my h/s went on to be computer programmers, internet web designers, Digital Graphic designers, networking techs, and the like.
Our freshman class had over 300 students. The high school graduated 147 of them. At that time the Colorado's funding for education was ranked 48/50, most of the classes were too full, I recall having many classes with 40/1 student-teacher ratio.
If I meet a woman approximately my age it would be safe to assume that she is a drug addict, comes from a non-nuclear family, is racist in some aspect(even if it is mild), has been raped and/or molested, has had an abortion, is religious but "doesn't practice" or is athiest, has been physically/mentally/emotionally abused, and/or committed a misdemeanor/felony. Whereas with older generations this is simply not expected as it is the extreme. I think my generation and later has some of the most social hurdles than any of the older generations in a large part. In the 1980's 70's 60's ect. Schools were not under attack by drug-dealers, gangs, ect anywhere near as much as the h/s during the 1990's and on.
I think in the end, you can try to place blame whoever/whatever you want but it is ultimately up to the individual what kind of person he/she becomes. Yes, Generation-X and the Dotcom generation faces severe hurdles but we ultimately are the cause of our future. Anything else is a cop-out.
Or it could be just the beer talking.
The "nerds" of my h/s went on to be computer programmers, internet web designers, Digital Graphic designers, networking techs, and the like.
Our freshman class had over 300 students. The high school graduated 147 of them. At that time the Colorado's funding for education was ranked 48/50, most of the classes were too full, I recall having many classes with 40/1 student-teacher ratio.
If I meet a woman approximately my age it would be safe to assume that she is a drug addict, comes from a non-nuclear family, is racist in some aspect(even if it is mild), has been raped and/or molested, has had an abortion, is religious but "doesn't practice" or is athiest, has been physically/mentally/emotionally abused, and/or committed a misdemeanor/felony. Whereas with older generations this is simply not expected as it is the extreme. I think my generation and later has some of the most social hurdles than any of the older generations in a large part. In the 1980's 70's 60's ect. Schools were not under attack by drug-dealers, gangs, ect anywhere near as much as the h/s during the 1990's and on.
I think in the end, you can try to place blame whoever/whatever you want but it is ultimately up to the individual what kind of person he/she becomes. Yes, Generation-X and the Dotcom generation faces severe hurdles but we ultimately are the cause of our future. Anything else is a cop-out.
Or it could be just the beer talking.
Rimesume wrote:
If I meet a woman approximately my age it would be safe to assume that she is a drug addict, comes from a non-nuclear family, is racist in some aspect(even if it is mild), has been raped and/or molested, has had an abortion, is religious but "doesn't practice" or is athiest, has been physically/mentally/emotionally abused, and/or committed a misdemeanor/felony. Whereas with older generations this is simply not expected as it is the extreme. I think my generation and later has some of the most social hurdles than any of the older generations in a large part. In the 1980's 70's 60's ect. Schools were not under attack by drug-dealers, gangs, ect anywhere near as much as the h/s during the 1990's and on.
I thik that's safe to say about any woman in the 40 and under group. I would guess that there is no female that posts on these boards that hasnt' experienced at least one aspect of the above.
Jophiel wrote:
Just to nit-pick, students spend about six hours a day in school. And, in high school, that's probably less than an hour a day with any one instructor. In contrast, students spend about eighteen hours a day out of school and, one would hope, a good percentage of that time with their family. Who should be having more influence on the child's/teen's attitudes and work ethics?
Certainly the parents have an aspect of it. The parents in my town were largely rural/farm types. A strong work ethic was a commonality rather than a rarity. Parents in our town encouraged hard work, whether it be in academics, or in athletics. I don't know how school is today, but when I went to school you were there from 8:30 to 4:30. There was no job programs, where you got to skip out of school to work at the mall, or anything like that. Not really sure if that was due to the fact that we didn't have a mall, or whether it was due to something else. There were simply no work-release programs. I didn't see that till I move to a larger city after I escaped from college, and then I saw it was common practice to let junior/senior students out early for job programs. This suprised and befuddled me, though I didn't question it at the time. At that point I thought it was quite the good deal. Making money while earing credits seems almost too good to be true. However, looking back I wonder how much those students actually learning punching a register at a clothing store.
Some people are like slinkies, they aren't really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.
I think in a very large way contemporary American society has been degrading, why is it a surprise that the education system, and more importantly it's students are following suit?
Quote:
I think in the end, you can try to place blame whoever/whatever you want but it is ultimately up to the individual what kind of person he/she becomes. Yes, Generation-X and the Dotcom generation faces severe hurdles but we ultimately are the cause of our future. Anything else is a cop-out.
I'm not trying to place blame. I guess what I'm trying to say is that we are largely a product of our environment. What environment that is can be determined largely by ourselves, if we're willing to take charge and begin to set an example to those who will follow. I don't know who it was that began that trend in my school, but I'd honestly like to find out.
I recall sitting in a ceremony when I was in 3rd or 4th grade. It was an even smaller school than that which I graduated from. The purpose of the cermony was to congradulate the seniors of the school for their accomplishments. The whole town turned out for it. As I recall, there were 13 students in the graduating class, one of which was my cousin. I sat there as a kid and watched him repeatedly get called up to the stage for various awards. It was at that point, that I decided I wanted that much attention when my time came.
When that time came, it was a larger school. But I would like to think that I accomplished my goal. I recieved achedemic, community, and even musical accolades. Part of that, I am sure, was seeing my older cousin recieve the support and attention when he graduated.
I don't believe it's the parental influence, although that certainly plays a part. But I think everyone agrees that at the younger age your peers present more of an impression to you than your parents, teachers, or family does. You could have your parents and teachers pushing you all day, but if your peers chastise you for attempting to excel than it makes it more difficult than any other obstacle in regards to trying to excel and push yourself.
I guess the whole point in my topic is simply for those that are still in school. You can set the example for those following. If your class begins to set the example that pushing yourself in your studies is important, you can change a whole communtities outlook on what is important.
When I go home, I'm often praised for my progress professionally. Yet I am never happy with that, and am always trying to excel beyond my current situation. I directly contribute that drive to those who went before me, and set high standards. I would encourage any who are still in High Scool, or even Junior High to try to set those standards. All it takes is someone to begin it, set off on the right step could begin a chain of success. You can begin a standard that will cause a whole community to strive for something greater than the norm. Once it begins, it's almost impossible to stop. The hard part is starting it.
Some people are like slinkies, they aren't really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.
I went to school and got mah edumacation and tain't no way I'm reading all them paragrafs.
I'm not trying to place blame. I guess what I'm trying to say is that we are largely a product of our environment.
Though I see your point and I agree with it, I will play the devils advocate.
Couldn't one argue that proclaiming "we are largely a product of our enviroment" is shifting the blame from ourselves to our enviroment placed around us?
Though I see your point and I agree with it, I will play the devils advocate.
Couldn't one argue that proclaiming "we are largely a product of our enviroment" is shifting the blame from ourselves to our enviroment placed around us?
Quote:
Though I see your point and I agree with it, I will play the devils advocate.
Couldn't one argue that proclaiming "we are largely a product of our enviroment" is shifting the blame from ourselves to our enviroment placed around us?
Couldn't one argue that proclaiming "we are largely a product of our enviroment" is shifting the blame from ourselves to our enviroment placed around us?
Fair enough.
OK. We are shifting the blame to the environment around us. But who provides that environment? Our peers, at that age, certainly. So all that is really required is that those peers who have the influence (and they know who they are) to change the environment to one that encourages this sort of peer pressure.
Some people are like slinkies, they aren't really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.
Quote:
It has been sometime since I attended high school, however things have changed from 1980's h/s flix, at least in the urban aspect. I attended high school in Colorado Springs, class of 1999. It wasn't that the jocks beat up the nerds, but more inline with the Bloods beat up the Crips, or the Peckerwoods beat up the Bloods, or the Mexican Mafia beat up on some Peckerwoods and so on. Gangs, violence, drugs, single parenthood, and racial distrust plague my generation. Much more than the public schools, public media, and admin boards were willing to admit. In other parts of the city gang related homicide was not all that uncommon among kids attending h/s. Harrison High had at least 5 gang related murders during my junior year alone.
This is nice to hear; brings back a lot of memories since I graduated in '97 and also did all my schooling in Colorado Springs. I even got to attend East Junior High the year after they were on Primetime with the undercover cameras showing kids stabbing one another in the hallways with pen-knives. That place got me ready for high school, which in turn gave me a great education in how to weigh a baggie and eat it if you have to.
I'm all for blaming parents, but it's pretty easy to see the enviroment's effect on my life. I was a standout as were many of my peers, but it was a scary time. I had plenty of sick days because someone had threatened me and I couldn't bring myself to go to school back in junior high, and as I changed into someone cool enough to not have their asS kicked on a regular basis in high school it meant selling drugs, casual sex and violence. Most of the guys I know from high school are locked up to this day, I was ironically fortunate and got my jail time all out of my system while I could still go to a juvenile facility. I was lucky to be, for a lack of a better word this early in the morning, smarter than 99% of my peers and I knew that I was going to need an educataion.
I had to get that education on my own, though. When I was 16 and old enough to get a GED I did that, and immediately started taking courses at the community college. I was failing out of my public high school, or coming close to it, and yet I was able to literally ace the GED exam and carry a 4.0 in my college courses. I made sure to take courses that would transfer to high school credit, and it got me out of there a year early, in the end. Without the scholarship that came along with my GED scores, I almost certainly wouldn't have graduated. Without my education I'd most assuredly be down at the criminal justice center or maybe even Canyon City, where two of my high school pals are for charges ranging from GTA to attempted murder. Somehow I'm a fooking insurance agent now, still in Colorado Springs, and it honestly baffles me how I did it.
In summary: there's certainly something to be said for enviroment outside the home. My parents were highly involved, too, be it Dad coaching my little league teams or Mom being on the PTA, so I'd give them credit, but I reserve most of it for myself.
Now the random beatings for wearing the wrong team's jersey, or the time I got stabbed in the face by a rival drug dealer when I was 15? I'd give those credit, too, but not in the same way. My family and myself get credit for lifting me up; the negative stuff gets it's due credit for scaring the shIt out of me, making me get out of high school a year early and making me generally distrust anyone younger than me to this day.
I, admittedly, didn't read this whole thread nor even all of Kakar's OP (gees - it's long!!), but that's not gonna stop me now.
Successful schools are due to successful kids who are bred by successful parents. It's really that simple.
A generality yes, there are certainly exceptions but by and large it's the parents and the choices they make about their kids education that will determine a kid's success.
(so it's good to start by 'making decisions' which many lower class communities/families don't do because they feel they can't afford it or just don't afford or just don't care - values and priorities, eh.)
I don't agree about it being our peers at all. If peers get in the way of a kid's education in a family that puts a high value on learning, the family will resolve that problem. I think instead what you have in a successful school are a bunch of kids (ok, the majority) that all take school seriously because that is was they were taught AT HOME and in their everyday environment.
Edited, Sat Mar 4 06:54:30 2006 by Elinda
Successful schools are due to successful kids who are bred by successful parents. It's really that simple.
A generality yes, there are certainly exceptions but by and large it's the parents and the choices they make about their kids education that will determine a kid's success.
(so it's good to start by 'making decisions' which many lower class communities/families don't do because they feel they can't afford it or just don't afford or just don't care - values and priorities, eh.)
I don't agree about it being our peers at all. If peers get in the way of a kid's education in a family that puts a high value on learning, the family will resolve that problem. I think instead what you have in a successful school are a bunch of kids (ok, the majority) that all take school seriously because that is was they were taught AT HOME and in their everyday environment.
Edited, Sat Mar 4 06:54:30 2006 by Elinda
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
How do you get a community to stand up be acccountable though? How do you make an unsuccessful school turn it around? The junior high I mentioned I went to was on a national news program, for bob's sake, and close to fifteen years later there's still discussion of closing the place down due to substandard test scores. Frankly, I wish they would, the place is an embarassment.
My first day at East I went to use the restroom and set my supplies on top of the urinal. I was not a large kid then, nor am I anything akin to a large man, now, but the guy who came in and took my books was. It was not unusual for kids to be driving themselves to school, even in junior high, because they had been left back multiple times. Now sure, that kid's parents failed him, apparently, and he had no school supplies. How did my folks have any blame in this highly formative situation? They did everything right, and yet my peers made my first day of junior high a different kind of learning experience. I didn't have to deal with his parents, I had to deal with him, my peer, so I could honestly give a shIt if he was from the same middle-class background I was or if his parents were smoking a glass **** all day while he went out and stole Trapper Keepers to feed their addiction.
My first day at East I went to use the restroom and set my supplies on top of the urinal. I was not a large kid then, nor am I anything akin to a large man, now, but the guy who came in and took my books was. It was not unusual for kids to be driving themselves to school, even in junior high, because they had been left back multiple times. Now sure, that kid's parents failed him, apparently, and he had no school supplies. How did my folks have any blame in this highly formative situation? They did everything right, and yet my peers made my first day of junior high a different kind of learning experience. I didn't have to deal with his parents, I had to deal with him, my peer, so I could honestly give a shIt if he was from the same middle-class background I was or if his parents were smoking a glass **** all day while he went out and stole Trapper Keepers to feed their addiction.
I'm out the door in a minute here so I'm not typing much but my previous post wasn't intended to solely place blame on the parents. Rather, I took exception to the phrase "produce these students" as if schools are given lumps of iron and, following a model, can always produce high grade steel.
Parents, community, peer groups, teachers, the school as a whole, etc... all are going to matter to some degree or another and I don't think you can easily say "This school is a success or failure due to ______". Perhaps a child from a poor community will succeed because of exceptional instructors who work with him or her. Perhaps a student with poor instructors will succeed despite them due to strong family environment that doesn't take "but my teacher sucks" as an excuse. A school in a violent community will have a hard time getting the students to focus on education despite its best efforts.
I don't excuse the teachers either. I think that a good teacher can help promote a desire to learn even in a less than stellar environment and hopefully get the students to go beyond what their family, community and peers expect of them. but it's still a single piece of the puzzle.
Parents, community, peer groups, teachers, the school as a whole, etc... all are going to matter to some degree or another and I don't think you can easily say "This school is a success or failure due to ______". Perhaps a child from a poor community will succeed because of exceptional instructors who work with him or her. Perhaps a student with poor instructors will succeed despite them due to strong family environment that doesn't take "but my teacher sucks" as an excuse. A school in a violent community will have a hard time getting the students to focus on education despite its best efforts.
I don't excuse the teachers either. I think that a good teacher can help promote a desire to learn even in a less than stellar environment and hopefully get the students to go beyond what their family, community and peers expect of them. but it's still a single piece of the puzzle.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Quote:
committed a misdemeanor/felony
But does it count if I didn't get caught?
Edited, Sat Mar 4 11:15:13 2006 by Yanari
I graduated in 2001 from a small town, we were the biggest graduation class ever with 94 people. (Until recently) When we were freshmen we had 110 people, iirc in the class. I can only think of a couple of people that acctually dropped out, but remember a few moving away and 1 dying in an accident. We all tried our hardest to gradaute, because most of us wanted to be part of the biggest class to graduate.
We had a drug dealer in the class that was in school almost every day. Even though the people around him dropped out he wanted to get he's diploma. We even had a guy that was suppose to graduate when we were freshmen come back and graduate with us. There was something about that class that makes me feel good to be a part of. The one's I do keep in touch with have all graduated college or are close to it. Some are teachers, engineers, and some run their own business. We are just one of those classes that want big things out of live and do them.
Our valedictorian and salutatorian were only a .2 GPA off of each other. We even had people that come from very poor familys in the top 10 of the class. I think in this case it was the peers that pushed everyone to do better than anyone else. And I thank them for that.
I hate to say it but I never went to college. School has just always bored me, but I met the women of my life that challenges me and wants me to go to school. So I told her I would go, I hope to start this coming fall. My younger sister will graduate next December and both my younger brothers are in a higher eduacation program in their school. So excelling in school is something thatn runs in the family.
We had a drug dealer in the class that was in school almost every day. Even though the people around him dropped out he wanted to get he's diploma. We even had a guy that was suppose to graduate when we were freshmen come back and graduate with us. There was something about that class that makes me feel good to be a part of. The one's I do keep in touch with have all graduated college or are close to it. Some are teachers, engineers, and some run their own business. We are just one of those classes that want big things out of live and do them.
Our valedictorian and salutatorian were only a .2 GPA off of each other. We even had people that come from very poor familys in the top 10 of the class. I think in this case it was the peers that pushed everyone to do better than anyone else. And I thank them for that.
I hate to say it but I never went to college. School has just always bored me, but I met the women of my life that challenges me and wants me to go to school. So I told her I would go, I hope to start this coming fall. My younger sister will graduate next December and both my younger brothers are in a higher eduacation program in their school. So excelling in school is something thatn runs in the family.
Elinda wrote:
Successful schools are due to successful kids who are bred by successful parents.
QFT
Yanari wrote:
Guilty!
But does it count if I didn't get caught?
But does it count if I didn't get caught?
Sure does.
The question is, can you remember how many times you have committed said acts. Mine would be in the thousands. Only been caught 4 times though~
Breaking the law is way too easy to do. I would have to say that not a day has gone by over the last ten years where I have broken the law at least once.
But hey, I like to think i'm still a decent person.
I graduated in 2002, from a school in Georgia. I am from NJ, and my mother moved us to Ga at the start of my high school years. From what I have read, basically the school systems that get the most financial backing have a better turn out of grades, and higher graduation rates. I believe our upbringing along with where we go to school, and things we have gone through as young adults makes us who we are.
At my school, there were cliques and the most popular kids were the "badasses" who never really cared, because of something they went through, or just because they thought it was cool. As I went to like 10th grade and so on..(the city I lived in High School started at 8th grade -.-), even though my home life was crazy as hell, I was able to gain more confidence in myself not to care what others thought about me. By no means was I a perfect student, lmao, I strived for good grades and got them, but it was hard because most of the teachers at my school didnt give a damn whether you passed or failed. I was lucky enough to have the same teachers that actually cared for my senior years. Every school is different though, some schools will have cliques that are clearly defined like "jocks", "cheerleaders", "nerds", and so on, but some schools dont, it just depends on where you go to school.
Our school didnt have a performing arts, it used to but the budget was cut. We had to use our own money to start a chorus. Our text books were old as hell. :( Basically, our funding was limited, but at the same time we had no one fighting so we could get funding. Thats how certain school systems thrive and some dont. Also, depending upon where the school is located. In NJ, I went to a prodominatly white school, we had a lot of resources, because we had great funding. In Ga I went to a prodominatly Black school that had a lot less funding, but in Ga a low % of the state budget goes towards education. In NJ, the % is somewhere around 20%. Ga is ranked 49th on the list of school ratings -.-, NJ is in the 10th. I saw excellent students at both schools in both states, but the main thing I saw was that, the kid who basically was going through a lot of **** in their life had it harder than someone who had a good home life. Also, a school with better funding will have higher graduation rates, and test scores, because the resources are available to give the student every possible chance to succeed.
At my school, there were cliques and the most popular kids were the "badasses" who never really cared, because of something they went through, or just because they thought it was cool. As I went to like 10th grade and so on..(the city I lived in High School started at 8th grade -.-), even though my home life was crazy as hell, I was able to gain more confidence in myself not to care what others thought about me. By no means was I a perfect student, lmao, I strived for good grades and got them, but it was hard because most of the teachers at my school didnt give a damn whether you passed or failed. I was lucky enough to have the same teachers that actually cared for my senior years. Every school is different though, some schools will have cliques that are clearly defined like "jocks", "cheerleaders", "nerds", and so on, but some schools dont, it just depends on where you go to school.
Our school didnt have a performing arts, it used to but the budget was cut. We had to use our own money to start a chorus. Our text books were old as hell. :( Basically, our funding was limited, but at the same time we had no one fighting so we could get funding. Thats how certain school systems thrive and some dont. Also, depending upon where the school is located. In NJ, I went to a prodominatly white school, we had a lot of resources, because we had great funding. In Ga I went to a prodominatly Black school that had a lot less funding, but in Ga a low % of the state budget goes towards education. In NJ, the % is somewhere around 20%. Ga is ranked 49th on the list of school ratings -.-, NJ is in the 10th. I saw excellent students at both schools in both states, but the main thing I saw was that, the kid who basically was going through a lot of **** in their life had it harder than someone who had a good home life. Also, a school with better funding will have higher graduation rates, and test scores, because the resources are available to give the student every possible chance to succeed.
I was reading a few days ago about penicillin(or rather a review of a book on the psychology behind happiness), and supposedly how the first recipient, back in 1940 had developed septicemia after being scratched by a rose thorn. He was treating with the expirimental drug for five days at which point they ran out of the drug and he died.
I imagine people weren't quite as violent, as may be seen now, somewhat out of necessity, given death had been so easy to come by for such a long time. Now you can be shot at a number of times and still have a reasonably good chance at living.
Which makes me somewhat wonder if the amount of violence that occurs at times in schools with stabbings and such possibly being relatable to being beat up in the past, lethality-wise.
I imagine people weren't quite as violent, as may be seen now, somewhat out of necessity, given death had been so easy to come by for such a long time. Now you can be shot at a number of times and still have a reasonably good chance at living.
Which makes me somewhat wonder if the amount of violence that occurs at times in schools with stabbings and such possibly being relatable to being beat up in the past, lethality-wise.
Just something I wanted to pass along to this thread, as it seemed appropriate.
My HS career was a little strange, as it took place in an institution for teh b4d kids. I hadn't gone to normal kids school for about five years by then, but that's another story.
What I thought was interesting to note was this...
The year I arrived, I was a Sophomore, and was kind of a mess. I won't go into the reasons I was there, but I was aggressive, violent, and barely functional. Which was ok, since most of the kids there were equally screwed up. What has always stuck with me was the one overriding thing we all seemed to feel and recognize.
Fear.
We were all terrified. Not of each other, but mostly of the future. The majority of us had no where to go back to. If we ****** this up, we were done. Capital D kind of done.
One of the interesting things about a place like that is that the consequences are immediate and obvious for every failure. If you screwed up there, you Went Away. And you didn't come back again, either. You were Finished.
Intellectually, I understand that once expelled, those kids went either back to jail or juvie, or a long term mental institution. But when you are already in the place two or three steps down the road from where the normal kids go when they Go Away, the next steps are the really, really final ones for a kid. The kind that puts you in places that you simply do not recover from. That was what drove a lot of us. We talked about it sometimes, and used it. Like a kind of motivation.
And it worked.
We weren't friends, most of us in my class, but we were all afraid, and did what we could to make sure we made it to graduation together. I remember myself tutoring a handful of people that I really couldn't stand in my English class, because I understood that if they failed there, they were done for. I may not have liked them, but there we were, and they took it seriously.
I had the benefit of receiving the same kind of help in my calc class from a girl that obviously thought I was the devil, but was still willing to do what she could.
I wonder sometimes if that kind of dynamic was purely situational, or if you could impress it on the kids in normal school settings, and see where it takes them. Make them utterly aware that if they **** up, they're Done, and that they are not going to make it without help.
I'm rambling here, I haven't slept really since friday, but this thread just made me remember the overriding...color?..of my own HS years.
I know that of my graduating class, at least half are still doing ok, and my own group of misfits still keep in loose contact. One just finished his Psychology degree, and one just got her Engineering crap finished with.
I seem to be the only sucker dumb enough to have joined the military.
But all in all, I think fear would be a tremendously useful tool, if you apply it right. An "us against them" mentality could do wonders...
Or maybe, like I said earlier, it was entirely situational.
My HS career was a little strange, as it took place in an institution for teh b4d kids. I hadn't gone to normal kids school for about five years by then, but that's another story.
What I thought was interesting to note was this...
The year I arrived, I was a Sophomore, and was kind of a mess. I won't go into the reasons I was there, but I was aggressive, violent, and barely functional. Which was ok, since most of the kids there were equally screwed up. What has always stuck with me was the one overriding thing we all seemed to feel and recognize.
Fear.
We were all terrified. Not of each other, but mostly of the future. The majority of us had no where to go back to. If we ****** this up, we were done. Capital D kind of done.
One of the interesting things about a place like that is that the consequences are immediate and obvious for every failure. If you screwed up there, you Went Away. And you didn't come back again, either. You were Finished.
Intellectually, I understand that once expelled, those kids went either back to jail or juvie, or a long term mental institution. But when you are already in the place two or three steps down the road from where the normal kids go when they Go Away, the next steps are the really, really final ones for a kid. The kind that puts you in places that you simply do not recover from. That was what drove a lot of us. We talked about it sometimes, and used it. Like a kind of motivation.
And it worked.
We weren't friends, most of us in my class, but we were all afraid, and did what we could to make sure we made it to graduation together. I remember myself tutoring a handful of people that I really couldn't stand in my English class, because I understood that if they failed there, they were done for. I may not have liked them, but there we were, and they took it seriously.
I had the benefit of receiving the same kind of help in my calc class from a girl that obviously thought I was the devil, but was still willing to do what she could.
I wonder sometimes if that kind of dynamic was purely situational, or if you could impress it on the kids in normal school settings, and see where it takes them. Make them utterly aware that if they **** up, they're Done, and that they are not going to make it without help.
I'm rambling here, I haven't slept really since friday, but this thread just made me remember the overriding...color?..of my own HS years.
I know that of my graduating class, at least half are still doing ok, and my own group of misfits still keep in loose contact. One just finished his Psychology degree, and one just got her Engineering crap finished with.
I seem to be the only sucker dumb enough to have joined the military.
But all in all, I think fear would be a tremendously useful tool, if you apply it right. An "us against them" mentality could do wonders...
Or maybe, like I said earlier, it was entirely situational.
Traumitizing kids would be interesting for Cops shows, but I imagine you'd just be creating more people that would just be annoying to sit near in a movie theatre.
Yeah, probably right.
I think the main problem with most kids is that they don't really know of anything that a good education could realistically help them achieve. Rather than having some scientists being glorified among youths about how they're coming up with ways to grow meat(funny story, they can make meat grow in pans now without an animal to carve it from), they glorify atheletes. Kids hear about how cool some basketball player is and how much money he has and see that as a more realistic goal to try achieving then getting into accounting.
A possible remedy would be to try and get kids, who are still in elementary and middle school, to learn a bit about possible professions alongside their studies and get a better idea of how they would make a career in some line of study.
Though I suppose you run into the random issues of people also not being too enthused by the idea of reading as a recreational activity in some areas, and just having that strange "deer in the headlights" stare when you bring up such a concept in any form. Such things probably help make people stay a bit disconnected from such ideas at younger ages of even building up a career.
Edited, Mon Mar 6 08:00:32 2006 by Vensuvio
A possible remedy would be to try and get kids, who are still in elementary and middle school, to learn a bit about possible professions alongside their studies and get a better idea of how they would make a career in some line of study.
Though I suppose you run into the random issues of people also not being too enthused by the idea of reading as a recreational activity in some areas, and just having that strange "deer in the headlights" stare when you bring up such a concept in any form. Such things probably help make people stay a bit disconnected from such ideas at younger ages of even building up a career.
Edited, Mon Mar 6 08:00:32 2006 by Vensuvio
I graduated in 2003, from a very small class for students with behavioral problems. I was involved in many fights in my younger days, refusing to back down from anyone. I ended up in a school that was rampant with drug dealers, users, and other various malcontents. I spent the last six years of my education there and watched many fall into depravity.
Meanwhile in my home life my family was going through much the same. My mother quit her job, we slowly started losing everything including the house, She fell into her old teenage lifestyle of sleeping around and started cookin meth. My sisters soon follwed her example.
We ended up all movin into my grandmothers house, where without a second thought, my mother soon took advantage of my grandmothers hospitality and ran her 40 grand in debt. And at the earliest convienence left without every coughing up a penny.
Throughout all of this I did not fall into a life of depravity, I did not follow the examples of my peers or family. I believe that a person chooses what will mold them. Many people choose to follow examples of those around them. I did not, and I rose above those around me. I was one of less than 20% of my class graduated.
I may be one of the lucky few who is not as affected by society as most, but I'd like to think that that I chose what would shape what I would become. To grow up to be an upstanding citizen you must simply discover what is defining a child's life and manipulate it to achieve the best results.
Meanwhile in my home life my family was going through much the same. My mother quit her job, we slowly started losing everything including the house, She fell into her old teenage lifestyle of sleeping around and started cookin meth. My sisters soon follwed her example.
We ended up all movin into my grandmothers house, where without a second thought, my mother soon took advantage of my grandmothers hospitality and ran her 40 grand in debt. And at the earliest convienence left without every coughing up a penny.
Throughout all of this I did not fall into a life of depravity, I did not follow the examples of my peers or family. I believe that a person chooses what will mold them. Many people choose to follow examples of those around them. I did not, and I rose above those around me. I was one of less than 20% of my class graduated.
I may be one of the lucky few who is not as affected by society as most, but I'd like to think that that I chose what would shape what I would become. To grow up to be an upstanding citizen you must simply discover what is defining a child's life and manipulate it to achieve the best results.
12 posts
put simple you are wut u live and know only you can change the channel just hope u like wut u change it to
Brevity certainly goes out the window with me after a 12 pack. I'm just suprised my spelling and grammar didn't turn into:
You are one of the individuals that when I get all drunk on a Friday night and wax intellectual I weep for.
Quote:
put simple you are wut u live and know only you can change the channel just hope u like wut u change it to
You are one of the individuals that when I get all drunk on a Friday night and wax intellectual I weep for.
Some people are like slinkies, they aren't really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.
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