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Drugs legal in the US if used to talk to god ......Follow

#1 Feb 23 2006 at 1:16 PM Rating: Excellent
No I am not joking!

Linky

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A small US congregation can use hallucinogenic tea as part of its rituals to connect with God, the Supreme Court has ruled.


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The hoasca tea is considered sacred to members of the group, O Centro Espirita Beneficente Uniao do Vegetal.


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Members of the group believe they can understand God only by drinking the tea, which is consumed twice a month at four-hour ceremonies


What a dangerous precident this sets.

I do not take drugs but if I did .. and lived in the US .. I would be starting a religious cult based on my drug and its potency in "reaching god". Anyone claiming it is illegal ... I would cite this case.

And besides all that, how on earth is a drug supposed to bring you closer to god? Smiley: oyvey

#2 Feb 23 2006 at 1:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Other religions have used drugs. Pot, peyote, other hallucinogens like mescal.

I could (but won't, because I'm lazy) make an argument that the sacramental wine is used to relax the mind and make one more receptive to the idea of an Almighty Bob.

Other religions make use of the body's own "drugs", like endorphins. The ecstatic experience is really a result of physical stress combined with a mental trance state. Does it bring the participants closer to Bob? I don't know - do you?
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#3 Feb 23 2006 at 1:21 PM Rating: Decent
JennockFV wrote:
And besides all that, how on earth is a drug supposed to bring you closer to god? Smiley: oyvey
They didn;t claim that, they claimed that it allowed them to understand God. This has been going on for centuries. Even natives used drugs for enlightenment. I can see using a drug to become deeply focused into a meditative state that would allow you to perhaps think more clearly regarding your belief or teaching. I would not bring in the question of Divinity since no religion can boast that with backing evidence.
#4 Feb 23 2006 at 1:22 PM Rating: Default
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JennockFV wrote:
And besides all that, how on earth is a drug supposed to bring you closer to god? Smiley: oyvey

Some crazy people actually believe drinking an alcoholic beverage like wine brings them closer to some dude named Jesus.

Weirdos.
#6 Feb 23 2006 at 1:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Some crazy people actually believe drinking an alcoholic beverage like wine brings them closer to some dude named Jesus.


Crazy people they are too Smiley: yikes

Actually on a serious note, is the communion not based on the last supper of Christ. Where he and his disciples ate bread and wine. There was symbolism of this being his "body", that has nothing to do with understanding him, does it?
I seem to remember something about Judas being mentioned by Christ too "someone will betray me" or something or other ...

I best play my DvD of "dogma" and study
#7 Feb 23 2006 at 1:28 PM Rating: Decent
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When they find a way to make money off of weed, then it will be legal. Like they are trying to make it so that you need a prescription for vitamins, come'on I've never heard of anyone overdosing on Vitamin C, god forbid they catch my 16 year old cousin selling Flintstones vitamins at school.

Edited, Thu Feb 23 13:28:55 2006 by kalaria
#8 Feb 23 2006 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
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Some Indians have used Peyote for hundreds of years in ceremonial rituals, and I'm pretty sure it's legal on Reservation land, and has been.
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#9 Feb 23 2006 at 1:30 PM Rating: Decent
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too much vitamin c just gives you the *****...trust me
#10 Feb 23 2006 at 1:34 PM Rating: Decent
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I would not bring in the question of Divinity since no religion can boast that with backing evidence.


The whole basis of faith is belief without the requirement for "backing evidence." Science requires evidentiary support. Religion merely requires a belief in and following of the tenets of the religion.
#12 Feb 23 2006 at 1:45 PM Rating: Decent
Family Guy wrote:

"Is this really the blood of Christ??"
"Yes, it is."
"Wow. Jesus must have been freakin' wasted like 24/7."

#14 Feb 23 2006 at 1:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Kakar the Vile wrote:
Some Indians have used Peyote for hundreds of years in ceremonial rituals, and I'm pretty sure it's legal on Reservation land, and has been.


Yeah ... It's one of the drugs I was always waaaaaay to scared to try. Shrooms was wild enough. Extending the trip for another 20 hours sounds insane.


/wild memories
#15 Feb 23 2006 at 1:52 PM Rating: Good
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I'm sorry to dissapoint you officer, but I'm using this DMT to communicate with god. So you can't touch me!

Go USA!

I wonder if you can use the same to argue for **** sex in Georgia.

OH god! OH god!
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But I hear a tale
About a heaven in Alberta
Where they've got all hell for a basement"

#16 Feb 23 2006 at 3:21 PM Rating: Default
I've actually known people involved in this religion in the U.S. I'm sure they will be very happy with this decision. And while I did think it was a bit weird at first, it didn't take me long to get past it. They are good people with good hearts, they don't hurt anyone and wouldn't ever, so whatever makes them happy is fine with me.
#17 Feb 23 2006 at 7:30 PM Rating: Decent
I huff gasoline when I want to see god or travel through time, it's multi-purposeful.
#18 Feb 23 2006 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
Elderon wrote:
They didn;t claim that, they claimed that it allowed them to understand God.
I would have asked what (s)he/they said before passing judgement if they understand 'em so well.
#19 Feb 23 2006 at 11:32 PM Rating: Decent
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132 posts

Quote:

What a dangerous precident this sets.

Danger for who? Drug takers? They already ingest these drugs, laws or no, making them legal would not start or stop them taking drugs.

Quote:

I do not take drugs but if I did .. and lived in the US .. I would be starting a religious cult based on my drug and its potency in "reaching god". Anyone claiming it is illegal ... I would cite this case.

This is a nice thought, but do you think a judge will buy your religious cult? If you have no honest claim to the drugs or religion then citing this case will get you nowhere.

Quote:
And besides all that, how on earth is a drug supposed to bring you closer to god? icon

If you believe in God, you generally believe in a supernatural realm outside physical time and/or space. This is often refered to as the spirit realm. Drugs can be seen as an effective tool to explore this realm, as they open the conciousness to experiences outside the physical senses. Whether this is an illusion or real is beside the point, because the realm exists outside of reality anyway, making it illusiory by definition. Many religions use meditation, prayer etc. as a tool to communicate with this other realm. Some use drugs.

Remember that you probably believe in the largest religion, namely western medicine. This is puported to be scientifically founded, yet is usually uses no better than heresay and anecdotal evidence. They use more drugs than any religion on earth, legally.

If these people want to drink tea, and that affects nobody but them, what business is it of yours what they put in their bodies? Where does the danger lie?
#20 Feb 24 2006 at 2:38 AM Rating: Decent
/sigh...... And this one too:

"Supreme Court rules against post office
Woman who tripped on mail at door sued
Jennifer A. Dlouhy, Hearst Newspapers

Thursday, February 23, 2006


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Washington -- People who tumble over mail left in their doorways can sue the U.S. Postal Service, the Supreme Court ruled Wednesday.

In a 7-1 decision, the panel said a Pennsylvania woman could continue her lawsuit blaming the post office when she tripped over packages and letters left on her porch in 2001. The woman wants the U.S. Postal Service to pick up the tab for injuries in the fall.

But the federal government argued that the Postal Service was immune from lawsuits under a federal statute blocking suits involving the "loss, miscarriage or negligent transmission of letters."

Writing for a majority of the court, Justice Anthony Kennedy said the federal law was only intended to cover losses from mail that is misdirected, lost or damaged en route.

"Congress did not intend to immunize all postal activities," Kennedy wrote.

Kennedy noted that in a 1984 case, the Supreme Court said the Postal Service could be held liable for accidents involving its delivery trucks. Placing mail in a way that creates a risk of accidents is no different, Kennedy wrote.

Justice Clarence Thomas was the only dissenter in the case. Newly installed Justice Samuel Alito did not participate.

Government lawyers had implored the Supreme Court not to allow the Pennsylvania woman's suit to go forward because, they said, it would open the floodgates for slip-and-fall claims that would be hard to disprove.

At risk, the government said, was the efficiency of the entire mail system. Every day, the U.S. Postal Service delivers roughly 660 million pieces of mail to as many as 142 million mailboxes, doorsteps and other drop-offs.

Mail carriers often have to place packages on front porches or at doorsteps because they won't fit through mail slots or in boxes, Assistant Solicitor General Patricia Millett told the court during oral arguments in November. Millett argued the Postal Service was defenseless against slip-and-fall lawsuits, which can be filed long after someone trips over a package without any witnesses.

Gerry McKiernan, spokesman for the Postal Service, said that in the wake of the decision, carriers would receive a refresher course on delivery protocols.

The Associated Press contributed to this report. The case is Dolan vs. United States Postal Service, No. 04-848. "


SO, basically I can't wait to claim religious affiliation with (insert group needing illegal drugs to Understand God better here - not to be confused with wine and that Neco wafer-like crap refered to as the "host" which are legal for church or otherwise... although I don't know who would voluntarily say, snack on a bag of "hosts," ) and have a grand ole tea party celebration after I claim Post Office Negligence when I "trip" on a poorly placed package outside my door...

YAY lawsuits and drugs! Maybe people can sacrificially kill others claiming religious beliefs next! WOOT - I can't wait to see how it all unfolds!

#21 Feb 26 2006 at 8:02 PM Rating: Good
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However small congregation is a vague term. So it could be argued that a "small congregation" is a group of at least 100 people. And then they'd also have plausible means of determining wether you are actually a 'legit' religious group or not. Do you meet regularly? have some form of service? And not just gather on sundays and smoke in jimmy's basement. The effort of having to go through all this to have a 'fake' religion to claim is bogus to me. Then they can also compare dates of your 'convergance' to what religion you denote in the census, on forms for college, and all sorts of other things. This ruling doesn't allow every drug userin america to say "It helps me see god!"
#22 Feb 26 2006 at 10:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Kakar the Vile wrote:
Some Indians have used Peyote for hundreds of years in ceremonial rituals, and I'm pretty sure it's legal on Reservation land, and has been.


It better be, you white DEVILS!
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#24 Feb 27 2006 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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Tazmaliah wrote:
However small congregation is a vague term. So it could be argued that a "small congregation" is a group of at least 100 people. And then they'd also have plausible means of determining wether you are actually a 'legit' religious group or not. Do you meet regularly? have some form of service? And not just gather on sundays and smoke in jimmy's basement. The effort of having to go through all this to have a 'fake' religion to claim is bogus to me. Then they can also compare dates of your 'convergance' to what religion you denote in the census, on forms for college, and all sorts of other things. This ruling doesn't allow every drug userin america to say "It helps me see god!"

Some info on the group itself:
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The UDV transmits its doctrine exclusively in its religious rituals Hoasca, tea, also called Vegetal, is distributed by the Mestre and has the objective of providing a state of balanced mental concentration to the disciples.
During the sessions "chamadas", or calls, are made - songs that transmit teachings, equilibrium and harmony. Everyone has the right to speak in the sessions. Mestres and Counselors transmit orientations useful in the individual transformation of each person.
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