Quote:
Did you read the Red Cross report stating that SEVENTY PERCENT of the detainees in Iraq were there for no apparent reason
90% actually.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/10/red.cross.report/index.html
Nexa
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Just saw the beheading videoFollow
90% actually.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/10/red.cross.report/index.html
Nexa
“It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes. But a half-wit remains a half-wit, and the emperor remains an emperor.â€
― Neil Gaiman, The Sandman, Vol. 9: The Kindly Ones
― Neil Gaiman, The Sandman, Vol. 9: The Kindly Ones
....
Nevermind..
Just
....
Edited, Wed May 12 08:26:10 2004 by Skeeter
Nevermind..
Just
....
Edited, Wed May 12 08:26:10 2004 by Skeeter
5 posts
One thing we've got to take into account before drawing any parallels between this incident and the Iraqi prisoner abuse is the fact that in the case of the Iraqi prisoners, we're dealing with a small handful of idiots overstepping their authority and acting outside of our principles as Americans - hell, our principles as civilized human beings. On the other hand, the fanatic scumbags who perpetrated this video and lopped off a man's head all the while praising 'God' are NOT the exception to the rule - they ARE the rule. And the Islamic extremists (not Islam in general, mind you, but the hardcore extremists who have twisted the religion to suit their own depravities) have NEVER needed an excuse to commit unspeakable crimes against anyone who doesn't subscribe to the same beliefs. Does anyone really believe al-Qaida's claim that this was simple retaliation for the Iraqi prisoner abuse? Can you honestly say this kind of thing wasn't happening before or wouldn't happen had the prisoner abuse issue not been brought to the world's attention? If you think that these zealots are only reacting to the actions of the United States then I truly pity your ignorance. These lunatics are pro-active in their belief that we all must die in the name of their religion and don't need any provocation to seek to do any of us harm. What greivous wrong had the U.S. perpetrated against them that morning 3 years ago when you turned on your TV to find New York City, the Pentagon and a Pennsylvania field in flames?
I can uderstand and support mental torture of iraqi's to a point. Hell if I am living in a country where I am trying to help them after overthrowing a despicable regime and all I get is bombs and bullets in return I would be pissed.
We do not walk in those soldiers shoes/boots (though I have). But if your doing a good deed far from home and all you get is deadly retaliation and you know you cannot just leave and go home (because you are a soldier), then you get frustrated. Hell watching your friends die or become cripples and knowing that each time you go outside the base your a target is highly stressful.
So I undertsand a bit of torture, only if it is to gather information about the people trying to kill me and my men. I do not agree with physical abuse and/or rape.
Most of the torture so far has been well done within standard guidlines used throughout many military formations worldwide.
The nudity factor is highly regarded in the region because for that religion and culture its extremely degrading. They think nothing of women and so being naked in front of one is a good way to upset them. there is also a reported case of a man being beaten for raping another inmate....well thats good.
The basis of torture is to stop having the tortured think clearly, if they think clearly they can decieve, if brought to a point where thought is influenced by rage and/or humiliation and fear they are more susceptible to telling the truth. And the truth is what we need....sometimes they are innocent, but with terrorists hiding amongst the population the odd innocent has to suffer.
We dont have a magic wand that identifies the baddies.
As for thr Iraqi's and the beheading, well that is inhuman and despicable.
My solution now is to not take any Iraqi prisoners anymore unless they offer up the murderers. They have brought a new level to the conflict and must suffer the consequences. Take the gloves off now and show them who is boss.
Its not as though those murdering bastards are not boasting about what they did, the ring leader and knife holder has already been identified. If honest Iraqi's dont give him up and his associates they are accomplaces in the crime.
We do not walk in those soldiers shoes/boots (though I have). But if your doing a good deed far from home and all you get is deadly retaliation and you know you cannot just leave and go home (because you are a soldier), then you get frustrated. Hell watching your friends die or become cripples and knowing that each time you go outside the base your a target is highly stressful.
So I undertsand a bit of torture, only if it is to gather information about the people trying to kill me and my men. I do not agree with physical abuse and/or rape.
Most of the torture so far has been well done within standard guidlines used throughout many military formations worldwide.
The nudity factor is highly regarded in the region because for that religion and culture its extremely degrading. They think nothing of women and so being naked in front of one is a good way to upset them. there is also a reported case of a man being beaten for raping another inmate....well thats good.
The basis of torture is to stop having the tortured think clearly, if they think clearly they can decieve, if brought to a point where thought is influenced by rage and/or humiliation and fear they are more susceptible to telling the truth. And the truth is what we need....sometimes they are innocent, but with terrorists hiding amongst the population the odd innocent has to suffer.
We dont have a magic wand that identifies the baddies.
As for thr Iraqi's and the beheading, well that is inhuman and despicable.
My solution now is to not take any Iraqi prisoners anymore unless they offer up the murderers. They have brought a new level to the conflict and must suffer the consequences. Take the gloves off now and show them who is boss.
Its not as though those murdering bastards are not boasting about what they did, the ring leader and knife holder has already been identified. If honest Iraqi's dont give him up and his associates they are accomplaces in the crime.
Quote:
They have brought a new level to the conflict
I'd say the conflict is at the same level.. disgusting barbarism.. all war is..
The new level that has been brought is Our Hatred.
I showed this video to several people and based on thier reaction it seem that they would have No Issues with torturing and beheading and More, All "sand-************* and "rag-heads".
We condemn the brutality by sinking to it our selves.....
I started watching the video yesterday but wisely asked myself "what the f'uck are you watching this for?" before they got to the beheading. The few seconds I saw gave me enough willies.
Wise Yanari, I have been disturbed all day.
Huh.
I must be some kind of twisted individual or maybe just jaded, because while it wasn't America's Funniest Home Videos, it wasn't what I was expecting-- gouts of blood spraying, screams, and a body flopping around in death.
What it was was another example of how badly Arabs do ****. They can't freaking hold the camera still, they can't keep it in focus, it takes five Arabs to kill one American, and they have to put him in an orange jumpsuit just so they can identify the dude-- otherwise they'd prolly start slicing each other up, the dumb bastards.
Arabs = savages
Totem
I must be some kind of twisted individual or maybe just jaded, because while it wasn't America's Funniest Home Videos, it wasn't what I was expecting-- gouts of blood spraying, screams, and a body flopping around in death.
What it was was another example of how badly Arabs do ****. They can't freaking hold the camera still, they can't keep it in focus, it takes five Arabs to kill one American, and they have to put him in an orange jumpsuit just so they can identify the dude-- otherwise they'd prolly start slicing each other up, the dumb bastards.
Arabs = savages
Totem
You must have seriously repressed empathy Totem.
11 posts
Well ... tell that the father from iraq who lost 5 kids and his wife cause a american high tech bomb was sure his house is a facility to produce weapons of mass destruction
Quote:
Wise Yanari, I have been disturbed all day.
Some would say it goes back much farther than just today.
I voted for the other guy.
Zing! Baddadum. Will you be performing all week Taco?
Standing room only, 2 performances a night.
I voted for the other guy.
What's really strange is that I was going to say that.
Perhaps not exactly in those words, but the same exact thought.
I figured cracking a joke would go against my whole "die" mentality though.
Well done.
Skeeter/Thundra/Tacosid/Mrens/trunks
Perhaps not exactly in those words, but the same exact thought.
I figured cracking a joke would go against my whole "die" mentality though.
Well done.
Skeeter/Thundra/Tacosid/Mrens/trunks
These things happen all the time...
Beheadings, rape, innocents killed for no reason
I know that most people don't see it on CNN everyday, but don't let that fool you into thinking that it doesn't happen all the time. I can think of 4 people that have been beheaded in Afghanistan in the past 2 months, and all were "innocent" cilvillians doing their best to better the country. Some were just laying down concrete to keep the road from Kabul to Kandahar in shape for these big *** jingle trucks they drive around.
We can't fight like they fight. We can't kill like they kill. We have rules and regulations we have to follow, and those who don't follow these rules will and should be punished to the full extent.
Just don't think this is new or isolated. It's happening everywhere all the time.
Afghani's are known for using women to reproduce and young boys for pleasure. Thats pretty sick, but somewhat excepted in their circles. We caught a little "orgy" going on in a conex box during a "lunch" break from their work on base. The guy that found the 2 adults and kids took the kids out of the conex, shut the door behind him and beat the **** out of the 2 adults.
It sucks to have to say that these events aren't special and the only reason you are even hearing about it is beacuse of the "cool" video tape that came with it that some web pages will use for hits and CNN uses for ratings.
Beheadings, rape, innocents killed for no reason
I know that most people don't see it on CNN everyday, but don't let that fool you into thinking that it doesn't happen all the time. I can think of 4 people that have been beheaded in Afghanistan in the past 2 months, and all were "innocent" cilvillians doing their best to better the country. Some were just laying down concrete to keep the road from Kabul to Kandahar in shape for these big *** jingle trucks they drive around.
We can't fight like they fight. We can't kill like they kill. We have rules and regulations we have to follow, and those who don't follow these rules will and should be punished to the full extent.
Just don't think this is new or isolated. It's happening everywhere all the time.
Afghani's are known for using women to reproduce and young boys for pleasure. Thats pretty sick, but somewhat excepted in their circles. We caught a little "orgy" going on in a conex box during a "lunch" break from their work on base. The guy that found the 2 adults and kids took the kids out of the conex, shut the door behind him and beat the **** out of the 2 adults.
It sucks to have to say that these events aren't special and the only reason you are even hearing about it is beacuse of the "cool" video tape that came with it that some web pages will use for hits and CNN uses for ratings.
Quote:
That was just f**king barbaric - the US treatment of those people in Iraq and Guantanamo Bay is f**king barbaric. In this year of 2004 - this is how we are going to be settling differences? Making innocent men perform pseudo sex acts on each other in Iraqi prisons and sawing off people's heads? How the hell is this going to be settled? Certainly not nukes, we can't afford to have all that oil contaiminated. Guess what? Unless the US starts showing some humilty and admitting that, hey, maybe we made a mistake, things are going to get worse and worse. Thanks President Bush!
Amen.
Quote:
Huh.
I must be some kind of twisted individual or maybe just jaded, because while it wasn't America's Funniest Home Videos, it wasn't what I was expecting-- gouts of blood spraying, screams, and a body flopping around in death.
What it was was another example of how badly Arabs do ****. They can't freaking hold the camera still, they can't keep it in focus, it takes five Arabs to kill one American, and they have to put him in an orange jumpsuit just so they can identify the dude-- otherwise they'd prolly start slicing each other up, the dumb bastards.
Arabs = savages
Totem
I must be some kind of twisted individual or maybe just jaded, because while it wasn't America's Funniest Home Videos, it wasn't what I was expecting-- gouts of blood spraying, screams, and a body flopping around in death.
What it was was another example of how badly Arabs do ****. They can't freaking hold the camera still, they can't keep it in focus, it takes five Arabs to kill one American, and they have to put him in an orange jumpsuit just so they can identify the dude-- otherwise they'd prolly start slicing each other up, the dumb bastards.
Arabs = savages
Totem
I was thinking the same thing although it was closer to:
Terrorists = inept sociopaths
You really need to get past this Arab = Savage thing. It only makes you look narrow minded and I really want to keep what respect I have for you.
Quote:
We can't fight like they fight. We can't kill like they kill. We have rules and regulations we have to follow, and those who don't follow these rules will and should be punished to the full extent.
We can only drop bombs on children in the middle of the night if we follow very specefic rules. Then it's fine.
Disclaimer:
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.
Quote:
We can only drop bombs on children in the middle of the night if we follow very specefic rules. Then it's fine.
Pssh...if anything, the wind prolly caught it.
Why can't we all just get along?
Yeah, but the Arabs = savages is my shtick now, Git. While I in RL don't actually believe that, for Asylum purposes it suits my demogogoric means.
As for that vid I suspect that all that chanting in the background is a form of self-hypnosis to help them ***** up their courage to do the deed. Note in particular the pussification of the typical terrorist: head wrapping to cover up their faces rather than being proud and unafraid of the consequences, the gang style beatdown of 5 vs 1, pulling the knife behind the guy so that he can't see what's coming, and the use of a video camera in secret rather than doing it in a public place.
Totem
As for that vid I suspect that all that chanting in the background is a form of self-hypnosis to help them ***** up their courage to do the deed. Note in particular the pussification of the typical terrorist: head wrapping to cover up their faces rather than being proud and unafraid of the consequences, the gang style beatdown of 5 vs 1, pulling the knife behind the guy so that he can't see what's coming, and the use of a video camera in secret rather than doing it in a public place.
Totem
1 post
Hi Darkflame, could you please explain that comment about Germany? I don't get it.
Thanks
Moll
Thanks
Moll
I wouldn't say I am empathetically repressed, Pat, it's just that such gore is deflected by the shielding I, and others like me, have put in place. I couldn't have been doing what I do for a living if I actually looked upon suffering humans as being inanimate objects or packages to be picked up and delivered. It's not that it doesn't provoke a sense of outrage, it's just that the visceral aspect of it immediately causes those shields to go up. Were it not for those psychological walls I'd have gone crazy or quit EMS work long ago.
I can see how various people can begin to treat other people with callus disregard when faced with brutality and pain on a daily basis just from my own experiences observing human misery. It would be a small step to go from being numb to it to engaging in it.
Totem
I can see how various people can begin to treat other people with callus disregard when faced with brutality and pain on a daily basis just from my own experiences observing human misery. It would be a small step to go from being numb to it to engaging in it.
Totem
What I find disturbing about it is not the blood and gore. I get disturbed because I can "feel" the fear. And I don't like going there.
Edited, Thu May 13 04:42:33 2004 by Patrician
Edited, Thu May 13 04:42:33 2004 by Patrician
Really? My sense of Berg's demeanor was that of a cow munching on grass unaware that the farmer is about to turn him into hamburgers. He looks blissfully oblivious to the imminent danger he is in by just sitting there placidly and contentedly waiting for something to happen.
I saw no wild head turning from trying to see what going on behind him, shaking in fear, pleading for his life, rocking back and forth bemoaning his unfortunate capture. It was almost as if he'd been drugged beforehand.
I know this prolly sounds cold to speak of him in this fashion, but I was struck at just how passive he is as he is about to be killed.
Totem
I saw no wild head turning from trying to see what going on behind him, shaking in fear, pleading for his life, rocking back and forth bemoaning his unfortunate capture. It was almost as if he'd been drugged beforehand.
I know this prolly sounds cold to speak of him in this fashion, but I was struck at just how passive he is as he is about to be killed.
Totem
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