In my foreign land, murder is OKFollow

Well, his lawyers dropped him. None of the articles I read say why. They also apparently told the Martin family lawyers that they didn't know where he was--they think he's still in the US, but don't know. Pretty sure he isn't in Florida, apparently.

The special prosecutor is also apparently going to release new info from the investigation as early as tomorrow.

In other news, Zimmerman has seriously hurt his defense against the profiling allegations. That web page he put up has pictures of graffiti voicing support for him. Graffiti on black cultural centers. Yeah...

At the same time, it doesn't seem like he has new representation. He tried to contact the prosecutor for the case, who refused to talk to him without his lawyers present. He hasn't reached out since, so...

Good to know the guy will presumably have his day in court. Too bad things had to get so contorted to get there.

What are the odds that Zimmerman has skipped the country?

Some speculation: Lawyers dropped because they knew Zimmerman was going to be charged but had already fled, and their "hey if you contact us we'll still represent you" and "he hasn't answered our emails or voicemails" was a warning shot to Zimmerman that he better buck up and answer when the police come knocking, or else it will become infinitely worse for him.

In other words, he thinks he's Joe the Plumber. Got it.

Yeah, I'd drop him too.

That's more to Hannity's credit for keeping mum than it is Zimmerman's. Unless he and Hannity are friends or something, I assume the reason why Zimmerman was calling him was to get a platform and not just a burning desire to shoot the shit with Sean Hannity. At that point, I wouldn't trust Zimmerman not to try some other media personality next.

Sure. I fully accept that if such information exists and hasn't yet been leaked, it's quite possible that the evidence against him is much stronger that we've seen so far.



Absolutely valid questions. Do you honestly believe that if the gunshot was in Martin's back and from a distance that this would not have been leaked by now? I mean, someone got a hold of security footage from the police headquarters and released that. In a case like this, where emotions run high, evidence in support of the emotional position pretty much *always* leaks. Evidence that opposes the emotional position either never does, or gets little air time.

Not like this is a conspiracy or anything, it's just human nature. You get a lot more viewers telling them stuff they want to hear than stuff that tells them they're wrong. Similarly, those with strong emotions have a willingness to find and release any information that supports their side. You honestly haven't noticed this?



I believe I've already written at length (twice I think) about various parts of the applicable statute and why it's good law. In this case, where many people have already formed strong opinions and assumptions, they don't like the law because it doesn't allow for what they want. But if you step back and look at broader sets of cases, it makes a hell of a lot of sense.




There's a whole huge range between handwaving that away and assuming it must be true. Do you honestly believe that had Martin been a white kid, dressed exactly the same, doing exactly the same things, on the same night, taking the same actions, and ending with the same result (face down with a bullet hole in him), that the police would have done anything differently? If so, why? Other than a fairly circular assumption that police are racist, is there a reason to think this?


I'm quite certain that if police arrived on a scene with a dead white teen, shooter saying he was assaulted, with physical evidence to support that claim (bloody nose, wound on the back of his head, grass on his back), and three witnesses who all corroborate the same story, that they would have ruled this self defense as well. Do you honestly think otherwise? Again: Why?

I think that he realized that his lawyers advice to stay out of the media was killing him, as the other side seemed to have no problem turning this into a trial by public perception rather than one by law. To be fair, his lawyers were doing what they're supposed to do. But I can understand him being frustrated as his side is ignored in the media in favor of wild speculation against him.



Obviously, you know my opinion. I think that if the prosecutor brings any charges at all, there must be some evidence we haven't seen that would make her take that risk. I just hope to god that she isn't bringing charges out of a belief that this will somehow satisfy the mob. That will backfire because despite the claims that they just want him arrested and a trial by jury, once he is arrested and charges filed, they'll demand a guilty verdict. And the anger and potential violence that would result if he's found not guilty down the line will be much worse than failing to file charges today.

You don't pacify a mob by giving them what they want. You embolden them and make them more sure of the rightness of their position. I really do hope she isn't just doing the legal equivalent of kicking the can down the road.

What crow? You make the mistake of assuming I'm siding with Zimmerman. I know that most people pick a side and argue for it, but my position through the whole thing was that we should act on the evidence and not speculation. And from what I've seen that's available to us, the evidence points to self defense. I have always acknowledged that if the police have additional information which would allow them to proceed with an arrest and filing of charges, that they should.

My opposition was to people rushing to judgment based on the emotion of the case, and not the facts. That has not changed, so I'm not sure why you think I'd feel like I was wrong or anything.


That the prosecutor has charged him (and with 2nd degree murder to boot) suggests that there is some significant evidence to show that Zimmerman's action was not self defense as he claimed. It'll be interesting to see what that is.


I'll still point out that if she's acting on public pressure and doesn't have a strong case, this could still backfire for her. Going for 2nd degree murder if she *doesn't* have an iron clad case is risky as hell.

Wow, charged with 2nd degree murder. I was honestly expecting manslaughter at most.

What I suspect is that the Sanford police simply took him at his word of "self defense" without digging too thoroughly into it because, hey, he seemed like a nice guy who wouldn't shoot a kid unless he had probable cause to suspect him of being dangerous. (We call those "good ol' boys" around here. And ugh, they're everywhere.)

Unfortunately, Zimmerman's story was weak, down to the bad movie dialog to the description of the incident and the exaggeration of the degree of altercation (I do not doubt some sort of altercation occurred and Zimmerman probably did get punched in the nose during it, but if one's head was smashed repeatedly into the sidewalk, one should probably request a visit to the ER), plus there is the fact that he ignored recommendations to not follow the victim, meaning he was the aggressor no matter how self-defensy he thinks he was being.

In short, a review of the evidence by the prosecution showed that the SYG law was improperly invoked. SYG doesn't mean "run toward danger because you have a gun."

That's cute. You were wrong about the chances of him getting charged, so of course it has to be because of public pressure.

Whatever the real events behind the scenes, special prosecutor Angela Corey was a great PR choice to put in front of the media. She said all the right things to diffuse the situation as much as possible, and to say that Zimmerman should get and will get a fair trial, and that Martin's death was always being looked after by the police, because they were making sure they had as much evidence detail as possible before they pressed charges.

Edited, Apr 11th 2012 10:21pm by Aripyanfar