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"Since the US is about to ignite a nuclear war...Follow

#1 Mar 11 2013 at 1:39 AM Rating: Good
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Even China is backing away very, very carefully from the crazy that has built up in North Korea under new military dictator Kim Jong-un. Up until now China has stuck to North Korea through thick and thin... but not when they pull out this:

"Since the US is about to ignite a nuclear war, we will be exerting our right to pre-emptive nuclear attack against the headquarters of the aggressor in order to protect our supreme interest." ~ NK Foreign Ministry message read out on NK nightly news.

Now, everyone is pretty sure that NK missiles can't reach America. But they DO have enough fissile material for dirty bombs. And the state daily lies to its people about what goes on outside of NK. It likes to rant about Sought Korean and USA hostility and aggression towards the NK people almost nightly on the news. It's a bit dangerous when a nation of starving and oppressed people get pointed at a common enemy outside themselves, as WW2 in Europe demonstrates. I'm not worried about the situation in Iran. Up to now nobody has been insane enough to wage an overt fissile nuclear war. But I'm really worried that Kim Jong-un doens't know how dangerous nuclear fire is to play with. If the worst comes to the worst, Russia and China may agree with the UN and USA that NK needs to be turned into glass, for the safety of the rest of the world.

I'm starting to play with the idea that the means of one lone assassin may justify the ends.
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#2 Mar 11 2013 at 3:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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Eh, they'll never do it. There are enough people in North Korea who are (relatively) wealthy and who have no desire to give up their lifestyle for the unknown of the afterlife and launching a nuclear attack on anyone is a guaranteed suicide.

And I don't even know how much of this is Kim Jong-un and how much of it is the generals and whatnot that he inherited from his dad.
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#3 Mar 11 2013 at 5:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm so tired of this world. One moment it's religious fanatics who blame everyone else for the troubles they put themselves in; the next it's a crazy manchild dictator with daddy issues in control of a brainwashed country. All we need now is some evil mastermind who decides to hold the world ransom because money.

***** it, I'm going to buy a piece of land outside the city. On that land, I'll build an elevator shaft that will lead down to an underground world, safe from nuclear blasts and radioactive fallout. The underground facility will be financed partly by acting as a testing facility for the development of biological weaponry. And I'll put an advanced artificial intelligence in control of everything, including containment protocols.

I don't even know where I get these ideas from, but they're fantastic!
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#4 Mar 11 2013 at 5:29 AM Rating: Good
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Uhuh... Fantastic.



Why don't you start a new city at the bottom of the ocean while you're at it?
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#5 Mar 11 2013 at 5:58 AM Rating: Good
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Uhuh... Fantastic.



Why don't you start a new city at the bottom of the ocean while you're at it?


Screenshot


Anyway, the biggest risk here is Japan. North Korea tends to hate them even more than they hate us, and they're definitely within range. Plus, their population density ensures that a missile blast anywhere near them would be devastating.
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#6 Mar 11 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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Yup. If NK attacked Japan, I think the USA would be drawn in to defend Japan. And that could really upset the Chinese.

Australia would really be in a strategic pickle. We're actually on pretty much equally good terms with China and Japan. And China is keeping our economy afloat right now. We'd have to take sides, instead of being a current neutral broker between China and the USA/Japan.
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#7 Mar 11 2013 at 9:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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If NK does something stupid China drops them in a heart beat. Why risk all out war with your biggest trading partners over some minor state that does nothing but mooch off of you and cause diplomatic headaches. NK is a convenient cushion and that's about it.
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#8 Mar 11 2013 at 9:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
If (X) attacked (Y), I think the USA would be drawn in to defend (Y).
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#9 Mar 11 2013 at 9:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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I laughed way too hard at this and now people in the library are looking at me...

dailyoftheday.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/little-man-syndrome.jpg

Edited, Mar 11th 2013 11:42am by Nilatai
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#10 Mar 11 2013 at 10:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
Yup. If NK attacked Japan, I think the USA would be drawn in to defend Japan. And that could really upset the Chinese.


The Chinese Government stated that they weren't happy about NK's nuclear testing. If NK does attack Japan then I bet China is going to wash their hands clean of it and let NK get stomped.


In short, what Protein-Joph said.

Edited, Mar 11th 2013 12:02pm by Shaowstrike
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#11 Mar 11 2013 at 10:14 AM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
Yup. If NK attacked Japan, I think the USA would be drawn in to defend Japan.

Don't quote me (or do quote me, see if I care!) but I'm fairly sure the US has a defensive treaty with Japan as part of their whole post-WWII military draw down and US military base establishment.
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#12 Mar 11 2013 at 10:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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Don't quote me (or do quote me, see if I care!)
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#13 Mar 11 2013 at 10:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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#14 Mar 11 2013 at 10:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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#15 Mar 11 2013 at 10:39 AM Rating: Good
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Smiley: lol
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#16 Mar 11 2013 at 10:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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I could have responded with "Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security between the United States and Japan signed in 1951" but that was more boring.
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#17 Mar 11 2013 at 11:28 AM Rating: Good
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someproteinguy wrote:
If NK does something stupid China drops them in a heart beat. Why risk all out war with your biggest trading partners over some minor state that does nothing but mooch off of you and cause diplomatic headaches. NK is a convenient cushion and that's about it.


Definitely this. China has eclipsed the US as Japan's primary trading partner globally. Even if there's not a lot of cultural love there, there's a MASSIVE amount of economic love.

And then you add the US into the mix, and China has a VERY strong reason to do anything they can to keep the peace. It's more likely that they'd assist Japan and the US in a war against NK, because they'd be insane to do anything else.

But the other thing China absolutely doesn't want is a stronger American military presence in Asia, so they'll do everything they can to prevent anything actually aggressive from NK.
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#18 Mar 11 2013 at 11:30 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Now, everyone is pretty sure that NK missiles can't reach America.


I see this said a lot and I've always wondered. Why does this matter? I mean, it matters for typical explosive ordinance as you need fast multiple delivery capability to be effective but Nuclear bombs aren't typical ordinance. In a first strike scenario with a nuclear weapon you can take as long as you like to get the weapon into position before setting it off. There are individuals who could get one of these into the country let alone sovereign nations...

Not that I think they're stupid enough to do it, I mean, a bottle of sleeping pills would be much cheaper.
#19 Mar 11 2013 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Yodabunny wrote:
Quote:
Now, everyone is pretty sure that NK missiles can't reach America.


I see this said a lot and I've always wondered. Why does this matter? I mean, it matters for typical explosive ordinance as you need fast multiple delivery capability to be effective but Nuclear bombs aren't typical ordinance. In a first strike scenario with a nuclear weapon you can take as long as you like to get the weapon into position before setting it off. There are individuals who could get one of these into the country let alone sovereign nations...


It matters because NK would never settle for one or two bombs. They're not terrorists hiding in a cave in a desert. If NK takes a shot at the US, it will be war. Nuclear war. Need ICBMs for that, which they probably already have. I mean, they almost sent a rocket into space a while back, and if they're really building the warheads right now then they've already got the delivery system.
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#20 Mar 11 2013 at 1:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Mazra wrote:
It matters because NK would never settle for one or two bombs.


Why does this require ICBMs? Bring them in on submersibles and have dudes throw them into vans on the beach and drive them to the nearest Walmart.

Heck, throw them in container ships and ship them to a bunch of ports, blow them right at the docks and take out every major port in the US without even having to clear customs.

These are just amateur off the cuff solutions, I'm sure NK, or any country for that matter, can come up with much better options without requiring advanced long range ICBMs, transportation and logistics aren't exactly new concepts for military applications. ICBMs are nice and all but they're really only needed for retaliation or short time frame advanced strikes. In a first strike scenario your delivery system doesn't need to be as quick, and certainly not as overt.

Drug cartels bring in tons of illicit materials every day, it's not "rocket science" :).
#21 Mar 11 2013 at 1:27 PM Rating: Excellent
Sure, they could try.

Yodabunny wrote:
Why does this require ICBMs? Bring them in on submersibles and have dudes throw them into vans on the beach and drive them to the nearest Walmart.


Assuming NK has anything that could actually get that far (unlikely, their stuff is from the 50s mostly), the US would get wind of it way before they got anywhere close to the continent. Boom, down goes the sub.

Quote:
Heck, throw them in container ships and ship them to a bunch of ports, blow them right at the docks and take out every major port in the US without even having to clear customs.


Ships coming from where? We have naval forces stationed all around NK, and we're not really trading with them right now. The nuke would have to come in on a SK or Chinese ship, and good luck getting it onto one of those undetected.

Quote:
These are just amateur off the cuff solutions, I'm sure NK, or any country for that matter, can come up with much better options without requiring advanced long range ICBMs, transportation and logistics aren't exactly new concepts for military applications. ICBMs are nice and all but they're really only needed for retaliation or short time frame advanced strikes. In a first strike scenario your delivery system doesn't need to be as quick, and certainly not as overt.

Drug cartels bring in tons of illicit materials every day, it's not "rocket science" :).


The point is, for anything naval, and I really do mean anything, the United States has that sh*t on lockdown. Quoth the Wiki about the US Navy: "It is the largest navy in the world, with a battle fleet tonnage that is greater than that of the next 13 largest navies combined."

There is almost nothing North Korea could do in a naval situation with any hope of succeeding.

Edited, Mar 11th 2013 3:28pm by IDrownFish
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#22 Mar 11 2013 at 1:39 PM Rating: Good
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I don't think the problem is in any likelihood of NK actually setting any fission bombs off on USA soil. I am worried that Kim Jong-un has grown up in such a sheltered bubble world, that he could be crazy stupid enough to lob his three nukes at the South Koreans, or at US military installations anywhere in Asia. From that point on, things would be *bound* to get ugly. Even if China and Russia join up with everyone else to flatten NK.

Plus, the northern Hemisphere will have MORE nuclear radiation pollution/fallout than it already does.

Edited, Mar 11th 2013 3:40pm by Aripyanfar
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#23 Mar 11 2013 at 1:52 PM Rating: Decent
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Ocean point drops via sail boat pleasure craft then. The US isn't in some impermeable bubble of instant eradication. **** it's not even all that well guarded when it comes to small craft. It's a big coast. And those container ships wouldn't have to be NK or Chinese at all. You would want to smuggle them out of the country and take them from a different port for obvious reasons but that's certainly doable, particularly when you control one side of the border. Buy all the border guards and dock employees for a million each for the week, ****, shoot them on the way through and make it look like a terrorist attack. You're starting a nuclear war, cost isn't an issue, neither are repercussions since you'll be a glass parking lot soon anyway.
#24 Mar 11 2013 at 1:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
I don't think the problem is in any likelihood of NK actually setting any fission bombs off on USA soil. I am worried that Kim Jong-un has grown up in such a sheltered bubble world, that he could be crazy stupid enough to lob his three nukes at the South Koreans, or at US military installations anywhere in Asia.


Yes, I would expect headquarters to refer to a military installation more than a political one.
#25 Mar 11 2013 at 2:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
I don't think the problem is in any likelihood of NK actually setting any fission bombs off on USA soil. I am worried that Kim Jong-un has grown up in such a sheltered bubble world, that he could be crazy stupid enough to lob his three nukes at the South Koreans, or at US military installations anywhere in Asia. From that point on, things would be *bound* to get ugly. Even if China and Russia join up with everyone else to flatten NK.

Plus, the northern Hemisphere will have MORE nuclear radiation pollution/fallout than it already does.
Again, I highly doubt that this is anything more than show. I'm confident that there are plenty of people in the political elite of NK who know how bad an idea it is to nuke anyone to make sure it never happens.

Smart people don't tend to run into wars that are pretty much guaranteed to end in a loss and take their lives in the progress.
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#26 Mar 11 2013 at 2:05 PM Rating: Excellent
Yodabunny wrote:
Ocean point drops via sail boat pleasure craft then. The US isn't in some impermeable bubble of instant eradication. **** it's not even all that well guarded when it comes to small craft. It's a big coast. And those container ships wouldn't have to be NK or Chinese at all. You would want to smuggle them out of the country and take them from a different port for obvious reasons but that's certainly doable, particularly when you control one side of the border. Buy all the border guards and dock employees for a million each for the week, ****, shoot them on the way through and make it look like a terrorist attack. You're starting a nuclear war, cost isn't an issue, neither are repercussions since you'll be a glass parking lot soon anyway.


The US isn't that well guarded when it comes to general things, but in a case like this when North Korea is saying "Hey, we're going to toss some nukes your way, heads up!" even though we know they won't, you can bet they'll still be watching things very carefully. Any attack coming from North Korea would be stopped pretty quickly.

Of course, what do I know? I'm not in the Navy. I'm just guessing here.
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