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the value of /sch?Follow

#1 May 02 2009 at 6:42 PM Rating: Good
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Hey Scholars,

I'm a SAM and COR main and was wondering what the pros and cons would be to subbing SCH as opposed to WHM for end game type stuff on my COR would be. I'm sure it'd be easy to look on wiki or wherever but I'd like some opinions also... plus I'm sorta at work now lol. /WHM isn't my preferred sub of choice (/war, /rng yes please!) but on the occasions I'm asked to be /whm (read: salvage, low-man sky farms), what would subbing SCH bring to the table?

Thanks :P

#2 May 02 2009 at 8:01 PM Rating: Good
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I'll preface this with saying I'm a COR and a SCH main.

SCH would offer a slightly smaller MP pool, but the added benefit of Light Arts, which will decrease your recast times and MP costs. You'd also get stratagems to cut MP cost or casting time in half. Sublimation, which is a form of refresh which stacks with Evoker's Roll, becomes available at COR70, and is extremely useful.

You would lose curaga and erase with /SCH, but I consider those losses arguably negligible.

Keep in mind that this is all dependent on why you're going /WHM. If it's just for healing, look into /DNC as well. And be sure to check out /RDM, which offers cures and Magic Attack Bonus, for more Quick Draw sexiness.
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#3 May 02 2009 at 8:37 PM Rating: Good
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299 posts
Yo,

thanks for the reply. Would i keep stuff like paralyna, poisona etc? I'm thinking mostly in terms of salvage and paralyna can be very nice to have there. I'm not main healing but occasionally the RDM will say "I'll paralyna tank1, you paralyna tank2"). Losing erase might suck in certain situations.

Not that worried about my MP pool because I get most of that from gear. I have almost 500 MP as /whm in my max MP gear set and on /mage I have my melee, QD and ranged sets as hybrids to retain 300+ of MP no matter what set I switch to (just keep the MP earrings, back and belt on full time). Mainly in Salvage i just run around rolling, melee when I can, WS when I can, toss out c3s and paralynas as needed. Have both /dnc and /rdm already finished (did /dnc for SAM and /rdm for BLM).

My SCH is currently at 10. lol I soloed it to 10 and just left it there cuz it was kinda slow. This was before they made DCs worth more XP, before FoV etc etc. It's one of the few subs I don't have that I think could be of value so I'm considering getting it to 37. Actually, I'd even consider taking it to 75 if I like it as of my 7 75 jobs, none of them are healing jobs so it'd add a little to my versatility.

Not sure how stratagems work but I can probably look that up sometime when I'm not at work. Just really wanted to find out if taking SCH to 37 strictly for my COR would be worthwhile.
#4 May 02 2009 at 10:21 PM Rating: Good
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The biggest advantage /SCH can give to a non-caster job (Including Support jobs) in comparison to /WHM is access to actually reliable Sleep, Drain, Aspir and Dispel.

/SCH on a 75 job without Native enfeebling will give yo 246 Enfebeling under dark arts. By comparison, BLM's natice enfeebling is C+ (230). This means that Add:Black Sleep 1 will reliably land on most mobs if you gear for it. This, coupled with Dispel Aspir and Drain will will provide beneficial as far as support roles go.

It is also worth mentioning that /SCH's puny MP pool is actually quite superior than /WHM's; thanks to Sublimation being based on Max HP. You can essentially have around 300MP, and a 250-300MP charge saved up.

As far as endgame uses go. /SCH is perfect for COR if all you're doing is support, since it'll give you additional Sleeps and dispels, freing your QD timer; and it'll give you a small nuke in Drain.
But if you're going to be backup healing, you need to be sure Erase isn't needed, as /SCH doesn't have it.

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#5 May 03 2009 at 12:56 AM Rating: Decent
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/sch is the best sub for single target mp-healing for a non-mage sub. You have a slightly smaller MP pool, but you have Light Arts and Penury, which effectively add 20~50% mp to your pool when coupled with sublimation (which stacks with all refresh gear except rdm's Refresh).

On top of healing you get the spells dispel and sleep, which will either let you save the QD charges or help you if you're waiting on the timers. Both spells stick reliably well for a sub. Aspir and drain can actually do quite a bit as well.

However, /sch does have some draw backs. It doesn't have curagas, it doesn't have any enfeebles (dia II is prolly the only important one), and the big one if you're going to be /mage, No Stoneskin or Blink. The main differences are if you need erase or if you fear being hit with high damage AoEs. SS and blink can be very important on what you're fighting, although I'm not sure how squishy corsairs are.

At the same time, /dnc isn't something to ignore. Drain Samba II can make a big difference even without using tp on waltzes. If you have a joy or m.kris, you'll be able to get quite a bit of tp so you can toss out curing waltz II or divine walztes. Dancer sub is great because you don't need to worry about mp, and most people don't have access to /mage with 500+ mp. I'm a big fan of dancer since it has some unique debuffs as well as pretty solid healing abilities all while allowing you to melee, even if it is weakened damage, it's superior to having to worry about mp. If you're doing nyzul, the added damage could be vital for trying to clear certain floors given limited time.

I'm a big fan of /dnc and use it any time I need to do some healing, but can still melee. On more dangerous things I tend to go /sch and stay at a range.
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80 Pup Brd, 75 War Rdm Drg Sam Mnk Pld Bst Thf Whm Nin Smn Blm Rng, 72 Drk, 63 Cor, 50 Blu, 40 Dnc Sch
#6 May 03 2009 at 6:08 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah,

In Salvage and being a COR, I've noticed I'm not very high on the priority list for getting a melee weapon lol. Actually today in AR, I never got one lol. So /dnc wouldn't have helped too much there, although I did have a gun at least. But I couldn't/shouldn't be meleeing on chariots or bosses (or poroggo NMs) anyway.

/whm has served me well enough in salvage so far but I noticed another COR using /SCH in there and figured I'd check it out. Maybe I'll start leveling the sub on Tuesday (my next day off). MP has rarely been an issue (for starters, I need a sub cell, a magic cell and a max MP cell to be of much use) but even so, it sounds like /sch can bring something else to the table. I'm typically shooting for tp on anything that would be dangerous enough to AOE me to death and melee the normal mobs so I don't think i'd miss ss/blink that much.

Thanks for the responses.
#7 May 03 2009 at 9:38 PM Rating: Decent
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As a main healer I can say that it really just depends on your playstyle. If I ever feel like I need a BRD or COR to step up for 30 seconds so I can rest, usually the best thing is a Curaga II. If you don't really use Curaga at all, /SCH is going to be better. If you do alot of single Cure IIIs, /SCH will be alot better.

It really just depends on your playstyle though. If you don't make the macros necessary to use the strategems regularly and get the extra MP efficiency, /WHM would probably be best. Also, you won't have Blink or Stoneskin.

It's a very solid sub to have as an option so I would just say level it and see for yourself.
#8 May 03 2009 at 11:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Don't you only need sub and magic? I thought max MP was only relevant to your sub's mp bonus, which is only going to give you like maybe 100 more mp? So really you only need JA, sub, and magic!

For salvage it really depends on how much damage you're expecting to take or if you're going to be going against heavy aoe mobs, though as a /mage I don't think it will make much difference and of the two I'm a fan of /sch more in general
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80 Pup Brd, 75 War Rdm Drg Sam Mnk Pld Bst Thf Whm Nin Smn Blm Rng, 72 Drk, 63 Cor, 50 Blu, 40 Dnc Sch
#9 May 12 2009 at 10:58 PM Rating: Good
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299 posts
Heh, just a quick update (I'm sure you're all dying to know how my SCH is doing... not!) but.... powered from 10 to 21 solo in about 6 hours of game time over 3 days. Hadn't lvled a low job since signet changes, since DC and EP mobs gave better xp, or since Sigil. My god it's so easy now. I hit 5.6k in 1 hour on SCH lol. Last night I pted from 21 to 26 so well on my way.
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