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Rdm's role in XP? 75+Follow

#1 May 27 2011 at 7:26 AM Rating: Decent
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I recently returned to the game after a long Haitus. Before I quit I was generally invited to XP parties to serve as a self sufficient healer/buffer. In other words all they wanted from me was to keep everyone healthy, hasted and refreshed. Mobs tended to die so fast in merit parties that any enfeeble other than Dia was generally a waste of mp.

Since I have returned it seems like WHM has reclaimed its crown as the king of the healers, and I'm curious where that leaves RDM? Are we still invited for the same reasons as before? Are invited to fill other roles now like enfeebling, nuking, crowd control etc? Or do we now play to our reputation as a jack of all trades doing a little of everything as necessary?

I'm sorry, I'm absolutely cluless as to what a Rdm's main role is nowadays, I'd like to join my first abyssea party this weekend, but dont want to get up there and embarass my self doing somthing stupid, or cause my party any trouble. So I'm avoiding putting my flag up until I have an idea of whats expected from me.

Edited, May 27th 2011 9:41am by CourierBarry
#2 May 27 2011 at 7:40 AM Rating: Good
In an Abyssea xp party, your job will be the same as before. The mobs die sooo fast (in a good alliance) that there is minimal time to debuff (but I always throw them out when I can). If I am set up in a DD party, I keep them buffed up and throw heals if/when needed. If you are in a mage party, refresh/refresh II is always nice. As a rdm, you will also be able to contribute to lights. In the beginning, most parties go for azure lights through magic kills, so throw out some nukes and help out there. You can melee if you want and help with pearls as well. In most parties, the puller pulls multiple mobs, so crowd control is always a plus! Just keep ss up for when inevitably someone wakes up the wrong mob and it comes barreling down after you! Smiley: smile

I main healed an entire xp alliance at around 60, so as far as expectations of the alliance leader ... look at your alliance members, see what areas are covered and go to town! The goal in an Aby xp party is to kill as quickly as possible. So really, just support your party by helping everyone kill faster (haste, nuke, melee, w/e).
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#3 May 27 2011 at 7:48 AM Rating: Decent
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Ah thank you very much! Thats put my mind at ease a little.

On another note, a friend has told me that I should start working on my atma as soon as possible. Are there any Rdm must haves? Anything in particular that I should prioritise?

My friend claims that I should already have access to the Atma of the Ultimate and Atma of the Full Moon, due to things I have completed in the old world areas in the past.
#4 May 27 2011 at 8:08 AM Rating: Good
/cry you have Atma of the Ultimate ... so very jealous.

In the beginning you only have access to 1 lunar abyssite. Full moon isn't a bad one to use with its minor refresh effect. Let's you do a little more while you are in there. Ultimate is awesome if you like to nuke with MAB superior and + to ice magic.

It depends on the type of rdm you like to play and what you are going to be doing when you go into Aby, so having a large variety of atmas is not a bad thing.

A must have for all mages is Minikin Monstrosity ~ +50 INT, 10 mp/tick refresh, - enmity.

Atma of the allure is nice for healing ~ +30 MND, +30% MP, - enmity.

If you are into melee rdm, then there is Raized Ruins, Voracious Violet, Gnarled Horn, Cloak and Dagger, and a few others.

Look here for the list. You can look at them sorted by where you get it, status effects, etc.

Have fun!!
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#5 May 27 2011 at 8:36 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah, you'll more than likely be tasked to healing. Nuking doesn't really come into its own until you get the Beyond Atma, Blizzard 4, and 3 Lunars. Then the feasibility of soloing in Abyssea ups dramatically. A good party will still be leaps and bounds better, though.
#6 May 27 2011 at 11:22 AM Rating: Decent
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Abyssea exp parties have given me more opportunities to be a Jack of All Trades than ever before. I've found myself doing just about everything at some point or another.

I've been the only mage with the sense to distribute Hastes.
I've done plenty of healing.
I've been crowd control.
I've done Nuking.
I've even done pulling when the Thief leaves and everyone else is determined to stand around with their thumb up their ***.

Everyone's so enamored of their refresh atmas, but honestly if you're just doing exp you won't need them. You know, unless you really just suck at managing MP, in which case you probably have bigger problems.
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#7 May 27 2011 at 2:16 PM Rating: Good
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I have found our primary role is to stand there and look good. You don't even have to do anything, just wear your pimp hat and cast Dia on every mob.
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#8 May 27 2011 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
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If it's a party that needs amber I usually dedicate myself to that until it's capped. I mean unless you have an Emp Corsair just lying around you'll likely be a better candidate for sniping mobs then most since with our gear selection you can get some pretty large numbers with AE or Sanguine.

If people still need assistance with other types of lights then I'll switch my atma set and help with Azure or Pearl.
(Or already have helped capped those if they want TEs first)

Once your lights are where you want them to be just Da III ever mob you can and you are pretty much good to go.
#9 May 29 2011 at 8:33 AM Rating: Good
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Thanks for all the responses.

I got my first party yesterday, managed to ding 78 in around 3 hours, and earned 50k Cruor towards my first Lunar Abysite, yay!

To be honest though I was a little overwhelmed by it all. I dont know if its because I'm so rusty, because I was lacking Atma and Buffs or because of the Camp and Party set up but I really struggled to keep up.

We were fighting Buffalo, I was in the DD party (Me and 5 DD). The touble was I just couldnt keep my MP up (Thank god for all those temp items!), the DD's were all subbing /war or /dnc and were taking huge amounts of damage, and my Cure III + IVs were barely keeping up with their massive HP pools. I spent a lot of my time pulling hate from cure bombing.

Another problem was my spells just were not sticking on the Buffalo, they were pulling multiple mobs and I was told to keep them slept, but I was getting resisted everytime, this usually resulted in me getting swarmed and raped by Buffalo (I dont know how it stands up to the new gear nowadays, but my gear and enfeebling set were considered pretty good at 75 when I quit). So I'm assuming they are just to high for me to land spells on yet? What are they? IT @90?

I'm not sure how I feel about abyssea, is this a normal experience? Or should I be levelling in one of the lower levelled abyssea areas for a while before coming back to the Heros of Abyssea zones?
#10 May 29 2011 at 10:23 AM Rating: Good
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They can indeed be T or higher to 90s, so having difficulty sticking things without atma or all the furtherance abyssites isn't unreasonable. As is, dumping you with a party of 5 sponging DDs was also a mistake of the leader, but sometimes they can only work with what's seeking. Going 75 > 78 in three hours seems kind of shoddy, though. Were you doing Ops alongside the kills?

Either way, it'll get easier as you pick up more atma and such. The Teal set will likely be some upgrades for you in parts, but those should also be replaced by AF3 or other goodies as you come upon them.
#11 May 29 2011 at 12:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Really? I thought the XP was great lol, I guess I'm still used to the old XP areas, cant wait to see a good abyssea pt!

Yeah we were doing OPs, but we were camping quite a distance from the NPC as there was another pt there, and as my DD's were all running back to get new OPs at different times, I was having a hard time finding a safe opportunity to run back, there was always somone in need of healing (Though I did get back there fairly often).

I also died a good number of time, which took off a good chunk of XP from my total.
#12 May 29 2011 at 4:46 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, that'd definitely cut into your time to reset ops. Breaking 100k/hr (little over 2 levels at that phase) at that camp should be doable, but if was crowded (which isn't surprising), then your numbers can dip off some. Either way, just keep your eye open for shouts for minikin or boss clears, as getting going with atmas will help your ability to support those parties of lesser optimization. A more laid back camp would probably be worms in LTP (they cap lower in level) or any of the non-Heroes zones, really. Dolls in Altep can be nice EXP, but Meltdown can **** up an ally right quick.
#13 May 29 2011 at 4:48 PM Rating: Decent
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That would explain you slow EXP after you experience a great party you will realize how slow that actually was, really you weren't much faster than a solid colibri/wivre, or Mamool party at 75 which could do 30-35K depending on setup/location and you were at about 45-47K based on your levels.

TBH those dom ops camps can really only support one great party, any other parties will be slow, or all parties will be kind of mediocre, as despite the repop rate etc, the competition can be fierce because of sheer killspeed.

Take for example me taking BRD from 77-85 yesterday in about 4 hours, that is 8*47Kish/4 =94K/hr, which still isn't the fastest ive had (20 merits in 1.5 hours was i think the best ive had. which is 133K/hr)

You will know a good party by the fact that as soon as you turn in a dom op it is time to turn another one in.

As for the issues you face on RDM, The job itself is kind of in a ****** spot as a healer right now, and as you mentioned all the /WAR /DNC does not help. Neither does the fact that a lot of people in these groups are low mid 70's that have artificaially inflated HP pools that don't match their defenses. While they may have near 2K+ HP they get hit for 300 or so a pop non WS and it fades fast.

Once you get Refresh II (82 iirc) a lot of mana issues melt away. Especially when you composure buff it because it returns like 900 MP back over 7.5 minutes, which is nearly the same has having 2 converts in the same window. It gets hella easy once you get refresh Atmas too. However the issues with healing lots of people won't be fixed until SE either gives RDM Cure 5 or thinks of another way for RDM to either mitigate large amounts of group wide damage, or give them a different way to restore group wide HP.

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#14 Jun 13 2011 at 12:46 PM Rating: Good
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Elspetta wrote:
/cry you have Atma of the Ultimate ... so very jealous.

In the beginning you only have access to 1 lunar abyssite. Full moon isn't a bad one to use with its minor refresh effect. Let's you do a little more while you are in there. Ultimate is awesome if you like to nuke with MAB superior and + to ice magic.

It depends on the type of rdm you like to play and what you are going to be doing when you go into Aby, so having a large variety of atmas is not a bad thing.

A must have for all mages is Minikin Monstrosity ~ +50 INT, 10 mp/tick refresh, - enmity.

Atma of the allure is nice for healing ~ +30 MND, +30% MP, - enmity.

If you are into melee rdm, then there is Raized Ruins, Voracious Violet, Gnarled Horn, Cloak and Dagger, and a few others.

Look here for the list. You can look at them sorted by where you get it, status effects, etc.

Have fun!!


I'm new again as well and now that you mention this I am curious... it looks like I can get Atma of Ultimate as well, but also have option of Atma of Kirin. I noticed that Atma of Ultimate has a -25% hit on MP which seems really bad. Do you think Atma of Kirin would be better to start off with (especially since I will likely start Abyssea with BLM)? Seems like it might also help with resists, which the OP seems to have had a problem with at lvl 75ish.

On a side note, what exactly do I need to get these things? It seems like having killed Kirin and/or Proto-Ultima, plus around 1500 curor is all it takes. I guess I somehow need to kill a boss in order to obtain that other item needed to bind the Atma to me when I enter Abyssea? This is somewhat confusing.



Edited, Jun 13th 2011 1:47pm by Mithsavvy
#15 Jun 13 2011 at 2:59 PM Rating: Good
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You need lunar abyssite to infuse atma.
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#16 Jun 13 2011 at 7:43 PM Rating: Good
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Mithsavvy, Atma of the Ultimate is nice if you have multiple Lunar Abyssites to offset your lower MP with some sort of Refresh Atma (Atma of the Minikin Monstrosity being the preferred with its +10 Refresh effect). If you're returning at 75, Atma of the Kirin would be a respectable choice since the Magic Accuracy and Intelligence are a pretty good boost. This is especially true if you join a Dominion Ops party where your magic skills will start to fall drastically behind due to quick levelling and since you're returning you won't have access to Abyssites of Furtherance to help enhance your stats (which I think many people take for granted when they're making recommendations to newer/returning players). However, I would also not underestimate the importance of any Atma with a Refresh effect, preferably one with some mage-boosting stat if you're going to be a BLM. Also, be aware of what you'll be doing. If you're going to be in an XP party, Refresh and Magic Attack Bonus will be helpful along with Magic Accuracy or INT if your magic skill is falling behind. Once you've started catching up in levels with your magic skill and Abyssite boosts, you don't have to focus as much on Magic Accuracy and more focus should be placed on Refresh and MAB. Of course if you're hunting NMs, MAB won't be as much of importance since you may want to keep your target alive while your party gets procs on it (procs being a discussion for another time). At this time, Refresh and Magic Accuracy will be helpful (especially if they're making you sub BRD since stuff happens and ES may be accidentally wasted). Well, after that long-winded explanation, guess I'll go on to talk more about Atma.

There are two types of Atma, those gained from Abyssea NMs and what's called Synthetic Atma. Synthetic Atma is obtained by meeting specific conditions and then bought from an Atma Fabricant with Cruor. The conditions could range from old NMs like Kirin to completing certain missions and quests in and out of Abyssea. As for the other type of Atma, these are dropped from certain Abyssea NMs. Just killing the NM has a very low chance to drop an Atma, which is why most people use a "Red Proc" to raise their chances of obtaining that Atma. Red Proc is obtained by doing certain magical Weaponskills on the NM. The first red proc you make will raise the rate of Atma drop somewhere close to 100% (but not fully, believe it's more like 95%). Once you have a red proc on an NM activated, you won't want to reuse the WS that caused it to activate else it'll lower the chance for the atma to drop (unless this was changed recently, don't believe it was though). That's a basic rundown of Atma and hope this was helpful. :o)
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#17 Jun 14 2011 at 2:13 AM Rating: Decent
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Well, tonight I mainhealed on my 87 rdm an altepa Doll pt ally while I got some crour for a friend (all my other jobs have been 90 for months.) All i did was cast CureIV in some haste gear as well as cast some Hastes so people wouldnt get sleepy (placebo.) I actually didn't cast a single other spell until the end when there were like 1 active people and somehow I was soloing a Doll so I chainspell nuked it down.

Good old ally rdm, it just delivers.

#18 Jun 14 2011 at 6:08 AM Rating: Good
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Well last night I joined a friend who killed the zone NM for me in LaTheine. He killed it a few times so I got close to 6k curor. I used a little to buy Atma of Ultimate, but after reading what you are saying, I think I should go back and grab Atma of Kirin as well.

Dom Ops parties won't raise my skills because they will almost always be level synced?

The ore I read the more I think I need to try to get help getting all three of those Celerity Abyssites. My main limitation right now is having enough Traverser Stones to keep entering Abyssea.

There's so many things I need that Curor are seemingly very valuable. Any tips on how to obtain quick Curor for someone just starting out with Abyssea?

Thanks for all the help in this thread.
#19 Jun 14 2011 at 9:52 AM Rating: Good
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Ah, I did not mean that you'd fall behind on your combat/magic skills due to level sync. What I meant was is that you'll level up so quickly that your skill gain will be unable to keep up. Level sync is not used in Abyssea parties since most consist of alliances where level sync won't work anyways. However, since the XP boost from completing consecutive dominion ops is so high, you'll be gaining levels really fast and thus your skills will fall behind. If you're worried about this though, Grounds of Valor has many new places where you can take advantage of the Signet boosts, get some XP, and work on catching up your skill levels on EPs and DCs.

As far as saving traverser stones and cruor, my advice would be to join Abyssea XP parties. The optimal Abyssea party for you will be the one that is quickly killing things and building up azure lights so that a healthy amount of time extensions are obtained so that you won't have to keep using stones. Keep in mind that although your time limit when entering is 120 minutes, you can stay for far longer than that with time extensions. Also, if you leave with more than 120 minutes left on the clock, you'll be able to enter with those 120 minutes again without having to expend stones. So if you keep joining Abyssea XP parties that are able to farm time extensions well, you'll naturally gain cruor, xp, and keep your time up as your stone stock builds up.

Although Abyssites of Celerity are great, you should also consider obtaining the Abyssites of Sojourn. Each of these extend your stone time by three minutes; with all of them you'd have 18 extra minutes per stone. Still, the Celerity ones are more important, but these are also a nice option.

I'm assuming at this time you have at least one Lunar Abyssite if you're already thinking about Atma. You should also try to get your second one if you haven't already. If you don't have the Lunar Abyssite (which is required to infuse an Atma), then your best bet is to join a party that is doing one of the parties that are doing the zone boss for the quest-line. Another option is saving your cruor for the 100k Lunar Abyssite from the second expansion. Though save up for the Ivory Abyssite of Sojourn and Ivory Abyssite of Celerity which are purchasable from the Cruor Prospectors in specific expansion zones. Good luck! :o)
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#20 Jun 15 2011 at 1:15 AM Rating: Decent
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Dom ops parties aren't level synced.

As far as getting cruor quickly, in maybe 2 hours or so my friend went from 900crour to 23k cruor off Dom ops completions (~1k cruor per completion.)
#21 Jun 26 2011 at 11:27 AM Rating: Decent
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I just bust out my Badelaire+2 and spam Chant du Cygne for 3k damage while keeping people hasted or refreshed. Nobody complains. Lots of options in Abyssea
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#22 Jun 30 2011 at 4:32 AM Rating: Default
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The first thing you should always do as RDM is cap everyone's azure, after that haste and cure people to help the melee dd's cap pearl, then do whatever you want.
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