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Best Red Mage race.Follow

#27 Apr 12 2010 at 5:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Aliekber wrote:
Point being, a few points of MND will never matter as much as a few points of INT can.


Agreed

The main reason I would never play a Taru though is I can't stand a their HP. I would be dead so often XD. I feel naked when I have less then 1k HP XD.

Whenever I see those Tarus in full Zenith running around with like 600 HP I just wonder how much they actually die.
#28 Apr 13 2010 at 12:29 PM Rating: Decent
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SlashAnonymous wrote:
Aliekber wrote:
Point being, a few points of MND will never matter as much as a few points of INT can.
Agreed

The main reason I would never play a Taru though is I can't stand a their HP. I would be dead so often XD. I feel naked when I have less then 1k HP XD.

Whenever I see those Tarus in full Zenith running around with like 600 HP I just wonder how much they actually die.
You could always just not idle in so much -hp? Taru doesn't benefit as much from mp gear in idle, so there's no reason to equip 600 mp for idle, since that'd be more than you'd have for vert. Taru can easily keep on bbq ring, etc without leaving their idle set with too low mp.
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#29 Apr 14 2010 at 4:29 AM Rating: Decent
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I heavily lean towards Hume over Taru, citing survivability myself. The 7 INT Taru has over Hume is nothing to laugh at though.

I think Race is going to become a more defining part of the game as we add another 24 levels onto it.

That 7 INT will turn into something more but we'll probably start seeing the point of diminishing returns on INT across the board after another 24 levels. Taru will also pick up much needed survivability.

Galka might gain enough MP to satisfy current game demands, but who knows what kind of content is in store for us. If we pick up Cure V, we'll have a very expensive Cure spell(that's too useful to pass up) that will more than eat up any gains Galkas get.

Unless new HNMs come out with extremely high stats, Hume will probably win the day without much of a fight. Without a push for specialization, the generalists win.
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#30 Apr 14 2010 at 6:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Elvaan is the best IMO mainly because of my bias, but also because of the stats of how I play.

It all depends on what you want to do as a RDM. As everyone already mentioned, there are pros and cons to every race. Either pick based off that or just pick on what you think looks good.
#31 Apr 14 2010 at 8:22 AM Rating: Good
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I'm kinda surprised we're taking this topic seriously.

But to contribute, it mainly depends on the situation on which race turns out to be "best". I know if I'm Sleep/Nuking I wish I had the MP/INT of a Taru, the strength of an Elvaan for Weaponskills, the HP of a Galka for tanking, or the ACC of a Mithra for TP. But if you're like me, and do all of the above, then Hume would be the "safe" choice. I hesitate to say best though.
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#32 Apr 14 2010 at 8:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Galka is out for obvious reasons.


The Galka does not die from bs endgame aoe/2hours. And not dying, to be able to continue to do your support duties is the only thing that matters.

Edited, Apr 14th 2010 9:05pm by RedGalka
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#33 Apr 14 2010 at 9:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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Certainly will be interesting to see how SE takes things heading to 99.

Quote:
I think Race is going to become a more defining part of the game as we add another 24 levels onto it.

That 7 INT will turn into something more but we'll probably start seeing the point of diminishing returns on INT across the board after another 24 levels. Taru will also pick up much needed survivability.


Probably the reverse, actually.

As it is, stats diverge more and more until around 59-60 or so, and then become less differentiated by the time you hit 75. Basically, seems like they didn't -really- want stat differences to be too significant. Can look at it here http://bellsouthpwp2.net/k/i/kinematicf/FFXI/StatCalculator/

Can see things like with THF/NIN, a Mithra gains only 4 DEX from 59 to 75. An Elvaan, by contrast, gets 8, but that's still less than they get from 50-59.
At 59, they have a 14 point gap in DEX. At 75, a 10 point gap.

Likewise, an Elvaan RDM/SCH, at 59, has 51 INT and 63 MND. A Taru has 69 INT and 53 MND. At 75: Elvaan has 63 INT, 71 MND, the Taru 76 INT and 63 MND. Goes from an 18 point INT gap and 10 point MND gap to 13 and 8 points. Still different, but less so.

If that trend continues on the rise to 99, first, we may not see very large gains in stats in the first place. Stat gains from 59-75 are less than those from 50-59, so it may well follow that stat gains from 75-99 could be even less. Maybe we'll only see 5-10 points added.
Since the existing trend is also to give less to stats that are racially favored, if things aren't changed, the stat gaps will probably only become closer.


That said, HP and MP don't follow that trend...yet.
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#34 Apr 14 2010 at 12:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Ranzera wrote:
That 7 INT will turn into something more but we'll probably start seeing the point of diminishing returns on INT across the board after another 24 levels. Taru will also pick up much needed survivability.
You will absolutely never hit that on anything that matters. Fyi, it's impossible to hit that for tier4 (and probably tier3, but i've never tested that, and i'm too lazy to now) nukes on level -1 wild rabbits, let alone level 100+ mobs.
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#35 Apr 14 2010 at 12:27 PM Rating: Decent
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RedGalka wrote:
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Galka is out for obvious reasons.
The Galka does not die from bs endgame aoe/2hours. And not dying, to be able to continue to do your support duties is the only that matters.
Neither does any other race if they aren't retarded.
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#36 Apr 14 2010 at 12:38 PM Rating: Decent
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Isiolia wrote:
Probably the reverse, actually.

I've never noticed that before. That's pretty interesting actually. Thanks.

ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Ranzera wrote:
That 7 INT will turn into something more but we'll probably start seeing the point of diminishing returns on INT across the board after another 24 levels. Taru will also pick up much needed survivability.
You will absolutely never hit that on anything that matters. Fyi, it's impossible to hit that for tier4 (and probably tier3, but i've never tested that, and i'm too lazy to now) nukes on level -1 wild rabbits, let alone level 100+ mobs.


I realize now I wasn't specific enough, I was referring to macc diminishing returns.

Edited, Apr 14th 2010 1:40pm by Ranzera
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#37 Apr 14 2010 at 1:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Ranzera wrote:
ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Ranzera wrote:
That 7 INT will turn into something more but we'll probably start seeing the point of diminishing returns on INT across the board after another 24 levels. Taru will also pick up much needed survivability.
You will absolutely never hit that on anything that matters. Fyi, it's impossible to hit that for tier4 (and probably tier3, but i've never tested that, and i'm too lazy to now) nukes on level -1 wild rabbits, let alone level 100+ mobs.
I realize now I wasn't specific enough, I was referring to macc diminishing returns.
We already do for almost everything anyway, so not sure why higher levels would change that (except possibly in the opposite direction).
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#38 Apr 15 2010 at 8:11 AM Rating: Decent
I've played BLM and RDM to 75 on an Elvaan, and I've played BLM to 75 and RDM to 67 on a Taru and I believe Taru has some distinct advantages.

To make up for the MP my Elvaan lacks over my Taru, I have to idle in and use lots of +MP/HP to MP gears, as well as spend a good amount of effort on macro systems that swap out gear dependent on how much MP I have. +MP stuff is useless if swapping to your nuke set causes you to dump 2~300 MP. Likewise it's harder for an Elvaan to reach the 75% HP mark to make Sorc Ring kick in on BLM.

Taru has the MP without adding +MP gears, and has more INT, so if I were to nuke down the same mob on my Taru, it would be done much more efficiently since I can swap to my full nuking gear when I still have max MP without dumping any, on top of doing more damage per nuke on every nuke since it's INT score is higher. To make up for having less HP, Taru can idle in -%PDT gear, which is much more attractive than being an Elf wearing Intensifying Cape and a Hedgehog Bomb...

Also my Elf has to carry like 1/3rd more gear since I need a Max MP set as well as all the basic Nuking/Enfeebling gears.

Carth wrote:
I'm kinda surprised we're taking this topic seriously.


Well it's not 2006 any more, that "Any race can play any job as well as any other." bullshit just doesn't cut it.
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#39 Apr 15 2010 at 8:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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SingBismark wrote:
Well it's not 2006 any more, that "Any race can play any job as well as any other." bullshit just doesn't cut it.

Yeah but the ********** is situational" still applies as well.

As long as you're not planning on handling every single dilemma by Sleep/Nuking for the rest of your life, Taru doesn't seem like the best to me. Then again I believe Hume is the best FFXI race in general, cause I'm a sucker for balance.
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#40 Apr 15 2010 at 12:39 PM Rating: Good
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SingBismark wrote:
I've played BLM and RDM to 75 on an Elvaan, and I've played BLM to 75 and RDM to 67 on a Taru and I believe Taru has some distinct advantages.

To make up for the MP my Elvaan lacks over my Taru, I have to idle in and use lots of +MP/HP to MP gears, as well as spend a good amount of effort on macro systems that swap out gear dependent on how much MP I have. +MP stuff is useless if swapping to your nuke set causes you to dump 2~300 MP. Likewise it's harder for an Elvaan to reach the 75% HP mark to make Sorc Ring kick in on BLM.
Not to mention ugly pendant. My elvaan blm needed less than 335 mp to activate ugly. A taru could activate it 130 mp earlier with the same gear. That allows them to not only activate it sooner, but it's also significantly easier to keep it active all the time when you can have as much as 630 mp (allowing for 3-4 nukes), and still have it active, instead of needing to be lower than 400 (only allowing 2 nukes).

sing wrote:
To make up for having less HP, Taru can idle in -%PDT gear, which is much more attractive than being an Elf wearing Intensifying Cape and a Hedgehog Bomb...
Of course every race should be using pdt gear still. Of course anyone who thinks tarus die easily either plays with a bunch of retards who don't use any (ie 90% of people, because it's just too hard to macro in an earth staff after casting), or are idiots themselves. Tarus don't really die any more than other races when played properly.

Quote:
Also my Elf has to carry like 1/3rd more gear since I need a Max MP set as well as all the basic Nuking/Enfeebling gears.
While taru doesn't benefit from full mp gear as much as other races, since it doesn't help much after vert, it's still useful to have any time you're resting to full. Starting a fight with 1200~1400 mp is kind of ******* awesome.

Quote:
Yeah but the "sh*t is situational" still applies as well.

As long as you're not planning on handling every single dilemma by Sleep/Nuking for the rest of your life, Taru doesn't seem like the best to me. Then again I believe Hume is the best FFXI race in general, cause I'm a sucker for balance.
Honestly, it's not that situational. Unless you absolutely never do anything that requires you to nuke/bind/etc where the extra int helps, or anything where your mp would be stressed, taru is the best race for rdm. Is it the best race? Honestly, the differences between the races for melee jobs is very small, and since the differences between them for mage jobs is relatively much larger for all mage jobs, i'd argue that yes, it is. Of course That doens't mean everyone should just be taru. If you want to play a wide variety of jobs, than hume is a pretty good race, especially if you like melee jobs better than mage jobs. However, arguing that taru is not the best job for rdm is beyond ridiculous. Again, it may not be that much better, depending on how you play, and what you do, but it's always better, if only by a slight margin.
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#41 Apr 15 2010 at 5:21 PM Rating: Good
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I hesitate to call Taru to be the best race simply because it's the best at one specific area, and it just happens that one area is used for soloing endgame mobs. It's true that besides HP, stat differences between melee jobs is minimal, but it's something worth noting.

If I had to objectively pick a best race though, it'd be Taru if only because their MP is leagues higher than any other race. In fact I'd say Taru is the best race for any mage job just for that reason.
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#43 Apr 19 2010 at 11:27 AM Rating: Good
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Elvaan is obviously the best cause our clothes move when we cast.


ugh. Who cares. At this point it doesnt matter anymore. Pic the race you can tolerate the most from behind.

Edited, Apr 19th 2010 10:28am by EarthSage
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#44 Apr 19 2010 at 12:25 PM Rating: Default
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rdmdontdie wrote:
It applies across the board for any job that relies on MP to do their best imo. Taru make probably the thickest paladins as well, a booming mp pool allows for -MP +HP gear while still contesting the highest MP pool of the races. Which equates to more sustained hate levels, and more MP = more HP.
That's all good and well until you realize pld holds hate with atonement, flash and jas, not cures. Wearing hp gear costs accuracy, which lowers your atonement frequency, causing less damage, and slower hate build. Of course you generally should have enough even with just the hp from homam, so it doesn't really matter. Race is fairly unimportant for any tank really. Personally I tank in 950 hp+350 ss now, and don't die any more than i did when i had 1300 hp, and 380 ss.
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#45 Apr 19 2010 at 1:10 PM Rating: Good
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Well, PLD does get some hate from cures, potentially a good bit via using cure cheats. Still, I agree in general, not many optimal gear sets use more than incidental HP or MP.
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#46 Apr 19 2010 at 1:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Isiolia wrote:
Well, PLD does get some hate from cures, potentially a good bit via using cure cheats. Still, I agree in general, not many optimal gear sets use more than incidental HP or MP.
Sure, but only once or twice right at the start. After that all their hate can come from flash, atonement, and occasional cures (when they actually need to be cured).
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#47 Apr 19 2010 at 1:24 PM Rating: Good
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I'd say situational. Sure, if you're actually taking damage then there's little point in creating an HP gap to cure. Point is more that cures are used for hate, potentially even if you aren't getting hit.

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#48 Apr 19 2010 at 1:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Isiolia wrote:
I'd say situational. Sure, if you're actually taking damage then there's little point in creating an HP gap to cure. Point is more that cures are used for hate, potentially even if you aren't getting hit.
Sure, they are used plenty for hate. But since hate caps so easily, having more mp for cures isn't a real advantage. Kind of like how enmity gear doesn't really help. Taking 4 minutes to cap hate instead of 3 isn't a real advantage. Technically it's faster, but since no one else except another tank will ever get that much hate that fast, it doesn't matter.
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#49 Apr 19 2010 at 2:25 PM Rating: Good
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ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Kind of like how enmity gear doesn't really help.


His pointy, double-attacking older brother makes him look bad.
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#50 Apr 19 2010 at 2:26 PM Rating: Good
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Well, I'd generally agree. In most group situations with a PLD, it's mostly a support issue. The PLD is probably going to get Refresh, Ballad(s), and possibly more, plus Auto-Refresh from traits and gear. Standing MP recovery tends to cover a normal rotation of spells for hate, and enmity does cap out without that much effort.

I would say that the extra MP would likely allow for a different playstyle compared to a Galka or whatnot, just not a significant enmity advantage as was concluded above. A Taru PLD has more base MP than a Hume RDM. A Galka (naked) doesn't even have the 150MP for Raise. If, say, you wanted a PLD to cover some of the healing in the party for healing's sake, then the Taru would be more likely to excel.
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#51 Apr 19 2010 at 2:36 PM Rating: Decent
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zellbaca wrote:
ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Kind of like how enmity gear doesn't really help.


His pointy, double-attacking older brother makes him look bad.
It took me 10 mins to realize that was a chainsaw+1 =/
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