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Pup changes headed to testFollow

#1 Oct 14 2011 at 1:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Automaton associated AI review
Magic Additions/Adjustments
For each category, such as enfeebling magic / enhancement magic, recast intervals have been set to be independent. ※ Cure, regeneration, magic status affect curing is set to have a separate cooldown.

New magic/ magic adjustments:
Protect (I ~ V) / shell (I ~ V) / Stoneskin / Haste / Phalanx / erase / Abuzoatori / dispel / Dread Spikes / Adol / Regen IV ※ Phalanx and Stoneskin are cast only on the master. ※ Protect, Shell and Haste will cast on all party members and the master.


Stormwaker will be getting Elemental magic Tier IV.

Cure Cure V and VI useage will depend on the degree of HP lost on the target.

Weapon Skill Adjustment
Magic Mortar will do a set amount of damage
Adjust fire automaton (???)
Elimination of the distance correction ranged attack

Related PUP changes:
We are addin a job ability to cure status ailments on the automaton (Lv30: 1 minute reuse)
Repair oil will be consumed and will remove abnormal status effects on the automaton (Only status effects normally cureable with Erase) to recover.
The above changes depend on the Tier of Oil being used and can remove up to four status anomalies. Additionally, we are adding Oil level +3 (Lv80 ~) .




Lots of attachment stuff I havent translated yet, but I have to go back to work.

Looks amazing so far...
#2 Oct 14 2011 at 2:33 PM Rating: Good
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Note that Abuzoatori is Absorb-Attri (like the lv91 DRK spell), and Adol is Addle.

See also the discussion on the official forums.
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#3 Oct 14 2011 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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This could seriously bring me back, I've been on a break from the game.

It's always irked me that my level 40 npc could cast more buffing magic on me than my endgame automaton. This is just fantastic. I am happy. :D

Separate timers ftw.

Edited, Oct 14th 2011 5:00pm by Thydonon
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#4 Oct 14 2011 at 4:36 PM Rating: Good
i was finally enojoying XIV, after the changes that 1.19 brought to the table, and then they announce version 2.0 and its AWESOME, seriously, it looks like the game it should have been, and then they announce they are starting the billing process next month, and 2.0 won't come in about a year, and then i find about this delicious piece of amazing awesome news...


FFXI, baby, lets not fight ever again ok? lets do it for our daughter Pino, she's been all alone changing her own oil +3, but things will change if you take me back, i promise!






I'm Home.
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#5 Oct 14 2011 at 5:05 PM Rating: Decent
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O.M.G.......... this update is going to be far better than I hoped. I wonder how they are going to trigger all of the enhancing magic though, that could get complicated, I guess with seperate cast timers they could tie it to maneuvers or something.
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#6 Oct 14 2011 at 6:39 PM Rating: Good
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Official translation is in!

Camate wrote:

Howdy!

Our puppetmaster adjustments are being finalized, so I would like to make an announcement before we implement these adjustments to the test server.

Usually we make these kinds of announcements at the same time as the changes are implemented in the test server, but it’s going to take us a little bit longer to implement our adjustments, so we decided to make the announcement first.

    Attachments 
        Increased the effect boost based on number of maneuvers for the following attachments 
 
            Strobe/Inhibitor/Flame Holder/Steam Jacket/Auto-Repair Kit II 
 
        Lowered the required capacity from 2 to 1 for the following attachments 
 
            Reactive Shield/Scope/Schurzen/Volt Gun 
 
        Attachment adjustments as follows

  Reactive Shield	Added a bonus to the amount of spike damage dealt based on the frame’s skill level 
        Mana Booster	Effect changed from shortening recast times to that of a fast cast effect 
        Drum Magazine	Lessened the negative impact to accuracy 
        Replicator	Increased the number of shadows based on the number of wind maneuvers used 
        Shock Absorber	Bonus added to the amount of damage absorbed based on the frame’s skill level and the number of earth maneuvers used 
        Armor Plate 
        Armor Plate II	Effect changed from increasing defense to decreasing the amount of physical damage taken 
        Analyzer	Tripled the amount of damage that can be mitigated 
        Hammermill	Shield Bash will be 100% accurate when Hammermill is equipped 
        Volt Gun	Removed the level dependence and added a bonus to additional damage based on the frame’s skill level and the number of thunder maneuvers used 
        Heatsink	The decrease in the probability of overload will be based on all maneuvers instead of just fire maneuvers 
        Damage Gauge	Shortened the recast time for cure spells 
        Eraser	Changed so that only light maneuvers are consumed to fix multiple status ailments 


Automatons

    Re-examine automaton logic 
 
    Add/adjust spells 
        Recast times for spells will be set up independently for each category (such as enhancing/enfeebling magic) 
        *Cure, regen, status ailment recovery spells will each have their own recast times 
        The following spells will be added 
 
            Protect (I-V)/Shell (I-V)/Stoneskin/Haste/Phalanx/Erase/Absorb-Attri/Dispel/Dread Spikes/Addle/Regen IV 
            *Phalanx and Stoneskin will only be used on the master 
            *Protect, Shell, and Haste will only be used on the master and party members 
 
        Tier IV elemental spells will be added to Stormwaker Y-700 
        Cure IV or Cure V will be chosen based on remaining HP 
    Weapon skill adjustments 
        Magic Mortar will have a set amount for its minimum amount of damage 
    Sharpshot automaton adjustments 
        Distance adjustments will be removed for ranged attacks


Puppetmasters
        A job ability that removes automaton status ailments will be added (Lv30 recast time: 1 minute) 
            Uses automaton oil to fix automaton status ailments (those that can be recovered by erase) 
            The number of status ailments fixed will depend on the type of automaton oil used, and a maximum of 4 status ailments can be removed at once 
            *Automaton oil+3 (Lv80+) will also be added. 




These changes will be implemented in the test server in a while, and we plan on making final adjustments based on feedback once these changes are implemented in the test server. Thank you!



http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/16004-Questions-for-the-Community-Rep-Moogles?p=212820&viewfull=1#post212820
#7 Oct 14 2011 at 10:04 PM Rating: Good
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I think.. I teared up a little...

*___* <------ overwhelmed

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#8 Oct 14 2011 at 10:16 PM Rating: Decent
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OMG. that. just like the best update for pup;;. they buffed like crazy. it too good to be true;;. i think this just top every updated that came out for pup in the past. dude and they giving the pet haste Phalanx and Stoneskin on master O.O

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPgw2phh5BY For the win!.

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#9 Oct 14 2011 at 11:57 PM Rating: Good
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Restarted my subscription....

Wow, separate cast timers
Wow, they fixed Eraser to only remove light. It went from meh to fantastic.
Wow, they buffed Mana Booster to fast cast.
Wow, they gave Damage Gauge fast cast on cure spells.
Analyzer was one of my common filler attachments, they just tripled it's effect.
Wow again, smart use of Cure 4-5 (going to be more important with separate cast timers).

Honestly, this is just too good to be true. Not all of it will make it from the test server to live, and I really don't even care. If they just give us the separate cast timers, the buffing magic, the new oil-to-erase /ja, and fix eraser I will sing nothing but praises of Squenix.

And, I see a little nugget tossed in there: "Re-examine automaton logic"

SE has radially changed pup on two prior occasions. The new heads and the legendary "Pupdate". It's time to start hoping that they might have fixed the healing AI. They don't take massive jumps like this on pup often, only twice in the game's history. If they are going to do it ever, this is one of the best chances we're going to get, I would think.

Edited, Oct 15th 2011 12:58am by Thydonon
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#10 Oct 15 2011 at 8:16 AM Rating: Decent
I wonder if the white mage head will be able to cast phalanx or it will be Stormwaker only. It does have Bio and poison despite being a white mage. Hmmm Can only hope. Still, dumbfoundly shocked they are making such a drastic change in the direction we been asking for, for years.
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#11 Oct 15 2011 at 2:21 PM Rating: Default
I hate to be that guy, but as impressive as these things are. Most of these adjustments should have existed from day one.




Also inb4 -na issue, casting silence on crabs, diremites, beetles, and drain and aspir at high % still all exist. Can't seem to fix those AI issues, but we can just throw more in there to make the PUPs go wild with joy.Overall, probably the biggest thing since they added the SW and SS heads.
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#12 Oct 15 2011 at 2:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hey bel, you know what sucks about being that guy? The fact that the things you just said aren't getting fixed, well they are. By getting separate spell timers you will still drain and aspir as much as before, BUT in between those because of the separate timers you will get nukes. Or in the case of -na and cures, in between -na you'll get cures.

Not to mention they said they were looking into changing the aspir on crabs and beetles, but even if they didn't, this is leaps and bounds in the right direction. Put on a smile and take it.

Edited, Oct 15th 2011 4:53pm by Camwin
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#13 Oct 15 2011 at 2:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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BelenosSwiftWater wrote:
I hate to be that guy, but as impressive as these things are. Most of these adjustments should have existed from day one.




Also inb4 -na issue, casting silence on crabs, diremites, beetles, and drain and aspir at high % still all exist. Can't seem to fix those AI issues, but we can just throw more in there to make the PUPs go wild with joy.Overall, probably the biggest thing since they added the SW and SS heads.

for drain and aspir, it would actually be preferred this time to be on a high % , the separate timer changes almost everything (tho a direct fix to AI logic wouldn't hurt ofc), Dark magic <> Elemental magic, what will happen if I'm not mistaken is the puppet will nuke first followed by another nuke or a dark magic, becuz the separate timer, the pet will choose a school of magic that off Cooldown, leading to some kind of rotation between schools depend on the MP usage and such, therefore the sooner the pet fill the gap using drain/aspir/etc between nukes the better.

even the -na issue will be lessened to some extinct with separate timers, mage pets will be very busy and responsive which what I hoped for , in a long time...I hate being a clowned BST.




edit: beaten :|


Edited, Oct 15th 2011 4:58pm by Bhujerba
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#14 Oct 15 2011 at 3:55 PM Rating: Excellent
Camwin wrote:
Hey bel, you know what sucks about being that guy? The fact that the things you just said aren't getting fixed, well they are. By getting separate spell timers you will still drain and aspir as much as before, BUT in between those because of the separate timers you will get nukes. Or in the case of -na and cures, in between -na you'll get cures.

Not to mention they said they were looking into changing the aspir on crabs and beetles, but even if they didn't, this is leaps and bounds in the right direction. Put on a smile and take it.

Edited, Oct 15th 2011 4:53pm by Camwin


Bhujerba wrote:
BelenosSwiftWater wrote:
I hate to be that guy, but as impressive as these things are. Most of these adjustments should have existed from day one.




Also inb4 -na issue, casting silence on crabs, diremites, beetles, and drain and aspir at high % still all exist. Can't seem to fix those AI issues, but we can just throw more in there to make the PUPs go wild with joy.Overall, probably the biggest thing since they added the SW and SS heads.

for drain and aspir, it would actually be preferred this time to be on a high % , the separate timer changes almost everything (tho a direct fix to AI logic wouldn't hurt ofc), Dark magic <> Elemental magic, what will happen if I'm not mistaken is the puppet will nuke first followed by another nuke or a dark magic, becuz the separate timer, the pet will choose a school of magic that off Cooldown, leading to some kind of rotation between schools depend on the MP usage and such, therefore the sooner the pet fill the gap using drain/aspir/etc between nukes the better.

even the -na issue will be lessened to some extinct with separate timers, mage pets will be very busy and responsive which what I hoped for , in a long time...I hate being a clowned BST.




edit: beaten :|


Edited, Oct 15th 2011 4:58pm by Bhujerba


this, mage automatons, will have a definitve use finally (for me), like real practical use (other than nuke-bot), can't beat having personal haste, dread spikes sounds awesome too, this days i prefer to go sharpshot for almost everything, even when the dmg needed is from afar (when you'll normally switch to spiritreaver), i just slap regain stuff and wait for it to get 100% get close and fire and retrieve
the defence down is huge and i let it reap hate if needed or if not Deactivate Activate (abyssea onry strategy of course), now with this changes i will actually consider using other automatons /le gasp, even when solo i prefer lower tier stuff for GOV and go /dnc with sharpshot.
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#15 Oct 16 2011 at 2:25 PM Rating: Default
Well it can't cast two spells at once is all I am thinking. I don't see the automaton chain casting like a player still, but we will see.

Personally I am envisioning a more controlled adventuring fellow.
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#16 Oct 16 2011 at 4:04 PM Rating: Decent
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And hear I was thinking I'd erase my character permanently. I'm gonna have to wait to see how these changes work out.
#17 Oct 16 2011 at 4:07 PM Rating: Good
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I'm wondering if the spell priority will stay the same though. Like, say you activate and deploy low HP, blinded, unbuffed. In what order will it start casting to meet your needs? As it stands it'd unblind you and then immediately cast cure, and then protect/shell or haste (whichever has priority over the other). There's going to be so much to test and relearn about how they behave. I can't wait.

I don't see what it won't be "chain casting" one spell after the other as the timers come up. It's still limited to one spell at a time and by its own MP pool. And more than likely we'll be able to control what it's casting with maneuvers, like putting a Wind on Soulsoother to force cast Haste. The only thing I'm worried about is how the puppet will handle casting haste, protect, and shell on a party of 6. That's a fairly big drain on MP and gives the puppet a lot of things to do that aren't watching HP. Maybe we'll get an MP oil, that'd be nice.

Also, people think we're going to get dread spikes? More likely that's something the puppet will only cast on itself. Which is fine. It'll make our Blm puppets much better at surviving hits when it draws hate. I can't tell you how often a little bit of lag made me deactivate a quarter second after the mob that Sancho just pulled hate on landed a hit.
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#18 Oct 16 2011 at 7:25 PM Rating: Good
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This is a brilliant tactic by SE, separating spell timers makes it so they don't even need to rework the AI. My bet is the priority goes -na>cure>buff.
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#19 Oct 16 2011 at 7:31 PM Rating: Decent
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I really hope its cure>na>buff.

If i get blindna while at 20 hp ill be mad.
#20 Oct 17 2011 at 8:18 AM Rating: Decent
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ShiftlessDrifter wrote:
Also, people think we're going to get dread spikes? More likely that's something the puppet will only cast on itself. Which is fine. It'll make our Blm puppets much better at surviving hits when it draws hate. I can't tell you how often a little bit of lag made me deactivate a quarter second after the mob that Sancho just pulled hate on landed a hit.


Dread Spikes is confirmed.

Quote:

The following spells will be added

Protect (I-V)/Shell (I-V)/Stoneskin/Haste/Phalanx/Erase/Absorb-Attri/Dispel/Dread Spikes/Addle/Regen IV
*Phalanx and Stoneskin will only be used on the master
*Protect, Shell, and Haste will only be used on the master and party members


The thing I wonder though... Phalanx and stoneskin are only cast on the master, and not on the puppet? Since those are self-target spells (yes, accessionable, but still self-target) does that mean dread spikes may possibly be cast on both the master and the puppet? Or maybe it will remain self-target only. I'd imagine they'd have mentioned it if they were going to allow it, but who knows...

Overall I love these changes, but I wonder about dispel... The crab uses scissor guard. Annalise uses Dark Maneuver. Koumei starts casting blind.

I wonder what they did with spell priorities and how they worked that out? That's going to be interesting.

I'm really looking forward to studying the job again when we get to play with this! I love how complex puppetmaster is

#21 Oct 17 2011 at 9:33 AM Rating: Decent
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I know Dread Spikes is confirmed, I'm saying that I've been reading a lot of hopeful talk in forums and in chat that has people think the puppet is going to cast it on us. It's probably a puppet only spell.
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#22 Oct 17 2011 at 9:39 AM Rating: Decent
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I think it makes sense to be puppet only. The stoneskin and phalanx being master only make it questionable, though.
#23 Oct 18 2011 at 2:05 AM Rating: Good
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Looks very very nice on the whole, I might have to get back into ffxi from my little break sooner than I thought... Still got a fair bit of skilling up to do on my mage frames.

Do have to wonder if they'll remember to have the automaton account for the effects of a vivi valve in selecting what cure to use, it's definitely a beefy enough bonus to affect that decision.
#24 Oct 18 2011 at 12:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Time to get off my **** and push from 90 to 95 and get those skills capped. PUP has improved greatly over the years and looks like it will continue to get better and better...
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#25 Oct 21 2011 at 2:27 PM Rating: Good
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Bayohne wrote:
We appreciate that so much feedback has been posted even though we have yet to make changes to the test server. I'm sure you can imagine these are major changes, so before implementation we have to perform a large number of QA tests.

We are working hard to get this ready for you as soon as possible, and hopefully you will able to try this out on the test server at the end of next week. Please continue to submit your feedback!
One more thing-
Camate wrote:
The following spells will be added
Protect (I-V)/Shell (I-V)/Stoneskin/Haste/Phalanx/Erase/Absorb-Attri/Dispel/Dread Spikes/Addle/Regen IV
*Phalanx and Stoneskin will only be used on the master
*Protect, Shell, and Haste will only be used on the master and party members

It seems that there are some players who are worried about the line “*Protect, Shell, and Haste will only be used on the master and party members” so I will clarify this a little bit.

Currently Protect, Shell, and Haste can only be used on the master and on party members in conjunction with water maneuvers and the Soulsoother C-1000 head. Thus, there is no need to worry about the automaton using enhancing magic willy-nilly.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/16004-Questions-for-the-Community-Rep-Moogles?p=215667&viewfull=1#post215667
#26 Oct 28 2011 at 4:39 AM Rating: Good
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someone bring us the good news from test server ASAP... I'm refreshing this page every day..
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#27 Oct 28 2011 at 6:46 AM Rating: Decent
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I do believe a post on official forums tells that the changes on test server will be done beginning of november, so we'll have to hold our breaths till then! *hops back to working on those annoying lottery NMs to hope to get Vere one day...*

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/16412-Delayed-Implementation-of-October-Test-Server-Features


Then again, Dfoley, a regular here too, posted an update on regular forums ^^;

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/16451-Pupdate-10-28-2011


Edited, Oct 28th 2011 8:47am by Rumiko

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 8:52am by Rumiko
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#28 Oct 28 2011 at 7:03 AM Rating: Decent
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Bah! people reporting 4 secs between casts, I don't like this one bit! :| :| :|
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#29 Oct 28 2011 at 7:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Maximum effect values for the following attachments will now be increased in proportion to the number of active maneuvers:

Strobe / Inhibitor / Flame Holder / Steam Jacket / Auto-Repair Kit II


increasing Inhibitor is nice. Buffing **** flame holder and ARK2? holy **** batman.

The required capacity of the following attachments has been reduced from 2 to 1:

Reactive Shield / Scope / Schurzen / Volt Gun


Jinte approves.

The properties of the following attachments have been revised:
Reactive Shield: Counterattack damage will receive a bonus in proportion to frame skill level.

I find this interesting. I'm a fan of Reactive Shield on VE when I don't need to use attuner (trials, farming, killing TW-DC **** because VE's durable enough to throw it out for hate and reactive shield actually does fairly nice damage for lolblazespikes. That they're buffing it makes it an even nicer toy.

Mana Booster: Effect changed from increased spellcasting frequency to shortened casting time.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO-
if they also reduced over all spell casting frequency universally, nvm. FAAAAST CAAAASSST!!!!! THAT I'LL NEVER GET TO USE WITH SPIRITREAVER WHERE I ACTUALLY NEED IT!!!! /bittersweet

Drum Magazine: The penalty to accuracy will be eased slightly, and attack speed raised.

Any word on how much is "slightly"?

Replicator: Blink shadow quantity will be increased in proportion to number of active wind maneuvers.

At first: "That's already what it does..." but then: "Wait, MOAR SHADOWS?!" but now: "Wait, I never use replicator anyway"

Shock Absorber: Damage absorbed will receive a bonus based on frame skill and active ice maneuvers.

At first: "Ice maneuvers? Wuh?" but then: "OMFGSPIRITREAVERDURABILITYILOVEYOUSE"

Armor Plate/Armor Plate II: Effect changed from enhanced defense to reduction of physical damage taken.

I think I've already expressed my love for this idea since they first suggested it.

Analyzer*: Damage reduction effect will be made approximately three times as potent.
*The damage reduction rate and effect trigger conditions for the Analyzer attachment are scheduled to receive further revisions in the next test server update.


Very nice, very nice. Potentially droolworthy, but probably not.

Hammermill: Shield Bash will always hit while Hammermill is equipped.

Good **** Nothing bugs me quite like when VE FINALLY shield bashes -before- a TP move, only for it to miss.

Volt Gun: Level dependency will be abolished, and a damage bonus will be granted based upon frame skill level and active thunder maneuvers.

I haven't used volt gun since like, level 30. There was a level dependency? lol

Heatsink: Overload rate reduction will now apply to all maneuvers rather than just fire maneuvers.

Good **** Heatsink is the same overload reduction as buffoon's/AF gloves. To bad it only makes cooldown even more worthless... lol

Damage Gauge: Recast time for curing magic will be shortened.

I like this so long as this doesn't **** with HP% procing.

Eraser: Will cure multiple status ailments and erase only light maneuvers.

**** finally Smiley: inlove

Automaton-related
Automaton behavior patterns have been refined.
Magic spells have been added/adjusted as follows:
Separate recast timers have been established for each category of magic, such as enhancing or enfeebling spells.
*Cure-type spells, Regen-type spells, and status ailment removal spells will each have their own recast timer.


I WANT DETAILS NAO.

Automatons may now learn the following spells:
Protect (I-V) / Shell (I-V) / Stoneskin / Haste / Phalanx / Erase / Absorb-Attri / Dispel / Dread Spikes / Addle / Regen IV
*Phalanx and Stoneskin will only be cast upon the master.
*Protect, Shell, and Haste will only be cast upon the master and party members.


I don't care how useless Stoneskin/Phalanx will be if they don't cap with skill/merits/gear. Haste and Regen IV are all I needed to see. Erase and Dispel are **** beautiful too, and dread spikes is such a delicious touch...

Level IV elemental spells have been unlocked for the Stormmaker Y-700.
Automatons will occasionally cast Cure V instead of Cure VI depending on the target's current HP.


And I came.

Weapon skill adjustments
A minimum damage value has been established for Magic Mortar.


And I lol'd.

Sharpshot adjustments:
Distance modifications for ranged attacks have been abolished.


And at this point I'm to busy crying tears of sweet joy to form an opinion about this because I haven't used sharpshot in a year.

Screenshot


SE knew I was getting ready to quit for good. This is basically all I needed to say **** that **** I'M PLAYIN' MOAR PUP, ****
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#30 Oct 28 2011 at 7:55 AM Rating: Good
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First, I agree with most everything Jinte had to say, especially about Mana Booster. I loved the old Mana Booster for my cure bot's recast time, but fast cast is badly needed for my nuke bot. So I can see why they changed Damage Gauge, but I'm worried about not getting cured until in the orange .-.

I'm fairly certain that the Shock Absorber bit was a mistake and they intended to say "earth maneuvers". In this post they said "earth maneuvers". Would they really change it to a completely unrelated element? Anybody know if the players' comments changed the element?

In that same post, they referred to Reactive Shield damage as spike damage dealt rather than counterattack damage. Just a strange bit of wording on their part, I suppose. meh, I just don't like it is all.
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#31 Oct 28 2011 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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I don't know if they figured to change damage gauge to shorter recast on cures because vivi-valve already changes the HP threshold to cure? Just a thought, but not sure I agree with it either.
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#32 Oct 28 2011 at 8:12 AM Rating: Decent
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SelkaSeraph wrote:
First, I agree with most everything Jinte had to say, especially about Mana Booster. I loved the old Mana Booster for my cure bot's recast time, but fast cast is badly needed for my nuke bot. So I can see why they changed Damage Gauge, but I'm worried about not getting cured until in the orange .-.

I'm fairly certain that the Shock Absorber bit was a mistake and they intended to say "earth maneuvers". In this post they said "earth maneuvers". Would they really change it to a completely unrelated element? Anybody know if the players' comments changed the element?

In that same post, they referred to Reactive Shield damage as spike damage dealt rather than counterattack damage. Just a strange bit of wording on their part, I suppose. meh, I just don't like it is all.


Reading over the official forums now. It seems that the universal spell recast has been reduced to 4 seconds, thus making the old manabooster effect obsolete (it would be able to set it to 0 with 3 ice up if they hadn't changed it). Still, it'dbe nice if they'd lowered the elemental slot req on ice maker Smiley: glare

Rumiko wrote:
I don't know if they figured to change damage gauge to shorter recast on cures because vivi-valve already changes the HP threshold to cure? Just a thought, but not sure I agree with it either.


wait, vivi-valve changes it too? That's news to me.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#33 Oct 28 2011 at 8:37 AM Rating: Decent
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I haven't tried it much, and haven't noted down numbers, but I remember using Vivi-valve + Optic Fiber made it so I was healed faster, without being in the orange threshold.

That's the post that made me try it, I'll re-test this when I have a chance to make sure.

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?fjob=18&mid=131301054647429807&h=50

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 10:37am by Rumiko
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#34 Oct 28 2011 at 11:04 AM Rating: Good
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Damnit... I may have to un-quit now.

#35 Oct 28 2011 at 11:12 AM Rating: Good
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Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.

There is soooo much to test this weekend. I will probably start with spell recasts and priorities.

#36 Oct 28 2011 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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dustinfoley wrote:
Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.

There is soooo much to test this weekend. I will probably start with spell recasts and priorities.



I'm about 2.5 hours away from finishing the test server download (the zip files, anyway). Hopefully, I'll be able to start work testing **** tonight. I vote we have a Test Server BBQ or something.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#37 Oct 28 2011 at 12:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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Okay. Preliminary casting AI tests done. This is just me **** around in Grauberg and taking notes on paper for two hours while I watched what Sancho did. Will do further testing later, but just sharing my groundwork so people can compare it.

Haste/Pro/Shell are indeed there for both Soulsoother and Stormwaker. However, only the Rdm head has access to Phalanx and Stoneskin.

Abs-Attribute (Spiritreaver only) is the same as Thf Aura-Steal. Sancho was casting it on pots to steal their blaze spikes and it gave the "Sancho is casting Magic (234)" message. Only activates with a Dark maneuver up.

Soulsoother still seems to prioritize -na spells, HOWEVER, the Damage Gauge seems to bypass this with a light maneuver up. This is good because at one point Sancho and I each had about three status debuffs on us (I waited a little to get a lot of them up and didn't use the new JA just so I could see what it'd do). When deployed he began spamming Erase. And when I mean spam it I mean he was casting it every 4 seconds and deleting moves while I was at 350hp curing myself with waltzes. Light Maneuver forced him to cure me.

I was unable to force it to cast Addle or Dread Spikes on any frame. This make me think that they're EM+ only moves like Regen, since the pots were all EP-DC at 95. Will need to test which frames get these moves. Since Stormwaker has exclusive spells now, I'm wondering if DS might be on Harlequin...

Spell priority for buffs seems to be this:
Phalanx/Stoneskin (Storm only) > Protect/Shell > Haste

First impression: Soulsoother looks like it's going to get replaced as the best choice for solo work with puppet curing. The addition of Phalanx and Stoneskin (both were full powered and awesome as HELL) are incredible, and the Tier 4 nukes being sprinkled in were nothing to scoff at. They were doing 900+ with no maneuvers on Wivres. My prediction is that Soulsoother is going to be primarily a party healer now with Stormwaker being our new solo curebot. The 4 second gap between spells isn't even noticeable compared to the old 15-25 second wait. I love this so much.

Things still to test: What the spell category priority is. -Na>Cure>Buff>Nuke>Debuff?
How to get Dread Spikes and Addle to fire.

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 2:56pm by ShiftlessDrifter

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:17pm by ShiftlessDrifter
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#38 Oct 28 2011 at 1:02 PM Rating: Default
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dustinfoley wrote:
Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.


Edited for false information due to my l o l p u p ness, ^.~


Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:42pm by Fantus
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#39 Oct 28 2011 at 1:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Fantus wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.


I think magic mortar doing damage is complete win because i can now do light skillchains with my pet when it has full hp. Alot of the mobs i have been soloing recently i fight next to my whm pet for the extra dmg, but its annoying when it uses mortar for 0 because it cant start a chain. With guaranteed damage, and once i get Vsmite it will be nice to throw in a light skillchain whenever my pet has some tp, 8')

On the other hand though with the pet spamming spells so often im not sure how fast he will be able to build tp, any extra skillchain damage is good to have though.

I solo'd half the points I needed for stringing pummel while I was on floor 50 with 0 damage magic mortars opening light for dragon kick.... Fairly sure 0 damage WS can still SC. the SC only fails if the WS misses.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#40 Oct 28 2011 at 1:23 PM Rating: Good
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Fantus wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.


I think magic mortar doing damage is complete win because i can now do light skillchains with my pet when it has full hp. Alot of the mobs i have been soloing recently i fight next to my whm pet for the extra dmg, but its annoying when it uses mortar for 0 because it cant start a chain. With guaranteed damage, and once i get Vsmite it will be nice to throw in a light skillchain whenever my pet has some tp, 8')

On the other hand though with the pet spamming spells so often im not sure how fast he will be able to build tp, any extra skillchain damage is good to have though.


Pretty sure you can close light after a 0 dmg magic mortar. For the record, your puppet can close light for 0 + 0 dmg woo!

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:23pm by SelkaSeraph

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:37pm by SelkaSeraph
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#41 Oct 28 2011 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
Fantus wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Magic Mortar was doing 355-400 dmg with a full hp level 95 pet... At least it doesn't feel like a complete waste.


I think magic mortar doing damage is complete win because i can now do light skillchains with my pet when it has full hp. Alot of the mobs i have been soloing recently i fight next to my whm pet for the extra dmg, but its annoying when it uses mortar for 0 because it cant start a chain. With guaranteed damage, and once i get Vsmite it will be nice to throw in a light skillchain whenever my pet has some tp, 8')

On the other hand though with the pet spamming spells so often im not sure how fast he will be able to build tp, any extra skillchain damage is good to have though.


Bolded is false.

MM has been able to chain with 0 dmg for a LONG time. Can't say its been that way forever because i frankly can't remember if it chained when it was added way back when. Up until now a MM with a 100% HP pet was essentially having the auto put chainbound status on a mob imo.

But however you wanna classify it, an auto WS'ing with MM for 0 dmg WILL chain with compatible WSs for SCs. Work on your timing, you should have been able to do MM > Stringing Pummel = Gravitation easily.

Pre-post edit: Went and did a quick search and this was the first thing that popped up. Its from '08 btw and its not my vid so sorry about the music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZ3xJvVsNAA
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#42 Oct 28 2011 at 1:33 PM Rating: Default
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Really? Must have missed or not timed it right the few times i tried it before i just figured it wouldnt work.

Thanks for the info, that will help with the few chesmas i have left till i get vsmite, 8')
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#43 Oct 28 2011 at 1:35 PM Rating: Good
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Man look at that Pup wearing Pantin head. That thing wasn't even good when it was new.

Which isn't a knock on a pup's gear from the bad old days. Just a knock at the gear. Wish they'd included the +2 update for relic gear in today's update.

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:36pm by ShiftlessDrifter
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#44 Oct 28 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Good
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ShiftlessDrifter wrote:
Spell priority for buffs seems to be this:
Phalanx/Stoneskin (Storm only) > Protect/Shell > Haste

Did you attempt to use maneuvers to change the priority on these at all?

Or, on that same vein, Do the spells fire off one-after-another fast enough for it not to make a difference?

Would love to get online to help test these, but the computer I have access to right now doesn't have the test server installed, and on top of that I have to leave for work soon. >.<
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#45 Oct 28 2011 at 1:55 PM Rating: Decent
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ShiftlessDrifter wrote:
Man look at that Pup wearing Pantin head. That thing wasn't even good when it was new.

Which isn't a knock on a pup's gear from the bad old days. Just a knock at the gear. Wish they'd included the +2 update for relic gear in today's update.

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 3:36pm by ShiftlessDrifter

<3 my pantin taj. I always keep it on me when I'm /sch. toss it and my orochi nodowa on and sublimation is free. And it looks slightly more stylish than my sol cap.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#46 Oct 28 2011 at 2:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah I tried a few maneuvers to change some priorities, but I didn't see anything affecting the order except for the cure thing I mentioned. That priority list was based on no maneuvers. Changing priority order is something I'll put more thought into, but there's really a lot of keep track of now with all the spells going off.

The recast on buffs seems to be around 10-15 seconds, which works out well when it's cycling through three spell types at a time. Something I noticed and didn't mention: if you have Rdm frame up, because Phalanx and Stoneskin are priority over protect and shell, it may take some time during a battle to get shell up.

For example, when I was playing with the Wivres Sancho put up Stoneskin first every time, then Phalanx, once both were up he cast protect. At which point the Wivre had finally broken stoneskin. The next buff cast was stoneskin, which was taken off by a TP move landing, he immediately cast stoneskin again. Then it cast Shell.

So the order seems to be Stoneskin>Phalanx>Protect>Shell>Haste specifically.

The casting time is fast enough to be effective. There's a 4 second global recast delay with each spell category having its own recast (on top of the individual spell recast that we already had, like how sometimes it'd cast Thunder V then Bliz V because Thunder wasn't ready to go again).

=Edit=
Deleted those guesses I made about the individual recast times. I tried out some of the IT turtles in Kuftal as a /dnc. Was able to kill them pretty easily, but man, the Mana Booster and Damage Gauge must be pretty buff. The spell recast rate is STILL really good, but not ridiculously fast. Need serious testing on this.


Edited, Oct 28th 2011 4:05pm by ShiftlessDrifter

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 4:40pm by ShiftlessDrifter
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#47 Oct 28 2011 at 2:37 PM Rating: Excellent
this is so freaking interesting, i wish i knew why i can't seem to qualify to the test server :/


Also: F5'ing the **** out of this thread.

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 4:53pm by KaynofTitan
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#48 Oct 28 2011 at 3:19 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
The 4 second gap between spells isn't even noticeable compared to the old 15-25 second wait. I love this so much.

ofc it's not noticeable now but probably later when we finally get used to it, and then find it irritating and annoying delay...
I was hoping for no delay at all or 1-2 secs max, we already have individual recasts why keep the universal one? (probably if they would remove it, they will lengthen the individual recasts to compensate I guess, but I can't tell how good/bad the current recasts setup is anyway, so I'll leave it at that)

I think the puppet should cast the buffs that has long duration like protect and shell before the other short ones otherwise it might get stuck casting the short ones.

keep the testing coming ppl!!
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#49 Oct 28 2011 at 3:21 PM Rating: Good
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Wind maneuver isn't forcing Haste to the front of the line. Doesn't look like you can change buff order yet.
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#50 Oct 28 2011 at 3:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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Managed to get spiritreaver to cast dread spikes. I had 2 dark maneuvers up though.

Seems like it need to be on top of hate list though.

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 5:45pm by Windermeres
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#51 Oct 28 2011 at 3:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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I don't think the recast will be all that annoying in the future. It's not too different from the animation lock that prevents you from casting spells too quickly back to back. Or a semi-competent mage scrolling through spell list manually.

Also. I decided to test Tactical processor to see if maybe the 4 second delay was related to those puppet status checkups they told us about. No dice.

Managed to get Sancho to cast Addle finally. On a beetle in the Garliage basement. It's apparently the lowest priority debuff, it only would cast it once Blind, Bio, Para, and Silence were on. The next time it tried to cast it under those conditions, I interrupted cast with Deactivate, reactivated and deployed with no maneuvers. It immediately started casting Addle again.

DREAD SPIKES DOESN'T EXIST

I've tried mixing and matching heads, attachments, tried deploying at low HP with full MP on all three caster frames. Put Valoredge on Stormwaker body, Stormhead on Valor body. Nuffin.

=EDIT=
HOW!? More details, please!

Edited, Oct 28th 2011 5:40pm by ShiftlessDrifter
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