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Get ready for the wave of noob PUPsFollow

#1 Mar 01 2010 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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A couple of my friends just bought attachments and are starting at PUP1 today...
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#2 Mar 01 2010 at 9:54 AM Rating: Good
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wat does this tactical processor do, lol.
#3 Mar 01 2010 at 10:12 AM Rating: Decent
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It's not worse that the several PUPs in mage gear coming to party with a gimped Stormwaker automaton that already populate vanadiel, really.
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Frejan - Ragnarok
SCH 99 PUP 99 WAR 99 RDM 49 NIN 49 SAM 49
Windurst Rank 10, ZM+CoP: The Last Verse, ToAU: Eternal Mercenary, WotG Champion of the Dawn.
#4 Mar 01 2010 at 10:15 AM Rating: Default
Edited by bsphil
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lolRagnarok.

From what I saw there were a lot more gimp PUPs there than there are here on Cerberus.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#5 Mar 01 2010 at 10:22 AM Rating: Default
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For every PUP wearing appropriate gear (I'll include myself there), there has to be 10 more in evasion-mage gear, really. No wonder why invites are so scarce, I myself have doubts about inviting other PUPs when forming one because of that.

I just hope that, with ther official acknowledgement in the DD department from SE, a good portion PUPs will try to gear accordingly, and not like some kind of unique soloer.
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Frejan - Ragnarok
SCH 99 PUP 99 WAR 99 RDM 49 NIN 49 SAM 49
Windurst Rank 10, ZM+CoP: The Last Verse, ToAU: Eternal Mercenary, WotG Champion of the Dawn.
#6 Mar 01 2010 at 10:24 AM Rating: Default
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*hit with stick hit with stick >:(*

Im so glad i got every last one of the big name attachments before they jumped in price, let alone after THIS update. Jesus ****, im glad im already decently geared out as well, less frustrating hours competing against new pups for gear.

*Beats with a stick some more*
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#7 Mar 01 2010 at 10:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Should edit the word "another" in your topic.
#8 Mar 01 2010 at 11:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Glad I just put together a targetting the captain static with some ls friends. I get the attachments that I need, they get everything else, including the attachments I already have. I max PUP, they get gil.

It's good to have a fun linkshell.
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#9shadowkind, Posted: Mar 01 2010 at 11:17 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Time for me to start doing the enm 60 again for the chance to price jack on the attachments.
#10 Mar 01 2010 at 11:44 AM Rating: Default
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TaimMeich wrote:
For every PUP wearing appropriate gear (I'll include myself there), there has to be 10 more in evasion-mage gear, really. No wonder why invites are so scarce, I myself have doubts about inviting other PUPs when forming one because of that.

I just hope that, with ther official acknowledgement in the DD department from SE, a good portion PUPs will try to gear accordingly, and not like some kind of unique soloer.


At your level the gear barely makes a difference since there is so little DD gear to choose from. People don't invite PUPs because they are just a hassle to deal with, good gear or not. I doubt people are thinking of the "crappy" gear but rather the time that the PUP's auto got killed and he couldn't reactivate (loltimer), or the time they level synced and the auto vanished with 19 minutes left on the activate timer.
#11xbobbobx, Posted: Mar 01 2010 at 12:16 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Luckily SE fixed that Twice already in patches.
#12 Mar 01 2010 at 12:19 PM Rating: Decent
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I am just glad I got all of my attachments and 6/6 relic before this. Now every single person in my Dynamis shell who had leveled PUP for another Usukane job wants the Pantin Cape and higher cost attachments.
#13 Mar 01 2010 at 2:37 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't imagine the price of the high end attachments will go up. This new wave just won't bother to buy them. Since you can't /check a puppet, they'll just pretend their bad performance is normal.

People tend to do a double-take when I tell them I've put close to 7m gil into the puppet alone. I hope I've put off a few casual people from the job like that.
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#14 Mar 01 2010 at 2:44 PM Rating: Default
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also that target the captain, if not capped at 75 well become very easy for a lvl 90+ group.
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#15 Mar 01 2010 at 2:58 PM Rating: Default
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I just explained to my LS about AF hands and all that to the 4 lvl 1-10 pups x.x;
#16 Mar 01 2010 at 3:04 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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Tell them all to go get Buffoon's collars!
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#17 Mar 01 2010 at 3:10 PM Rating: Good
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It will be really difficult for starting PUPs. Premium attachments are hard to come by.

I believe most of the guys in my LS have yet to get Turbo Charger, Condenser, Tranquilizer, .etc. Either its too expensive or they have difficulty finding it on the AH.

Imagine how much harder it will be if there is a new wave of PUPs on the way.


#18 Mar 01 2010 at 3:29 PM Rating: Decent
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SuiRyu wrote:
It will be really difficult for starting PUPs. Premium attachments are hard to come by.

I believe most of the guys in my LS have yet to get Turbo Charger, Condenser, Tranquilizer, .etc. Either its too expensive or they have difficulty finding it on the AH.

Imagine how much harder it will be if there is a new wave of PUPs on the way.


Yeah, I reactivated my account today to pick up some of the attachments I'd been holding out on (turbo charger+optic fibre), before the influx of bandwagoners hike the price >_>

There weren't any tranquilizers or economizers on though |:
#19 Mar 01 2010 at 3:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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Which reminds me, I need to buy my Turbo Charger ASAP >_<

Bye bye gil I was saving for an Enfeebling Torque...
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Frejan - Ragnarok
SCH 99 PUP 99 WAR 99 RDM 49 NIN 49 SAM 49
Windurst Rank 10, ZM+CoP: The Last Verse, ToAU: Eternal Mercenary, WotG Champion of the Dawn.
#20 Mar 01 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Good
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You know... at first I was really happy about the A H2H rating. I was jumping with joy. But then I gave it some thought. Really, I think it's gonna hurt us. We were already fantastic with what we had, just people didn't understand us. But now, people are going to start liking pup FOR ALL THE WRONG REASONS

Think of it, it's like a healing SMN. People don't really know what smn can do, they just use them to heal. Now people are going to look at pup as a DD mnk, NOT AS A PUP. No one is going to care about what the puppet can do, and people lvling it up will focus on themselves and not the puppet.

I also really really hate the fact that we all went through **** as pup, constantly being made fun of, people telling us we couldn't do it, and still we never gave up on the job and gave it a good name always. And now all those people are eating their words, again, for the wrong reasons. Now everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon and say "Hey pup is great!" I already really hate all those people... People are seriously going to start looking at us completely different now, for a reason I really don't want.

PUP, imo, was meant to just have your puppet deal the majority of all the dmg, with you being able to deal some. But that's why people hated us, because they didn't SEE big numbers from US, but never pay attention to what the puppet is doing. And yes, a lot of noob puppets would give us a bad name because they didn't know how to work the puppet or didn't have attachments. I see DRG as more like a job that has a pet that just adds dmg, and the drg themselves doing the most dmg. Somewhat of a same concept for bst in some cases. But pup the idea of the job was to utilize the puppet, not really the master as much. But with the upcoming change, people are going to look at our puppet as being useless and won't care about what it can do

Thank you SE, for us original pups who cherish the job for what it is really do appreciate it. But dammit for what the future of the job may become.......
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#21 Mar 01 2010 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
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[quote=HardBacon]But pup the idea of the job was to utilize the puppet, not really the master as much./quote]

Well I can agree with this bit, in that it was always annoying especially pre-merited i.e. pre 75 PUP to have enmity stolen by the paper-armour automaton. Now that the auto, in VE or Harle form (why Harle, goodness knows, unless its a 'show PUP players below level 20 what their awesome auto can (not) do)) form will be more durable, and the master will have A class H2H to keep agro, that's not an issue.
#22 Mar 01 2010 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
You know... at first I was really happy about the A H2H rating. I was jumping with joy. But then I gave it some thought. Really, I think it's gonna hurt us. We were already fantastic with what we had, just people didn't understand us. But now, people are going to start liking pup FOR ALL THE WRONG REASONS

Think of it, it's like a healing SMN. People don't really know what smn can do, they just use them to heal. Now people are going to look at pup as a DD mnk, NOT AS A PUP. No one is going to care about what the puppet can do, and people lvling it up will focus on themselves and not the puppet.

I also really really hate the fact that we all went through **** as pup, constantly being made fun of, people telling us we couldn't do it, and still we never gave up on the job and gave it a good name always. And now all those people are eating their words, again, for the wrong reasons. Now everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon and say "Hey pup is great!" I already really hate all those people... People are seriously going to start looking at us completely different now, for a reason I really don't want.

PUP, imo, was meant to just have your puppet deal the majority of all the dmg, with you being able to deal some. But that's why people hated us, because they didn't SEE big numbers from US, but never pay attention to what the puppet is doing. And yes, a lot of noob puppets would give us a bad name because they didn't know how to work the puppet or didn't have attachments. I see DRG as more like a job that has a pet that just adds dmg, and the drg themselves doing the most dmg. Somewhat of a same concept for bst in some cases. But pup the idea of the job was to utilize the puppet, not really the master as much. But with the upcoming change, people are going to look at our puppet as being useless and won't care about what it can do

Thank you SE, for us original pups who cherish the job for what it is really do appreciate it. But dammit for what the future of the job may become.......


That kind of rational thought gets you rated down around here, so be careful. It's bad to disagree with the people who support the A rank.

Once they see the mistake they've made, SE will tweak our damage-dealing capabilities back down. They probably won't reduce the A rank, though. We'll probably see our nerf in the way of Stringing Pummel. I can't see them leaving it as potent as it is when our accuracy is on par with a monk's.

I'd like to see how they plan on balancing us against well-geared monks. Because if things stay roughly the same, a monk will end up being a PUP with no puppet.
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#23 Mar 01 2010 at 5:09 PM Rating: Good
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TaimMeich wrote:
I just hope that, with ther official acknowledgement in the DD department from SE, a good portion PUPs will try to gear accordingly, and not like some kind of unique soloer.


This x1000. The acknowledgment that the master should be punching stuff will hopefully do something to remove the worst kind of currently existing PUP - that guy wearing a bizarre mix of AF, STR rings, random mage pieces, and evasion gear (along with any piece of Relic gear they managed to get). I thought it was obvious enough with all of the DD armor S-E has been giving PUP for some time now, but it was pretty hard to overcome that way of thinking from the early days when we only had access to a grab bag of mage gear to prevent the master from being too powerful.

And hey, at the very least, A rank H2H skill provides a safety net for PUP to still perform well even if the player is subpar at using the automaton. For someone who isn't very skilled, PUP can still perform half-decent just by using DD gear that isn't ridiculous (much like SAM today). A GOOD PUP will still be far better, but a mediocre PUP won't be totally useless. Maybe they'll learn to improve while they play, we can only hope.
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#24 Mar 01 2010 at 5:13 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:
I don't imagine the price of the high end attachments will go up. This new wave just won't bother to buy them. Since you can't /check a puppet, they'll just pretend their bad performance is normal.

People tend to do a double-take when I tell them I've put close to 7m gil into the puppet alone. I hope I've put off a few casual people from the job like that.


I think it will help us alot more then it will hurt us.

The more people leveling the job, the more interest in the top name attachments. The more people interested in those attachments, the more people looking for different ways to get them, eventually leading the more on the market.

Targeting the Captain, and Ob are not the most difficult things on the planet, they're just considered a waste of time for anyone who isn't just chilling with a pup friend. With more and more people looking for a stronger job to use, Pup attachments will decrease in price.

Especially with the server merges, it won't be overnight but this is why the Volan's Greaves, Mountain Gaiters (iirc) and Optical Needle all went down in price.

SE will probably add more attachments as long as they're looking at the job.

Quote:
You know... at first I was really happy about the A H2H rating. I was jumping with joy. But then I gave it some thought. Really, I think it's gonna hurt us. We were already fantastic with what we had, just people didn't understand us. But now, people are going to start liking pup FOR ALL THE WRONG REASONS


Someone else said it, but it goes as simply as need be:

"Pup haters, will quiet down. Pup lovers, won't shut up. It won't make a bad Pup great, but only make the great pups even greater and where they should have been."

Pup, is not Dragoon. When they repaired the lol - Drg sentiment it carried by doing an update of along the same lines (Make them more accurate, hit harder, and make their pets more noticeable) you got a wave of old Drgs and new Drg's who just want another Mnk, Drk, or War.

Because of that, you have Drg/Dnc, which is the biggest solo joke combo in quite some time, especially the amount of time they spent into making Drg/Whm such a beastly combo.

It cheapens the uniquness of the job when you just blend them together. There "was" no other job like Drg and it had the Drk rivalry at the time to make it even better. Now its lost all that, its more like another DD. Pup has rivalries with everybody, but none stand out like our compeition from Monks.

This will ultimately make the bad Pups with good gear and horrible auto skills, just like that of a Monk without an O.Kote. Decent, passable, but you'd like it more of its own thing. You know, the kind of thing that makes us top DD for the first 40 levels or so with the right skill.

But as I said, Pup is not Drg. You cannot play it like any other melee, you cannot play it like any other mage, **** even if you play Bst, you can't play it like that either.

Pup is its own entity, a micromanaging, three steps ahead, high maintenance mechanic that takes alot of practice to get from watching its puppet die on Decent challenges, to soloing Wamoura's or chaining VT's. (Fun things to do.)

There will be a wave of new Pups, but this is not a job you can Astral Flow leech either, much like Blu. You got to put in the time, to get the most out of it. And because of this, this is a buff, if not a blessing when you factor in everything.

Edited, Mar 1st 2010 6:19pm by TheLordOfTheSandwhich
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#25 Mar 01 2010 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
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What I really don't get is why some people can do so badly in parties with PUP. People keep saying that playing PUP is complicated, but even with the most basic attachments, and doing a cycle of lightning, fire and whatever with Sharpshot they would be contributing good damage to any party. It's as mindless as hitting a macro button once every 20 seconds on average... I don't know, PUP is my first DD job, but even when leveling WAR for sub I wasn't outparsing people SO easily (and I put on it the effort I would if I was leveling it as a main). I think it's actually EASY to do well on PUP.

Maybe I'm overestimating people's skill ability to hit 3 buttons?
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Frejan - Ragnarok
SCH 99 PUP 99 WAR 99 RDM 49 NIN 49 SAM 49
Windurst Rank 10, ZM+CoP: The Last Verse, ToAU: Eternal Mercenary, WotG Champion of the Dawn.
#26 Mar 01 2010 at 5:33 PM Rating: Good
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Easiest way to prepare for the new wave of PUP is to convince them that Guard is really really really really useful and MUST be maxed out. Those mandys in Bibiki Bay need something to do.
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