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/ra hands? (other than CFG)Follow

#1 May 16 2011 at 6:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Having a hard time figuring out what hands to use for shooting. This is for situations where I'd be shooting for TP - not for WS (I use Heafoc for Slug/Det, Schutzen for Leaden, and I don't have WF).

The one caveat: I don't have CFG, because I never really got into sky. I hear some of the new augments on them are pretty sweet, but ewww Synergy ;P Maybe the new augments will revitalize Sky enough that it's a good opportunity for me to get my hands on these hands, but for this discussion I'm assuming no CFG.

My options:
- Navarch's +1 (no +2, but for purposes of this discussion they're really pretty similar - R.Acc+13 versus R.Acc+16)
- Commodore (Snapshot, R.Acc+5, AGI+2)
- Trigger Gloves (R.Atk+8, R.Acc+6, AGI+3 - aka Barbarossa's Moufles +1, or CFG-1 if you look at it that way)
- Praeda? (I don't have, but should be able to get without too much hassle)

Do you run into stuff where the huge chunks of R.Acc on Nav+1/+2 are ever really needed, or is it overkill? Does Snapshot win out, or would something like the R.Atk on Trigger be of more benefit?

For what it's worth, the rest of my ranged build is something like this:

Weapon: Vulcan's Staff/Axe Grip
Ranged: Ice Mayhem+2 or Miramar, Steel Bullets
Head: Nav+1
Neck: QQ Collar
Ears: Volley/Clearview
Body: Nav+1
Hands: ???
Rings: Jalzahn's/Rajas
Back: Terebellum or Libeccio
Waist: Buccaneer's
Legs: Nav+1 or Entois
Feet: AF+1
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#2 May 17 2011 at 6:30 AM Rating: Decent
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Anza wrote:
Having a hard time figuring out what hands to use for shooting. This is for situations where I'd be shooting for TP - not for WS (I use Heafoc for Slug/Det, Schutzen for Leaden, and I don't have WF).

The one caveat: I don't have CFG, because I never really got into sky. I hear some of the new augments on them are pretty sweet, but ewww Synergy ;P Maybe the new augments will revitalize Sky enough that it's a good opportunity for me to get my hands on these hands, but for this discussion I'm assuming no CFG.

My options:
- Navarch's +1 (no +2, but for purposes of this discussion they're really pretty similar - R.Acc+13 versus R.Acc+16)
- Commodore (Snapshot, R.Acc+5, AGI+2)
- Trigger Gloves (R.Atk+8, R.Acc+6, AGI+3 - aka Barbarossa's Moufles +1, or CFG-1 if you look at it that way)
- Praeda? (I don't have, but should be able to get without too much hassle)

Do you run into stuff where the huge chunks of R.Acc on Nav+1/+2 are ever really needed, or is it overkill? Does Snapshot win out, or would something like the R.Atk on Trigger be of more benefit?

For what it's worth, the rest of my ranged build is something like this:

Weapon: Vulcan's Staff/Axe Grip
Ranged: Ice Mayhem+2 or Miramar, Steel Bullets
Head: Nav+1
Neck: QQ Collar
Ears: Volley/Clearview
Body: Nav+1
Hands: ???
Rings: Jalzahn's/Rajas
Back: Terebellum or Libeccio
Waist: Buccaneer's
Legs: Nav+1 or Entois
Feet: AF+1


Outside of Abyssea, its stack racc is usual. You should look into getting praeda shoes to replace +1 feet. Also sky is rpetty cake, so getting the gloves shouldnt be any harder the obtaining paeda really. Id stick with af3 all around. Crit bonus benefits ranged attacks a lot more now then it use to especially in abyssea.

Snap shots only good if you have a snap shot set, I personally dont due to the fact I have to much gear as it is on COR to begin with.
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#3 May 17 2011 at 2:13 PM Rating: Good
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Anza wrote:

My options:
- Navarch's +1 (no +2, but for purposes of this discussion they're really pretty similar - R.Acc+13 versus R.Acc+16)
- Commodore (Snapshot, R.Acc+5, AGI+2)
- Trigger Gloves (R.Atk+8, R.Acc+6, AGI+3 - aka Barbarossa's Moufles +1, or CFG-1 if you look at it that way)
- Praeda? (I don't have, but should be able to get without too much hassle)




I've been testing in Sky another day, /ra crit-hit was doing maybe 20~50 more dmg only, and it rarely crit, don't think it's worth it to use AF3 hands just for crit-hit. Unless you really really need racc.

In abyssea I'm either using atma to increase WS dmg when I /ra(fire attack and MAB atmas), or just melee it. I'll find a time to test /ra with RR atma, was thinking Evi build with RR atma + Awilda's Gun+ triple shot to gain TP may actually be a pretty good way to DD on magic resist NMs without getting hit by AoE and still able to run in and WS.

AF2 hands is just a snapshot macro, personally I won't bother if you don't use snapshot macro since one snapshot piece doesn't make a **** difference.

Trigger gloves looks cheap and easy to get, probably a good choice to use it for now if you don't need that much racc from AF3 hands and not using crit-hit atma in Abby.

Out of all the gear listed above, I think Praeda hands are the best choice if you have feet and aiming for x-hit, since both pieces will give you STP+5 and that helps your x-hit a lot. I'd use this if I were you, and swap to AF3 hands if racc is still an issue.


Edited, May 17th 2011 4:15pm by Afania
#4 May 17 2011 at 4:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks for the input.

Yeah I guess I don't really see when to use Snapshot. Perhaps I should visit the Porter Moogle and just store the Relic hands to save some space... Does anyone here actually put a Snapshot build to good use, and if so, what do you use it for - Odin in Einherjar maybe, some of the new Voidwalker stuff perhaps? Would Courser's Roll ever make a less than full Snapshot set more worthwhile? I guess such a build would include things like:

Head - Aurore or Zha'gho Barbut
Hands - Commodore
Waist - Impulse Belt
Back - Navarch's Mantle
Legs - Navarch's +1/+2

I suppose for now I'll just stick to Trigger when I don't need R.Acc, and Navarch's if I do need to up the Acc a bit. Though honestly, I don't really feel like I'm wanting for R.Acc very much with stuff like Navarch head/body and a couple R.Acc+4 earrings, and if I'm ever actually shooting for TP I'd be eating R.Acc food anyway. I already go a little heavier on damage over R.Acc in gear by choosing stuff like Jalzahn's/Rajas and Qiqirn Collar over pure R.Acc options, and I always waffle on Libeccio versus Terebellum for back (though the tiebreaker usually lands on Libeccio for the Recycle).

Praeda look interesting, guess I'll work on getting those too. But the set bonus is a little less impressive considering that regain from Atma/Tactician's Roll does mess things up a bit for a traditional x-hit build.

Maybe I'll get CFG, but I'm not really making a big deal out of it since I don't get into that many situations where I need to shoot for TP/damage. If it happens, it happens. Not gonna go sky-crazy just for that though. If it was just for getting to 100tp fast, I guess Navarch hands or the Praeda set would be ideal anyway.
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#5 May 18 2011 at 5:19 AM Rating: Decent
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Anza wrote:
Thanks for the input.

Yeah I guess I don't really see when to use Snapshot. Perhaps I should visit the Porter Moogle and just store the Relic hands to save some space... Does anyone here actually put a Snapshot build to good use, and if so, what do you use it for - Odin in Einherjar maybe, some of the new Voidwalker stuff perhaps? Would Courser's Roll ever make a less than full Snapshot set more worthwhile? I guess such a build would include things like:

Head - Aurore or Zha'gho Barbut
Hands - Commodore
Waist - Impulse Belt
Back - Navarch's Mantle
Legs - Navarch's +1/+2



You can also get snapshot augment body piece from Dominion NPC.

Basically snapshot macro is just a set of gear with snapshot you macro in before you /ra, and after you /ra you macro in your STP/rattk gear so you get the benefit of both, much like fast cast.

Most ppl believe courser's roll/snapshot works like haste, the more you stack the more beneficial it is. But I'm not sure if it's better or worse than regain roll for /ra TP, I can't even find any number on wiki about courser's roll last time I checked.

#6 May 20 2011 at 2:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Is this inside or outside AByssea?

Inside Abyssea I almost never shoot. Between Tactician's roll, QD and Sea Daughter Atma, I get to 100 TP almost too fast to bother shooting. Additionally, inside Abyssea, if I'm on COR its mostly to provide tactician's roll for the red proc'ers or fast cast roll for the yellow proc'ers. My damage output is generally superfluous. Speed of most NM kills in my experience is largely dependent on speed of obtaining red and yellow weakness proc. What hands I'm wearing won't change that.

For trash mobs (i.e. dom ops parties) I just go COR/DNC and DW Twilight Knife and Yhatagan with DA/haste gear, RR/VV/apoc atma and use evisceration.

Outside Abyssea I'd look at store TP if X-hit is your thing. You shouldn't really need AF3+1 against most things in Vanadiel with 350 marksmanship skill. So Praeda is an option if you have feet and need 5 STP for an Xhit build. Otherwise Trigger is a good compromise to CFG. Sadly some of us play on 360 so we can't do the Snapshot -> switch to RATT gear macro swaps.

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#7 May 21 2011 at 7:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Dartagnann wrote:
Is this inside or outside AByssea?


Honestly, it's more theoretical than anything. Just kind of tweaking gear builds for fun I guess. Maybe some unusual situation where you want some more damage in your group but melee is dangerous due to AoE. I can't even think of a good example off the top of my head, but on rare occasion I'll find that a ranged build comes in handy. I haven't done much Voidwalker stuff or the new KCNMs yet, maybe that will provide some of those kinds of situations.

In Abyssea I'm honestly usually on something other than COR, but if I am it's generally like you - either melee with Yahtagan/Twilight RR/VV/Apoc and Evisceration, or I'm there for buffs with a bunch of regain.

Outside Abyssea, even then I'm usually just taking daggers these days. With 8/8 dagger merits and a pretty solid haste build, I just melee for TP and even then I debate whether to use Evisceration or a ranged WS.

Maybe the more appropriate question is "when do you /ra?"...
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#8 May 22 2011 at 6:21 PM Rating: Decent
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Dartagnann wrote:
Is this inside or outside AByssea?

Inside Abyssea I almost never shoot. Between Tactician's roll, QD and Sea Daughter Atma, I get to 100 TP almost too fast to bother shooting. Additionally, inside Abyssea, if I'm on COR its mostly to provide tactician's roll for the red proc'ers or fast cast roll for the yellow proc'ers. My damage output is generally superfluous. Speed of most NM kills in my experience is largely dependent on speed of obtaining red and yellow weakness proc. What hands I'm wearing won't change that.

For trash mobs (i.e. dom ops parties) I just go COR/DNC and DW Twilight Knife and Yhatagan with DA/haste gear, RR/VV/apoc atma and use evisceration.

Outside Abyssea I'd look at store TP if X-hit is your thing. You shouldn't really need AF3+1 against most things in Vanadiel with 350 marksmanship skill. So Praeda is an option if you have feet and need 5 STP for an Xhit build. Otherwise Trigger is a good compromise to CFG. Sadly some of us play on 360 so we can't do the Snapshot -> switch to RATT gear macro swaps.




Have you try Voidwatch NM yet?

I haven't really get into it(really haven't play much nowadays), just randomly helped twice when it was out, but from what I've heard:

1.COR is really useful for this new event.

2.Even A rank melee jobs need sushi/hunters roll.

So I can imagine by next half an year, main game content may focus towards outside NM and acc become relevant again. Don't give up racc pieces just yet XD


#9 May 22 2011 at 8:54 PM Rating: Good
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Anza wrote:
Maybe the more appropriate question is "when do you /ra?"...

Triple shot

Also Voidwatch has brought back the need for support jobs with a vengence.

~Ath
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#10 May 23 2011 at 10:26 AM Rating: Good
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Afania wrote:
Have you try Voidwatch NM yet?

2.Even A rank melee jobs need sushi/hunters roll.


I haven't jumped into Voidwatch yet, but interesting to hear the input.

Tying this back to the topic question... if what Afania says re: need for Acc even on A rank jobs, that seems to point to Navarch's +1/+2 as an ideal hand choice due to the large amounts of R.Acc.

Edited, May 23rd 2011 12:27pm by Anza
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#11 May 23 2011 at 3:54 PM Rating: Good
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I have a pretty decent snapshot set built up.

Aurore Head
Skopos Jerkin +3
Navarch's Mantle
Impulse Belt
Navarch's Culottes +1

From what I understand, you treat snapshot like fast cast gear, you equip it before you /ra then equip your ratk/racc/etc. gear while you are "shooting".

I have found limited information on how much benefit "Enhances Snapshot Effect" is, but I have found some info suggesting that +1 like for Skopos or Mirke is 2% delay reduction for the shot. When I get some more trophies, I am for sure going to be trying to get a Skopos Jerkin with +5 on it. Also looking to try to get Commodore hands for the snapshot on it.
#12 May 26 2011 at 8:16 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Have you try Voidwatch NM yet?


Not yet. But if they are nasty NM's that need RACC, I'm fine with that. Have all this RACC gear I barely ever need to equip.

I'd love a fight that required COR buffs and a need for slugshot once again. But right now our LS is still working on Empyrean stuff and New Dyna.
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#13 May 26 2011 at 10:58 AM Rating: Good
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Dartagnann wrote:
Quote:
Have you try Voidwatch NM yet?


Not yet. But if they are nasty NM's that need RACC, I'm fine with that. Have all this RACC gear I barely ever need to equip.

I'd love a fight that required COR buffs and a need for slugshot once again. But right now our LS is still working on Empyrean stuff and New Dyna.


One thing I've learned in the past many months is that I really don't miss Slug so much. Honestly, any fight that "required" COR buffs and massive RACC I'd maybe lean toward Detonator's reliability a bit more. And even OUTSIDE of Abyssea, in a melee friendly situation, if you have a good Evisceration setup you might be able to beat Slug - I was playing around with Slug and Steel Bullets versus Evisceration while doing some magian trials with a friend, and my Eviscerations averaged better damage than Slug (not to mention no ammo cost and no risk of a complete miss).

But yeah, I agree with the sentiment that seeing a few fights that benefit from COR buffs (and might also play into using /ra) would be a bit refreshing. Not that I don't like Abyssea, but mixing it up is always fun.

Edited, May 27th 2011 12:26pm by Anza
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#14 May 31 2011 at 5:10 AM Rating: Good
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One thing I've learned in the past many months is that I really don't miss Slug so much.


I can't say i do either. I rarely get to play COR, but when I do now its the 'Gun Mage' approach using MAB build and atma's Quick drawing, Leaden Saluting and buffing RAing inbetween if viable - also I'll take up Haste duty aswell. I got all my +1 for COR from redundant drops and a couple of +2 pieces that I actually think matter (inc the boots obviously).

Abyssea changed the way COR is played on a massive scale (introducing 2-3 different ways to play the job that beat the Slug/Det style), but it does look like more 'old skool' style playing will take place post abyssea.
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#15 May 31 2011 at 7:29 PM Rating: Decent
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Sandmasterr wrote:
Quote:
One thing I've learned in the past many months is that I really don't miss Slug so much.


I can't say i do either. I rarely get to play COR, but when I do now its the 'Gun Mage' approach using MAB build and atma's Quick drawing, Leaden Saluting and buffing RAing inbetween if viable - also I'll take up Haste duty aswell. I got all my +1 for COR from redundant drops and a couple of +2 pieces that I actually think matter (inc the boots obviously).



Sounds like other +2s doesn't matter XD

I'd say body AF3+2 is very good, makes regain roll godly. It's actually one of the few enhance roll pieces that makes very noticeable difference IMO.
#16 Jun 02 2011 at 7:29 AM Rating: Good
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Afania wrote:
I'd say body AF3+2 is very good, makes regain roll godly. It's actually one of the few enhance roll pieces that makes very noticeable difference IMO.

Totally agree, as a macro piece for Tactician's it is amazing.

~Ath
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