Gear question?Follow

So considering taking up SMN, but had a few quick questions. As far as gear go, outside of MND for curing, what are the main stats that I need to build for? I don't have a whole lot of knowledge on mage jobs, but like for BLM, I know you want things like INT, MAB, MACC, Elemental Skill, etc...

SMN is a bit of a mystery to me as far as what to build for. Have done a little research on Wiki, so I have a very small general idea of what I'll need (MP, MP, MP, Summoning Skill, Blood Pact delay and Perp. cost), but is there anything else?

Thanx in advance.

You should also consider trading in a few keys to the Tenshodo Coffer, you can get some decent pet gear that way. The gear isn't so great that you would want to wear it fulltime, but it is definitely worthy of macroing in for Bloodpacts. You could also try getting the Herder's Subligar from locked chests in Sauromugue Champaign - also useful for BP's.

Edited, Oct 9th 2009 12:48pm by Squintik

Yeah, already have some HMP gear from my BLU. Another quick question... Obviously BLM is pretty much the staple main nuking job, but how does SMN compare?

See, I have a friend that swears that some day I will level BLM... Never much cared for mage jobs, but getting to a point where I kind of need one. My BLU can pull off some pretty surprising breath attacks, but the range sucks. There is no way I'm going to let this friend be right about me leveling BLM (I'd never hear the end of it), which is why I'm looking into SMN.

I have all DD jobs to this point, but wanted something (besides BLM) that would allow me to be more helpful in MB only events. Thought about SCH, but didn't want to basically be a WHM for my first 70 levels.

Also, SMN/THF at 66? Really? Are you talking for like meleeing in Campaign or something?

Edited, Oct 9th 2009 4:51pm by MinscandBoo

It doesn't, really. The thing about SMN is that it's not a specialist at all, not in any respect. It is in fact the most versatile job in the game, it can do damage decently well, but not as well as ANY dedicated DD (even the lower ones like a poorly equipped THF or DRG). It can buff decently, but not nearly as well as jobs like BRD or COR. It can heal decently, but not nearly as well as jobs like WHM, RDM, or SCH. It can even tank decently, but not nearly as well as jobs like PLD, WAR, NIN. So if you're leveling SMN to fill one particular gap, then you are leveling the wrong job. The only thing SMN does better than any other job is: EYE CANDY! We have some of the most beautiful effects in the entire game, even better than BLM.

In terms of a raw comparison between BLM & SMN, SMN's strongest advantage is in being able to do hate-free damage. However, tanks these days can generate so much enmity that this usually isn't a concern. A BLM can often drop damage way faster than a SMN can and still not pull hate, so SMN doesn't really stand up to BLM in terms of damage output unless the mobs are resistant to magic.

However, it sounds like you're more interested in SMN as a job that isn't useless in manaburn situations, rather than being comparable to BLM in terms of function. SMN can fill a good role in manaburn, because SMN's magic buffs are actually comparable to real buffs from say a BRD or COR. Dream Shroud rocks, and on a low moon phase Ecliptic Growl can be very nice for mages too. Also if there's a COR in the party, SMN will make their Evoker's Roll stronger. Plus on top of these things, you can deal significant low-risk damage. So if you're just looking for something that can be useful in a manaburn scenario, SMN can fill that role. Just don't expect to be dealing the same kind of damage BLMs are doing.


He means meleeing in exp. INT & MND are both mods for Spirit Taker, which you can obtain at Lv66. This assumes you can find a party that'll let you do it, though. Sadly most invites you get will be to fill support/healing roles.

merited pacts, specifically fully merited ones, often pull in numbers similar to am2. non bursted, non tp'd 5/5 wind blades will put up 1100-1200 against fafnir, with minimum mab from gear and merits. most blm will put out 1200-1300+.

i am currently at 2/5 mab merits, being the only mab i have for my pacts. it is possible, without getting nirvana, to get at least +27 mab, or about a 27% increase in damage. so considering a 5/5 windblade's base is about 1100 damage to fafnir, it becomes 1397 with full mab, and 1617 with full mab and nirvana.

actually, absolute peak to fafnir, if my math is correct, is 2277 damage with the following situations:
5/5 windblade, no tp, which could skew it further!
27 mab from gear and merits
20 mab from nirvana
20 mab from astral pot
30% bonus due to MB.
10% bonus due to day.

Edited, Oct 10th 2009 2:17pm by frodnonnag

Edited, Oct 10th 2009 2:18pm by frodnonnag

For "textbook" SMN (Blood Pacts + healing), MP is king, and choosing equipment prior to 70 is pretty straightforward:

- Austere set
- AF pants/feet/head
- Carbuncle Mitts
- Elemental staves

Other than that, the general rule is to choose whichever piece gives the most MP for each slot. Pieces with -enmity are also useful for soloing and healing. You'll also want a resting set for MP recovery (Dark Staff, Baron's Slops, etc.)

Once you get to 70, there are more options in endgame gear, but by that time you should be able to make your own informed gear choices. ^.^

Mellowy's advice is directed toward melee SMN, which unfortunately I have never explored so I have no advice other than to agree with INT/MND for Spirit Taker. (Mellowy, can you please explain your choice of THF subjob for melee SMN over WAR, NIN, SAM, etc.? Having never taken a non-mage job past 20, I'm somewhat melee challenged...)


Edit: Oh, if you're looking for a nuking job to compare with BLM, perhaps you might take SCH out for a spin.

Edited, Oct 11th 2009 3:16am by Nupinu

Well, I don't NEED to match or beat BLM in nukes, but so long as I can come somewhat close I'll be happy. Gear looks pretty straight forward, but I do have one other question concerning merits. Looking to make a pure nuking SMN. I have 6 (almost 7) DDs, so I pretty covered physically. So does the following look right?

Avatar Magical Acc: 5
Avatar Magical Att: 5

Then go 5/5 on 2 of the merited Avatar moves (looking at Heavenly Strike and Thunderstorm so that I cover both light and dark sides)? Ice and thunder seem to be the 2 BLM get the most use out of, so figured those would be the way to go.

MinscandBoo wrote:


All that and SMN seems to need the least amount of the extra gear that BLM or SCH would need such as INT, MAB, MACC, Dark/Elemental/Enfeebling/etc. Magic Skill...

Still a long ways from 75, so it'll give me time to think more on merits. Getting Carby Mitts tonight, so there's a good start. :D

Yeah, my SMN would be purely for end game type events. My LS been looking to get into Sea gods at some point soon here and I wanted something to have ranged nukes (besides BLM and SCH). We're also in need of some UFO organs and I'm the only one of our usual 6-10 member group that doesn't have a nuker besides BLU (great breath attack nukes, but range sucks).

As far as MAcc, I was leaning towards 5/5 (and 5/5 MAtt) as it seemed to make more sense to me to have the nuke go unresisted than to have some extra damage through TP gain. Not to mention, as far as something like UFOs go, don't want to be feeding them TP anyways.

As far as tier 2 merits, am I good with going 5/5 Heavenly Strike and 5/5 Thunderstorm? Is there a better light or dark based nuke I should be looking into or is this just a case of "sh!t is situational"?

Also, will merit Summoning Skill help magical nukes land? Bit confused how SMN skill works.

No, I read that. It just isn't the whole picture. Gear requirements are fairly similar, especially if you only care about nuking. SMN has an earlier capping point in terms of total gear amount, yes, but BLM and SCH are wildly more situation. You won't need, for example, an super INT build since fights that use that can be done on other jobs. SMN also has the problem of being slotted as a curebot just as SCH does. Soloing and making your own party to avoid being "a WHM for my first 70 levels" can be done by BLM and SCH too.

On top of that, as Perg said, our Magic BPs are rarely the best option. While Frodo was getting excited over our potential (rightfully so), BLMs don't reach the breaking point as soon as SMN does and doesn't require a Mythic to do so. You're intentionally limiting yourself your goal is purely nuking, and really the only reason to pick SMN over BLM or SCH for nukes is so that your LS doesn't make you come BLM to every other even once you get it.

The arguments against BLM|SCH vs SMN are hollow because SMN, SCH, and BLM arguments are all pretty equal. So I assumed you put more thought into it, hence the "so ok".


Summoning skill (over cap) increases BP accuracy, magical and physical. It's much easier to gear for skill than other forms of accuracy and it rarely clashes with Pet: MAB given our stupidly low gear selection. Granted, gearing and meriting skill and MAcc will give you the highest accuracy, our resist rates don't vary wildly. TP will have a higher influence on total damage than MAcc ever would, and merits will increase TP gain by 7-8% while still helping physical BPs.


The biggest factors I've seen people look at are magic bursting Light and Dark, Threnodies BRDs use (and other forms of elemental resistance down), and least but sometimes most important Avatar efficiency.

Light and Dark are easy to get, you'll find numerous combinations that fight. Elemental resistance tends to be the biggest one people look at, and which is why SMNs emulate BLMs, since Blizzard and Thunder are the two strongest elements in there repertoire.

What most people don't look ate is avatar efficiency. Garuda is the most used Avatar due to her having arguable the best BP:Rage and Karura Hachigane making her the most MP efficient of the 6 primes. On top of that she has Whispering Wind to repair your party if they're hit with something nasty, and since you'll already have her out it's a trivial matter to fire Whispering Wind. Same with Leviathan, who has the second best BP:Rage and can fire Spring Water which is one of the best AoE Cures out there since it doubles as Erase.

Incidentally, Garuda and Leviathan fill the Light and Dark skillchains, but don't get covered by Threnodies often.

Personally, I don't get to see Threnodies often on my SMN, so I'm toying with either Garuda and Leviathan or Garuda and Shiva.

Edited, Oct 14th 2009 12:59pm by jlejeune

5/5 Wind Blade is the way to go, because with all the available gears, you can have Garuda out at any time in any weather for as little as -2 mp perp. cost. One refresh and you are gaining mp while Garuda is out.





Edited, Oct 14th 2009 5:59pm by icebabyisme

Ok, here's another question which I thought I already knew the answer to... Does MAB gear do anything for SMN? I thought no, but I saw a 55 SMN in Bastok [S] last night with one equipped and that threw me off.

Maybe he really, really liked Banish?

To add to it, I'd recommend a damage reduction gear setup of some sort, especially if you're the soloing type of individual. Given that in some, if not most, endgame situations we are in, we'll be in range of physical or magical TP moves, and with our relatively low HP, it's good to be able to mitigate that as best you can.

Helps mythic WS, but in general you hit for the same damage with Spirit Taker and it gives MP back, so it is not a very important stat.

Hahaha.

Yep, that's what i thought too, when i started lvling summoner. But serioulsly: My smn-gear nowadays uses up more than 60 (don't know the exact number of pieces) slots of inventory space and i'm far from having gathered all pieces i want. There are so many things that you can boost: HMP, hMP, Pet: MAcc, MAtt, PAcc, PAtt, defense, bp-timer, perpetuation cost, summoning skill...

with the last updates/add-ons more and more useful (macro-)gear has become available.

Ok, so is there another feet option that might be better besides Marduk or Nash? I've noticed some posters talk about AF+1 feet, but I absolutely HATE Tor. Canal and figured I wouldn't bother with the AF feet as they didn't look all that impressive.