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For the love of Altana, someone help us all with daggers?Follow

#1 Dec 06 2011 at 5:35 AM Rating: Good
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I have read a lot of threads. I have talked to a lot of people... all of which disagree! I've been told so many different things about daggers, my brain is melting. The only thing everyone agrees on is...

Twashtar and Mandau are awesome.

So let's get that out of the way. I am new to THF, having had the job about 4 months. I only levelled it because whilst getting my sub up for farming I accidently went a bit further (50s) and subsquently decided to see whether I liked it at higher levels. I have COR, so dagger and marksmanship were capped to a reasonable level.

Now I discover I LOVE THF. It's a welcome break from WHM which I seem to play at every waking moment. Being a career mage until this point, I also know far too little about DPS and WS. I get haste, I understand the difference between TPing and WSing. I get evasion, but what I don't get (and seems everyone else is in the same boat) are daggers!

Name	Source	Damage	Delay	Additional Effects		 
Twashtar (90)	Empyrean	48	176	Dex +15	Rudra's Storm	Aftermath:  Occ deals double damage 
Mandau (90)	Relic	49	176	Att +35	Mercy Stroke	Add effect: Poison 
Dakka +2 (90)	WoE	47	201		Rudra's Storm	 
Kila +3 (STR)	ToM	45	190	STR +10	Attack +20	 
Kila +3 (AGI)	ToM	45	190	AGI +10	Evasion +20	 
Kila +3 (DEX)	ToM	45	190	DEX +10	Accuracy +15	 
Fusetto +3 (WS DMG)	ToM	42	186		WS Dmg + 10%	 
Fusetto +3 (TP Bonus)	ToM	40	186		TP Bonus +100	 
Coruscanti	Qilin	49	189	DEX +15	Crit Hit +5%	Occ deals severe damage 
Lux Pugio	Qilin	48	195	DEX +10	Crit Hit +4%	 
Twilight Knife	Shinryu	40	190	QA +3%	TP, HP or MP Drain	 
Triplus Dagger	Isgebind	38	176	TA +3%	Increases TA Damage	 
Rapidus Sax	Amhuluk	32	150	Acc +12	Haste +1%	 


What the **** do I do? I have a Twilight Knife, a triplus dagger, a rapidus (don't use) and am nearly done with an AGI Kila.I'm going to finish that up for the new WS anyway. I could work on a Dakka but Twashtar and Mandau are very unlikely.

I am more likely to see a Lux Pugio as I regularly do VW but Coruscanti seems rare. I caused a huge discussion in shell between 2 THF about Twilight v Triplus. I don't have full EAF+2 yet (done feet/body, nearly done on hands, legs and head soon).

I know I should /equip the THF knife and then /equip something else.

I have questions like...

1) Does a Dakka +2 at 90 (done for comparison because for me the 95 Twashtar is unobtainable) or even +3 beat a Coruscanti and under what conditions?

Because I duo on THF a lot and I love my Sneak attack, I glanced at the dex Kila but I know THF's attack could use a boost so then looked at a STR kila. But then I get told I'm 'doingitwrong' and should finish my AGI Kila because it's full of awesome sauce for TA. Which when duoing and procing in dyna is about as much use as a chocolate teapot. My duo partner is too busy being off pulling and procing on DNC. But obviously in larger group events AGI and TA ftw. I am starting to be occasionally used in larger stuff so I need to consider it.

I am willing to put the effort in to obtain a decent but not ultimate set of daggers. Solo/Duo the fusettos look awesome for WS but DPS is important.

2) Why do people hate the Twilight knife? I can kinda see why the Triplus is nice with the EAF set bonus and our merits.

I am pulling my hair out here because I really can't see a definitive solution other than sacrificing a taru and hoping that Coruscanti or even the NQ, drop from Qilin (yay for my Fajin boots!) and even then wth do I sub?

I know I am not the only one here who struggles with it. Anyone willing to try and summarise for us noobs?

Edited, Dec 6th 2011 6:37am by eldelphia
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#2 Dec 06 2011 at 7:51 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
1) Does a Dakka +2 at 90 (done for comparison because for me the 95 Twashtar is unobtainable) or even +3 beat a Coruscanti and under what conditions?

No idea, I don't have either and if I ever have one it will be Twashtar.

Quote:
Because I duo on THF a lot and I love my Sneak attack, I glanced at the dex Kila but I know THF's attack could use a boost so then looked at a STR kila. But then I get told I'm 'doingitwrong' and should finish my AGI Kila because it's full of awesome sauce for TA.

Players who tell other players they're 'doingitwrong' are 'doingitwrong' themselves. Offering subjective comments of that nature is never productive. It's better to stay objective and offer advice, but only when it's asked.

Quote:
I am willing to put the effort in to obtain a decent but not ultimate set of daggers. Solo/Duo the fusettos look awesome for WS but DPS is important.

In abyssea, with dual Fusettos and Gales / Ultimate / Sea Daughter I pull 1800-1900 dmg per Aeolian Edge. Great for AoE farming and XP.

In a solo or duo situation, I often use 2 AGI Kila for the evasion. DPS is important, but a dead or weakened THF has no DPS.

Quote:
2) Why do people hate the Twilight knife? I can kinda see why the Triplus is nice with the EAF set bonus and our merits.

I wouldn't say ppl hate Twilight knife, its just very difficult to obtain compared to Triplus. If I had it, I'd certainly use it.
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#3 Dec 06 2011 at 3:20 PM Rating: Good
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I think there was a discussion in another thread about what daggers people went after with the the time that they had to work on them, so ill kinda respond along those lines.

I rate daggers by two conditions. One is how much time your have. Obviously twashtar and mandau are the top of the line daggers, but it seems like you don't have that time. I will say, if you're considering making a STR kila, a daka +3, a dex kila, and farming a coursucanti...then you might as well just forget all of those and make a twashtar. To be honest it really doesn't take that long, especially since we're all getting higher levels, thus making abyssea stuffs easier to kill with less people. Even if you get stuck at some point of not having enough people in your group, you can almost always find help by offering other drops. In addition, everyone that I know that made a daka pretty much dropped it and started a twash. Its not really the ws that makes it good, but the aftermath.

The second thing I go by is upgradeable vs static daggers. Sure corsucanti, luxury, trilplus, etc look good at the levels that you can equip them at, but we all know that the upgradeable daggers have another level to go to become that much stronger. I've been saying this since level 80. If you come across another non magian dagger, that's fine, keep it for situational use...but I wouldn't go out of my way to get one until we see all of our options at 99. And who knows...maybe there will be other augments to the magians past the next upgrades to make them that much stronger.

So I guess the tldr answer to your question would be to go ahead and make a twash first. If you have absolutely no desire for making one then I would probably make a str kila and offhand triplus until you came across a lux or corsucanti. Also would definitely make at least one if not 2 agi kilas. Anything outside of these I would wait on to see what the update has in store.





edited for stupid auto correct kicking in ; ;

Edited, Dec 6th 2011 5:32pm by Kalisa
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#4 Dec 07 2011 at 3:07 PM Rating: Good
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THanks for taking the time to answer. I really can't do a Twash right now. I have an almost (40/50) 85 Gambanteinn which is stopping there but I'm also working on the empy gun for cor. I do have a bunch of birth coins though for the WOE version. We're spamming VW right now and Lux drops reasonably whereas we haven't seen a Coruscanti.
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