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Atma of the Alpha and the OmegaFollow

#1 Dec 07 2010 at 6:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Triple attack: Major, Attack: Major, HP- Major.

I tried this tonight and the triple attack has to be at least +30%
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#2 Dec 07 2010 at 6:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Lobivopis wrote:
Triple attack: Major, Attack: Major, HP- Major.

I tried this tonight and the triple attack has to be at least +30%


O.o. Is that HP minus though? How bad was the HP hit?
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#3 Dec 07 2010 at 7:19 AM Rating: Good
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If it follows the same trend as the HP+ atmas, it'll be 20%. Incidentally, if this is the case, and you're using S.Scythe, they'll cancel out for no net change to your HP.

Just checked, and it's -25%. Took me from 1243 to 932. Didn't get much of a chance to play with the TA rate (grabbed the nearest thing to deathwarp home), but over about 20 attacks, I had 4-5 TAs. This was as RDM, with no TA gear. Needs more testing, but I'd say it's definitely >10%.

Edited, Dec 7th 2010 8:45am by Desoo
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#4 Dec 07 2010 at 3:54 PM Rating: Good
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I was using this coupled with Hybrid Beast (because I don't have RR or any other good atmas, stupid work during ls hours). I wish I had a working parser at the time, but for 5 hours continuously I was using this pair. TP gain was noticeably higher and quite often I would still be hitting a mob after it was dead as if I was using a kraken club. This was not the case prior to using these atmas.

I wish I had more than anecdotal evidence, but over at BG they're quiting at least a 10% increase on alpha/omega.

Gear was the following, so there was no augmented triple attack rate beyond 5/5 Triple attack merits:

Auric/Rapidus/xbow/bolt
af3+1/tiercel/suppa/brutal
rap/homam/rajas/ulth
amemet+1/swift/af3+1/homam

Finally grabbed teh new memlocs for KParser, so on my next foray into abyssea I'll try and use just alpha/omega on nin, or another job w/out native triple attack or triple attack gear.

#5Lobivopis, Posted: Dec 07 2010 at 4:26 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) 4-5 out of 20 is not less than 10%
#6 Dec 07 2010 at 4:46 PM Rating: Good
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4-5 Out of twenty > 10%.
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#7 Dec 07 2010 at 7:58 PM Rating: Good
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This may be a synthetic atma but I like it!! The "minor" double attack we get from the VV atma is 5%, so I would guess that "Major" TA == 10%. It also has 50 attack and that's pretty darn sweet. I think my new combo is likely to be VV + RR + AO with that in mind. It's only 20 attack lower than Stout Arm, but 10% Triple Attack higher. That's darn nice. I can't wait to find out what drops the third lunar.
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#8 Dec 07 2010 at 10:22 PM Rating: Good
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If it were indeed 30% instead of 10, that would be sick for non-6-hit WS's.
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#9 Dec 07 2010 at 10:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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3 hours of parsing on my wyvern (who has no DA or TA or zanshin or kill shots to mess up the parse) puts it right at 10%

Edited, Dec 7th 2010 11:59pm by LafingCat
#10 Dec 08 2010 at 3:23 AM Rating: Good
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5% base traits (and have a question on that one)
5% from merit
10% from Omega's Atma
3% from ring (optional)
3% from new dagger (optional)
1% from earring (more than optional)
(I wont count the accessory waist, we better use some haste there).

27% Triple Atk rate, with 4/5 AF3+2 augments, how much or DoT will increase ?

Back to the first statement > 5% base traits. Is there a possibility we earned a new version there ? Could explain the 30% from first post (but for sure I'm sceptic about it).

Edited, Dec 8th 2010 10:24am by Neraya
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#11 Dec 08 2010 at 7:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
3 hours of parsing on my wyvern (who has no DA or TA or zanshin or kill shots to mess up the parse) puts it right at 10%


Smiley: lol Called it. S-E is sooooo darn predictable. Multi attack traits on atma's look like Minor == 5%, Major == 10%, Superior == 15%. They're so methodical in programming this game it's scary. I'm gonna go buy this atma when I log in after work today and take it for a spin. RR + AO for now, and see how I like it with VV once I get my 3rd atma.

Edited, Dec 8th 2010 8:39am by Melphina
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#12 Dec 08 2010 at 9:42 AM Rating: Good
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Aww thats what i get for taking that "30% TA rate" from a few peoples anecdotal experiences. Oh well, it takes some of the OMGZ away from my other post, but oh well. That is still good.

If I understand it right, each +2 piece after the 1st adds 10% proc for triple damage on the additional 2 hits of each triple attack? If i end up with my 4/5 +2 TP set, that would be 30% proc rate. So with base/merits/this atma/af+2 helm we would have a 23% triple rate. Ignoring DA for the moment just for a ballpark.

100swings=146 swings with 23% TA. All 43 can proc the triple damage proc at a 30% rate.

30% of 46=13.8 procs

each proc adds the equivalent of 2 more hits (basically as if you tripled on a triple regarding damage). This gives equvalent damage to 27.6 more hits.

146+27.6=173.6 hits worth of damage.

173.6/146=18.9% more damage.

So with atma, merits, and AF2 head for TA, our damage would jump up by nearly 19% from the set bonus alone. That is a very nice and tangible boost. Upping melee damage by a straight up 19% just for wearing **** gear we would probably want to use anyway is very very nice.

Though I would like some confirmation that the 10% proc rate for each piece past the 1st is in fact how it works. I am remembering that from somewhere, but not sure exactly where and could be wrong.
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#13 Dec 10 2010 at 11:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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I did get a chance to try it yesterday in a Misareaux party (on NIN though, not THF) and was thoroughly disappointed. It might be good coupled with the set bonus on the Raider set, especially if said bonus applies to triple attacks on WS.

For now I'm gonna stick with RR+GH on THF, been ripping up IT solo like they were TW, and the added AGI from GH really does help out with mob TP. When I get my third Lunar Abyssite I might consider this as a third atma, but from my (limited) experience this far, and my ever dropping STR boost from gear, I'm leaning more towards VV or SA at this point.
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Jayheart wrote:
Does anyone actually have this knife yet? What does "Increase Critical Hit Dammage" do?


Endrew wrote:
i dont have the dagger, but i'm pretty sure it increaes the damage of your critical hits


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#14 Dec 10 2010 at 11:21 AM Rating: Good
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I used on WAR and NIN so far. I didn't really paid attention on both and so I didn't notice it on NIN also. Well the job already swing katana fast so it wasn't obvious when 3A goes. But on WAR it was amazing some time.
I got one 24TP return on Raging Rush (I do have a 6-hit build but still 24 ****!) and got more than 60TP in what was supposed to be one swing of my GA. Funny ^^

Now I considering to use it coupled with Atma of the Hybrid Beast (3A & 2A minor). Not really for a DDing purpose but for a skillup one ! More hits, more skillup keep it simple !

Edited, Dec 10th 2010 6:21pm by Neraya
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#15 Dec 12 2010 at 7:36 AM Rating: Decent
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Got to try it again yesterday, this time on THF. It definitely does have a noticable impact on triple attack, but there is something odd about it. I had very long, and I mean unusually long, periods with no triple attacks, so I'm thinking there is something wrong with it.

Also got my third Lunar yesterday along with Atma of the Stronghold, which will probably be my third atma for solo for the time being (and probably events until mages start waking up).
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Jayheart wrote:
Does anyone actually have this knife yet? What does "Increase Critical Hit Dammage" do?


Endrew wrote:
i dont have the dagger, but i'm pretty sure it increaes the damage of your critical hits


bsphil wrote:
Genius!
#16 Dec 12 2010 at 4:14 PM Rating: Decent
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anarkrist wrote:


Also got my third Lunar yesterday along with Atma of the Stronghold, which will probably be my third atma for solo for the time being (and probably events until mages start waking up).


Personally I would use Cloak and Dagger, Siren Shadow and Stronghold for solo and replace Stronghold with Dark Depths for lowman tanking.

Edited, Dec 12th 2010 6:16pm by Lobivopis
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Final Fantasy XI 12-14-11 Update wrote:
Adjust the resolution of menus.
The main screen resolution for "FINAL FANTASY XI" is dependent on the "Overlay Graphics Resolution" setting.
If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#17 Dec 12 2010 at 7:53 PM Rating: Decent
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I've been thinking in the same direction myself, but Gnarled Horn has been working absolute wonders for my evasion rate. THF has such a huge natural evasion boost that I think AGI is the place to check out for improved evasion. It's one of those things that I guess I never would have realized if it hadn't been for Abyssea.
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Jayheart wrote:
Does anyone actually have this knife yet? What does "Increase Critical Hit Dammage" do?


Endrew wrote:
i dont have the dagger, but i'm pretty sure it increaes the damage of your critical hits


bsphil wrote:
Genius!
#18 Dec 12 2010 at 9:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Dark Depths gives you "Major" critical hit rate increase though.
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Final Fantasy XI 12-14-11 Update wrote:
Adjust the resolution of menus.
The main screen resolution for "FINAL FANTASY XI" is dependent on the "Overlay Graphics Resolution" setting.
If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#19 Dec 13 2010 at 2:31 AM Rating: Good
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AGI is still just 2AGI:1Eva, unless something has changed. The idea that AGI or eva skill did something different in the overall calculation of evade rate, has fallen to the wayside for quite some time. But I mean, 50AGI from an atma is 25 eva, which is quite a lot; 12.5% evade rate. If your evade rate was high--sat, 60% before, the marginal gain from 12.5% eva is causing you to evade over 25% of the hits you would have received prior to the atma. Quite a large increase indeed.

I just started playing again and I don't have RR or VV or SA yet. When I had one lunar I couldn't decide between Alpha and Omega or major crit from Dark Depths. I got 2 lunar now tho so those are what I'm using currently for DD.


Total other note, been playin for 2 days now; Just repped my lul blau/x's with an auric. Had to try cuelebre 2 times b4 I could do it as 90Rdm/Sch and 80Brd/Whm and I got teh drop. I'm thinking right now of aiming for a build with 23% haste and Nusku's Sash (5% DW) and using Auric with that, but I don't know yet how badly I'd actually need acc/atk from other dagger options.
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#20 Dec 13 2010 at 6:34 AM Rating: Decent
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AGI has a 2:1 rate for giving evasion, I'll give you that, but don't forget that AGI has a twofold impact on your overall evasion, first AGI vs DEX check and then the added evasion it gives.

Considering a level 90 THF has an evasion skill of 361 capped (unmerited) in addition to 48 evasion from traits, and you stack on another 17 skill from Boxer's Mantle and Evasion Torque plus 27 evasion from assorted gear that lands you at 453 evasion. Granted this is in no way a huge amount, it is to the point where I've seen AGI doing extremely well in boosting the actual evasion, high enough in fact that I have been taking down IT mobs while getting a VT-IT link halfway through and only taking a few hits, if any at all. Also factor in the regen from Stronghold and you're recovering 300 hp per minute giving you almost no downtime.

Oh, and there is such a thing as overdoing it, even if the atmas mentioned does push you to 7-800+ that's kinda pointless if you can get away with way less and boost other stats so you can kill faster.
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Jayheart wrote:
Does anyone actually have this knife yet? What does "Increase Critical Hit Dammage" do?


Endrew wrote:
i dont have the dagger, but i'm pretty sure it increaes the damage of your critical hits


bsphil wrote:
Genius!
#21 Dec 13 2010 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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anarkrist wrote:
AGI has a twofold impact on your overall evasion


I don't know where you heard this. But it is not true.

Quote:
first AGI vs DEX check and then the added evasion it gives.


The AGL vs Dex check determines critical hit rate.

Quote:
Considering a level 90 THF has an evasion skill of 361 capped (unmerited) in addition to 48 evasion from traits, and you stack on another 17 skill from Boxer's Mantle and Evasion Torque plus 27 evasion from assorted gear that lands you at 453 evasion. Granted this is in no way a huge amount, it is to the point where I've seen AGI doing extremely well in boosting the actual evasion.


2 AGL is no different than a piece of gear with 1 evasion on it. The cap is the cap. Once you reach the (very easy to reach at 90THF) cap, you will not evade more than the cap. It doesn't matter what stat you apply.

We most certainly have more than +48 from traits as well. I don't know of anyone that has bothered to test at what level but we have gotten at LEAST one more level of evasion bonus since the level cap raise. If not 2.

I have a MONSTEROUS evasion set. But its really only for show. I do use it for ichi casting sometimes, ***** moments, kiting, pulling etc etc. But for the most part, GH + 2x evasion Kila's (if I'm soloing/lowman) caps me (with some variation) on just about everything I fight.
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#22 Dec 13 2010 at 1:42 PM Rating: Decent
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for building up lights and pure DD im using. stout arm, RR, alpha and omega ( im missing malboro atma to try out ; ; )
once lights are built for my group i'll split off and get multiple NMs i then switch over to RR GH amd mounted champion
20 hp regen is fawking amazing

#23 Dec 13 2010 at 5:10 PM Rating: Decent
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anarkrist wrote:
AGI has a 2:1 rate for giving evasion, I'll give you that, but don't forget that AGI has a twofold impact on your overall evasion, first AGI vs DEX check and then the added evasion it gives.

Considering a level 90 THF has an evasion skill of 361 capped (unmerited) in addition to 48 evasion from traits


We got at least one additional tier of evasion bonus during the level cap increase if not two between 75 and 90.

ThiefKiller wrote:


2 AGL is no different than a piece of gear with 1 evasion on it. The cap is the cap. Once you reach the (very easy to reach at 90THF) cap, you will not evade more than the cap. It doesn't matter what stat you apply.


On fodder mobs and tier 1 NMs yes but stronger NM's you are never going to reach the cap no matter how much +evasion you equip.



Edited, Dec 13th 2010 7:15pm by Lobivopis
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Final Fantasy XI 12-14-11 Update wrote:
Adjust the resolution of menus.
The main screen resolution for "FINAL FANTASY XI" is dependent on the "Overlay Graphics Resolution" setting.
If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#24 Dec 13 2010 at 5:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Lobivopis wrote:
On fodder mobs and tier 1 NMs yes but stronger NM's you are never going to reach the cap no matter how much +evasion you equip.


This may have been true pre: 2X evasion Kila, additional evasion bonus traits, better evasion gear, AF3 Feet, cruor buffs, atmas, etc etc etc. But not anymore. It is certainly possible to cap evasion on a lot of high tier NMs.


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#25 Dec 13 2010 at 11:13 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah I really don't know what we couldn't evade if we had all the means. The gear has gotten ridiculous. And if you wanted to go to ridiculous measures you could add mambos, ninja phantom rolls, gain-agi, absorb-acc, and who knows what else.

By the way about that evasion trait. I've been out of the loop. I wouldn't be surprised if we got another one but how do we know for sure that we did?
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#26 Dec 16 2010 at 1:35 AM Rating: Decent
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Shamaya wrote:
By the way about that evasion trait. I've been out of the loop. I wouldn't be surprised if we got another one but how do we know for sure that we did?


We I don't. But assuming and aserting it as fact is fun XD.

It would make sense though seeing as how every other job has had increased tiers of their comparable job traits.

That, and it is a LOT easier to evade, even big game, now than it ever has been. Then again we are walking around with 200+ AGL from cruor buffs, atmas, increased evasion skill etc soooooo...maybe. maybe not.

I have not seen any tests regarding additional evasion bonus traits.

I'm more interested in trying to figure out how the AF3 bonnet (or if my enmity set does anything) effects accomplice/collaborator.

Edited, Dec 16th 2010 2:54am by ThiefKiller
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#27 Dec 17 2010 at 9:51 AM Rating: Default
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ThiefKiller wrote:

2 AGL is no different than a piece of gear with 1 evasion on it. The cap is the cap. Once you reach the (very easy to reach at 90THF) cap, you will not evade more than the cap. It doesn't matter what stat you apply.


Not advocating the use of one atma over another in this statement, but AGI does have the side benefit of boosting whatever other defensive buffs may apply. In this case, parrying. While this won't be a gigantic boost to your defensive skills, it's still another boost.

Bolded: Are you trying to be a snowflake? "AGI" has been the Square abbreviation for "agility" since Breath of Fire on SNES. "AGL" while I'm sure may have been used in another company's game, has not been used in any Square titles as far as I'm aware.
#28 Dec 17 2010 at 5:11 PM Rating: Decent
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#29 Dec 18 2010 at 2:21 AM Rating: Decent
Atma of the Apocalypse has Triple Attack Superior. Just got it last night kinda itching to stack it with razed ruins and omega.
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#30 Dec 18 2010 at 7:35 AM Rating: Good
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And of course AGI lowers an enemy's TP gain from player hits now too.

That apocalypse one sounds durty durty durty. Right now I'm considering that and RR + Scorpion Queen.
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