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Slug Shot?Follow

#1 Aug 21 2009 at 10:18 AM Rating: Decent
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I was just curious to all you other thf/rng zergers out there. How do you gear yourself for slug shot? Using Culverin or Coffinmaker?

Being that we can make good use of feint, can have minimal consideration for Racc, and access to some nice STR gear (Hecatomb set). Just looking to get an idea of what gear sets you guys are using and what kind of results you are getting.

From what I understand, STR is the biggest damaging stat mod you can make until you cap fSTR2 then agl & ratt? I have a lot of improvements I think I can make to my set. Just looking to get some ideas from other thvs that lolthf/rng :P
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#2 Aug 21 2009 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Damage wise Culverin + Cannon Shell would be the best way to go. First problem you run into is getting the Cannon Shells. They hardly on the AH on levi. So you need high lvl Alchemy(94). Or you need to find a friend who has.

Setting: zerg sitation and we assume feint is on.

Setup I would go with:
Vulcan's/fire staff / Axe Grip / Culverin / Cannon Shell
Maat's cap / Breeze Gorget / Triumph Earring / Triumph Earring
Skadi's Cuirie / Skadi's Bazubands / Rajas Ring / Flame ring
Amemet Mantle +1 / Buccaneer's Belt / Skadi's Chausses / Enkidu's Leggings

I assume you start with 100tp. So you would open with with a dagger WS. I.e. SA+hide -> draw wep -> spam Shark Bite macro. Get feint in. Then swap to Vulcan's/fire staff.

Or could go without a dagger. Which I could understand in the chaos of a zerg fight. With just a staff open the fight with: SA+feint+hide -> draw wep -> run in. Then: Slug Shot -> I wing -> Slug Shot -> Barrage -> Slug Shot.

Problem is: that is a lot of extra work and hardly extra damage over a dagger zerg situation. Dagger zerg example could be: thf/drk or thf/war. Feint -> SAws -> I wing -> TAws -> melee -> ws.

Sad part is in both sitations the sam, mnk, war, drk will still do way more damage then you. That is if they know what they doing. But they cheat with there damage 2hour ;_;
/fume SE give thf a damage 2 hour also!

Edited, Aug 21st 2009 10:04pm by Breaze
#3 Aug 21 2009 at 12:44 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't have DRK leveled so I can't really comment on that but I have done /war. In my experience the most damage I've been able to put out in a short window of time is this (eating meat):

SATA+AC+Feint+Hide+Dagger WS==> TP wing==> Slugshot==> Barrage==> Slugshot.

I keep my dagger on because you can also throw in a few fully powered Solo SA and TA.

So that 3 big WS, 1 big barrage (meat+feint if all hits land) and a few solo TA/SA in 30 seconds. I always liked this because dagger WS unstacked on tough stuff just seemed a bit "meh" and on a lot of the boss stuff...SAWS = flail.

Now as I said, I haven't tried thf/drk but most of the things I have done this on were small group stuff(low on healing support). I was there for TH and feint anyway so I said @#%^ this I'm kicking some *** too. Seems to me /drk might not be practical for most of them (but again I have never tried it).

I don't have all the best toys but my thf is no slouch either and the damage I've been able to pull out of my thf/rng build has been impressing me.

Now I'm just looking to consciously maximize gear sets for it. Seeing as how STR seems to be the best stat to increase damage (correct me if I'm wrong), and we get lots of it in our endgame gear (heca, skadi etc), that a thf could put together a pretty solid slug shot build.

Just curious if anyone was doing that already.

Edited, Aug 21st 2009 4:45pm by ThiefKiller
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#4 Aug 21 2009 at 11:44 PM Rating: Default
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Is this a joke?
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#5 Aug 22 2009 at 1:54 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I don't have DRK leveled so I can't really comment on that but I have done /war. In my experience the most damage I've been able to put out in a short window of time is this (eating meat):

SATA+AC+Feint+Hide+Dagger WS==> TP wing==> Slugshot==> Barrage==> Slugshot.

It is not really clear from your post but you can't Slug Shot with thf/war. I assume that you mean the above senario was done with thf/rng.

I would suggest testing all these combinations and gear setups yourself. And definatelly give thf/drk a try also. If you getting cure bombed thf/drk should be the best thf "zerg" SJ.



Edited, Aug 22nd 2009 11:55am by Breaze
#6 Aug 22 2009 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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Nvm me if that's your case, but I don't think any linkshell lead will give a thf a personal whm. It's a lot more interesting to give a whm to a mnk/drk or a drk.

If I had to classify thf's SJ orders for zerging, I'd go with :
#1 /drk with mercurial kriss, but you NEED a dedicaced healer, which doesn't happen often
#2 /rng, tossing many slugshots with culverin is a great way to do damages
#3 /war, WS'ing as soon as you have TP. But it is 95% nullified if the target got phalanx (bahamuth2, which resist dispel in like 75% of the casts >.> )

That's assuming you get the songs buffs. When I don't get them I usually /whm or /blm to get out faster when we are done as my dmg would be negligible anyway.
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#7 Aug 23 2009 at 9:36 AM Rating: Default
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Breaze wrote:
It is not really clear from your post but you can't Slug Shot with thf/war.


Duh?

I would think it would be "clear" because I said I've been doing it that it was thf/rng? The /war part was in response to the "better" dagger zerg comment form /drk and /war.

Breaze wrote:
I would suggest testing all these combinations and gear setups yourself. And definatelly give thf/drk a try also. If you getting cure bombed thf/drk should be the best thf "zerg" SJ.


I have been and intend to. The purpose of this post was to compare gear sets of other thvs that thf/rng zerg like this (I know there are a few others on this board), not to discuss the best sj to zerg with on thf.

I have heard good things about drk zerg, but I dont have a kris, or a dedicated healer in most cases. And /rng with a culverin is quite impressive. I encourage all who havent tried this to try it at least once.

Quote:
Is this a joke?


No. It's not a joke.

Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 1:40pm by ThiefKiller
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#8Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 23 2009 at 10:39 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Equip your Assassin's Armlets and/or Thief's Knife, pop Feint and leave the DDing to the other melee.
#9 Aug 23 2009 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Queen Noodles wrote:
Equip your Assassin's Armlets and/or Thief's Knife, pop Feint and leave the DDing to the other melee.

In a zerg like KV, Kirin or Baha V2, your primary roles are feint and treasure hunter. You're kidding yourself if you think that you're there for damage, or that you'll have a dedicated Whm healer for /drk.

If you want to take your zerg damage seriously, with the haste you'll have in a zerg, I doubt a slug>barrage>slug from VERY low skill will trump the damage you could get from meleeing and spamming DE with full buffs and max haste (Assuming you swap in TH in last few moments).

Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 6:41pm by Noodles


On any HNM with DEF high enough that DE or SB will be out damaged by Slugshot, Mandalic Stab will out damage that by virtue of it's attack multiplier.



Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 6:22pm by Lobivopis
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#10 Aug 23 2009 at 6:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Queen Noodles wrote:
Equip your Assassin's Armlets and/or Thief's Knife, pop Feint and leave the DDing to the other melee.

In a zerg like KV, Kirin or Baha V2, your primary roles are feint and treasure hunter. You're kidding yourself if you think that you're there for damage...


/facepalm

You are kidding yourself if you think you shouldn't be doing damage.

Queen Noodles wrote:
If you want to take your zerg damage seriously, with the haste you'll have in a zerg, I doubt a slug>barrage>slug from VERY low skill will trump the damage you could get from meleeing and spamming DE with full buffs and max haste (Assuming you swap in TH in last few moments).


lol. Again, I am NOT interested in a debate on whether or not you think that thf/rng is a good idea. You seem to have no experience with it. I'm looking for gear sets of thvs that do.

Quote:
On any HNM with DEF high enough that DE or SB will be out damaged by Slugshot, Mandalic Stab will out damage that by virtue of it's attack multiplier.


Thats only true if you can stack them. Most hnms you cant SAWS so that leaves TAWS or a fully stacked WS at the beginning. The fact of the matter is that with culverin and cannon shell your base damage even before stats is 140 on a ws that does quadruple damage. With marksmenship merits, gear, support, food and feint, these attack and accuracy deficiencies can be made up for enough for this strategy to be effective.

But again, Im not looking for inexperienced or uneducated people trying to tell me it doesnt work lol. Believe me it does. I'm looking to compare THF WS gear for slug shot. That is all.

Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 10:38pm by ThiefKiller

Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 10:40pm by ThiefKiller
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#11Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 23 2009 at 9:48 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Ok fine. You want to waste your gil on equipment for /rng, just to do less damage than a meleeing thf/war, be my guest.
#12 Aug 24 2009 at 7:41 AM Rating: Good
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Queen Noodles wrote:
Ok fine. You want to waste your gil on equipment for /rng, just to do less damage than a meleeing thf/war, be my guest.

If you're so superb, then you shouldn't need to be told what gear works, you should know. (Every Skadi piece, Denali Jacket, Optical Hat, Quadav SCNM hat, Peacock Charm, Triumph Earrings, Merman's Rings, Flame/Rajas Ring, Amemet Mantle +1, Buccaneer's Belt)

So theres the gear for the answer to your stupid question.

Yes, it's stupid. Why? Because as I and Lobi have pointed out, it's damage will still not out-do a Thf/War spamming DE. AND, if you're "not getting enough buffs that slug will outperform DE", by means of a lack of attack, then your slugs will suck too. Good luck getting them over 200ish on a Kirin without attack buffs.

And if you are getting attack buffs? (protip: you should be if you're in a zerg), then Meleeing with a good dagger and spamming WSs WILL outbeat a gimp Slug>Barrage>Slug from piddly 220 skill.

Thf/Rng is not for zergs. You wanna play with it? Be my guest, knock yourself out, I couldn't give a **** what you do in campaign or solo or besieged or whatever, But it's damage will suck on anything important.

Also, uneducated and inexperianced? From the guy who thinks spamming (read: using it twice and barrage once) slug shot with 230 skill will in any way whatsoever come remotely close to the damage you could achieve Thf/War

Edited, Aug 24th 2009 5:54am by Noodles


lol. Ok?

I would like to invite you to try it. It doesnt work in EVERY situation but nothing does. The fact is, there are many situations where thf/rng with a culverin will destroy /war.

I don't fault you for being ignorant. **** trying to say something is stupid that you have neither knowledge of nor experience with only makes you look stupid.

And a lot of the gear you mentioned, one would not (intelligently) use for this purpose.

Noodle Queen wrote:
then Meleeing with a good dagger and spamming WSs WILL outbeat a gimp Slug>Barrage>Slug from piddly 220 skill.


SO is it 220 skill that /war would "outbeat?" (lol)

Noodle Queen wrote:
From the guy who thinks spamming (read: using it twice and barrage once) slug shot with 230 skill will in any way whatsoever come remotely close to the damage you could achieve Thf/War


Or is it 230?

Nebo wrote:

With marksmanship merits..


Or is it 246 with merits?

Nebo wrote:
..gear..


Or is it 258 with Gun Belt and Faith Torque? (Hint: that's 11 skill points shy of an unmerited marksmanship RNG).

Nebo wrote:
support, food and feint


"OMG, Nebo, that's still 11 skill points of GIMPPPPP!" Touche, young noodles. But WAIT! THF can FEINT...every 2 minutes!!! NOWAI!!!! Its like you could eat meat, Slug Shot in full damage WS gear (without that Racc crap you suggested for this...which would be "stupid") with that bad *** cannon and make a Biga BOOOM!!!! Of all the stupid ideas!

Or do you have even the slightest clue what you are talking about?

I'll give you a hint:


Noodles Queen wrote:
Equip your Assassin's Armlets and/or Thief's Knife, pop Feint and leave the DDing to the other melee...

..You're kidding yourself if you think that you're there for damage


This means that you don't.

Edited, Aug 24th 2009 2:13pm by ThiefKiller

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 9:30am by ThiefKiller

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 9:31am by ThiefKiller
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#13Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 24 2009 at 4:01 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Skill is attack and accuracy. You may have enough acc to land them with feint, sushi /rng and range acc gear, but you'll be about 150ish attack short of Thf/War with a dagger.
#14 Aug 24 2009 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
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Queen Noodles wrote:
Skill is attack and accuracy. You may have enough acc to land them with feint, sushi /rng and range acc gear, but you'll be about 150ish attack short of Thf/War with a dagger.

If I'm so ignorant to your amazing setup (and: if you know it works so well, and what gear to wear, then why are you even posting?), then why don't you post some proof of how it can be better.


Mostly because I'm not interested in debating the merits of thf/rng with you.

Seriously though, did you even read the post you just responded to? Sushi? racc gear?.....nevermind. I don't care.


If you'll recall the OP:

I wrote:
I was just curious to all you other thf/rng zergers out there. How do you gear yourself for slug shot?


Edited, Aug 24th 2009 8:14pm by ThiefKiller
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#15 Aug 25 2009 at 7:39 AM Rating: Decent
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Who need sushi when feint is up?

Who call a zerg a zerg when it last more than 30s?

As you said the difference between a 292skill and 230 skills is 62 attack. Your thf/war will have double march, double minuet while a thf/rng will have quadruple minuets and will be with the rangers pt. Something tells me the difference of attack is covered here. So that point is irrelevant.

When gearing /rng, I am with :

fire staff / axe grip / culverin / the big ammo
skadi's mask / light gorget(Faith for barrage) / triumph *2
Hecatomb body (skadi's for barrage)/ skadi's hands / rajas / flame (behemoth for barrage)
amemet / bucaneer's belt / skadi's legs / hecatomb feet

There are a few upgrades possible, this is far to be perfect. Hecatomb head-maat's cap would be perfect for this for exemple.
The goal is to gear for STR / ranged attack, there is no worry to have with accuracy when feint is up(I put some for barrages tho, just in case because it would eat up a full WS to have a bad miss).

Note that I only got +8 Xbow skill merits, as my other merits are taken by dagger and h2h.

With that I land slugshots for 1400-1700, depending on how good I am with keeping distance, on bahamut 2, or 900-1100 on kirin. In the 1st case, phalanx would nulify your dagger meleeing. And in the 2nd case, the fSTR will reduce your dmg considerably.
I have never done KV, I'll admit it, so maybe you're right on this one.
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#16Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 25 2009 at 8:52 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Someone using a weapon with -40 native accuracy from skill, and then using a weaponskill with a further -40racc at 100% TP.
#17 Aug 25 2009 at 11:12 AM Rating: Decent
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Queen Noodles wrote:
jainaproud wrote:
Who need sushi when feint is up?

Someone using a weapon with -40 native accuracy from skill, and then using a weaponskill with a further -40racc at 100% TP.

Feint is not capped acc with a sh*t weapon. Why do you think Drks still need Madrigal, even with feint, when they zerg?

A Thf/Rng will also have march x2 minuet x2. You're not going to get your own private songs afterwards. And even if you do, you wont get both. If for some special reason they taylor the songs around a thf/rng's needs, the last buffs you get befor pianissimo will still be sung under troubingale, which will wear just after. You can then only put ONE non-troub song on top. Trust me. I'm a bard. That's how it works.

You say "what kind of zerg lasts longer than 30sec?" and then say "the rng pt". What kind of gimp zerg has a rng party?

Secondly, you're also doing it very wrong in your gear. Slug shot has a -40racc penalty at 100%TP. So you're going to need over capped acc for a good chance of landing it. If you're over capped acc in that STR set you post, then why would you equip more racc (skadi body) afterwards? You're already past cap, it does nothing for barrage. capped racc is capped racc, +1000 racc, and it's still capped racc.


Why are you still posting? Thf/Rng isn't for you. Great. Go the **** away.

Edited, Aug 25th 2009 3:13pm by ThiefKiller
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#18Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 26 2009 at 3:15 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Ok, I'll leave your post alone. Where's anna? I want to have a Thf/Whm discussion and I don't want any input from uneducated and inexperianced people telling me it's a bad combo cus i know it works!
#19 Aug 26 2009 at 5:22 AM Rating: Decent
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jainaproud wrote:
Who need sushi when feint is up?

Who call a zerg a zerg when it last more than 30s?

As you said the difference between a 292skill and 230 skills is 62 attack. Your thf/war will have double march, double minuet while a thf/rng will have quadruple minuets and will be with the rangers pt. Something tells me the difference of attack is covered here. So that point is irrelevant.

When gearing /rng, I am with :

fire staff / axe grip / culverin / the big ammo
skadi's mask / light gorget(Faith for barrage) / triumph *2
Hecatomb body (skadi's for barrage)/ skadi's hands / rajas / flame (behemoth for barrage)
amemet / bucaneer's belt / skadi's legs / hecatomb feet

There are a few upgrades possible, this is far to be perfect. Hecatomb head-maat's cap would be perfect for this for exemple.
The goal is to gear for STR / ranged attack, there is no worry to have with accuracy when feint is up(I put some for barrages tho, just in case because it would eat up a full WS to have a bad miss).

Note that I only got +8 Xbow skill merits, as my other merits are taken by dagger and h2h.

With that I land slugshots for 1400-1700, depending on how good I am with keeping distance, on bahamut 2, or 900-1100 on kirin. In the 1st case, phalanx would nulify your dagger meleeing. And in the 2nd case, the fSTR will reduce your dmg considerably.
I have never done KV, I'll admit it, so maybe you're right on this one.
.

Thanks for the info. My current set puts me at 258 skill with neck and waist with STR > RATT everywhere else. I know there are better pieces for those slots so I'm going to have to work toward them. That looks like a really solid Thf Slug set though, quite inspiring.

I actually have a full body racc swap for barrage lol..I just dont like missing hits.

Mainly I just wanted to see what peoples experiences with heca were. I'm going to be getting a few soon and they seem like good slug shot pieces (mainly the head).

I know a few guys that use a vulcan staff for this, but it never seemed worth the damage to swap out a dagger and either a) land a fully buffed MS or SB at the start an/or land a few solo TA or SA as well.

Do you just Feint=> Slug=> TP Wing=> Slug=> Barrage=> Slug?

I've always been partial to:

SATA+AC+HIDE+Dagger WS, Feint, Barrage, Slug, TP Wing, Slug, Solo TA as timers allow, Solo SA as timers allow (while meleeing in between).

Its always fun to see peoples eyeballs pop out of their skull when they have never seen it done before and theres some decent thf damage there on the zerg parse.

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 9:25am by ThiefKiller

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 9:28am by ThiefKiller
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#20 Aug 26 2009 at 5:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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thf/drk and thf/rng with culverin are pretty good for zergs. And feint is that strong.
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#21Queen Noodles, Posted: Aug 26 2009 at 7:48 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) IF you have enough racc that your landing slug shot at 100%TP why swap in more racc for barrage?
#22 Aug 26 2009 at 8:19 AM Rating: Good
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Queen Noodles wrote:
IF you have enough racc that your landing slug shot at 100%TP why swap in more racc for barrage?


Becuase if you miss one hit with barrage you dont get the rest.

Becuase the reason for barrage is to build tp for the next WS.

Because there is no good reason not to.
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#23 Aug 26 2009 at 8:31 AM Rating: Default
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ThiefKiller wrote:
Queen Noodles wrote:
IF you have enough racc that your landing slug shot at 100%TP why swap in more racc for barrage?


Becuase if you miss one hit with barrage you dont get the rest.

Becuase the reason for barrage is to build tp for the next WS.

Because there is no good reason not to.

Yes, but if you have enough racc to land slug shot, with it's -racc penalty (-40 at 100TP), then you're goint to be at racc cap anyway. And if you're not then you need more racc in your slug shot set.

If you're at racc cap, you're at racc cap. Adding more racc does not make barrage any more accurate if you are at cap already. So if you're already at cap, you're adding more racc which does nothing whilst replacing str which can and will up barrage damage.

The only reason a ranger macros in more racc is to offset the loss of AF+1 hands over their normal piece. Any who racros in lots more is doing it wrong. Either they have far too much for barrage (which will have sharpshot up aswell) OR they have not enough for TPing.

In a similar case to you: Either you have not enough racc in your slug shot set, OR you have too much in your barrage set.

edit: typos

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 4:32pm by Noodles
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#24 Aug 26 2009 at 8:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Queen Noodles wrote:
ThiefKiller wrote:
Queen Noodles wrote:
IF you have enough racc that your landing slug shot at 100%TP why swap in more racc for barrage?


Becuase if you miss one hit with barrage you dont get the rest.

Becuase the reason for barrage is to build tp for the next WS.

Because there is no good reason not to.

Yes, but if you have enough racc to land slug shot, with it's -racc penalty (-40 at 100TP), then you're goint to be at racc cap anyway. And if you're not then you need more racc in your slug shot set.

If you're at racc cap, you're at racc cap. Adding more racc does not make barrage any more accurate if you are at cap already. So if you're already at cap, you're adding more racc which does nothing whilst replacing str whilsch can and wipp up barrage damage.

The only reason a ranger macros in more racc is to offset the loss of AF+1 hands over their normal piece. Any who racros in lots more is doing it wrong. Either they have far too much for barrage (which will have sharpshot up aswell) OR they have not enough for TPing.

In a similar case to you: Either you have not enough racc in your slug shot set, OR you have too much in your barrage set.



I'm not quite sure what you are arguing here. TWO other people have come here and told you that it does work quite well. Yes feint IS that strong. This isn't my oppinion or even my own totally whacky Nebo idea. People have been doing this for a long time.

Those numbers about 40 racc deficiency from skill are wrong. I already get 258 skill in my set from two pieces of gear with merits and there are much better pieces in those slots I could be wearing but don't have yet. But even if it were true, with base marksmenship merits plus feint, Slug Shot Racc is within effective levels.

THF gets a lot of great gear to Slug Shot with, and a few STR pieces that would make a RNG drool. Add to that support and the ability to eat meat or even Pot-Au-Feu...and you have quite a powerful combination.

THF/WAR couldn't match this in a zerg because they can't weapon skill as fast or as hard. You are either super buffing one ws and blowing your sa and ta timers, TA wsing then trying to get a solo SA, or on the off chance that its something that doesn't flail, you can pop that tp wing and get a SAWS. But then what. Melee....get tp and try to ws again unstacked?

A THF/RNG can put out 3 exceptionally powerful weaponskills + barrage damage + a couple of fully geared solo SA and TA (eating meat) in ~30 seconds.

My friend, that will "outbeat" anything THF/WAR can offer you in that timeframe. Culverin STARTS at 140 base damage...and with all the Racc, Ratt and STR we just talked about... a THF/WAR would go home crying from a zerg wishing it could grow up to be a big strong THF/RNG one day.

In longer fights, I agree, THF/WAR could likely come out on top. But for short zergs...THF/RNG is good for any THF that is looking to be productive.

Edited, Aug 27th 2009 3:49pm by ThiefKiller
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#25 Aug 28 2009 at 5:02 AM Rating: Default
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ThiefKiller wrote:
Queen Noodles wrote:
ThiefKiller wrote:
Queen Noodles wrote:
IF you have enough racc that your landing slug shot at 100%TP why swap in more racc for barrage?


Becuase if you miss one hit with barrage you dont get the rest.

Becuase the reason for barrage is to build tp for the next WS.

Because there is no good reason not to.

Yes, but if you have enough racc to land slug shot, with it's -racc penalty (-40 at 100TP), then you're goint to be at racc cap anyway. And if you're not then you need more racc in your slug shot set.

If you're at racc cap, you're at racc cap. Adding more racc does not make barrage any more accurate if you are at cap already. So if you're already at cap, you're adding more racc which does nothing whilst replacing str whilsch can and wipp up barrage damage.

The only reason a ranger macros in more racc is to offset the loss of AF+1 hands over their normal piece. Any who racros in lots more is doing it wrong. Either they have far too much for barrage (which will have sharpshot up aswell) OR they have not enough for TPing.

In a similar case to you: Either you have not enough racc in your slug shot set, OR you have too much in your barrage set.



I'm not quite sure what you are arguing here. TWO other people have come here and told you that it does work quite well. Yes feint IS that strong. This isn't my oppinion or even my own totally whacky Nebo idea. People have been doing this for a long time.

Those numbers about 40 racc deficiency from skill are wrong. I already get 258 skill in my set from two pieces of gear with merits and there are much better pieces in those slots I could be wearing but don't have yet. But even if it were true, with base marksmenship merits plus feint, Slug Shot Racc is within effective levels.

THF gets a lot of great gear to Slug Shot with, and a few STR pieces that would make a RNG drool. Add to that support and the ability to eat meat or even Pot-Au-Feu...and you have quite a powerful combination.

THF/WAR couldn't match this in a zerg because they can't weapon skill as fast or as hard. You are either super buffing one ws and blowing your sa and ta timers, TA wsing then trying to get a solo SA, or on the off chance that its something that doesn't flail, you can pop that tp wing and get a SAWS. But then what. Melee....get tp and try to ws again unstacked?

A THF/RNG can put out 3 exceptionally powerful weaponskills + barrage damage + a couple of fully geared solo SA and TA (eating meat) in ~30 seconds.

My friend, that will "outbeat" anything THF/WAR can offer you in that timeframe. Culverin STARTS at 140 base damage...and with all the Racc, Ratt and STR we just talked about... a THF/WAR would go home crying from a zerg wishing it could grow up to be a big strong THF/RNG one day.

In longer fights, I agree, THF/WAR could likely come out on top. But for short zergs...THF/RNG is good for any THF that is looking to be productive.

Edited, Aug 27th 2009 3:49pm by ThiefKiller
Look you ***. I'm not discussing the use of Thf/Rng with you anymore. I couldn't care. But I am coming to you from my 75RNG perspective to give you advice from barrage.

You don't want to listen to me because I don't like Thf/Rng. But Thf/Rng or Rng main, the game mechanics are still the same. As much as you don't want to listen to me, it doesn't make me any less right.

If you are macroing in thousands of racc over your slug shot set into your barrage set then you ARE doingitrong. There is no discussion. Slug shot is LESS accurate than barrage. Racc caps at 95%. Either you are well well well over cap for barrage (in which case you are losing damage by the Str/Ratt you are swapping out for meaningless racc) OR you have not enough racc in your slug shot set. There is no discussion on this. It is just fact. Go over and look at the rng forums. Why do you suppose no ranger wastes ABCs on that racc+20 back piece?

Put your petty dislike to me aside and listen if you actually want advice. I am right on this matter no matter how much you think I am wrong about the worth of Thf/Rng. I am not discussing Thf/Rng, I'm discussing barrage mechanics.

The -40Racc you quoted has NOTHING to do with Thf/Rng racc loss. It's on SLUG SHOT. Slug has a -40~ish Racc PENALTY at 100%TP.
Meaning if you have 90% acc rate in your TP set, you're slug shots will be only 70% racc.

It looks like you quoted my post without actually reading it at all. I didn't mention thf/rng anywhere in it. I talked only about barrage.
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#26 Aug 28 2009 at 8:23 AM Rating: Decent
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I was just curious to all you other thf/rng zergers out there. How do you gear yourself for slug shot? Using Culverin or Coffinmaker?


I tried this. With feint on I wiffed everything and people laughed at me, lol. Had sushi as well. I came lowest on the parse. I can't remember how much ranged acc equip I had on. Maybe with a full heavy r acc build. Usually feint should be enough but it just didn't seem to do the job on Kirin. And not like you're going to get preludes in a zerg.

If ya did get /drk tho and outside heals, its pretty nice. My last ls didn't have drks, but we had well equipped wars in high-end ga builds just at the 80% haste mark. The only war's that I wouldn't outdamage or essentially tie with were war's using mighty strikes.

I'd say Thf/War, switch to TK at end.

Thf/Nin isn't terrible. You can get another WS off. I'm not sure how it'd be vs Kirin. Maybe better suited vs Bahamut. At one point I topped the parse at KV simply because I had time to get 2 WS's off. I was the first and last to WS it. At KV even if you are /war there can barely be enough time to switch weapons.
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