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Ret DPS advice?Follow

#1 Mar 15 2011 at 4:22 PM Rating: Good
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So I've been a hunter player since Vanilla with a rogue alt for dps. I've always been in the top 5 in most raids, often in the top 3. My paladin I leveled from 1-80 as prot/holy to get a different flavor. I decided to take her to 85 as Ret to finally experience a bit of 2handed facesmashing but my DPS is a bit low. At 82 I can hit around 7-9k on a boss, which is respectable and sometimes #1 or 2, but my trash dps is often terrible.

I've checked dps charts and it seems that Ret is around the middle of the barrel but I've seen them do real well and I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrong. Other classes in my groups have done around 5-6k on trash whilst I'm sitting around 3-5k depending on procs.

On groups:
Judjement> concencration > divine storm > holy wrath > then pretty much anything that lights up/procs after this. I also try to keep up Inq when I can.

Any suggestions? No one has complained so far and I suppose I do fine but I'd like to step it up a bit and figure out if I'm missing something. Thanks Paladins.

*** I think I'll just go back to Prot. Not only can I get insta dungeons and better survivability, I'm also much much better at tanking. Oh well it was worth a shot lol.

Edited, Mar 15th 2011 9:36pm by Transmigration
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#2 Mar 15 2011 at 9:20 PM Rating: Good
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Your dps will tumble as you level, this is because your hit, crit and expertise will fall at a terrifying rate everytime your level increases.

All I can reccommend is the priority list for your DPS.

If you have less than 3 Holy Power:
Crusader Strike > Templars Verdict > Exorcism > Hammer of Wrath > Judgement > Holy Wrath > Consecration.
If you have 3 Holy Power, Inquisition is your top priority if it isn't up, followed by Templar's Verdict above all else. If Divine Purpose procs you should be using Inquisition if necessary, but Crusader Strike before Templar's Verdict. Generating Holy Power is key above everything except Inquisition.
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#3 Mar 16 2011 at 10:16 AM Rating: Good
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Well you can go back to prot if you'd like, I'd just like to expand on the answer.

AoE ret is a bit tricky, it can be very awesome if there are tons of mobs, but the worst is when theres about 3 mobs that you're trying to AoE down. This is because this is the line where you should switch from doing single-target to multi target.

If you have 4 or mobs you should be doing what you said: using Divine Storm, consecration, maybe switching seals to get the cleave effect. At 3 mobs, you actually do more dps (slightly @ 3 mobs, definitely @ 2 mobs) by keeping up your single target rotation, and burning whatever mob the tank is currently fighting. This might change in the next patch when Divine Storm starts giving Holy Power, but the rule is this:

For 3 or less mobs: single target rotation.
For 4 or more: aoe rotation.
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#4 Mar 17 2011 at 10:11 AM Rating: Default
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Having been a former paladin with about 4 alt paladins, i will be honest on ret: as far as dps in pve hc's are concerned( or in the poster's case normals) ret is almost near useless. when mr Ghostcrawler decided to cave in to other ppl's complaints, we did get nerfed indirectly. the aoe's that rets have now are pathetic. Divine Storm hits for only 8K crit(when i was a level 80 with 264's i did 10K crits) and unless u are a prot never ever use consecration. it costs nearly 50% of your base mana, and does a dismal amount per tick. and since DS shares a cd with CS atm, DS has nearly no functional use.

If u want to exercise your right to play in an rhc in future though, make sure you go with guildies. coming from an EU server, as a ret you are more than likely to be the scapegoat for low dps if u use the lfd.

a small glimmer of hope though is that rets are still good in single targets(i.e boss fights such as Baradin Hold). for those it is simply a matter of stacking holy power, then using Zealotry , followed by Inquisition and unload Templar's Verdict onto the boss. ofc, dont forget to use the Exorcism when it procs( its free and does double damage) and ofc the feared Hammer of Wrath which can be used when you have Avenging Wrath on, though you should have the glyph of salvation in ur book unless u want to peel the mob off the tank.

as for gear, i suggest using the blue pvp sets if u have enough honor points. the justice point ones are terrible. in a full set of pvp blues gemmed up my strength was about 4050. as for trinkets burst ones are the best. if both of them proc, it is possible for u to get nearly 6000 strength for a short time.

supposedly, it was rumoured in a baradin hold run a ret pally came either 2nd or top on the dps list for argaloth.

my advice though, stick to prot for pve and use ret for pvp if u do it. the safe side is to go holy spec, but if u have no prior experience using it u dont want to experiment with it in rhc's as it is expected that a healadin in cata dungeon's is competent.

P.S: CapJack, is it just me or was it intended that the Seals of Command talent would work as it currently does, only hitting two extra targets for 7% weapon damage?
#5 Mar 23 2011 at 1:50 AM Rating: Decent
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I have been a ret pally for far too long and it is very hard to make it as a ret pally these days. I find that I can do anywhere between 10k-14k on trash in heroics and on boss fights 15k-20k. That is only if the fight doesn't go on for too long. I have found I have a very small rotation if you can even call it that due to the fact I am hitting some attacks only during procs, and others only with full holy power. I can't speak for all ret pallies but it takes more luck than skill these days to be ret and not get booted from groups....
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#6 Mar 23 2011 at 4:39 AM Rating: Good
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Romes2007 wrote:
I have been a ret pally for far too long and it is very hard to make it as a ret pally these days. I find that I can do anywhere between 10k-14k on trash in heroics and on boss fights 15k-20k. That is only if the fight doesn't go on for too long. I have found I have a very small rotation if you can even call it that due to the fact I am hitting some attacks only during procs, and others only with full holy power. I can't speak for all ret pallies but it takes more luck than skill these days to be ret and not get booted from groups....


I wouldn't agree. In a longer fight we can use our cooldowns multiple times, if a fight lasts just over 5 minutes I can squeeze 3 Hammer of Wraths and 3 Zealotrys in alongside 2 Guardians. We dont have mana issues so fight length is pretty irrelevant in general.

Regardless of how unlocky I have felt my procs to be, it always balances out across a raid length fight and as such I see very little fluctuation in my own DPS. I have only 6 out of 16 possible epic items, and a weapon isnt one of them, yet I consistently pull inbetween 15 and 16k dps with almost no fluctuation.

If you are being booted from anything but hardcore progression groups for being a ret pally, then you simply arent skilled enough. Although your procs do rely on luck, so does every single other class rely on luck, either for procs or crits.
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#7 Mar 23 2011 at 7:03 AM Rating: Decent
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what is rather ironic about being a ret right now is that they can come near the top in raids,(due to just having to kill one boss mob), but then we come near the bottom in hc's (due to the fact we have almost no effective aoe's to use against the many trash mobs, consecration is a waste of mana, and as we all know DS hits about as hard as a 9 year old girl, in addition to sharing a CD with crus strike, hence making it near useless). and it is the latter reason that results in the ret being thrown out of the hc.
#8 Mar 23 2011 at 10:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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If he's getting thrown out of anything but a 10-man hardmode raid, or a 25-man progression raid that's at least 5/12 or 6/12, he's running with the wrong crowd. 10-14k on trash is plenty for 5-mans, and there's only a couple of bosses in 10-mans that (a) have critical adds and (b) adds aren't just handled by the ranged - and even then, that's so close to par that it would only matter at the very cutting edge of progression for his group.
#9 Mar 23 2011 at 12:24 PM Rating: Good
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2,010 posts
Quote:
I have been a ret pally for far too long and it is very hard to make it as a ret pally these days. I find that I can do anywhere between 10k-14k on trash in heroics and on boss fights 15k-20k.


I'd like to know how you are hitting these numbers at all. I am using CLCret, know the priority, follow the gearing advice on EJ and I can't break past 6-7k max and that's on a good day. I couldn't in WoTLK, either. I don't know what it is I am doing wrong but some of these numbers people are talking about just amaze me.

I'd be thrilled with pushing 10k in normals much less heroics.....

#10 Mar 23 2011 at 12:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Without seeing your gear Torrence it is hard to judge you.

Some tips for Heroics:
Pop wings with your first Inquisition, by then a good tank will have enough aggro to hold against you. Use Guardian Spirit early to get the max strength bonus during Wings.
Use Zealotry with the 3 Holy Power that you would be using for the second inquisition then go to town.
Plan your trinkets if they have a Use effect. If it is strength, use it with Wings. If it is Mastery use it with Zealotry.

Generating Holy Power is more important than anything. If you dont have 3 Holy Power and Crusader Strike is on cooldown, use it. You can generally fit two fillers between each Crusader Strike, this is when you use Exorcism and Divine Purpose procs. Use Judgement only if CS is on cooldown, Holy Power isnt full and nothing has procced.

If your gear is good and you arent reaching 10k then you are following the priority wrong. The priority is for the most part fairly forgiving, you will get the occasional GCD where you aren't hitting anything and can take the time to plan what moves are next, but if you do something like use a Templar Verdict with only two Holy Power it is a waste of so much potential damage and can really throw you off your game.
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They'll rape us to death, eat our flesh and sew our skins into their clothing. And if we're very, very lucky... They'll do it in that order.
#11 Mar 23 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Good
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Those are great tips - I appreciate it!
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