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Druid fun anymore?Follow

#1 Jan 19 2011 at 11:00 AM Rating: Decent
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I was curious how many of you druids have switched mains or stopped playing and how many are still having fun on your druid. I for one have switched to my Paladin because tanking and healing is way ahead of the druid. And just to make you bears cry Ill list some of the reasons.

Aoe damage is #1. With 3 AoE abilities (2 short cds and one that stays on ground) I don't have to worry about rounding up the whole group before starting. Good luck getting dps to wait that long on their aoe. Then add taunt- both classes have single target taunt on short cd. But as pally I have righteous defence- 3 targets and it is a short cd.

#2 Tools at my disposal. As pally I have 3 cds compairable to the 3 of druid. 20%/1min. Another 20% and heals me if I was to die on 3 min cd. 50%/3min cd. Now add in ability to use WoG on anyone and it gives me 10% extra block damage reduction (I've had 1800 hps in a heroic fight that healer couldn't keep up)yet they nerf druids self heal on 3min cd. Hand of freedom to get out of snares/movement effects, and I can cast on others. Druids can shape shift to get out of snares... till next patch. Of course druids can break fear with berserk... again till next patch. Not done yet- as a paladin I have access to spells that decrease damage by 20% for everyone in raid. I have access to spells that transfer damage to myself. Let's not forget Lay on Hands/Divine shield... both can save a fight.

#3 raid buffs. I have 1 buff I share with druids and 1 unique to the class. Then I have 4 auras that each can be useful depending on fight.

#4 Avenger Shield. A spell that does massive damage to 3 targets and silences them ( and does NOT hit cc mobs unless you target them). Way better way of pulling targets when using cc than anything druids have. Currently shield is only version of silence pallies have and is on 15 sec cd compared to druids 10 seconds- but with talents can proc ALL the time.
Plus reports are on beta all paladin specs can get the silence that ret has now.

The only thing I miss from druid is charge (which with eng I can fix)... but even then, with the amount of casters and cc needed, charging into a pack of cc mobs isn't brightest idea. I can throw my shield and make them come to me.

When I play my driud I feel like a shell of my previous self and have lost intrest in whole class... besides doing enchants I haven't played my druid in 3 weeks... but I miss what my druid was in WotLk. But when my paladin is better in every facet of the game (I amtank for pve and holy for pvp). On druid I was bear and resto for pve (niether fun) and I dislike dps.
#2 Jan 19 2011 at 11:30 AM Rating: Good
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Most druid tanks have switched to other builds or chars. I say most because my 10 man raid is running with a Bear tank and we are doing just fine, I guess. 25man he goes dps and we have a pally/warrior tank combo, pally is tank for the other 10 man group we have.

Since I`m not tank, I`m having a blast with my Moonking/Healer spec. I`m not going to change the class I love to play just because Blizzard doesnt love us. Blizzard never did love Druids anyway, so...
#3 Jan 19 2011 at 11:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Brisin wrote:
Most druid tanks have switched to other builds or chars. I say most because my 10 man raid is running with a Bear tank and we are doing just fine, I guess. 25man he goes dps and we have a pally/warrior tank combo, pally is tank for the other 10 man group we have.

Since I`m not tank, I`m having a blast with my Moonking/Healer spec. I`m not going to change the class I love to play just because Blizzard doesnt love us. Blizzard never did love Druids anyway, so...



I didn't mean to imply druids can't tank, but they are short on resources to not just survive themselfs but help the whole group. Paladins can be played with much more creativity and help twice as much when it comes to the group surviving. I hate switching from druid but when blizz. Tips me over and slaps a rainbow on my *** before nuetering me, I'm not gonna stick to class
#4 Jan 19 2011 at 1:10 PM Rating: Good
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Vilaca wrote:
Brisin wrote:
Most druid tanks have switched to other builds or chars. I say most because my 10 man raid is running with a Bear tank and we are doing just fine, I guess. 25man he goes dps and we have a pally/warrior tank combo, pally is tank for the other 10 man group we have.

Since I`m not tank, I`m having a blast with my Moonking/Healer spec. I`m not going to change the class I love to play just because Blizzard doesnt love us. Blizzard never did love Druids anyway, so...



I didn't mean to imply druids can't tank, but they are short on resources to not just survive themselfs but help the whole group. Paladins can be played with much more creativity and help twice as much when it comes to the group surviving. I hate switching from druid but when blizz. Tips me over and slaps a rainbow on my *** before nuetering me, I'm not gonna stick to class

Great thing of WoW is that anyone can play the game the way they like and see it fit. If what you like is playing the best char/class for the purposed intended untill that class get hit with the nerf bat and then change to another one, feel free to do so. I bet that, in the end of this expansion, you will be back to Druid Healing, since Druid Healers are always the best healer in the end of every expansion (well, not counting vanilla).

I like to play Druids. I`m even making a mage alt, but still, I like Moonkin better. I tried shaman once and only liked the melee spec of it. Tried warrior and I hated it. Same with pallys, they are boring as ****. Rogues are fine, Mages are OK, locks are boring as **** too, priests are ok. Hunters, for me, are the worst of all. Of all those, Druids are the ones I have the most fun. If it wasnt, I wouldnt play them. Matter of tastes, I suppose.

Edited, Jan 19th 2011 4:11pm by Brisin
#5 Jan 19 2011 at 2:25 PM Rating: Good
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#1) We have abilities to hit mobs before everything's grouped up too, they're called Mangle and Maul. People ***** but I have NEVER lost a mob to AoE (without it dying before it reaches the dps) unless it was one that hasn't reached me yet. And for those pulls that are tricky to hold onto for whatever reason we have Berserk. If that thing isn't always on cooldown you're wither CCing down to one mob, approaching a nasty pull where it WILL go on cooldown or you're doing something wrong.

#2) I'll see your 20% and a heal and raise you a 30% life boost and 60% heal. Frenzied Regen's healing was cut because in an infinite mana situation it came out to over a full life bar in healing and that was a ***** to balance around. So cut the heal and boost the tank's armor.

If you're gonna brag about CC avoidance don't count PTR changes until they actually go through. Blizzard has been reversing those things almost as fast as they make em. As a Druid I have battle rez, as a Druid I have Tranquility, and I'm savvy enough of boss abilities to use them while tanking.

#3) your "unique to the class" buff doesn't stack with other mp5 or AP buffs. You have a unique combination but a Felhunter's (int/mp5) more unique than you are. Only a mage can cover his int part while AP's done by DK tanks, Marks hunters and Enh Shamans.

#4) Ok, here's where Berserk comes in. You throw a shield every 15 seconds for good damage, I make at least three enemies explode every 3 minutes. Faerie fire pulls just fine (unless Avenger's Shield includes a fixate it's not going to be enough to stop a nova-ing DPS) and skull bash trumps the shield, as you said.


I haven't played a Pally but I did just get an IM from a friend leveling a druid for the first time about how much he's enjoying it compared to his, says he feels a lot more flexibility. Anecdote != data and he's not 85 yet, I just mention it to note that the water flows both ways in the realm of class preference.
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#6 Jan 19 2011 at 3:22 PM Rating: Good
I play a Boomkin and I still love playing her. I got frustrated quite a bit at first when I was doing heroics because my DPS was so low, but that was partly due to gear and partly due to my ****** computer. Now that I have better gear and an awesome computer my DPS is much better. Granted, it still can be very random which is annoying, but I think that happens with most any DoT class. There have been some runs where I've done 9k on one trash group, and others where I'll do 3 or 4k. Also, in some dungeons I do more DPS if I slap DoTs on all the mobs first and then do single target, and some dungeons I do less DPS if I do that. Still trying to figure out which are which. SFK DoT tabbing definitely lowers my DPS.
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#7 Jan 19 2011 at 4:39 PM Rating: Good
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selebrin wrote:
#1) We have abilities to hit mobs before everything's grouped up too, they're called Mangle and Maul. People ***** but I have NEVER lost a mob to AoE (without it dying before it reaches the dps) unless it was one that hasn't reached me yet. And for those pulls that are tricky to hold onto for whatever reason we have Berserk. If that thing isn't always on cooldown you're wither CCing down to one mob, approaching a nasty pull where it WILL go on cooldown or you're doing something wrong.


No AoE tanking isn't hard when pulling mobs, however in boss situations where mobs spawn all around and each one is on a different person, having my extra AoE is very nice, added with Righteous defence and the transition is much easier. If you have time to run to each one of them, maul/mangle, go to next, maul mangle- more power too you. Im not saying its impossible to do as druid, but more of a pain.

selebrin wrote:
#2) I'll see your 20% and a heal and raise you a 30% life boost and 60% heal. Frenzied Regen's healing was cut because in an infinite mana situation it came out to over a full life bar in healing and that was a ***** to balance around. So cut the heal and boost the tank's armor.

If you're gonna brag about CC avoidance don't count PTR changes until they actually go through. Blizzard has been reversing those things almost as fast as they make em. As a Druid I have battle rez, as a Druid I have Tranquility, and I'm savvy enough of boss abilities to use them while tanking.


Well maybe I was vague- I was saying my Paladin has 3 cool downs comparable to my druid. I have Divine Protection (bark skin) Ardent Defender (rivals Frenzied Regen imo) and I have my Guardian of Ancient Kings- 50% damage reduction. Now add into that my Word of Glory - can do a LOT of healing when needed if there is a damage heavy fight and a healer having trouble keeping up, or if there is a situation where splash damage is unavoidable (Such as when Halfus does his chain stuns and the meteors come down)
Then there is Divine Guardian which lowers damage taken by 20% for EVERYONE in raid (except the casting paladin.) There seem to be a LOT of fights with tons of AoE, in which these abilities can help big time with damage/healer mana.

I mentioned the PTR changes to point out how idiotic the changes blizzard wants to implement and how they are treating Druids since 4.0. So you have Tranquility- please give me an example of when its safe to pop into caster form while a boss is pounding on you in order to channel your heal like I am able to do with WoG. Rebirth is nice to have in raid, but can be tough to pull off in some boss fights as tank (Im talking from experience, My main was a bear almost all the way through LK)
Now add in the fact there is only 1 battle res per fight, we can easily fill the roll with a moonchicken/tree/kitty and invite a tank with more abilities to help the raid.

selebrin wrote:
#3) your "unique to the class" buff doesn't stack with other mp5 or AP buffs. You have a unique combination but a Felhunter's (int/mp5) more unique than you are. Only a mage can cover his int part while AP's done by DK tanks, Marks hunters and Enh Shamans.


99% of the time, I have some sort of buff/aura that can help the group. Yes many classes may be able to cover some of my buffs, but more often than not, not everything is covered in 5m (or even 10m sometimes)

selebrin wrote:
#4) Ok, here's where Berserk comes in. You throw a shield every 15 seconds for good damage, I make at least three enemies explode every 3 minutes. Faerie fire pulls just fine (unless Avenger's Shield includes a fixate it's not going to be enough to stop a nova-ing DPS) and skull bash trumps the shield, as you said.


I haven't played a Pally but I did just get an IM from a friend leveling a druid for the first time about how much he's enjoying it compared to his, says he feels a lot more flexibility. Anecdote != data and he's not 85 yet, I just mention it to note that the water flows both ways in the realm of class preference.


My shield isn't really the biggest part of my damage rotation- many fights I do not include it in rotation, I save it for the timed interupts on the healers/casters. My point here is it is a ranged silence that silences 3 targets and still does damage. My druids Berserk does nothing but increase damage and maybe gain some agro in emergency situations- something Paladins have more than enough tools to handle the job explained in part #1.
I never said skull bash trumps shield, yes it is a slightly shorter cooldown, but with Grand Crusader I often get it to proc to where i can cast it within 3-5 seconds of eachother. They are just different.

Now we come to the pull, 3 casters 1 melee and you have 2 cc's available, I'd say this situation happens a lot. Druid- You can cast FFF and just have the casters stand there and laugh at you. You can charge in on the non cc targets and skull bash them, only take a few gcd. Or fight them where they stand and see if your dps can stay off spells that have splash damage. Of if its available, you can use Line of Sight and let casters come to you/the healer.
On Paladin. we CC 2, I throw my shield and it hits other 2 (since it doesn't hit CC mobs unless I target them) and they run to me, we take them down fast. Move on to other 2. So I feel its safe to say that when casters are in the equation, paladins are faster on the pulls, which makes the instance goes faster when its all added up.
This was never in issue in wrath because it was aoe zerg fest- just charge in and swipe. Maybe this was too easy, but at least the druid could keep up with other tanks.

Sorry for the long post, but to add it all up, other tanks seem to have tons of utilities not available to the druid to make some aspects of the game easier and more efficient where druid tanks are getting all of their tools and features nerfed in pve because of pvp.

This is not a thread to hate on druids, its a thread to point out the ludicrous changes blizzard wants to make to the bear. I am not advocating that every tank have a tool for every situation, but druids are WAY behind paladins (and I'm assuming other classes as well, but I have never played a warrior or DK tank)

In WotLK I had extra health, high armor/dodge/advoidance. Very sweet AoE ability to pick up all the mobs when they spawned. Now my armor/health/avoidance is mostly on par with other tanks, but without any of the tools and abilities.

Call it Egotistical, as a Tank, I want to stand out. I want my class to have a reason for a group to pick me and want me to tank for them, I want to have the ability to make as much difference as I can by playing my class as efficient and cleaver as I can. On the druid, I feel short changed and wish blizzard would make them stand out again. Not calling for druids to be OP- but each of the other tank classes seem like they have abilities that make them stand out in their own way.
#8 Jan 19 2011 at 5:45 PM Rating: Good
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Vilaca wrote:
So you have Tranquility- please give me an example of when its safe to pop into caster form while a boss is pounding on you in order to channel your heal like I am able to do with WoG. Rebirth is nice to have in raid, but can be tough to pull off in some boss fights as tank (Im talking from experience, My main was a bear almost all the way through LK)

Note that even a couple of ticks of Tranq can be useful, a full cast isn't mandatory.

Toxitron- Poison Protocol (if you're his tank of course, adds won't go for you) just make sure you're back in bear before the third slime spawns.
Magmatron- either of his non-shield abilities unless a mage iceblocks off the aiming without warning anyone. I later informed the guy that "Tranqing on the next lock-on" means you sit there and take it like a good boy.
Arcanotron- if I'm not needed for interrupts (we have a ton of mages and shamans in the guild) I can run across the room and drop a Tranq easily. He stops so often on his way over to cast that while I may need to cut it short most of the heal gets off.

Magmaw- offtank segments of course. I use the time when Mangled to hit Berserk so even if we move to 1-tanking it I can Tranq during the spike phase without losing much of my damage time, if needed. Slow attack speed so I can (and have done) Rebirth between melee swings.

Halfus- during the Slate Dragon's stun, depends on what else is going on and not as predictable as the above bosses. Least forgiving of the bosses I've seen so far.

That's all the guys I can speak firsthand on; I haven't seen the other fights so while some look to have periods of AoE damage where the tank's not getting hit directly I can't speak with confidence.
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#9 Jan 19 2011 at 6:10 PM Rating: Decent
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selebrin wrote:
Vilaca wrote:
So you have Tranquility- please give me an example of when its safe to pop into caster form while a boss is pounding on you in order to channel your heal like I am able to do with WoG. Rebirth is nice to have in raid, but can be tough to pull off in some boss fights as tank (Im talking from experience, My main was a bear almost all the way through LK)

Note that even a couple of ticks of Tranq can be useful, a full cast isn't mandatory.

Toxitron- Poison Protocol (if you're his tank of course, adds won't go for you) just make sure you're back in bear before the third slime spawns.
Magmatron- either of his non-shield abilities unless a mage iceblocks off the aiming without warning anyone. I later informed the guy that "Tranqing on the next lock-on" means you sit there and take it like a good boy.
Arcanotron- if I'm not needed for interrupts (we have a ton of mages and shamans in the guild) I can run across the room and drop a Tranq easily. He stops so often on his way over to cast that while I may need to cut it short most of the heal gets off.

Magmaw- offtank segments of course. I use the time when Mangled to hit Berserk so even if we move to 1-tanking it I can Tranq during the spike phase without losing much of my damage time, if needed. Slow attack speed so I can (and have done) Rebirth between melee swings.

Halfus- during the Slate Dragon's stun, depends on what else is going on and not as predictable as the above bosses. Least forgiving of the bosses I've seen so far.

That's all the guys I can speak firsthand on; I haven't seen the other fights so while some look to have periods of AoE damage where the tank's not getting hit directly I can't speak with confidence.


In almost all the cases you stated, You are really playing with fire. Depending on how far you are pushing it (which if you aren't, it probably isn't too effective) the bosses switches back from their cast and hits the tank pretty fast. WoG is instant, so I can cast while being hit. on phases where they are casting and damage is high (such as magmatrons lock on) I can get a couple flash heals off and push it, if I'm still casting and he hits me- My armor still mitigates the damage, and I don't take a much bigger hit than if I wasn't casting. Can you say the same in caster form if you mistime it or lag just the slightest? :)

Not meaning to make this sound like a "anything you can do, I can do better" - but this utility of a druid is kinda pushing it and unreliable.
From post I have read, I believe a lot of people feel the same as I do. Druids need something to make them stand out and put them in line with other tanks better. Its my firm belief, if you have 2 equally skilled players- one playing a druid tank, one playing a pally tank, the pally tank is going to be more beneficial to the group.


Edited, Jan 19th 2011 7:11pm by Vilaca
#10 Jan 19 2011 at 7:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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selebrin wrote:
#1) We have abilities to hit mobs before everything's grouped up too, they're called Mangle and Maul. People ***** but I have NEVER lost a mob to AoE (without it dying before it reaches the dps) unless it was one that hasn't reached me yet. And for those pulls that are tricky to hold onto for whatever reason we have Berserk. If that thing isn't always on cooldown you're wither CCing down to one mob, approaching a nasty pull where it WILL go on cooldown or you're doing something wrong.


I get what you're trying to prove, but the fact is that while Bear AOE was nerfed to the @#%^ing ground, Paladin and Death Knight AOE was buffed.

Personally, I couldn't give a crap what Maul and Mangle spam does in an AOE situation. If you're telling me that you can run in and Thrash, Swipe and Mangle/Maul, while your group spams AOE, and not lose aggro, you're either running with a guild or a Hunter/Rogue using MD/TotT. All it takes is one Howling Blast or a Whirlwind and you've lost aggro.

I know, because I've tried it. Full DPS gear, I lost aggro to a Whirlwind over two layers of Thrash and a Swipe. ***** Mangle and Maul spam. If you're fighting 5+ mobs, you don't have enough GCDs to apply threat to all of the mobs before some random scrub pulls aggro.

Naturally, the solution would be for people to not be scrubs and hold back, but why should they when Paladins and Death Knights just /rofl through that kind of AOE with ease? Again, I know this because I've got a Paladin as well.

selebrin wrote:
As a Druid I have battle rez, as a Druid I have Tranquility, and I'm savvy enough of boss abilities to use them while tanking.


Smiley: lol

Good luck using your Feral Tranquility while tanking a heroic or raid boss. Hello instant death. At the least, you'll be taking more damage than Tranquility makes up for.

selebrin wrote:
#3) your "unique to the class" buff doesn't stack with other mp5 or AP buffs. You have a unique combination but a Felhunter's (int/mp5) more unique than you are. Only a mage can cover his int part while AP's done by DK tanks, Marks hunters and Enh Shamans.


Paladins have more flexibility with buffs than the Druid regardless.

selebrin wrote:
#4) Ok, here's where Berserk comes in. You throw a shield every 15 seconds for good damage, I make at least three enemies explode every 3 minutes. Faerie fire pulls just fine (unless Avenger's Shield includes a fixate it's not going to be enough to stop a nova-ing DPS) and skull bash trumps the shield, as you said.


Smiley: rolleyes

So you can explode stuff every three minutes. My Paladin can explode stuff every pull. GG. And Avenger's Shield hits for 10k+ - on three targets - and silences them - and the cooldown can be reset via using your main AOE ability.

selebrin wrote:
I haven't played a Pally but I did just get an IM from a friend leveling a druid for the first time about how much he's enjoying it compared to his, says he feels a lot more flexibility.


Flexibility isn't all. Sure, Druids can decide whether they want to go Thrash and pray, or Tab-select and Lacerate/Mangle, but in the end, you're forced to take the most efficient route - regardless of your class. And if he's referring to Feral being very versatile then I agree. It just doesn't do much for us when we're tanking.

To name some utility tools that my Paladin has:

Reduce group damage taken by 20% every two minutes.
Reduce someone's threat output.
Turn someone immune to physical damage.
Turn a killing blow into a 15% heal.
Heal himself for 100% of his health every 7 minutes.
Heal himself for 20-30k health every four GCD (two GCD if talent procs).
Remove diseases and poisons while tanking.
Silence three targets from ranged distance.
Stun every undead, demon, dragon and elemental around him every 15 seconds while dealing damage to them.

Those are just abilities that my Druid doesn't have. 20% 1-minute CD and 50% CD are of course also something my Paladin has. The only thing he doesn't have is the +healing taken buff from glyphed Frenzied Regeneration, but he's got a passive +6% healing taken and a 30% chance on self-healing with WoG to get an extra for free. Hello 50k health in two GCDs.

And once the patch hits, he'll be able to interrupt spell casts every 10 seconds without having to spend two talent points on it. Oh, and he already gets more +spell damage via his specialization than a Druid gets +spell healing via 2/2 Nurturing Instinct.

The only thing Druids have to their advantage right now is the ability to perform two roles in a group without changing talent spec. Except, we kinda suck at that as well, since we can't have six Prime Glyphs.

I get that you want to defend your class, selebrin, but if you don't know how the other tanking classes perform in the game, you shouldn't try to compare them. I'd love to be able to say that my Druid is okay, but I'd be lying, because I've seen what the other classes can do. And it hurts my soul that the class I've loved through the last six years is being ripped apart, piece by piece, in the name of homogenization.

Druid tanking has been gimped to a degree where, if you've played the other tanking classes, it just doesn't make any @#%^ing sense anymore. As a Druid, you have to bend over backwards to do what other classes take for granted.

Ghostcrawler can bite me.

Edit: Note that I'm not comparing survivability here. I know that the classes have about the same avoidance and mitigation. What I'm comparing is utility, of which the Bear Druid has very little compared to every other class. Rebirth and Tranquility are nice spells, but if you're tanking, it's rarely usable since the incoming damage is increased by a lot when you shift out. And my Paladin's AOE heal isn't on an 8-minute cooldown and can be cast while tanking.

Edited, Jan 20th 2011 5:24am by Mazra
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#11 Jan 20 2011 at 11:19 AM Rating: Default
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Mazra wrote:
As a Druid, you have to bend over backwards to do what other classes take for granted.

Ghostcrawler can bite me.
GC and the Frostmage Band are after Druid in PVP. Half of the Bg’s are FM, I won’t be able to move as Feral. I will have a new form, GHOST...

So my Druid is a Bank alt, my FM is currently 2200 rating in 3 (so easy). Feral Druid is not fun anymore.
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#12 Jan 20 2011 at 2:14 PM Rating: Good
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Ghostcrawler can bite me.


Second that. Only way to put it without lots of profanity.
#13 Feb 05 2011 at 2:16 AM Rating: Good
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I still like tanking on my bear. Well raids. Heroic tanking sucks on bear.

Rage being retarded doesn't help. I'm usually running on fumes and most pulls are annoying unless I have most stuff CC'd or get a group where I can chain pull to some degree.

Raid tanking is fun as a bear. The mobs hit hard enough to give me a decent rage supply so I can do stuff.

I need to get a separate gear that is more threat based for heroics I think.
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#14 Feb 10 2011 at 12:47 AM Rating: Decent
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I played a druid back in vanilla when guilds actively tried to pressure ferals into becoming casters and feral armor was also known as "stealing from the rogue" so I've seen far worse then this and the current nerf.

Most of the druids who are crying and class swapping are later druids, folks who never even considered a druid till our golden years in Outlands when we had more health then a pally and warrior put together and epic bears were soloing heroics for fun and profit.

There were some nerfs in Wrath, but nothing that'd slow down any but the most incompetent of face roller druids and some of which one could reasonably say were fair nerfs.

There's one thing though that has separated the vanilla druids from every other class out there and that's that back in vanilla, we learned an exploit.

Yup, I said the E-word and I'll even post what that exploit is here on these forums because it's so deeply ingrained in the class that Blizz can never fix it and if you weren't a vanilla druid, it's almost impossible for you to use it.

The exploit is that us vanilla druids learned how to play our class!

We couldn't rely on armor and weapons because there were none for us - a naked vanilla druid was about as dangerous as a fully geared one for the simple reason that there was so little gear for us that in order to play the class effectively one had to actually learn it.

As a bear, you had to keep up a real rotation, exploit every aggro generating skill you had and be nurse your "oh crap" CDs with care, knowing how and when to use them to maximum advantage. Think about it - warriors and pallies had all sorts of AOE type aggro generators while us bears had to keep swapping targets to keep damage on all of them so as not to have a sped DPS or healer strip them away, forcing us to learn a degree of situational awareness that your average warrior, pally and DK will never possess due to their wealth of AOE taunts, heck, I still rotate targets when mass pulling even with our current spread of AOE taunts - I'm sure many of you probably do the same.

Those of you who've been around since then probably recall that the overall assessment of most players was that feral druid was the hardest and rarest class to play.

The result of being Blizz's red headed step child all those years was that druids learned their class better then any other class out there and short of removing every last one of our talents, taking away all of our gear and reducing our white damage to single digits, no nerf in the world is going to stop us bears from being solid, competent tanks.

So there's our exploit and the reason why we'll always be solid bear tanks and the friends and guildies we run with will always be surprised whenever they encounter "droods sux" comments - because Blizz can nerf our class, turn our armor to wet paper and give us a piece of silly string for a weapon and we'll still kick ****.
#15 Feb 10 2011 at 2:27 AM Rating: Good
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Well said rusttle. I remember when they gave us real gear/talents in TBC (****, when they gave us ALMOST half-decent gear like Genesis *gag*) and druids suddenly exploded because we had learned how to manage on scraps. It was like running on a treadmill that suddenly stopped.

I'm not an uberbear, but I'm slowly beginning to recognize the abilities I HAVE honed that make my guildies happy. I think of them as simply being competent, and it wasn't until I caught myself fawning over a hunter guildy CC juggling three mobs that I realized competence is relative. I think what I do isn't special because I've been doing it for years. Heck, I could do a half-decent cat rotation blindfolded, running off internal buff timers and energy counter.

(Three mob Hunter CC: Trap in front of one mob, 30 seconds in trap another and start the pull, wyvern sting a third and when that wears off another trap will be back up. Since he's SV trap lasts 90 seconds so he can then cycle trap on all three mobs with Wyvern as backup. Note that he pulled this off in Vortex Pinnacle, where you need to do everything while working around those stupid grounding fields.)
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#16 Feb 10 2011 at 6:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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No, I think I can safely say, at least for me and Maz, we've been playing Druids since pre BC. For tanking, Prot pallies just have more utility tools to play with. Holy Radiance is like a mini Tranquility on a 1(!) min CD, and it's instant, not channeled. I don't have to worry about getting insta-gibbed it I let it run too long. I can heal either myself or others with WoG while I'm tanking without trying to fit it in between boss swings. And I have HoProtection and HoFreedom and HoSalv. Battle Rez is great, but since it's capped per fight, we run into the cap in 25s way before I need to risk popping out of bear to get someone up.

I still love DPSing on my druid, because I can actually shift out to do more. I have Cyclone, Hibernate, Entangling Roots, (a grossly nerfed) Innervate, Tranq, Soothe. I can BR the healer, or go bear and take over for the tank if he dies.

Are druids still fun? **** yes, I love kitty DPS. 5-man bear just seems frustrating compared to 5-man cat.

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 7:02am by AstarintheDruid
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#17 Feb 10 2011 at 1:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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@rusttle

I disagree with a bit of your post... or perhaps I would just word it differently. For example:
Quote:
As a bear, you had to keep up a real rotation, exploit every aggro generating skill you had and be nurse your "oh crap" CDs with care, knowing how and when to use them to maximum advantage. Think about it - warriors and pallies had all sorts of AOE type aggro generators while us bears had to keep swapping targets to keep damage on all of them so as not to have a sped DPS or healer strip them away, forcing us to learn a degree of situational awareness that your average warrior, pally and DK will never possess due to their wealth of AOE taunts, heck, I still rotate targets when mass pulling even with our current spread of AOE taunts - I'm sure many of you probably do the same.


Unless you forgot to mention you play a new class in the last sentence, you said bears have a "spread of AOE taunts"; by which I believe we have exactly one. Alt-tabbing is needed and has been since TBC, precisely because we only have one AoE taunt on a long cooldown and relatively weak AoE for groups larger than three. Saying that "learning to play your class" and gain situational awareness are exploits that only bears gained above other classes sounds, well, childish to me.
Quote:
Those of you who've been around since then probably recall that the overall assessment of most players was that feral druid was the hardest and rarest class to play.

No, I recall the assessment as "Feral druids are worse than other tanks in all situations at level 60." They weren't hard; they were handicapped. They were rare because it was a sub-par tank. You yourself said that gear made hardly any difference and that's completely right. Blizzard messed up when it came to feral (and at first, Paladin - I leveled protection pre-1.8, and THAT was a nightmare) tanking back in vanilla.

Quote:
The result of being Blizz's red headed step child all those years was that druids learned their class better then any other class out there and short of removing every last one of our talents, taking away all of our gear and reducing our white damage to single digits, no nerf in the world is going to stop us bears from being solid, competent tanks.

Going forward this is true. Looking back, it was not true. Feral druids in vanilla were not solid tanks, even when competent. They could get the job done, but so could a voidwalker (I remember a MC video showing a VW tanking the bosses and reading a comment saying "Hey, the blueberry is better than a bear for tanking!"). But to do so required much more coordination from DPS (and less damage, to keep aggro on the bear), more healing from a healer, and a higher chance of failure.


I really feel you have rose-tinted glasses on when it comes to the nostalgia of the good ol' days. I was active in the raiding scene back in vanilla, and feral druids were never a part of our raids. Not because the players weren't good, but because the spec was terrible. We didn't have demonology warlocks or beast mastery hunters either, as I seem to recall. People shunning feral druid wasn't because "the class spec is too hard" it was because "the class spec is not good." We don't have quite the same issue now, but the class is definitely tougher than at any time since TBC (when I started my druid). My Paladin is a blast, however.

Edit: And Blizzard was fine with some specs not working. Ask a fire mage how much they liked MC or BWL. Ask a shadow priest if they got to DPS. Ask a Retribution Pally how often they got to deal damage instead of respeccing holy and being a cleansebot. We're not even talking about cookie-cutter specs with a difference in damage of 5% from one another - we're talking about entire specs being about half as effective (or less) on raid content.

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 2:30pm by LockeColeMA
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#18 Feb 10 2011 at 2:05 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
No, I recall the assessment as "Feral druids are worse than other tanks in all situations at level 60." They weren't hard; they were handicapped. They were rare because it was a sub-par tank. You yourself said that gear made hardly any difference and that's completely right. Blizzard messed up when it came to feral (and at first, Paladin - I leveled protection pre-1.8, and THAT was a nightmare) tanking back in vanilla.


This. I'm pretty sure Warriors were the only tanks in raiding. I remember people got excited (on alla, at least) when someone posted a video of a Bear MTing Ragnaros. And even then, if I recall, he was switching off with a Warrior.

Did Paladins ever get to the point where they were MTs in Vanilla? I first tried to level one before 1.8 and I didn't touch the class again until BC.
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#19 Feb 10 2011 at 3:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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idiggory wrote:

This. I'm pretty sure Warriors were the only tanks in raiding. I remember people got excited (on alla, at least) when someone posted a video of a Bear MTing Ragnaros. And even then, if I recall, he was switching off with a Warrior.

Did Paladins ever get to the point where they were MTs in Vanilla? I first tried to level one before 1.8 and I didn't touch the class again until BC.


I don't believe so. Bears WERE used in very rare cases, like Jindo who would use polymorph. Up until 1.9, Paladins didn't have righteous fury - they used Seal/Judgment of Fury for extra threat, but none of their other abilities (Holy shield, judgment... and auto-attack) had threat modifiers. They had Holy Shield, but their final talent was Repentence (yay!). Consecration was in Retribution and out of reach if you put 31 points in Protection. In fact, Protection was more of a PvP build than anything else; Consecration was really useful if you got jumped by several people or needed to get a heal off, and since you needed 5 points in improved seal of justice (what a terrible waste of points, as it's on diminishing returns!), they were best off for stunning utility. I loved a video of a Grand Marshal Protection Paladin. 1.9 gave Paladins a bit more utility with Blessing of Sanctuary and a Consecration lower in the holy tree, as well as the Righteous Fury changes, but until TBC Paladins still did not have a baseline taunt, making them worthless on fights that needed a taunt rotation.

Druids got their change in 1.8 (AQ patch), but the changes mostly affected cats and Balance druids. Balance got Moonkin; feral got Leader of the Pack (just a 3% crit buff to melee). Feral also got some buffs - finally a threat modifier for bear form, as well as more attack power (but still no scaling from weapons). All through vanilla, the only thing druids could do as tanks was growl, Maul, Demoralizing Roar, and Feral Faerie Fire (no damage component). Due to this they had a VERY hard time keeping threat. And unless I miss my guess, I don't think they had growl or swipe originally either (not positive on that, though). Even when Swipe was given to druids, it would only affect 3 enemies.

I REALLY wish Quor's history of the druid class still existed Smiley: glare I think it was forever lost in the merger with wowhead.
Edit: Found it: http://wow.allakhazam.com/forum.html?wclass=6&mid=1169562232160472122#msg1226323722252602049

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 4:11pm by LockeColeMA

1.8 marked the real changes making druids better in feral, giving them raid utility. This means for almost a year, they were sub-par. Even then, weapons did not scale so only the Agi and Str stats mattered for some minimal extra damage. Not until 1.11 (Naxxramas release, June 2006) did Innervate go to a trainable skill and people stopped automatically assuming a druid was Restoration.

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 4:27pm by LockeColeMA
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#20 Feb 10 2011 at 4:40 PM Rating: Good
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I've been playing Druid for so long I remember when Feral Druids were Resto Druids. I leveled my Druid through Vanilla by stabbing **** with my dagger while healing myself. That's how Druids rolled.

Druids were pretty gimped up until The Burning Crusade, where Blizzard unfortunately overdid their balancing (nowai, amirite?) and Feral became the FOTM. It's been on a decline ever since.
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#21 Feb 10 2011 at 6:19 PM Rating: Good
I don't know, I remember in Vanilla doing a 40 man raid in ZG and the boomkin topping the dps charts. This was somewhere between 1/2 to 3/4 of the way through Vanilla, right around the time that AQ came out. He was even beating out the two or three mages. That was when I first got the idea that someday I wanted to level up a boomkin.
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#22 Feb 10 2011 at 6:36 PM Rating: Good
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
I don't know, I remember in Vanilla doing a 40 man raid in ZG and the boomkin topping the dps charts. This was somewhere between 1/2 to 3/4 of the way through Vanilla, right around the time that AQ came out.


I meant Feral Druids. Smiley: tongue

AQ wasn't released until well over a year into the game (patch 1.9). Things started to change around that time. For the first year of the game, though, it was all dagger and heals.

Although I do have some fond memories of running Stratholme on my Druid as Feral. Man, good times. Our strength back then was our ability to off-tank, especially in 5-mans. Perhaps that's an overlooked thing in Cataclysm because most people expect 5-mans to include only one tank. The fact that one or two crits in a heroic will gib most non-tanks is a contributing factor. Only Druids can effectively off-tank with Thick Hide.

Still, whenever I try it, the healer and tank take turns at calling me names. Even if I do have 170k health and 42k armor buffed.
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#23 Feb 10 2011 at 7:11 PM Rating: Decent
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rusttle wrote:
I played a druid back in vanilla when guilds actively tried to pressure ferals into becoming casters and feral armor was also known as "stealing from the rogue" so I've seen far worse then this and the current nerf.

Most of the druids who are crying and class swapping are later druids, folks who never even considered a druid till our golden years in Outlands when we had more health then a pally and warrior put together and epic bears were soloing heroics for fun and profit.

There were some nerfs in Wrath, but nothing that'd slow down any but the most incompetent of face roller druids and some of which one could reasonably say were fair nerfs.

There's one thing though that has separated the vanilla druids from every other class out there and that's that back in vanilla, we learned an exploit.

Yup, I said the E-word and I'll even post what that exploit is here on these forums because it's so deeply ingrained in the class that Blizz can never fix it and if you weren't a vanilla druid, it's almost impossible for you to use it.

The exploit is that us vanilla druids learned how to play our class!

We couldn't rely on armor and weapons because there were none for us - a naked vanilla druid was about as dangerous as a fully geared one for the simple reason that there was so little gear for us that in order to play the class effectively one had to actually learn it.

As a bear, you had to keep up a real rotation, exploit every aggro generating skill you had and be nurse your "oh crap" CDs with care, knowing how and when to use them to maximum advantage. Think about it - warriors and pallies had all sorts of AOE type aggro generators while us bears had to keep swapping targets to keep damage on all of them so as not to have a sped DPS or healer strip them away, forcing us to learn a degree of situational awareness that your average warrior, pally and DK will never possess due to their wealth of AOE taunts, heck, I still rotate targets when mass pulling even with our current spread of AOE taunts - I'm sure many of you probably do the same.

Those of you who've been around since then probably recall that the overall assessment of most players was that feral druid was the hardest and rarest class to play.

The result of being Blizz's red headed step child all those years was that druids learned their class better then any other class out there and short of removing every last one of our talents, taking away all of our gear and reducing our white damage to single digits, no nerf in the world is going to stop us bears from being solid, competent tanks.

So there's our exploit and the reason why we'll always be solid bear tanks and the friends and guildies we run with will always be surprised whenever they encounter "droods sux" comments - because Blizz can nerf our class, turn our armor to wet paper and give us a piece of silly string for a weapon and we'll still kick ****.



From the gibberish here the message I got is you think you are better than everyone because you played a druid in vanilla?

Perhaps if you read, not one person is claiming a druid can't tank. I will readily admit druids are fine at tanking.
The problem comes when druid tanking is lackluster and feels incomplete.

As a druid tank, there is usually very little I can do to help the group down a boss other than doing my job as best as I can. As a Paladin I have 3 times the utilities and abilities that I can use in a multitude of ways to help the group- allowing me as a player to be creative and make it seem like I'm stepping out of the box rather than being restricted.

Going from an 85 druid to an 85 Paladin is similar in switching from a level 40 to a lvl 85 of the same class. Sure at level 40 you have the basic tools, but the rotation and reward just isn't the same.
#24 Feb 10 2011 at 7:35 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Unless you forgot to mention you play a new class in the last sentence, you said bears have a "spread of AOE taunts"; by which I believe we have exactly one


Nope, I cheat and use swipe, thrash, glyphed maul, demoralizing roar, berserk enhanced mangle every three minutes and challenging roar every two and a half mins.

So what's the single AOE taunt you're stuck with?

Quote:

I really feel you have rose-tinted glasses on when it comes to the nostalgia of the good ol' days.


You're kidding, right? Those were the bad old days, the dark days, the suck-**** everyone in the guild trying to pressure you into being a caster no matter how many times Mr Bear kicked *** and saved the day when the warrior died days.

I don't miss them, I don't look back fondly on them, the only benefit of them is that they taut me to survive in the same way that WWIII would teach you to survive. O_o
#25 Feb 10 2011 at 8:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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rusttle wrote:
Quote:
Unless you forgot to mention you play a new class in the last sentence, you said bears have a "spread of AOE taunts"; by which I believe we have exactly one


Nope, I cheat and use swipe, thrash, glyphed maul, demoralizing roar, berserk enhanced mangle every three minutes and challenging roar every two and a half mins.

So what's the single AOE taunt you're stuck with?


Only one of those skills is an AoE taunt.

rusttle wrote:
Quote:

I really feel you have rose-tinted glasses on when it comes to the nostalgia of the good ol' days.


You're kidding, right? Those were the bad old days, the dark days, the suck-**** everyone in the guild trying to pressure you into being a caster no matter how many times Mr Bear kicked *** and saved the day when the warrior died days.

I don't miss them, I don't look back fondly on them, the only benefit of them is that they taut me to survive in the same way that WWIII would teach you to survive. O_o


WWIII hasn't happened yet. I'm assuming you meant WWII, current mechanics are more similar to modern warfare with drones, fancy new guns and complete different tactics. WWII, ie the old style, would teach you nothing about the new modern system of play. The basics of awareness and using all of your skills can be learned no matter the tool set. People are complaining druids have a WWII toolset instead of drones planes, new weapons and new kevlar vests. How does being handed the equivalent of a machine gun and told good luck have anything to do with the extensive tool set most other tanks have.


Edited, Feb 10th 2011 4:09pm by Horsemouth
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#26 Feb 10 2011 at 8:48 PM Rating: Good
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I don't know, I remember in Vanilla doing a 40 man raid in ZG and the boomkin topping the dps charts. This was somewhere between 1/2 to 3/4 of the way through Vanilla, right around the time that AQ came out.


I meant Feral Druids. Smiley: tongue

AQ wasn't released until well over a year into the game (patch 1.9). Things started to change around that time. For the first year of the game, though, it was all dagger and heals.


If you meant feral druids you should have said feral druids. :-p You said druids were gimped until BC, that leaves room to assume you meant druids as a whole.
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#27 Feb 11 2011 at 12:43 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:

Only one of those skills is an AoE taunt.


You do damage, you taunt.

Quote:

WWIII hasn't happened yet. I'm assuming you meant WWII,


Not everyone's bright enough for analogies I see. >_<
#28 Feb 11 2011 at 1:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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rusttle wrote:
Quote:

Only one of those skills is an AoE taunt.


You do damage, you taunt.


So if my priest attacks with her dagger that counts as a taunt?

rusttle wrote:
Quote:
WWIII hasn't happened yet. I'm assuming you meant WWII,


Not everyone's bright enough for analogies I see. >_<


You're an idiot.

edit: quote fail

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 9:05pm by Horsemouth
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#29 Feb 11 2011 at 3:08 AM Rating: Good
I think most of the people here get analogies, yours was just a ****** one.
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#30 Feb 11 2011 at 4:35 AM Rating: Decent
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rusttle wrote:

You do damage, you taunt.


You do damage, you build threat.

rusttle wrote:
Not everyone's bright enough for analogies I see. >_<


I agree, so please stop trying to use them.



I'm not sure why people are having such a hard time understanding that we aren't saying druid tanking is nonviable, we are simply pointing out that they are outdated and only about 1/2 as much fun as other tanks.

If I'm looking for a raid on my druid, I want groups to have a reason to pick me.

****, If I'm at my loading screen, I want a reason to pick my druid! Which I'm sure many of you have reasons to pick your druid , but personally the way I have the most fun in the game is tanking raids/heroics, so the other specs of druid doesn't carry much interest for me.
#31 Feb 11 2011 at 5:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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rusttle wrote:
Quote:

Only one of those skills is an AoE taunt.


You do damage, you taunt.


That's not how it works. Taunting, in the English dictionary, is defined as verbally insulting someone. A taunt, in this game, is an ability that causes mobs to change their target to you.

Swipe is neither, nor is Maul, Thrash or Demoralizing Roar.

Challenging Roar and Growl are taunts.
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#32 Feb 11 2011 at 10:41 AM Rating: Good
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A taunt is an ability that forces a mob to focus on you, regardless of your threat towards it. Many of them include additional threat, to make it more likely that the mob will stay on you when the taunt's duration is up.

Druids get an AoE TAUNT on a long CD, and can generate AoE Threat through Swipe (cone) and Thrash (radius-based AoE).

Both are on 6 second CDs, which is absurd. When glyphed, your Maul will do 50% damage to an extra target.

That's the extent of AoE options.

Now let's look at my DK (I'm assuming 4 mobs):

DnD>Place Diseases>Spread Diseases
Blood Boil>Death Strike
Blood Boil>Blood Boil>Blood Boil

And all the while I too am tabbing through mobs and using Rune Strikes, which hit hard and are off the GCD. I also have 2 taunts, one melee interrupt and a ranged silence. I have a talent that allows me to heal the group directly, and one that spawns worms that will burst with an AoE heal. And, as Heart Strike also hits 1 additional mob, I can use that instead of BB as mobs die. Oh, and in case I need it for some reason, I can forgo the Rune Strike and launch a Death Coil at a ranged target. I also have a long CD ability that will give me additional mitigation in the form of my Parry+Dodge as it summons a bunch of minions that will taunt the mobs and does decent damage, allowing the healer to focus solely on getting everyone back up as I can reestablish threat on the mobs (which will redirect to me when their taunts end/they die).

Problem?

[EDIT]

Correction, RS is on the GCD now.

Edited, Feb 11th 2011 2:59pm by idiggory
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#33 Feb 11 2011 at 12:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mazra wrote:
rusttle wrote:
Quote:

Only one of those skills is an AoE taunt.


You do damage, you taunt.


That's not how it works. Taunting, in the English dictionary, is defined as verbally insulting someone. A taunt, in this game, is an ability that causes mobs to change their target to you.

Swipe is neither, nor is Maul, Thrash or Demoralizing Roar.

Challenging Roar and Growl are taunts.

For another example (using a different class), if someone else pulls (contrary to plan) and the mob with the square moves before freezing trap activates, he'll likely be in the tank's AOE zone within another GCD. At that point I'm going to have to frontload a heck of a lot of damage to pull him off into the new trap without Distracting Shot, which is a taunt.

Taunts generally do little or no damage and don't (necessarily) have a permanent effect on the aggro table. What they do do is get the guy chasing you for a small window of time so that you can either have an exclusive opportunity to build threat, or (as above) do something else without other people getting in the way.
#34 Mar 22 2011 at 9:50 AM Rating: Default
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Just coming back to the game, been a long while since I played (left after Tournament dropped). From what I see here druid tanking is mostly dead except on single target boss fights? That is a little upsetting I used to love tanking when I played. Still have it specced too. =(

Im leveling as Boomy and it seems to be all right, still tinkering with the new system for eclipse. (at least its a **** ton more consistent then RNG of Wrath Eclipse). What exactly does Starsurge do and how does it fit into the rotation? Ive been using it when I get falling stars (i think thats the buff that makes it instant) and that is about it.

Is resto doing ok without the tree is it still a top raid healer? Any better at single target healing (tanks).

PVP I assume hasn't changed much boomy still a fluffy target, resto the go to easy button?

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#35 Mar 22 2011 at 9:57 AM Rating: Default
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Oh just an additional comment. Is their any old style Restokin PVP builds out there? I understand they dropped IIS so is there any reason to even go that route anymore?
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#36 Mar 22 2011 at 11:35 PM Rating: Good
If you'd like some general tips on Boomkin stuff, check the sticky. To answer your question though, usage of Starsurge depends on a few different factors. Before you get your 4 piece set bonus though, you generally want to use Starsurge on CD, unless you're close to entering an eclipse phase. Then you want to hold off and use it as your second spell into the eclipse, using either Starfire or Wrath first.
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Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
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#38 Jun 22 2011 at 4:37 AM Rating: Good
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Dirgeofyoursoul wrote:
what the **** did u say?


you shut your ***** mouth before someone does it for you
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idiggory wrote:
Drinking at home. But I could probably stand to get laid.
#39 Jun 22 2011 at 7:56 AM Rating: Good
Ghost in the Machine
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I think he's trolling.

His username tells me he isn't the flaming ****** he's pretending to be. Or perhaps it's the remnants of a fleeting hope for mankind. To bring about such waste of precious oxygen seems the ultimate sin.

People need a license to drive a car, but any two ******** can make a child.

Silly world. Smiley: oyvey
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Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
#40 Jun 22 2011 at 1:38 PM Rating: Good
I dunno, he's had some decent posts. I think it's probably more likely that he just doesn't know proper forum etiquette. And that his grasp of the English language is not so good.
____________________________
Proudmoore US server:
Popina, 90 Priest
Digits, 86 Shaman
Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
The MMO-Zam's FB group. Please message me first so I know who you are.
#42 Jun 22 2011 at 10:28 PM Rating: Good
It's okay, you didn't offend anyone. Smiley: smile Some of us posters who have been around for a while get suspicious of newbies with poor English or other issues. My main suggestion would be to try not to post in topics that haven't had a new post in over a month. That's called Necroposting, and people don't tend to like it. If you have a question related to what was discussed in the topic, just make a new topic. If you're trying to be helpful and answer someone's question, it's best not to in that particular case, because more than likely their question has already been answered by that time.
____________________________
Proudmoore US server:
Popina, 90 Priest
Digits, 86 Shaman
Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
The MMO-Zam's FB group. Please message me first so I know who you are.
#44 Jun 23 2011 at 8:28 AM Rating: Good
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내 사과드립니다. 당신의 국적을 상하 시게 하려던 건 아니어요.

Sorry if that's horrible Korean. Google Translate, y'know. Smiley: tongue
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Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
#45 Jun 23 2011 at 1:27 PM Rating: Good
Your nationality did not mean to offend you? lol
____________________________
Proudmoore US server:
Popina, 90 Priest
Digits, 86 Shaman
Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
The MMO-Zam's FB group. Please message me first so I know who you are.
#47 Jun 24 2011 at 1:31 PM Rating: Good
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Wonder Gem PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
Your nationality did not mean to offend you? lol


You ran it back through Google Translate, didn't you?
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Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
#48 Jun 24 2011 at 2:04 PM Rating: Good
Sort of? I highlighted it, right clicked, did a search and then I got a popup that asked if I wanted google to translate it to English for me and I clicked yes.
____________________________
Proudmoore US server:
Popina, 90 Priest
Digits, 86 Shaman
Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
The MMO-Zam's FB group. Please message me first so I know who you are.
#49 Jun 24 2011 at 10:46 PM Rating: Good
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7,633 posts
Interesting
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idiggory wrote:
Drinking at home. But I could probably stand to get laid.
#50 Jun 25 2011 at 8:48 AM Rating: Good
Muggle@#%^er
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19,982 posts
I too feel like +1ing.
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IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people

lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
#51 Jun 25 2011 at 2:35 PM Rating: Good
Copycat.
____________________________
Proudmoore US server:
Popina, 90 Priest
Digits, 86 Shaman
Thelesis, 85 Mage
Willowmei, 85 Druid
Necralita, 85 DK
Shrika, 72 Warlock
Jaquelle, 54 Paladin
Grakine, 32 Hunter
The MMO-Zam's FB group. Please message me first so I know who you are.
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