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SotC buff in 1.12, an Oboard threadFollow

#1 Aug 25 2006 at 6:37 PM Rating: Good
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Here is an interesting thread from the Oboards. I have no idea how big of a deal it is, but it's an interesting thread none the less.

Excerpt

Oboards wrote:
Okay, so what you all are saying is this:

Before 1.3: SotC increases speed and adds attack power. Major DPS boost.

After 1.3: SotC increases speed, then cuts hastened damage by a percentage to leave DPS unchanged. Then it adds attack power. Moderate DPS boost.

After 1.12: SotC cuts base damage and then increases speed, providing a DPS boost. Then it adds attack power, increasing DPS more. Significant DPS boost.



So in effect, SotC is doing a little more than it used to. I always noticed a DPS boost by using it, but now it will be a little higher than it used to be. Something like 30dps increase instead of 22. This is the long and short, correct?


It also seems that because of this, finally one-handed, weaker, faster weapons are superior while using this seal, while SoC prefers slow, heavy-hitting two-handers, and SoR remains somewhat indifferent, providing a more-or-less static addition of Holy DPS.


#2 Aug 26 2006 at 1:07 AM Rating: Decent
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1,515 posts
More Excerpts
Quote:
I don't think this was "unfixed". I am almost positive this is not a bug.


From my calculations what happens now is the following:

Attack power bonus increases your damage per swing.
Damage reduction (as per tooltip) decreases your damage per swing.
Haste then increases your attack speed without changing damage per swing.

We just happen to be seeing that the damage reduction (about 15%) is canceled out by the attack power bonus.


No one has really crunched the numbers to prove it. I think I'll go do that.


It wasn't buffed. In fact, it's identical to how it was before, take a look at the formulae this guy posted:
Quote:
It technically wasn't "unfixed". It was buffed. "Unfixed" would mean it was reverted back to the way it was prior to Patch 1.4. For easy reference, I derieved the old and the new formulas for Seal of the Crusader. Use as you wish.

-- Pre 1.04
(.5(Weapon Min + Weapon Max)+(Attack Power/14)(Weapon Speed))/(Weapon Speed/1.4) = DPS

-- Post 1.04
5/7(.5(Weapon Min + Weapon Max)+(Attack Power/14)(Weapon Speed))/(Weapon Speed/1.4) = DPS

-- Post 1.12
(.5(Weapon Min + Weapon Max)+(Attack Power/14)(Weapon Speed/1.4))/(Weapon Speed/1.4) = DPS

Obviously, to see your what your listed damage average would be just don't divide by the weapon speed at the end. Viola!


If you look at the second and third formulae, you see that in one case, it is multiplied by 5/7, and in the other case, the same value is divided by 1.4.
But 5/7 == 1/1.4, so that amounts to no change.


My opinion is that with the update of the haste effects, the tooltip/paperdoll display was changed a bit, but the seal itself is identical to how it was before.
#3 Aug 26 2006 at 1:59 AM Rating: Decent
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961 posts
No, it's definitely giving a much bigger dps boost than it was before. Try it in game if you haven't already.

I think the point that the last post you quoted was trying to make is that before the latest patch, the game would use the hasted weapon speed to calculate the damage increase from attack power, but now the game is using the original weapon speed, even though you're swinging 40% faster.

So for example, say you have a weapon that does 50 dps at 3.5 speed -- an average of 175 damage per swing. When you turn SotC on, it gets hasted by 40% and becomes a 2.5-speed weapon that does an average 125 damage per swing -- faster speed but lower damage, so the weapon still has the same dps.

Now here's the part that changed. Say you have 1400 AP with SotC up. 1400 AP is normally worth 100 dps. With the old SotC, it would take that 100dps and use the hasted weapon speed (2.5 seconds) to calculate the extra damage -- 250 damage per swing, giving you a total damage per swing of 375. At 2.5 seconds per swing, that's 150 dps.

But since the patch, it uses the original weapon speed of 3.5 seconds to calculate the extra damage -- 350 extra per swing, for a total of 475 damage per swing. But you're still swinging it at the hasted speed of 2.5, so now you're doing 190 dps.

It's a pretty significant boost. I have no idea if it's intentional or if it's just a side effect of the way they changed hasting/slowing effects. (I've got a pretty healthy pessimism about Blizzard giving us nice things, so I'm going to guess it's an unintended effect that'll be nerfed soon.)
#4 Aug 29 2006 at 12:56 PM Rating: Decent
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1,503 posts
am i the only one that overlooks the use of SotC? i judge it almost everytime and use SoC with my 2H for real dps since i am Retrib spec. 1H can't do enough damage from a pally no matter what seal u use. Fury Seal is better for tanking w/ 1H. i'm not knocking SotC as a valid seal, just don't understand when to use it.

btw, i have imp SotC and the Libram, but use it purely for judgement bonus
#5 Aug 29 2006 at 1:15 PM Rating: Decent
"Fury Seal"?
Anyway, the only time I use SotC is when I'm judging it (which is a lot of the time when I am using SoC), or when I am going up against a tough elite, putting on JoW or JoL then putting up SotC with my 1-hand and shield to try to get more procs out. But with the dps increase that I see now, I might use that as my main seal even over Command when I am PvEing (my dps jumps from about 105 base dps to about 166 with BoM and SotC).
#6 Aug 30 2006 at 1:21 AM Rating: Decent
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1,515 posts
I used seal of fury all the time when I was tanking... until it was removed from the game.
#7 Aug 30 2006 at 10:19 AM Rating: Decent
Yeah, I remember it, but it's been gone out of the game for a few months now. Also, I thought it was a blessing instead of a seal, but I may just be remembering things wrong, I only got the chance to use it a few times before the patch switched it around.
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