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I Bought MoPFollow

#52 Dec 02 2013 at 10:17 PM Rating: Good
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#53 Dec 02 2013 at 10:46 PM Rating: Good
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The Trinkets are always the same, yes. The ones spawned by Timeless Curio, that is.

Those are pretty rare... you got 2 of those? lol.

There's only 4: Intellect, Agility, Strength DPS, Tank. Each one's icon looks like 1 of the 4 Celestials. (Xuen for Strength/Agility, Yu'lon for Intellect, Niuzao for DPS and... I forget what Chi-Ji's is. Healer? I forget).

Shoulda warned you about that so you didn't waste any rare curios lol. Didn't come to me while I was typing all that other stuff.

Edited, Dec 2nd 2013 11:48pm by Lyrailis
#54 Dec 02 2013 at 10:50 PM Rating: Good
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Nah, it occurred to me while I was clicking that it was probably a bad idea. Smiley: lol
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#55 Dec 03 2013 at 11:45 AM Rating: Good
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I just bought a MoP too its a Shark Steam MoP and it rocks!!! Smiley: sly

Edited, Dec 3rd 2013 12:45pm by Rukkuss
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#56 Dec 03 2013 at 3:07 PM Rating: Good
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IDrownFish of the Seven Seas wrote:
The main city being gated is to ensure you see the story leading up to it. It's fairly important and colors the relationship between the Alliance/Horde and Pandaren.


Unless you did a lot of questing, the small tidbit you get from unlocking the Vale makes no sense.

Go to temple.
Fight yourself.
Go to Vale gate.
Enter.

There was some Anduin and Random Tauren dialogue in there, but it was pretty uninteresting. Something, something, recycled plot development from Wrath of the Lich King and Cataclysm, Garrosh is bad, you may enter the Vale. Congratulations, you can't afford to buy Pandaria flying license, because you ran too many dungeons while leveling.

P.S. You can go to Timeless Isle without talking to Chromie, and without buying your flying license. If you're on a class with a Jesus spell (Path of Frost, Glyph of Nightmares, etc.), you can simply ride to the island from easternmost part of Pandaria. Anyone else can pop a potion of whatchamacallit speed and swim there.
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#57 Dec 03 2013 at 3:14 PM Rating: Good
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Mazra wrote:
IDrownFish of the Seven Seas wrote:
The main city being gated is to ensure you see the story leading up to it. It's fairly important and colors the relationship between the Alliance/Horde and Pandaren.


Unless you did a lot of questing, the small tidbit you get from unlocking the Vale makes no sense.

Go to temple.
Fight yourself.
Go to Vale gate.
Enter.

There was some Anduin and Random Tauren dialogue in there, but it was pretty uninteresting. Something, something, recycled plot development from Wrath of the Lich King and Cataclysm, Garrosh is bad, you may enter the Vale. Congratulations, you can't afford to buy Pandaria flying license, because you ran too many dungeons while leveling.

P.S. You can go to Timeless Isle without talking to Chromie, and without buying your flying license. If you're on a class with a Jesus spell (Path of Frost, Glyph of Nightmares, etc.), you can simply ride to the island from easternmost part of Pandaria. Anyone else can pop a potion of whatchamacallit speed and swim there.


Or the Water Strider if you happen to be doing this on an alt.
#58 Dec 03 2013 at 4:44 PM Rating: Good
Mazra wrote:
IDrownFish of the Seven Seas wrote:
The main city being gated is to ensure you see the story leading up to it. It's fairly important and colors the relationship between the Alliance/Horde and Pandaren.


Unless you did a lot of questing, the small tidbit you get from unlocking the Vale makes no sense.


I disagree. I thought Anduin arguing for a second chance for his people was pretty important in coloring the Pandaren/Outsider relationship, especially with Taran Zhu vehemently against allowing them access.
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#59 Dec 03 2013 at 5:42 PM Rating: Good
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Okay, I thought my BBB was blue, but he isn't. And now I'm confused, because I would have sworn he was...

I have a blue Polly now, from catching it, and I replaced Miniwing with it. I don't have any blue mechanical or beast pets, though.

I do have a blue fawn - should I use it for the healing skill?
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#60 Dec 03 2013 at 5:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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It's worth a try, see if it works for you. The bleat isn't a powerful heal, but it heals the whole team. So when one of your guys gets a bit hurt swap him to the bench for a while and let the fawn fight until the benched thingy is healthy again. (Fawn has something to change it's type to elemental as well I believe, if you run into too many beasts, because they're everywhere). I liked it, it helped me bridge the heal pets CD pretty well.

Also, if I can venture one other idea, bring something with a shield to mitigate bleed damage, several pets have shell shield which will make many dots or multi-attacks do little or no damage for when come across something that like those.

Edited, Dec 3rd 2013 3:55pm by someproteinguy
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#61 Dec 03 2013 at 5:59 PM Rating: Good
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IDrownFish of the Seven Seas wrote:
Mazra wrote:
IDrownFish of the Seven Seas wrote:
The main city being gated is to ensure you see the story leading up to it. It's fairly important and colors the relationship between the Alliance/Horde and Pandaren.


Unless you did a lot of questing, the small tidbit you get from unlocking the Vale makes no sense.


I disagree. I thought Anduin arguing for a second chance for his people was pretty important in coloring the Pandaren/Outsider relationship, especially with Taran Zhu vehemently against allowing them access.


But unless you've done a lot of quests, you have nowhere to put all this information. I went there and was like "What the sh*t, a giant spectral tiger?" and then later on you meet the giant spectral bird and cow. I was just staring at the screen for a moment. Unless you've done the Pandaren starting zone or at least a lot of quests in Pandaria, it makes no sense at all to have giant animals pop into the story from out of nowhere. And I'm supposed to be amazed by these things? I fought animal gods back in Northrend. Are these guys different? Don't know, because I didn't do the million quests that came before this one.

And from all my quests in Stormwind and Pandaria as an Alliance player, Anduin, to me, reeks of daddy issues. Such an uninteresting character. He constantly gets himself in trouble to a point where I feel like I'm cheating evolution when I help him. "Gee, lots of blood over here. Might be that crazy cult that worships demons. Hey, I'll just go take a look. No, no, you don't have to babysit m-- OH GOD, HALP!"

Smiley: disappointed

Edited, Dec 4th 2013 1:06am by Mazra
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#62 Dec 03 2013 at 8:02 PM Rating: Good
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Okay, I thought my BBB was blue, but he isn't. And now I'm confused, because I would have sworn he was...

I have a blue Polly now, from catching it, and I replaced Miniwing with it. I don't have any blue mechanical or beast pets, though.

I do have a blue fawn - should I use it for the healing skill?

Others my disagree, but I don't find the fawn really that great. I'd rather have more offensive power and try to take out the opposition quickly, than prolong a fight with heals. Heals can be important against trainers, but I don't find them as important against wild pets.

Just my opinion, but there you go. :-)

I'm trying to remember, but I think I used a snake as one of my earliest Beast pets. The dive ability is a nice heavy hit ability.
#63 Dec 03 2013 at 8:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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A few excellent (but easy to get) pets I've found:

Pterrodax Hatchling: Gained from Archaeology, it is an Avian that has a powerful heal and a 1-round invincibility. You can choose between a multi-hit and a "hit lowers defense" move for its first slot.

Onyxian Whelpling: If you were around during Wrath of the Lich King, you probably got an Onyxian Whelpling on one of the WoW Anniversary. If not, you can tame them near Onyxia's Lair, though be warned: Finding a Blue one is hard and time-consuming. This pet, like many drake pets, has a Fire Breath, a Self-Heal (that heals more depending on how much damage you took the past round) and also a Lift-Off attack (the same one the Pterrodax has).

Darkmoon Tonk: Wanna kill a beast? This thing will absolutely destroy it, and it could be yours for a measly 40 DMF Tokens! Seriously, this thing is ridiculously powerful. You get a powerful attack that might stun your target for one round, a "chargeup" move that is guaranteed to one-shot a beast unless it is Purple-quality (and even then, there goes 75% of its health), and the basic attack isn't too shabby either, AND it has ridiculously high HP.

Water Waveling: Found in Zul'drak, this thing can hit Mechanical Pets like a truck.

Sea Pony: Use this pet to "solo" the Pet Tamer in Valley of the Four Winds. All you have to do is keep using Rain Weather and the AoE Wave attack to kill its back-row pets while the front-row one keeps healing itself.
#64 Dec 03 2013 at 9:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Fawn is the suck. He looks great on paper but his heal is weak weak weak.

Emperor Crab is a nice high level pet that's easy to catch rares of in Pandaria. If you don't have a pet high enough level to tame one, there are plenty of lower level crabs around. Snails and moths are also wild pets that are very common and easy to catch rares of, and are handy to have.

For mechs, if you have DMF tickets the tonk and the zep are both great. If you don't have those, there are a couple of wild mechs you can catch in Winterspring - chicken and squirrel - and the tiny harvester in Westfall, which has the advantage of being low level if you haven't got high level pets to trap with. Of the three I'd say the harvester is the handiest. None of them are spectacular, but even an average mechanical is a really useful thing to have. At some point you'll start getting battle stones (from dailies) and then you can upgrade the good mechs. :)

If you've got the patience to look for one in Sholazar Basin, a rare Emerald Proto Whelp will get you far. Before I had any kind of range of 25's he was my staple pet for pretty much every team vs. every tamer.

Edit: and I know he's gone out of fashion, but for PVE battling against critters the Flayer Youngling (found in Terokkar Forest) is still my go-to guy.

Edited, Dec 3rd 2013 10:46pm by teacake
#65 Dec 03 2013 at 9:46 PM Rating: Good
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teacake wrote:
Fawn is the suck. He looks great on paper but his heal is weak weak weak.

Emperor Crab is a nice high level pet that's easy to catch rares of in Pandaria. If you don't have a pet high enough level to tame one, there are plenty of lower level crabs around. Snails and moths are also wild pets that are very common and easy to catch rares of, and are handy to have.

For mechs, if you have DMF tickets the tonk and the zep are both great. If you don't have those, there are a couple of wild mechs you can catch in Winterspring - chicken and squirrel - and the tiny harvester in Westfall, which has the advantage of being low level if you haven't got high level pets to trap with. Of the three I'd say the harvester is the handiest. None of them are spectacular, but even an average mechanical is a really useful thing to have. At some point you'll start getting battle stones (from dailies) and then you can upgrade the good mechs. :)

If you've got the patience to look for one in Sholazar Basin, a rare Emerald Proto Whelp will get you far. Before I had any kind of range of 25's he was my staple pet for pretty much every team vs. every tamer.


That Squirrel has an awesome +Defense ability, though.

He is pretty handy to have, along with the Tonk. In fact, the only team I've found yet that I could actually beat that stupid Oondasta pet on the Timeless Isle with, is partly due to that Squirrel and the fact he has, IIRC, a Humanoid Attack even though he's mechanical and has that awesome +Defense move (which saves his life against that stupid pet's "I keeel you now!" ability that you can't seem to avoid).

I only wish the squirrel had better offense, but meh. He's supposed to be a tank, you're supposed to use him to soak the huge-damage hits.
#66 Dec 03 2013 at 10:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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That is handy to know about the Timeless Isle - I haven't done any of that yet because I've been trying to avoid getting obsessive about pet battling since I resubbed. Smiley: nod These days I just do the PVP weekly and that's it. I looked up the Oondasta thing in Wowhead though, and a beast with magic attacks should be able to be taken by most mechanical teams, no? I might try the same thing I do with the fabled beasts that are beast family: Mechanical Yeti, Call Lightning, Ion Cannon --> Darkmoon Tonk, Ion Cannon --> (if not dead yet) Menagerie Custodian, Ion Cannon. None of them have the kind of defensive moves you're talking about but they only need to live 2 rounds at most, which Mechs almost always will due to the racial. Makes for quick fights.
#67 Dec 03 2013 at 10:13 PM Rating: Good
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teacake wrote:
That is handy to know about the Timeless Isle - I haven't done any of that yet because I've been trying to avoid getting obsessive about pet battling since I resubbed. Smiley: nod These days I just do the PVP weekly and that's it. I looked up the Oondasta thing in Wowhead though, and a beast with magic attacks should be able to be taken by most mechanical teams, no? I might try the same thing I do with the fabled beasts that are beast family: Mechanical Yeti, Call Lightning, Ion Cannon --> Darkmoon Tonk, Ion Cannon --> (if not dead yet) Menagerie Custodian, Ion Cannon. None of them have the kind of defensive moves you're talking about but they only need to live 2 rounds at most, which Mechs almost always will due to the racial. Makes for quick fights.


You can try that, dunno how good it will work. lol.

That thing really does hit hard and has a LOT of HP being an Orange-quality pet.

But yeah, I'm not saying you must have defensive abilities, its just what I had available to me at the time. I found it helpful.
#68 Dec 04 2013 at 12:58 PM Rating: Good
Great tips in here guys, thanks! I haven't been playing a lot recently, but that should change in a couple days or so.
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#69 Dec 04 2013 at 1:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Okay, I thought my BBB was blue, but he isn't. And now I'm confused, because I would have sworn he was...

One more thing confusing this is that the "pet battle quality" of a pet is not connected to the "item quality" of the item you learn that pet from.
I think that there are some pets that are "epic" in loot tables but "common" in combat.
#70 Dec 04 2013 at 1:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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Lyrailis wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Is this no flying thing... permanent?


On Timeless and Thunder Isles, yes unfortunately.

The Timeless Isle is designed for land travel; there's gimmicks to get to unreachable places (birds, etc). Its just like Molten Front, Tol Barad, etc like they did before.

From the sound of things, I'd expect that from now on: (a) all new zones that are "current" content will be no-fly zones, (b) "Operation Shieldwall/Dominance Offensive" type of content that gets retconned into an existing zone will have their fair share of AA emplacements.
They want everyone to see all the content the first time, and no cheesing set-piece encounters by using three-dimensional thinking (stealth is bad enough to design around).
#71 Dec 04 2013 at 1:49 PM Rating: Good
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I didn't mind lack of flight while leveling at all. Made perfect sense and gave me an appropriate experience.

But losing flight when I have it for the rest of my content is far less forgivable. It gives me a standard for comparison and keeps me from forgetting about the lost capability.
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#72 Dec 04 2013 at 5:31 PM Rating: Good
Okay, that was annoying. I got all the Timeless Isle chests that aren't difficult, and at least a third of the tokens I got were for either mail, leather or plate. I also got a fair amount of duplicates, which I sent off to my mage.

Also, I read a guide on how to get to the last four, and it said something about throwing something at an albatross and fighting it to get on top of it. Throw what? I have nothing to throw at the stupid birds. I could mail a leather ball to my priest from my druid, but that's the only thing I can think of. Would that work?
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#73 Dec 04 2013 at 6:32 PM Rating: Good
Just attack an albatross that isn't already carrying someone, and it will pick you up in its mouth and carry you around. Kill it to drop down (take into account the amount of time it takes to kill the **** thing so that you don't miss where you are trying to go).

They spawn at about the north side of the lake.
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#74 Dec 04 2013 at 6:56 PM Rating: Good
I tried casting SWP on it, and it said "invalid target."
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#75 Dec 04 2013 at 7:29 PM Rating: Good
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
I tried casting SWP on it, and it said "invalid target."

That's odd. My DK abilities worked just fine.

Did you try something that wasn't instant?
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#76 Dec 04 2013 at 7:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
I tried casting SWP on it, and it said "invalid target."


It was probably already carrying someone.

Try the next one.

They made it that way so people can't grief (this was a huge thing when the Isle first came out, people killing other peoples' birds).
#77 Dec 05 2013 at 3:11 AM Rating: Good
Yeah, I got it to work tonight. Got all my chests except the one that drops the big super token. Also did that quest chain that gets you the 502 boots, which I was in desperate need of an upgrade. Now I'm ilvl 497, woo hoo!
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#78 Dec 05 2013 at 6:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
Yeah, I got it to work tonight. Got all my chests except the one that drops the big super token. Also did that quest chain that gets you the 502 boots, which I was in desperate need of an upgrade. Now I'm ilvl 497, woo hoo!


The Blazing Chest is very much a suicide run.

Just unequip your gear, and make a run for it. Die, move away from the Spirit Healer ASAP before it resses you (they really need to give us a way to CHOOSE whether or not we want to be ressed at the SH) and corpse run. Keep dragging your corpse to the chest. If you rez BEHIND The chest up against the wall, you can get the chest without aggroing the two elementals near the chest. Then once you get the chest, die, get ressed by the SH (which is near the waterfalls), then you just make your way down the cliff (or jump off and die intentionally with gear still unequipped).

EDIT: Start the suicide run by dropping off the bird in the red pond. Jump over the Waterfall into the pond below it (The small one right next to the Sanctuary itself). Walk along the southern edge of the Sanctuary all the way to the west end of it. There's a doorway on the very western end of the "half-circle" part of the building, which leads into a large round room with the chest way over by the wall.

This area is full of mobs that will kill you in 2 seconds if you get hit by their attacks (their normal melee attacks hurt a plenty too).

Edited, Dec 5th 2013 7:25am by Lyrailis
#79 Dec 06 2013 at 12:15 AM Rating: Good
I was able to get in once, and I got kicked out for not having my legendary cloak yet.
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#80 Dec 06 2013 at 6:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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If we're still talking about the Blazing Chest, Pigtails, I think you're going to the wrong area. This one isn't actually in the same area as Oreos, the bullish cookie god, it's around the corner. It can be done solo, just as Lyr wrote.
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#81 Dec 06 2013 at 10:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
I was able to get in once, and I got kicked out for not having my legendary cloak yet.


Rhodekylle wrote:
If we're still talking about the Blazing Chest, Pigtails, I think you're going to the wrong area. This one isn't actually in the same area as Oreos, the bullish cookie god, it's around the corner. It can be done solo, just as Lyr wrote.


You have to go aaaaaaallllllllllll the way to the "circle" area in the very western end of the compound, by going along its southern side. Don't go in the middle, the doorway right next to the broken bridge, that is indeed Ordos's area.

Of course this makes you aggro more mobs and die more, but meh. Going naked still works quite well. But then the more you die, the more chances your spirit will spawn at the SH when it has 1-3 seconds before its next rez pulse. *sigh*

They really need to make that a choice.
#82 Dec 06 2013 at 10:34 AM Rating: Good
Ah okay. I must have been going the wrong way to get to it then. You still need to take a bird to get to it though, right?
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#83 Dec 06 2013 at 10:36 AM Rating: Excellent
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
Ah okay. I must have been going the wrong way to get to it then. You still need to take a bird to get to it though, right?


Yeah, you gotta drop off in the red pond, then jump the waterfall into the other pond, same as usual. Just continue going west after the broken bridge.
#84 Dec 06 2013 at 10:46 PM Rating: Excellent
Okay, I got it! Thanks Lyr. Took me a little while because I tried to go inside and got ejected again, but then I remembered you said to go around.
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#85 Dec 07 2013 at 1:25 PM Rating: Good
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Farm once you are done the story arc and are exalted is mainly about growing mats for whichever Profession you are. I farm herbs and that has kept my main and alt full on flasks the entire expac without ever once having to go flying around for herbs. It's a nice quick thing to check in on daily. I am using it right now to farm what I need for my Sky Golem.

Pacing on questing compared to when expac first released is meh. I just leveled my Priest to 90 and I wasn't close to finishing any zones. My paladin at launched finished Jade Forest, Valley of the Four Winds, Kun-Lai and I was most of the way done Townlong went I cherry picked quests in Dread Wastes to get 90. Story wise the pacing of the zones and the daily quest story arcs fit well and tie off rather nicely at the end. This is an Alliance vs Horde expac with the Pandaren being caught in the middle. It also shows insights of the Horde and Alliance doing soul searching about what they are along the way.

5 mans are a joke compared to Cata. Merely a step to gearing. Heroic Scenarios have some mechanics that will kill you if you are a goober. Nothing super elite though, just basic bad.com checks. The raiding is fairly decent this expansion. Once you have geared up a little get in LFR, goto Timeless island and start working through the reps. As for DK's my brother was of the same exact opinion as you, however somewhere along the way he fell back in love with his DK and now I can't get him to stop playing it and get on his druid.

Honestly this expac is a very solid outing. Theme~atically very different than WotLK but in terms of volume of content and variety of content a lot better than Wrath.


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#86 Dec 07 2013 at 2:11 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:

Honestly this expac is a very solid outing. Theme~atically very different than WotLK but in terms of volume of content and variety of content a lot better than Wrath.


I can't agree at all.

To be completely fair, I'm coming in at the last patch. But I already have no desire to log in, and I JUST came back. Everything feels pointless and empty. The fights are just so boring and gimmicky to me - nothing really feels like it's all that much about performance, And I've never been more bored with gearing, because the actual items are never interesting. Between how dumbed down stats are and reforging, getting a new item feels super empty to me. Up my ilvl, and it's an upgrade. And the returns for items at the same ilvl are essentially all sidegrades or extremely minor up/down-grades.

I'm bored with the dungeons, because every fight just feels like a major gimmick. It never feels like it's about my performance as a player, or even my coordination with my team. I'm just not sure why even bother with multiplayer content if there's not going to be anything social about it, much of a challenge at all, or in any way bring in team play.

The absurd stat inflation across content that's become commonplace since mid-Wrath certainly doesn't help.

The farm isn't nearly as interesting as I thought it would be.

I'm honestly willing to say that the only things I would praise about this expac are the art and pet battles. And there's loads of room for improvement in the latter, it's just that it's distinctly new for the game.

Story stuff (and why I think that the writing is really bad):
I'm honestly completely fine putting MoP second-to-last with regards to storytelling and general plot int he entire series, with only Cata doing worse.

In some ways, it has the same severe flaw as Cata - it absolutely butchers the proper ebb and flow of conflict and resolution to keep someone moving through the story and caring. They have so many plot threads in the air, they're barely developing, and I'm halfway through the content. And I'm just not interested. And I'm about as heavily predisposed to be interested as you could possibly get.

But I've done three zones and learned so, so little about Pandaren culture besides "They like food and booze." There's the Sha, but the quest line literally just goes "Hey, don't think about this for the next two zones. Kthxbye" and dumps you in Valley of the Four Winds. Are you kidding? And then the Valley fails to do nothing about Pandaren culture, because it's entirely about you saving Pandaren farmers, and leaves so little ingenuity up to the locals (Thanks, Li and Chen for being the only Pandaren who come up with ideas).

The human starting zones teach you a lot about human culture (or they did - dunno now). This zone taught me little besides pointing out that Hozen and those rodent things really suck.

Then we meet those insect things, and they introduce ANOTHER antagonist without developing it at all. You go south, and they introduce the Mogu, and you learn so little about them, their relationship with the Pandaren, or why you should care. And to make it even less interesting, they aren't even suggested as a primary antagonist, like the insect guys and the Sha are.

Capping all that off is the fact that the core theme of the expac - Horde/Alliance/Pandaren - is completely dropped from the plot from the very start of Jade Forest through the end of Valley, at least. That's 2.5 zones to help you completely forget it was a thing you were supposed to care about.

I'm willing to grant it's possible they handled the last 2-3 zones really well, and that the story moves at an appropriate pace, with appropriate conflict/resolution spikes. But if you've completely failed to get me interested in your story, at all, after 3 zones, then I'm not giving you any points for that.


I guess the TL;DR: is that I unsubbed already. I can't agree with the consensus that this was a good expac. I can agree that there are good things here - like making flexible raid modes, making the challenging raids the exception, not the norm (so that people can experience the content, and hardcore players still get to have a real challenge/return for it). Pet battling and alternate content is a big asset. The farm could have been great, if it wasn't just a series of annoying daily quests. There were plenty of really good plot lines here that were just utterly mishandled and the assets were completely underutilized.

Side note: I hate the tavern music with a passion...
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#87 Dec 07 2013 at 4:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Sorry to see you aren't having fun with it.

Personally, I am loving the questing and the story lines. I don't really have a high bar, though, and I am coming back after 4/5 years (pre wotlk) so all the changes since then are still new to me.
#88 Dec 07 2013 at 7:17 PM Rating: Good
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Well personal taste is what it is and it's a shame to see you aren't enjoying it.

In terms of content though, Raiding is top notch, I haven't bothered with PvP at all this expac, heroic scenarios were a good addition, the reputation through dailies was too much. Timeless Isle, Isle of the Thunderking all had a lot going on. Lots of small stuff like Brawlers guild, pet battles, farms, the new proving grounds etc have kept me busy.

Wrath and Cata I spent most of my time in game in a main city. Now I usually have something to do.
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#89 Dec 07 2013 at 10:13 PM Rating: Good
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bodhisattva wrote:
Well personal taste is what it is and it's a shame to see you aren't enjoying it.

In terms of content though, Raiding is top notch, I haven't bothered with PvP at all this expac, heroic scenarios were a good addition, the reputation through dailies was too much. Timeless Isle, Isle of the Thunderking all had a lot going on. Lots of small stuff like Brawlers guild, pet battles, farms, the new proving grounds etc have kept me busy.

Wrath and Cata I spent most of my time in game in a main city. Now I usually have something to do.


^^
This.

Back in Cataclysm, the ONLY thing I could come up with to do was leveling new characters. Couldn't do Heroics, they were too hard and everybody in the randoms failed (didn't have a guild either).

Too few dailies meant not having anything to do on that front either.

Crafting sucked, and there was very little that could be made so that sucked too.

At least now there's LFR, the Heroics are do-able and smooth, there's Scenarios if I wanna show off (I meet a lot of peeps wearing blues in those, lol), Pet Battles, etc.
#90 Dec 08 2013 at 8:09 AM Rating: Good
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Did not give two sh*ts about the story. It just didn't "click"... I felt like I was being pulled through one giant side-quest. The Asian symbolism and philosophy was cute, but building an entire expansion (and therefore continent) on it... too much.

Class changes were mostly underwhelming. I liked the Warlock changes, but they broke my Druid, and I had nine years invested in that character, so I guess it's still bad. Did not like the changes to PvP. PvP gear no longer impacts performance (except for hit/expertise caps), which means you can PvE in PvP gear, but you can't PvP in PvE gear. A fresh level 90 in blue, craftable PvP gear will shred me in seconds. Kinda feels like Vanilla in that regard, except everyone gets to gank raiders now.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 3:10pm by Mazra
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#91 Dec 08 2013 at 8:48 AM Rating: Good
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Mazra wrote:
Did not give two sh*ts about the story. It just didn't "click"... I felt like I was being pulled through one giant side-quest. The Asian symbolism and philosophy was cute, but building an entire expansion (and therefore continent) on it... too much.

Class changes were mostly underwhelming. I liked the Warlock changes, but they broke my Druid, and I had nine years invested in that character, so I guess it's still bad. Did not like the changes to PvP. PvP gear no longer impacts performance (except for hit/expertise caps), which means you can PvE in PvP gear, but you can't PvP in PvE gear. A fresh level 90 in blue, craftable PvP gear will shred me in seconds. Kinda feels like Vanilla in that regard, except everyone gets to gank raiders now.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 3:10pm by Mazra


Wha?

From all the complaints on the boards, it sounds like people wearing PvE purples (at least in the open world) had the advantage because they changed how Resilience worked?

When's the last time you tried PvP?

Or did they change that back in 5.4? lol. They keep going one way, then the other way.....

There's no **** way they're going to make PvP <> PvE... they're going to have to either just accept that PvP is utterly broken and will never be balanced or fair, or make both gearsets equal to each other and just accept that people can raid and get gear for PvP.... why not? People can AFK and dork around in Battlegrounds and buy Honor Gear. Is there some kind of difference there? Oh, right, you can't really AFK raids very well. At least not anything above LFR.

IMO: Make PvE gear the same as Honor-bought PvP gear of LFR-tier item level, and downgrade Normal+ Raid gear while in Battlegrounds to even the playing field. Conquest Gear can remain the same level as Normal/Heroic Raid Gear or something. That way, if you AFK in battleground or AFK in LFR.... you get about the same kind of gear anyways.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 9:50am by Lyrailis
#92 Dec 08 2013 at 8:50 AM Rating: Good
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I felt like I was being pulled through one giant side-quest


That's actually a good way to put it, and is how I felt as well. None of the quest lines were given enough oomph to feel really important, and they were juggled enough that it always felt like doing side quests.
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#93 Dec 08 2013 at 8:56 AM Rating: Good
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Quote:
I felt like I was being pulled through one giant side-quest


That's actually a good way to put it, and is how I felt as well. None of the quest lines were given enough oomph to feel really important, and they were juggled enough that it always felt like doing side quests.


Sometimes that can be a good changeup.

I mean, during Wrath it was all Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Vrykul Vrykul Arthas Vrykul Malygos Arthas Malygos Vrykul and it got a little old after awhile (hence why I took most of my characters through Sholazar but yet skipped large pieces of the rest of Northrend on my alts).

Then Cataclysm and it was all Deathwing Deathwing Deathwing Deathwing Cult Cult Cult Cult Cult Cult Cult Deathwing Cult Deathwing Cult Deathwing Cult.

THAT got old real fast. There weren't even any sort of diversions or anything, except for the Harrison Jones and the Temple of Uldum thing... which got old fast too. If I wanted to watch an Indie Jones movie, I'd watch an Indie Jones movie, TBH. That's why when I took Alts through Uldum, I did the Ramkahen portion and didn't touch Jones' portion much at all.

Now, in Pandaria... we have some HvA (but yet not too much of it: after 9 years of it, it is getting old too), some Sha, some random side-quest things happening, their 4 gods worship, the Mantid, the Yaungol, and... bleck. The only thing I really did not like about MoP was MORE F---ING TROLLS.

PLEASE tell me we killed off the last of the non-darkspear trolls. Please.

They better not pull some bulls--- out of their *** to make an excuse for trolls to appear in WoD... I will be fairly *******

EDIT: The more I think about it, the more I feel like they made every excuse they can to put trolls in MoP, because... trolls. They seem like they are forced to put them in every expansion, no matter how ridiculous their inclusion feels. In Cataclysm, it was kinda "meh".... a Tribe that was once on your side has suddenly turned evil and now you gotta re-do two dungeons all over again! Oi. Okay fine.

Then in MoP... I was questing through Kun-lai for the first time, you go down into the Emperor's Tomb (I hadn't been reading much about the lore online to avoid spoilers), and suddenly... it is "OMG THE ZANDALARI ARE HERE! The Trolls have been friends with the Mogu for thousands of years!" and my reaction was: "Are you f---ing KIDDING ME?" because this sounded like the most lame excuse ever to include Trolls in an expansion to date. If the Trolls and Mogu were friends for thousands of years, why didn't the trolls at any point earlier in the game ever mention the Pandaren or the Mogu whatsoever? They didn't, because that part of the lore hadn't been invented until MoP and it just seems like a lame excuse to include them.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 10:03am by Lyrailis
#94 Dec 08 2013 at 9:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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Mazra wrote:
PvP gear no longer impacts performance (except for hit/expertise caps), which means you can PvE in PvP gear, but you can't PvP in PvE gear. A fresh level 90 in blue, craftable PvP gear will shred me in seconds. Kinda feels like Vanilla in that regard, except everyone gets to gank raiders now.


PvE in PvP gear is not really an option. The way lower itemlevel means you can only do outdated content. Also, at least in world PvP you are extremely powerful when wearing current PvE equip since you have ~40 itemlevels more than anyone in PvP gear (those caps at 522 I think).

If you enter a BG in PvE gear, that's a whole different story though. Thanks to the downscaling I lose around 200k HP and my spellpower/haste/etc go down as well.
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#95 Dec 08 2013 at 10:18 AM Rating: Good
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Sometimes that can be a good changeup.


No. It can't. This is an entire expansion we are talking about, not a patch. The entire expansion should not feel like a series of side quests. That's just really, really bad writing.

I'm not going to bother with Cata, because Cata also had terrible writing.

But both BC and Wrath were very well done. I think you've completely forgotten what Wrath was like, because it was DEFINITELY not all Arthas, all the time.

Yeah, your war on the Lich King was the central plot of the expansion, and it was the context by which you came to Northrend. But Ulduar and the Blue Dragonflight were both major plot elements. Plus the Vrykul. And they were plot elements that, along with the Scourge, were explored throughout the expansion.

Did the Scourge get most of the screen time? Of course it did. You were invading a continent they controlled - your conflicts with them SHOULD be the majority of your story.

But it's just not true, at all, that it was all Arthas, all the time.

Stuff on the various plot lines and how they're unveiled and interacted with from Zone 1 to endgame:
You arrive in Borean, and the first thing you do is deal with some Scourge attacking your base. Awesome - that's why you just boarded a boat to Northrend, to kick Scourge ***. But as you progress through the zone, you also get introduced to the Blue Dragonflight conflict. Later on in the zone, they start seeding the Ulduar/titans stuff, with the curse of flesh stuff. You also meet the Walrus people (Kalu'ak?) and have to help save them from Vrykul invaders.

That is one zone that, A. introduces all the major plot threads of the expansion but B. portions them out. Probably 50% of your quests are Scourge-specific or -adjecent. The rest are related to the other plot elements.

After that you go to Dragonblight, where you deal with Scourge, Dragons, Horde/Alliance tensions, and the walrus people again.

Yes, Scourge remains a real present threat, and that story progresses, but they also progress the other plot lines.

And they use each plot line to support and progress the others. Like when you get to learn about the origin of the human race from the Vrykul while also learning more about Arthas' transition into the role of the Lich King, when you're in Howling Fjord.

The Howling Fjord to Grizzly Hills is more Alliance/Horde and Vrykul and shaggy Tauren, with a side of Scourge, than the Western side of the continent. But it does the same thing - it explores the Scourge through the lens of the Vrykul. So you get a dynamic plot structure.

Then your two end-game zones are Icecrown and Stormpeaks, primarily, which let you further the expansion's main plotline AND explore the entire world plot (yay worldbuilding!) of the continent itself, AND learn more about the Titans, the Dwarfs, meet the giants, deal with the Old Gods, etc.

And let's not forget that we have Scarlet Onslaught thrown in there. And plenty else. Like Trolls. (Smiley: lol)

I mean, of the Wrath raids, only two were actually dealing with the Scourge. I guess 3 if you count the Tournament... but c'mon.


But what the expansion did was unify the plot threads. It made nothing feel like a serious outlier - everything was a part of the world, and you were IN the world.

Stuff on why MoP doesn't do that at all:
MoP has completely missed the mark there. If I wasn't working from a position of this being last patch and I know where things were going, none of these plot lines would make any sense. They aren't being linked together at all, and they aren't really selling themselves on their own value, either. Big Sha-infested areas crop up for no reason at all (seriously - from my perspective in the story they just feel like RIFT's rifts). I've encounted only a handful of Horde. The Pandaren just farm. Mogu may or may not be up to something and it may or may not be problematic. The insects broke the wall, but they don't really want to invade, and it's unclear if that was just Sha influence or if they were trying to escape something.

Maybe these all come together in the end. But it's TERRIBLE writing if your plot threads aren't reinforcing one another to make the player want more. Right now, it's a "pick and choose" scenario, which is the absolute worst thing you can do to drive world building, plot development, or immersion.

So, yeah, I disagree.

I absolutely agree that side quests are important. Like I said earlier, the actual ASSETS here are quality. There's so much they COULD have done with them. What I'm saying is that they failed miserably at actually using them.

Like, look at it this way.

You arrive in Jade Forest and you've been meandering your way to the tower battle. It's not perfect, but whatever - you're there. You have this Hozen vs. Fish people plot, this militarization plot, the Pandaren hesitation, some Celestial guardian that just lost its statue thing, and the Sha.


So, instead of just going your separate ways for two freaking zones...

Admiral Taylor and the Horde dude get possessed by Sha, and return to their factions as leaders (and you obviously have no proof of anything that happened there). That drives the Horde vs. Alliance thread. While you're helping Farmers in the Valley, you also need to deal with some skirmishes between their factions.

Celestials plot line? You have a Jade Serpent Order. Have them rushing out to help protect and warn their other Pandaren. Now SOME of those help the farmers quests can be recast as "Holy crap these crazed animals are already bad - get my stuff back and help me build barricades in case the Sha come!"

Then you actually have the Jade Serpent Order flesh out more of what is causing the Sha energy to break out across Pandaria, rather than just at the tower. THEY send you to the bird celestial guy, and you get to learn more about the role of Celestials in Pandaren society (not just "Save him! even though you know nothing of why he's important).


Etc.

You don't just freaking press pause on the plot then have you jump through assorted plot lines that don't link into each other in any meaningful way.


I guess the way I want to put it is that these plot lines are like you're playing Skyrim, where they can't know what kind of progress you'd make on other quest lines, so EVERYTHING is disconnected. You might have ended the Civil War, killed the emperor, and stopped Alduin, but the Mage tower quest line references none of that in any way.

And we accept that, because it's done to give you the freedom of choice in your content.

This is a completely directed and controlled story experience not designed to be skipped (literally, because you can't even access endgame until you progress it far enough). For me, it's inexcusable for that experience to not be working with itself.
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#96 Dec 08 2013 at 10:35 AM Rating: Good
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Also depends on which order you do the zones in too.

Nobody is forcing you to do Valley of the Four Winds and Krasarang first after Jade Forest.

Yes, Yu'lon drops you off in Vot4W, but personally when I arrived at the Valley, I did a few quests for the farmers until I stumbled upon Grassy Cline (if you don't stumble upon it, a grummle in Halfhill sends you there soon enough AND there's a giant "!" on your map).

If you go up the Veiled Stair.... you run into Admiral Taylor / Bloodhilt (I think that's his name) and it continues from Jade Forest -- these two are wounded after having fled the battle in Jade Forest.

They are running away from the Sha.......and run smack into the Yaungol who are attacking the Pandaren. Taylor/Bloodhilt are without many troops (only their special agents remain) and they need more supplies and troops immediately!

They conscript the local Pandaren and begin training them in camp immediately when they learn about the Temple of the White Tiger and how the Pandaren are trying to convince Xuen to open the gates to let everybody into the Vale to get away from the Yaungol that are rampaging across Kun-lai.

You do the stuff at the White Tiger Temple and then follow the refugees into the Vale where they find the Shrines and settle down. Then, in the Shrines, the Pandaren there tell you go out and help all you can -- they send you to the Shado-pan out in Kun-lai (which kicks off the whole Sha/Mantid in the North and leads into.....ugh.....the trolls).

The stuff in Krasarang/Valley?

That's actually a continuation of the story that began in Tian Monastery -- those young monks you meet in Tian are travelling Pandaria, using their newly-minted skills. That's why those 4 questgivers send you to random places in the Valley and Krasarang, and both zones come together at Stoneplow to kick Mantid ***.

Now, Granted, a lot of people seem to miss the fact that there are two very separate story paths through Pandaria. True. But they are there and they do make sense. The Battle at the Statue in Jade Forest goes into North into Kun-lai, while Tian Monastery goes South into Valley/Krasarang. Both of these end up in Dread Wastes. If you did everything right, Dread Wastes is your final destination in your questing path -- after it, comes the Mogu invade the Vale and then the Scouts arrive in Krasarang and then the Shado-Pan and your allies invade the Isle of Thunder.

EDIT: Townlong Steppes is a continuation of the Shado-Pan and Yaungol: Why are the Yaungol suddenly attacking the Pandaren after years of them happily living in Townlong Steppes? Well, it is because the Mantid who have the Sha, are invading the Yaungol and displacing them into Kun-lai Summit.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 11:40am by Lyrailis
#97 Dec 08 2013 at 10:51 AM Rating: Good
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Now, I'm going to start by pointing out that all you've suggested is that there exists an alternate, less-terrible story path. That's not really a stellar accomplishment.

And if you have to stumble into it, then it's not something they're getting any credit for from me. Yeah, I got that quest. But I had a bunch of quests in my pack for the current zone I was in, which was level appropriate. And those quests naturally led me to the next zone.

A breadcrumb quest is only valuable when you need to follow the breadcrumbs. If they wanted to ACTUALLY create a fork in the road, then I should have had a quest that established that fork. Find myself at that pass and have to choose whether or not I want to follow Chen or Lo, or whatever. Not permanently, but make it clear that the story is forking and I'll be following one path or the other.

But that still doesn't change the fact that he Krasarang/Valley plot lines were just bad. Simply not good. There's nothing wrong with the individual pieces of it - they were all fine. The problem is with the construction of the whole.

Let me put it this way; say you were writing a book series and each zone was its own book. Howling Fjord could be a good read. Valley and Krasarang wouldn't be.

And my point as a whole remains the same. Under no circumstances should finishing the first three zones of an expansion leave you in a place where you feel like you've failed to find any real plot.

I'm SURE the plot picks up right at that point, in the next zone (after you take that boat down stream). Thing is, I just don't care. I did well over a hundred quests that were so empty of real substance that the promise of amazing substance around the corner wouldn't make up for it (and I don't really trust that it's going to be amazing).

It's the equivalent of having to read 200 pages into a book before it finally starts to get decent. That's ridiculous. And we aren't talking about a 1500 page book, here. We're talking about one that's 350-450 pages. By the time I hit the halfway point, I should be really invested in the story. Not forcing myself to chug along in the hopes something, some time, will matter.
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#98 Dec 08 2013 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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Lyrailis wrote:
From all the complaints on the boards, it sounds like people wearing PvE purples (at least in the open world) had the advantage because they changed how Resilience worked?


I guess the lack of PvP Power is balanced out by the amount of raw damage you can push out with end-game PvE gear. While questing on the Timeless Isle, I got torn up by people in blue PvP gear constantly, though. I could not crack the nut that was 72% base mitigation (+ additional mitigation) with my 0% additional PvP damage.
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#99 Dec 08 2013 at 4:24 PM Rating: Excellent
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Lyrailis wrote:

I mean, during Wrath it was all Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Arthas Vrykul Vrykul Arthas Vrykul Malygos Arthas Malygos Vrykul


You are a phylumist for revising Wrath history to exclude Anub'Arak. >8< spider pride
#100 Dec 08 2013 at 6:56 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
It's the equivalent of having to read 200 pages into a book before it finally starts to get decent. That's ridiculous. And we aren't talking about a 1500 page book, here. We're talking about one that's 350-450 pages. By the time I hit the halfway point, I should be really invested in the story. Not forcing myself to chug along in the hopes something, some time, will matter.


The problem with this, is that Veiled Stair is nowhere near halfway into MoP.

You did Jade Forest, and some of Krasarang, and some of Valley of the Four Winds.

You didn't touch Kun-Lai Summit (which itself is HUGE!), Townlong Steppes (this is also pretty large) and Dread Wastes (not as big as the other two, because it is a main daily hub).

So... recap...

You did (I assume?) all of Jade Forest.
You did, what, about Half of Valley and Krasarang?
You did none of Kun-lai
You did none of Townlong Steppes
You did none of Dread Wastes
You did none of the Vale
You did none of the Landfall questline.
You did none of the Thunder Isle questline.

Am I right? If any of these assumptions are wrong, please correct me -- I'm trying to piece together what you did from what you've said in this thread.

You didn't read "halfway" into the book, you stopped about a fourth of the way through the book. You are taking about "200 pages in a 500 page book".... but the book really isn't 500 pages, it is actually 800-1000.

I still have to say I don't think you're giving them enough credit. Blizzard heard overwhelming complaints from Cataclysm that the zones were too linear (they were). But yet, Blizzard liked Linear zones because it was easier to tell a story that way, rather than a million short stories loosely connected, or allow the player to play the story at any random order (which can be confusing).

So what they decided to do, instead, was create 4 main questlines:

1). HvA, which is started the moment you arrive in Jade Forest and continues up through the Veiled Stair into Kun-Lai. This storyline "ends" temporarily upon arrival in the Vale. It leads into Questline #4.

2). The Hidden Master/Stoneplow/Young Monks, which is started in Tian Monastery and goes through half of the Valley and most of Krasarang Wilds, which has small offshoots and things that you see along the way. Both of these end at Stoneplow when everything is done, which culminates in an epic battle, where everybody you met along the way helps you overcome a huge foe and you get to be the Hero and Savior of the Valley.

3). Chen Stormstout and his niece. This line starts at Pang's Stead which you may have seen, and ends at Stoneplow along with the Hidden Master line.

4). The Shado-Pan and the Yaungol/Mantid/Sha. This starts in early Kun-lai Summit and ends in the Dread Wastes with the Klaxxi trying to take down Shek'zeer.

These 4 questlines encompass 90% of all the quests in MoP, except for the Vale (most of these quests are no longer available since 5.4 sadly) and Thunder Isle.

They did it like this to make it non-linear to please the people complaining about Cataclysm, but yet they also liked long-running storylines so they tried to give us a mix of the two.

I liked it.

*shrug*

Quote:
You are a phylumist for revising Wrath history to exclude Anub'Arak. >8< spider pride


Right. The spiders. I forgot about them, because they have such a small little piece of the storyline pie. You see them in Early Dragonblight and then..... nothing until Naxxramas.

Quote:

I guess the lack of PvP Power is balanced out by the amount of raw damage you can push out with end-game PvE gear. While questing on the Timeless Isle, I got torn up by people in blue PvP gear constantly, though. I could not crack the nut that was 72% base mitigation (+ additional mitigation) with my 0% additional PvP damage.


"Questing on the Timeless Isle" implies you were wearing Timeless Isle gear and not Siege of Orgrimmar gear. The difference between the two is absolutely huge from what I've heard. My Paladin who is now 530 (LFR SoO is 535 IIRC...) and the difference between her, and my 500-510 characters is... ridiculous. Like... at least 10k DPS difference. At least. Maybe 15k+. And they have the same weapons, to boot.

I'm quite sure that a person wearing 476 PvP gear is going to get smeared by anybody wearing Siege gear. Heck, I saw a Heroic Siege tank... I'm assuming they were Heroic Siege.... who had ~950k health. Blue PvP gear isn't going to keep you alive against that. And they probably had the Buff Items and a Shrine buff too -- there's 3 buff items: One has a chance to proc for 60k self-heal, one has a chance to proc for 100k damage on any offensive ability, and one increases a primary stat by 8,800 at a chance. The Shrine Buffs:

1). Nuizao: 25% Damage Reduction.
2). Xuen: +15% Damage Done.
3). Yu'lon: +20% Stats
4). Chi-Ji: +25% Mastery and Haste

Either of these would be ludicrously powerful, and someone equipped with one of these will wipe the floor with you unless you had one yourself.

Edited, Dec 8th 2013 8:05pm by Lyrailis
#101 Dec 08 2013 at 7:31 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
You did (I assume?) all of Jade Forest.
You did, what, about Half of Valley and Krasarang?
You did none of Kun-lai
You did none of Townlong Steppes
You did none of Dread Wastes
You did none of the Vale
You did none of the Landfall questline.
You did none of the Thunder Isle questline.


I finished 3/7 zones.

Fine, maybe that's not the halfway point. Maybe it's a quarter.

I still don't care. It's pathetically bad to have gone through that much content and still not care, for the content to be completely at odds with itself, to feel like I'm just doing unrelated quest arcs that don't matter, and which fail to actually develop the world I'm in.

See, my argument doesn't hedge on whether or not these arcs come together in the end or not. My point is that I quested to level 90, finishing 3 zones in the process, and the plot was a hot mess. I just don't care if Blizzard gets around to wrapping up it up nicely with a bow in the end, because they didn't earn that right.

It doesn't matter if the second half of a novel is amazing if the first half is pathetic. The book is still mediocre in its execution.

This is the point you are completely missing. If nothing in the plot starts working together until you've done even 25% of the content, it's a severe failure of writing.

If you're not playing the game for the story, then it's probably not the worst deal. Because you were going to play even if the story was meh, so you can ignore the fact tha the story is sucking.

And you don't need a linear plot line to make these parts work together. All you need to make them work together is to contextualize them alongside each other. They can't just be separate until the final event ties up the bow. That's awful. But the actual plot threads can have causal effects on eachother outside of major events.

And the game did a decent job of that up until Cataclysm (with BC a huge step forward from Vanilla, with an even bigger step forward with Wrath), where it pretty much just disappeared. Suddenly everything became linear, and in seemingly separate directions.

MoP may not be so linear as Cataclysm. But its plot still runs in separate directions, which is a problem when none of the plot lines are given the attention they need to stand on their own feet.

Because at the end of the day, that's the problem. There isn't a single plot line that's been actually explored or given the support necessary to even act as an interim main plotline. I'm three zones in, and the game has been nothing but quests that are being treated as side quests without anything else to compliment.

That's the problem. There is literally no central plot to the questing experience through the first 3 zones.

I want you to really take a moment to think about what I mean. Think about the final, major closing event for Valley - the break in the wall. You literally just stop into that village for a moment before you head elsewhere on the map. You issue some evacuation orders, and then you're gone. Yet THAT is the plot line they use to drive the events to a finish?

I was fighting that battle, and then killing that big bug, and all I could think about was how stupid it was that I was doing this. How I'm doing something big and heroic and it doesn't even matter to me because I literally can't tell you the name of a single Pandaren in that village, because I have no clue what the wars with these things actually are, because I have no clue how important this wall actually was.

It was built like a climactic event, but none of the previous events of my quest led up to it. And then, to make matters worse, it's solved by a ridiculous feat of deus ex machina on part of the player.

I was so bored during that quest line. They clearly wanted it to be energetic and exciting, like the end of the DK quest line, when you revolt against the LK.

But without context, it was just a random big bad. Sure, I wanted to kill it - I was playing a video game. But I had no particular emotional desire to kill it.

And that is the entire reason a RPG exists.

Plus, these random, emotionally insignificant "climaxes" were my personal major issue with Cataclysm. Once upon a time, the game was so good at setting up story climaxes, like NO ONE else in the MMO industry was doing. Wrathgate and so many other questlines in Wrath are so memorable.

But then Cataclysm turned everything into a climax moment. MoP, thankfully, didn't do that... as much. But I've been consistently underwhelmed by the climaxes across the board. The random army clashing at the Jade Statue? That came on so fast - you equipped those soldiers so much earlier in your questing, and suddenly they were back in the limelight? And wait, when did the Horde presence get THAT big? And why are we marching to do battle at this statue; that makes no sense - why lose so much of an army at a strategically insignificant location and not even have the pleasure of taking out supply chains or bases in the process? Etc.

And, again, the problem is that the "main" quest line was executed the same way as the "side" quest lines.
____________________________
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people

lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
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