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Occulus Changes Again. Oh my!Follow

#1 Jan 05 2010 at 1:32 AM Rating: Good
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To encourage players not to shy away from the many invigorating adventures to be had in The Oculus, we have applied a change to enhance the rewards players are provided when selected for this dungeon via the Random Heroic option in the Dungeon Finder. Once Ley-Guardian Eregos is defeated, one loot bag per character will be provided in his chest in addition to the current rewards. Each loot bag will offer players rare gems, two additional Emblems of Triumph, and a chance of being rewarded the Reins of the Blue Drake. These fine treasures could be yours should you honor your fellow party members by besting the challenges contained within The Oculus! Keep in mind, however, that these extra loot bags will only be awarded to each party member if Oculus is selected by the Dungeon Finder when players choose the Random Heroic option.

In light of this change, the Reins of the Azure Drake will now have a chance of dropping in both 10- and 25-player versions of The Eye of Eternity.



Oh my!
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#2 Jan 05 2010 at 1:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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...when selected for this dungeon via the Random Heroic option in the Dungeon Finder....a chance of being rewarded the Reins of the Blue Drake


That's all I saw. Smiley: drool2
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#3 Jan 05 2010 at 1:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Even better, we won't have to wait for another patch for this.

It's a hotfix.
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#4 Jan 05 2010 at 1:45 AM Rating: Good
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Of course, I got into it tonight, no bonuses no nothing. Still did it.
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#5 Jan 05 2010 at 1:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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OMG Oculus is now my favourite dungeon after this change.
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#6 Jan 05 2010 at 2:02 AM Rating: Good
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*Sighs* Pretty sad they had to do this to get people to be less stupid. This instance is so easy. Clear to first boss. Kill boss. 3 dps drakes, 1 healer drake, 1 tank drake. Fly straight up to first big circular platform, kill, fly over to horseshoe center platform, clear around. fly to other circular platform directly across, kill, fly back to horseshoe, fly to top of arc, fly across to third platform. kill boss (don't stand in beam or in the squiggly lines!), up to first long platform, kill adds, fly to next one, kill adds, fly to third one, kill adds, fly to middle on either side of boss, kill boss (tank kite out of frost towards party and party moves with tank, hide behind INNER pillar when he teleports). Mount up, clear whelps on the side you're going to be tanking boss, DPS time stop boss when he enrages, run to opposite side as boss is facing when purple flashy orbs come out...and you're done.

Copy, paste it, print it out, duct tape it to your monitor. Its easy. So easy that I who have only done it five or six times have it memorized by heart step by step. Oy vey!

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#7 Jan 05 2010 at 2:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well you know... since Oculus has been a whopping 40% of ALL my random dungeons then @#%^ yeah I'll take extra loot. The number of times I've had to teach morons to press 3 followed by on 1 on amber drakes and still had them fail...
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#8 Jan 05 2010 at 2:13 AM Rating: Good
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Maybe I'll actually get to see Oculus now. It's the only dungeon I've yet to run.
#9 Jan 05 2010 at 2:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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Occulus is the only dungeon left on 4 of my 80's Northern Dungeon Hero achievement, maybe I'll finally get them done!
#10 Jan 05 2010 at 3:53 AM Rating: Good
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So an easy dungeon just got a large bag loot attached to it so really bad players will stick around.

This is of course my opinion.

Flame away.

But seriously, this is ridiculous.

edit: This makes me want to get Occy now. I mean it was fine before and I usually get Occy or HoS as the random so WOOT WOOT. 50/50 shot free stuff

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 5:01am by Horsemouth
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#11 Jan 05 2010 at 4:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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Horsemouth wrote:
So an easy dungeon just got a large bag loot attached to it so really bad players people who can't be bothered to coordinate or pay attention in an instance that, heaven forbid, isn't facerollable will stick around.


FTFY. People don't bail on Occ because it's hard or because they're bad, they bail because you can't just slam your fist into your keyboard for 20 minutes and get badges.

Fly... up...? Move away from giant glowy things??? I don't understand!!!! What is this madness?!?!?!?!

I vote they bring back heroic entrance requirements like BC had where getting into a heroic required at least a little more than just being 80. But then, I think all of the level 80 content could benefit from some sort of "Weed out the garbage" buffer between level 79.999 and 80 that made the bads either get better or give up and go play something else.

But I digress.
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#12 Jan 05 2010 at 8:16 AM Rating: Decent
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I vote they bring back heroic entrance requirements like BC had where getting into a heroic required at least a little more than just being 80. But then, I think all of the level 80 content could benefit from some sort of "Weed out the garbage" buffer between level 79.999 and 80 that made the bads either get better or give up and go play something else.


Yeah, and screw over all the late-comers who need Normal instance runs, but can't find any...

I remember TBC. I almost quit WoW permanently during it, but then they announced Wrath and I heard some of the promises about "a less painful gear curve" and such, so I stuck around, and I'm glad I did.

I hit Lv70 about the time Black Temple came out, TBC was already halfway into swing. I played a Warrior.

In TBC, nobody wanted a DPS warrior; they sucked unless they were fully decked out in the best Raid Gear and even then, DPS warriors were not common by any means. So, if I wanted to do endgame content, I had to go as a Tank. Gearing up a Tank to Tank Level 80 Normal Dungeons was painful enough, forget Heroics.

I needed lots and lots of Normal Dungeons; I must have done the Lv80 normals at least 20+ times and I had gotten 2 piece of gear, a shield, that wasn't as good as the one I already had (SSO had just recently been released; I had their shield) and a pair of shoulders from Black Morass.

I spent weeks on tanking the same 3-4 instances (Slabs, killed Murmur 8 times, no shoulders), Bot, Mech, and even did Arcatraz a few times, all the while wishing I could get Badges for these runs so that I could actually get decent gear that would let me into Karazhan.

Nobody wants to spend 3, 4, 5+ weeks tanking normal instances for boss drops that almost never drop it.

The current system is fine, though I will agree the Oculus bribes are going a little far. 2 Extra Triumphs, though... the instance already gives 4, you get 2 more from the random LFG system if it wasn't your first dungeon, and then now 2 more from the bag... 8 badges from one instance, I'll definitely love seeing Oculus come up on the Randoms now.

Esp. now that I can get a drake ontop of THAT.

Not sure what they mean by "rare gems" .... do they mean the super-common blue quality ("rare") gems, or do they mean the purple-quality gems? Most of the Blue-Quality gems aren't worth that much, 'cept Yellow and Red... oh well. They still vendor for 3g each. lol.

Edit:

The good thing of it is, is if you "force" (or, well, strongly encourage) people to do Oculus, the "harder" (more complex?) content found within that instance might actually wake some of the scrubs up into being better players. Some of them. Others are beyond hope... that's what Vote-Kick is for.

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 9:26am by Zariamnk
#13 Jan 05 2010 at 8:55 AM Rating: Default
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I logged into my tank - Picked Heroic Random... Got Occ. As the loading screen clears the healer drops. Then a DPS beat me to the /leave group button. God I hate that place.

I waited the 15 minutes... Figured I'd run a regular instance for the badge drop... Again - Regular Occ. Healer drops out immediately. I follow.


It's a horrible instance. The first sets of trash pulls are really annoying (Even as a Pally -aoe- tank.) You get one random whelpling that always gets away... You move on to the first boss - no one really knows the mechanics for him. So he's always annoying. Then you fight that stupid mage that keeps moving. Then you have to try to move around on the stupid dragons... Then the final boss fight... If anyone dies they get lost. 1/2 the people don't know where the entrance to the instance is. Once they get in they don't know what to do to find you. No one picks the right dragon....


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#14 Jan 05 2010 at 8:57 AM Rating: Excellent
Yay! Now I need to actually get occulus for a random :(
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#15 Jan 05 2010 at 9:02 AM Rating: Good
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OMG Oculus is now my favourite dungeon after this change.


This. I didn't enjoy Occulus before, but it wasn't hard *at all* post-nerfs. The fact that it wasn't fun is what made me not want to do it.

But now...

7 Emblems for the run. [EDIT] Oops, sorry, EIGHT. [/EDIT]
Rare gems.
AND a chance for the Blue Drake?

Yeah, here's hoping it is ALWAYS my daily.


Edited, Jan 5th 2010 10:19am by idiggory
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#16 Jan 05 2010 at 9:05 AM Rating: Excellent
Zariamnk wrote:

Not sure what they mean by "rare gems" .... do they mean the super-common blue quality ("rare") gems, or do they mean the purple-quality gems? Most of the Blue-Quality gems aren't worth that much, 'cept Yellow and Red... oh well. They still vendor for 3g each. lol.


Blue = Rare.
#17 Jan 05 2010 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Ever feel like you find new ways to die?

Tanked Oculus y'day, charged one of those damn whelps in the first area. Whelp was right near the edge, and sure enough, I went falling. *sigh*

Fun? /agree not really. Easy? Only if I don't have to explain the drakes to an Oc-newb.

Was a ridiculous bonus loot reward needed? Hell no. Ultimate caving in to whiners.
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#18 Jan 05 2010 at 9:25 AM Rating: Good
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I was doing the LFG thing last night and Oculus popped. My toon went through the loading screen and I see in party chat "crap." The next thing I know, literally within ten seconds, I'm alone in the group. Everyone else dropped group.

Like an idiot I teleported out and dropped group to re-enter the LFG, forgetting for the moment about the 15 minute debuff. I don't think it's that bad an instance, but it has that reputation and it's hard to overcome that. A nice mount may be just the ticket.



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#19 Jan 05 2010 at 9:26 AM Rating: Good
idiggory wrote:
This. I didn't enjoy Occulus before, but it wasn't hard *at all* post-nerfs. The fact that it wasn't fun is what made me not want to do it.
Oculus is probably the most fun heroic there is aside from the new ones. Or do you enjoy thoughtless button smashing.
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#20 Jan 05 2010 at 9:35 AM Rating: Decent
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Was a ridiculous bonus loot reward needed? Hell no. Ultimate caving in to whiners.


I disagree.

This is a game. And there was a while part of it that players just weren't finding fun (to the point where 15 minutes of doing nothing sounded better).

Do you think that maybe, MAYBE, changing the game according to player opinion is actually part of the mission statement for the game?

Did they HAVE to do this? No. And it is surprising. But there certainly isn't anything wrong with it. Blizz wants players to run all of the dungeons. This is a relatively easy-to-make change that will increase the population of players running it. And they may like it better since it has high rewards.

Let's break up players into 5 groups with reference to Occulus:

1. Hate it, Will always leave
2. Kinda Hate or Really Dislike it, will leave sometimes.
3. No strong opinion, will leave if 2 have left.
4. Like it, they aren't going to stick around if if it down to two people.
5. Love it--they run it through specific dungeons all the time.

Now, even with this change, most from group 1 will still leave. Because 6 emblems wasn't enough to entice them, 8 probably won't be. People that really want the mount may stay though.

In group 2, however, you will probably have more people that will hang around upon entering, where they might have left otherwise. And, if one player leaves, they will be more likely to stick around instead of just quitting.

Group 3 is more likely to stay by a decent margin. And, since fewer from groups 1 and 2 will be leaving, they will find themselves in a 3-man party much less.

Group 4 is very likely to stay now.

Group 5 was never going to leave anyway.

I think most players probably fall into groups 3, with a skew towards 1 and 2.

But, this will cause more groups that form to actually DO the instance. That means 3-5 are going to have more fun. Even group 2 may find themselves not hating it AS much.

Overall, people hate Occulus less because their groups aren't falling apart.
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#21 Jan 05 2010 at 9:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Oculus is probably the most fun heroic there is aside from the new ones. Or do you enjoy thoughtless button smashing.


I find Occ to be even more mindless than regular play. Okay, I have to not fly into patches of dragons, but that certainly isn't hard.

Other than that, you have 1-3 buttons to press the whole time. And they aren't even that interesting.

So. Boring.
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#22 Jan 05 2010 at 9:40 AM Rating: Decent
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Oculus is probably the most fun heroic there is aside from the new ones.


Back in the day of the ach for daily dungeon's I had to do the one for occulus. So I started to get a group together. The first recruit said "I love occulus its fun!" So I was like cool. Then it took me awhile to find the other 3 people but eventually I did get a group together. So we get in there. We take down the first boss, then have trouble dealing with flying around. Some of us die more than once, but eventually we get what we needed for the quest. After that first person to say "I'm done" is the guy who said occulus was fun.


More to the point though is. They nerf it, nerf it again, still no one likes it. Now they have to bribe us to do it. HAHAHAHAHA. Always works for government too. You want to be able to do something. Bribe them!

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 7:49am by clusto
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#23 Jan 05 2010 at 9:40 AM Rating: Good
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Occulus is the same as any other heroic instance. Rediculously easy. Always has been even before the nerfs. I did, however, appreciate all the scrubs removing themselves from the group before it began. If you cannot figure out a 3 button rotation on a mount, please continue to drop group at the sight of Occulus.

Which brings me to my public service announecment: If you are scared or incapible of figuring out the one, two, and three-button on your keyboard, but insist on remaining in the group due to the improved rewards, please find a nice and safe area where you can /dance, /cower, /palywithyourself and let the grown folks easily four-man (woman) it.

/Thank you
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#24 Jan 05 2010 at 9:49 AM Rating: Good
idiggory wrote:
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Oculus is probably the most fun heroic there is aside from the new ones. Or do you enjoy thoughtless button smashing.


I find Occ to be even more mindless than regular play. Okay, I have to not fly into patches of dragons, but that certainly isn't hard.

Other than that, you have 1-3 buttons to press the whole time. And they aren't even that interesting.

So. Boring.
Well, the bosses have decent mechanics, that at one point you actually had to pay attention to, and while the last boss isn't hard per say, I enjoy the vehicles and the flying around. I wouldn't want more, but one fight out the heroics is fine with me. Of course between the nerfs and the gear it's just a super fast run, but I still remember when you couldn't just ignore the lightning bars from the first guy, or where the mage would one shot you with his blast.

The only fail part of it is how some people lose their heads when they get off the drake, but that's easily dealt with.

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 9:58am by Xsarus
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#25 Jan 05 2010 at 10:10 AM Rating: Excellent
I completed Occulus several time, I even got my red proto-drake from Glory of the Hero a long time ago, back when people didn't outgear 5 man instance so bad you could get the achievements without even trying.

I don't find Occulus hard.

But apparently, a lot of people do. I have no interest in wiping because of other people's failure. What's worse is that because of the GS system in LFG, I usually get paired up in group that can clear the entire instance before the 15minute debuff even clears out... so doing any instance that will take more than 15 minutes feels like a waste of time. I have no patience at all for wiping in 5 man.

This bag of loot gives a bunch of epic gems (so gold, which I don't need), emblem of Triumph (which again, I don't need) and a blue drake (which I don't care about because it's not 310% speed)... yeah, don't think I'm going to stick around.
#26 Jan 05 2010 at 10:11 AM Rating: Decent
Ahh Occulus. Bads dont like it becuase it confuzzles them. Decent players don't like it becuase it's to much information to have to try and type out to bads who really should know the instance by now but failed the apptitude test for it before they nerfed it into the mushy bowl of easy paste it is today.

So it annoys both good and bad players when it comes up. I'll take my extra bag of loot as reward for assigning people drakes, and telling the bronze their time stop order on enrage. ( You first, you second ) And reminding players that BIG BALLZ TO FACE IS BAD!

I actually don't leave when I get it. I am head master at the instructional school for Occ newbs. Not that I want to be. But its so easy now we usually get [Make it count] without even trying. So 20 min run. No biggie.
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#27 Jan 05 2010 at 10:16 AM Rating: Good
Sweet, even more reason for me not to leave (I never do, I think it is an easy dungeon).

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#28 Jan 05 2010 at 10:35 AM Rating: Default
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idiggory wrote:
Do you think that maybe, MAYBE, changing the game according to player opinion is actually part of the mission statement for the game?


This a trick question? lol

While player opinion may influence game changes, and that's a good thing, the Oculus changes are overboard imo. Blizzard can't, and shouldn't, have to make such concessions.

I know that many folks dislike Gnomeregan and Blackrock Depths, for example, for being large, time consuming dungeons (for the intended level players), but I think it's faulty player expectations to "like" every dungeon that Blizzard puts out. "Different" isn't necessarily bad, and "fun" is relative from one player to the next.

Tweaking and tuning (and revamping in the extreme rarity) I can understand. But such outright "bribery" "compensation" to run that dungeon, as if Blizzard is saying "We're sorry for making you endure it uptil now", is unnecessary. Almost like they're admitting failure/stupidity for creating it (some players opinion), which I think is unfair to say.

And yes, I'm gonna stick to the "each dungeon is like a snowflake" argument. And I'm willing to accept others may not agree. :)
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#29 Jan 05 2010 at 11:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Every dungeon is going to have a player base that dislikes it. That's unavoidable.

But the fact of the matter is that this change has nothing to do with how hard or easy, fun or boring, etc. that Oculus is. This change is meant to keep the groups from dissipating the minute they enter, and it happens more with Occ (by a large margin) than with any other instance. That is a clear problem, and this was meant to solve that. Because, there is NOTHING they could do to Occ apart from completely redesigning it that would make people like it. That's the point.

What's the better option? Spend tons of resources to completely revamp an instance that already has a bag stigma to it, and exists for no purpose other than quests for new players and triumph emblems? Or add a little bit of loot to keep players running it, so at least the groups aren't just dissipating?

Because the instance is brutally easy now. The ONLY semi-difficult part of the whole thing is if you have a healer that can't deal with Urom's DoT. That's it.

And I would MUCH rather Blizz say "Hey, we know you don't like this so we are gonna try and do what we can so that you think running it is better than 15 minutes spent doing nothing" than for them to just ignore the problems and make players deal with it.

There's nothing Blizz could do with Occ that would be worth it, in terms of spending resources to change mechanics and such. Players don't like it, and the idea of the dragon fight now being totally different isn't going to bring them back.

Why not just add a bonus so that the 60% of players that won't drop group are more likely to avoid the stress of having to constantly seek new members?

And it isn't bribery. At least, no more so than any of the other dungeon changes implemented in 3.3. They are trying to get people to think it is worth running. All they are trying to do is equalize the drop rate of players for this instance compared to others.
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#30 Jan 05 2010 at 11:28 AM Rating: Good
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...the Oculus changes are overboard imo. Blizzard can't, and shouldn't, have to make such concessions.



Blizzard completely scaled up and relaunched the entire Naxx Raid because they felt that too few people had seen the content and they want players to experience the stuff they have worked on. Perhaps they want to motivate people to look at (play) what they worked on? I don't know... Just an idea.



Either way - Occ sucks. I haven't liked a single fight that was designed around a mount (Gimick). I'll admit I haven't done Airships...


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#31 Jan 05 2010 at 11:35 AM Rating: Good
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Either way - Occ sucks. I haven't liked a single fight that was designed around a mount (Gimick). I'll admit I haven't done Airships...


I don't think Vehicles CAN'T be fun. But the thing is, I'm playing a Death Knight. I chose the class because I like the abilities, look and mechanics.

I'm not playing "Ruby Drake" (though I totally would if it was an option, lol).

I think Vehicles where your class mechanics are still important could be fun, like if the dragons added an extra ability or two and 3D movement, but that's it.

But it just isn't fun to hit the same one or two buttons for a minute while waiting for the enrage announcement, or for the boss to turn clear and fly away.

It's a slow-paced, boring fight. It's a LITTLE better for Ruby Drakes, since you have to try and manage evasive charges and your damage redirect, plus your damage to the boss is higher if you can get it from a bounce off the Whelps.

I haven't tried the Emerald Drake yet, though. But the Bronze one bores me. And Ruby isn't much better.
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#32 Jan 05 2010 at 11:35 AM Rating: Good
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Azaza wrote:

I know that many folks dislike Gnomeregan and Blackrock Depths, for example, for being large, time consuming dungeons (for the intended level players), but I think it's faulty player expectations to "like" every dungeon that Blizzard puts out. "Different" isn't necessarily bad, and "fun" is relative from one player to the next.

Tweaking and tuning (and revamping in the extreme rarity) I can understand. But such outright "bribery" "compensation" to run that dungeon, as if Blizzard is saying "We're sorry for making you endure it uptil now", is unnecessary. Almost like they're admitting failure/stupidity for creating it (some players opinion), which I think is unfair to say.

And yes, I'm gonna stick to the "each dungeon is like a snowflake" argument. And I'm willing to accept others may not agree. :)


But this is a different situation than BRD and Gnomer. Not wanting to go to Gnomer or BRD is voluntary. The random LFG puts you in Oculus, you don't have a choice in the matter.

What happens is most people don't want to do it, so they leave the group. Either A. they don't like it because it's boring or B. they don't like it because people fail so hard at it. So they bail on the group, and then someone else leaves and ultimately one or two people left with their thumbs up their butts and a 15 minute debuff that doesn't allow them to requeue for another random heroic just to complete their frost badge daily.

This is just a little more incentive for people to stay. And it really isn't that big of a bonus to be honest.

8 emblems of triumph, 1 more than nexus or gundrak.

Gems, a nice source of income, but pretty easy to come by already, I mean I get so many from converting stone keeper shards into honor points, that my guilds bank is sitting at about 20 of each color and I've become tired of selling them on AH, or even going to WG to convert the shards into honor.

I'm not sure about the extra gear, is it going to be ilevel 200 similar to the gear that drops there now, or is it going to be iL 232 like the stuff that drops in ICC heroics. If it's the 200 then it is just vendor trash like everything else that drops, if it is 232 it will be nice, probably some decent upgrades, but it will be no different than the ICC heroics are now, where I see most of that gear is being sharded.

Another chance at the mount is probably the biggest boon.

I like the change to be honest, never had a problem with OC before, never was hard, just no one did it. Now it seems like I am always being put in that instance, and then being stuck standing around for 15 minutes not able to get anything done because the rest of the group bailed just because it was that instance.
#33 Jan 05 2010 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
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I don't think Vehicles CAN'T be fun. But the thing is, I'm playing a Death Knight. I chose the class because I like the abilities, look and mechanics.

I'm not playing "Ruby Drake" (though I totally would if it was an option, lol).



I completely agree. I've actually stated the "I'm not playing Ruby Drake" thing before.


The other problem I see with mounted combat is the lack of game design to support them. The game wasn't designed to support rapid fighter pilot like combat in a 3D zone. I just feel very 'clunky' trying to do it.

You combine that with the fact that for the first 2/3 of the instance my green healing mount has 2 buttons to use. Of those two - there is no reason to use anything but button 1. When I'm on my Red mount I notice that I have 2 buttons. Though this time I can use #2. So that's slightly more interactive...

I normally play a Pally Tank. I have multiple things to do, to watch out for, and people to take care of. It's great. When I play green drake I have to push the button 1 for about 10 seconds. Then mobe to another mob and push 1 again. Maybe if they spice it up...

---

With respect to places like Gnomer or BRD they are just too long. Same with Uld and Mara.
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#34 Jan 05 2010 at 12:08 PM Rating: Good
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While player opinion may influence game changes, and that's a good thing, the Oculus changes are overboard imo. Blizzard can't, and shouldn't, have to make such concessions.


They didn't have to do anything. I'm assuming they looked at their reporting tool, saw that the level of Oculus's abandoned or not completed was way higher than the other dungeons and decided to incentivize players finishing it rather than find a way to punish them ("You have abandoned Oculus, you may not requeue for a Random Dungeon for 28 days.") It's not a complete overhaul, just a reason for people to actually stay in the dungeon and play it rather than bailing.
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#35 Jan 05 2010 at 12:11 PM Rating: Default
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Once upon a time....(before ther was vent, questhelper and Gameguides)
people had to have certain quests, reps and achievements. when a 40man-raid depended on each player doing their part. It's sad that 2-3 people have to carry a raid. The big job now is get ur dps score up and stay alive (GOD help you if ur "gear-score" isn't 4k or better, or u can't get an invite.

I'm too young to be nostalgic dammit!
#36 Jan 05 2010 at 12:14 PM Rating: Good
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Once upon a time....(before ther was vent, questhelper and Gameguides)
people had to have certain quests, reps and achievements. when a 40man-raid depended on each player doing their part. It's sad that 2-3 people have to carry a raid. The big job now is get ur dps score up and stay alive (GOD help you if ur "gear-score" isn't 4k or better, or u can't get an invite.

I'm too young to be nostalgic dammit!


Did you mean to post this in a different thread?

[EDIT]

There's no "t" in "mean."

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 1:21pm by idiggory
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#37 Jan 05 2010 at 12:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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when a 40man-raid depended on each10 players doing their part
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#38 Jan 05 2010 at 12:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Was this implemented in today's maintenance, or was it announced for later?
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#39 Jan 05 2010 at 1:42 PM Rating: Good
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Hotfixed along with:

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•The Lady Deathwhisper encounter has seen the following changes in the 25 player normal version: mana pool has been reduced, the health on all adds has been reduced, and Adherents will wait a little longer after spawning before they start casting.
•Interrupting a fireball being cast by the Ymirjar Flamebearers in normal and heroic Pit of Saron will no longer make them instantly cast Hellfire.
•The ghost waves at the beginning of both normal and heroic Halls of Reflection have undergone several changes that should make them easier to defeat such as preventing 2 mages or 2 mercenaries from spawning in the 5 mob pulls, a shorter duration of the spectral footman’s shield bash, and the spectral mage’s flamestrike having a longer cast time, shorter duration, and (in heroic) doing less damage.
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#40 Jan 05 2010 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
Some of my guildies got this as the frost random right after the server came up.

The bag had 2 [Blue rare]yellow gems and two triumph in it.

And as for the Lady D 25 nerf (She was already easy on 10 but pretty rough on 25 for non l33t guilds). Yay on that. We carry too many people in my casual guild and she was raid walling us in 25. I imagine this pattern will repeat as new content unlocks. The DPS check for Fester looks brutal for example.

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 12:30pm by Shojindo
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#41 Jan 05 2010 at 2:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Killzfun wrote:
when a 40man-raid depended on each player doing their part.

wat

Seriously, is that a joke?
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#42 Jan 05 2010 at 2:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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It's a horrible instance. The first sets of trash pulls are really annoying (Even as a Pally -aoe- tank.) You get one random whelpling that always gets away... You move on to the first boss - no one really knows the mechanics for him. So he's always annoying. Then you fight that stupid mage that keeps moving.


This is a joke right? I tanked up to the first boss on my holy paladin while healing when a dk new to tanking wouldn't do it. If you lose 1 whelp to dps, who cares? The first boss... tank and spank really. The mage boss, fight him where he stands, leave your healer behind that pillar... then just run out back to where he was standing so frost is never on the healer/ranged. We healed through his frost the first week of northrend since kiting him makes him slower to kill and the damage was never tough to heal through. It has been nerfed since.
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#43 Jan 05 2010 at 3:03 PM Rating: Good
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I try to rate instances on how quickly you can kill every boss, and the number of abilities the mobs do that do way too much damage randomly.

Oculus is fast. I can get it done in 15 minutes if the group knows what to do. The only ability that fits into part two is Mage-Lord Urom's Arcane Explosion, but lately I can kill him before he casts it once. Oculus rates very well on my list.

I'd like it a lot more if everyone else stopped leaving instantly, or.. I don't know.. not even trying?

Edited, Jan 5th 2010 3:10pm by Ehcks
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#44 Jan 05 2010 at 4:09 PM Rating: Decent
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The isntance is not fun. not fun....is not fun.
No matter how they nerf it, change it or increase the rewards i will not run it if its not enjoyable to do so.
#45 Jan 05 2010 at 5:10 PM Rating: Good
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ekaterinodar wrote:
*Sighs* Pretty sad they had to do this to get people to be less stupid. This instance is so easy. Clear to first boss. Kill boss. 3 dps drakes, 1 healer drake, 1 tank drake. Fly straight up to first big circular platform, kill, fly over to horseshoe center platform, clear around. fly to other circular platform directly across, kill, fly back to horseshoe, fly to top of arc, fly across to third platform. kill boss (don't stand in beam or in the squiggly lines!), up to first long platform, kill adds, fly to next one, kill adds, fly to third one, kill adds, fly to middle on either side of boss, kill boss (tank kite out of frost towards party and party moves with tank, hide behind INNER pillar when he teleports). Mount up, clear whelps on the side you're going to be tanking boss, DPS time stop boss when he enrages, run to opposite side as boss is facing when purple flashy orbs come out...and you're done.

Copy, paste it, print it out, duct tape it to your monitor. Its easy. So easy that I who have only done it five or six times have it memorized by heart step by step. Oy vey!

/end_wall_of_text


Easy instance, yeah, but somehow it always takes longer than any other instance and people always tend to fail more, regardless of how many times they've done it.

Personally, I don't care for the instance's difficulty. That's not the major reason I try to avoid that place like the plague. It's the entire idea behind the instance. To take all your hard-earned (lol) gear and make it absolutely redundant because you now have to spend the next 30 minutes on the back of a dragon. Fun the first few times, boring as crap afterwards. I know your gear affects the health of the dragons, but I gained something like 20k health from going nekkid to T9-equipped. 20k isn't a lot when you've got dragons hitting you for 10k or more. And that's the trash.

I hate the place because it becomes exponentially more difficult the less skilled players you're with. There's no over-gearing to save the day. You can't pop cooldowns and ride home solo. If one fails, the groups fails. Which is why I always pick the healer dragon (emerald). Not so much because I prefer healing, but because I know everyone else hates it. I mean, people barely have enough active synapses left firing to know that Temporal Rift and Martyr should be kept up as much as possible. I don't feel like putting my character's life (and a 10g repair bill) in their hands because I know they can't handle applying a DoT and healing at the same time. Sure, sure, they may be able to juggle 10 hotkeys and cooldowns when raiding, but they can't spam two buttons, nuh-uh. Why? Because we're on a @#%^ing dragon! It's the same thing that happens in Trial of the Champion. Oh noes, I'm on a horse, what to do? And it's not that hard, is it? You have four buttons:

Attack
Ranged attack
Charge
Shield

Well, three attacks because let's face it, no one really uses the ranged anymore. It's all about charging everything until wipe or win. The encounter is about keeping your shield up while attacking the enemies. You get three kinds of attacks and one shield-button. And I still see people fail utterly. Charging in with no shield up. Trying to tank the mobs with the shield down and doing 700 damage with the melee attack. They have 300k health, you have 50k, what the hell were you planning?

My experience tells me that the moment you pull people away from their comfort zones, which most often is superior gear, but also familiarity and habits, you mess with their minds and the collective IQ drops like a rock. Healers know that when people start to die, you press Button A. Tanks know that in order to keep aggro, you spam Button B. DPS knows... well, usually knows that to do as much damage as possible without pulling aggro, they just have to spam Button C. They all have a buffer in terms of gear that far outweighs the content they're fighting. It's like going to a bumpercar contest in a tank.

Pull that away from people and they freak out. They start to panic. No more buffer, no more comfort zone. You get the same stick as the other guy and you now have to rely on knowledge and skill to survive. Good luck. I mean, you can almost feel the developers' smirk as you think it through, right? We're talking about putting the same people that spend hours talking about rectal sortie in the trade chat in a place where they have to rely on their wits to make it through.

I saw fail a mile away. Apparently others do too.

That said, I love the place when I'm on guild runs. Mostly because the guild no longer contains any moronic @#%^s that can't tell left from right and wrong. If Oculus pops up as the random heroic, I check the temperature of the group with a short "Hey guys, anyone done this before?" If I get silence or "gogo" or anything else that might indicate that one or more individuals in the group lack a proper processing unit in the upper floor, I bail. I don't feel like spending 30 minutes just to wipe and have the group break up. Yeah, yeah, I know the new LFG thing made it easier to get a new member for just one boss, but even then, there's no guarantee you won't get another John Doh with an inadequate cooling unit.

Better safe than sorry, in my opinion.

Edited, Jan 6th 2010 12:19am by Mazra
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#46 Jan 05 2010 at 6:28 PM Rating: Good
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Biggest problem with Occulus is the attentiveness requirement. It's a good thing that when you start doing raids, you don't have to pay attention to where you are or what you're doing or avoiding stuff.

Oh, wait...

Here's a thought: maybe this is why so many people stand in fire. "Pay attention what? 1112234214411233413443132144121 Why am I dead?"
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#47 Jan 05 2010 at 9:48 PM Rating: Good
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Just ran Oculus. I cheered when the LFG tool dropped me down in there.

At the end, I opened my bad to find 2 Monarch Topaz and a couple Triumphs.

Someone in my group got the drake. ._.
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#48 Jan 05 2010 at 11:02 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't think that difficulty is what turns people away from it. I think its just the fact it is tedious. I have done it a few times and not a big fan of being forced to use a vehicle. I want to be able to play my class not get on a dragon and depend on the abilities it gives me.

Before if I caught this as DPS I would usually do it but I wouldn't on my healer. Now will prob always do it.

Now give us extra loots at low lvl when we get stuck in Wailing Caverns with 4 people who don't know where to go or how to jump?
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#49 Jan 05 2010 at 11:08 PM Rating: Decent
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While I like this change (simply because I'm a mount collector) I do hope that after Cataclysm hits, the drake is moved into the normal Heroic drops, since I doubt we'll be able to do a random Wrath Heroic at 85 (the same way we can't do random BC heroics at 80)
#50 Jan 06 2010 at 2:04 AM Rating: Good
I've had Oculus three or four times now as my random daily. It's such an enormous leap down from what it was at WotLK launch that I think a big part of the reason people leave as soon as they see it is the same reason you see people asking in trade about patch note details from the patch that went in 3 months ago...they're ignorant and happy to be that way. The probably don't know it has been nerfed to hell and aren't the kind of people to find out on their own.

I guaran-damn-tee you for the next few weeks you're still going to have people dropping form Oculus groups the moment they zone in because they aren't going to know that bonus loot and a chance at a mount has been added.

The whelps that comprise the majority of the trash between your group and the first boss now have ~16k HP. That's less than double the HP of mobs most people fight for their dailies.

(And they're not hard to tank if you have a clue, either. Especially for pallies. There's more to tanking large trash groups than throwing your shield at the closest one and then trotting in with your thumb up your ass trying to figure out how the @#%^ you're going to get the three in the back to stop pewpewing your healer.)

The first boss is a tank 'n spank now. The mines he sends out do trivial damage. Stand there and burn him down and if your healer is any good at all, you can let the mines explode wherever you want and it's not going to kill you.

And then...zomg...you get your drake. I mean like...killing 2-3 blue drakes before landing on the SE or SW platforms to clear the trash is all...hard and tedious and stuff. Of course, you always seem to wind up with the one guy who flies way too high or comes in at some ludicrous angle and stalls the group clearing unnecessary adds, but if they want to bitch about how not-fun the drake part is, the best solution is for them to pay @#%^ing attention to where they're flying relative to the mobs around them and not aggro sh*t that doesn't need to be fought. Done right, you spend a minute or two TOPS on your drake between trash platforms and then you're on to the second bosses. You can get to the ring with the trash pulls before the third boss without getting aggro from ANY drakes. The "QQ I don't like drake fighting" doesn't even come into play. 3 easy...EASY trash packs and then once again your zipping over on your drake for another easy boss that, if your group can manage 7-8k dps TOTAL out of all three dps players, is another tank 'n spank because he'll never have time to teleport to the middle. He'll be dead. And then it's another drake hop up to Ley-Guardian Eregos killing maybe 4-5 whelps TOPS before you engage him and then it's a 90 second lolblitz to easy loot.

So out of a 15-20 minute dungeon, you'll spend maybe 1/3 of that time on drakes (barring fail, of course) and as the random daily it already awarded a total of 6 emblems (four from bosses, 2 from the daily).

That's a dungeon as fast as or faster than Violet Hold that actually involves less trash, less sitting around waiting for things to happen, and now almost double the emblems for doing it as the daily.

And a shiny blue dragon mount. That lots of people won't know how to fly. Because not flying into sh*t that wants to eat you is hard. Like...srsly hard.
#51 Jan 06 2010 at 2:08 AM Rating: Good
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Did a random heroic with some friends. We got Occy.

The bag gave me 2 Triumphs and Twilight Opal.

Yeah, free loot.
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