http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/20sqar/dengenki_online_article_with_yoship_regarding/
Dont think its already been posted.. But looks like relic upgrades with be a bit of a longer process (something like oldschool mythic in FFXI to some degree?) Also looks like 3 separate paths to reaching high level weapons. Also some info about fantasia potions coming out on the 21st.. Any translators in ZAM want to verify?
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#2REDACTED,
Posted: Mar 19 2014 at 6:50 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Some definite backtracking/opinion changing regarding the F2P issue and stating how some games such as League of Legends and World of Tanks do it right. Seems like it might be on the table IMO at this point. Not surprising considering my server population - even immediately after an update, nobody really wants to play.
#3REDACTED,
Posted: Mar 19 2014 at 6:52 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) $$$ Cash Shop retainers and apperance change potions coming up. So already more pay-to-win elements than something like LoL with the former because it's actually gameplay related and not just cosmetic, but there's still a subscription fee. Kind of destroys the argument that a subscription model keeps this stuff out.
Looks like fantasia and more retainers (for a fee) will be one of the items on the plate for 2.2. Interesting.
I am liking the fact that he stuck to his promise to not make relic weapons obsolete.
News about Phantasia potions during the PLL the 21st
More retainers via micro transactions
Mirage Prism
Even blue items like Allagan gear can be changed.
Zodiak weapons
Simply put, it's relic weapons being reforged. We expect the quest to take some time to complete.
Incremental improvements in 2.25, 2.3, etc.
Most people probably won't have even completed the quest by the time 2.25 rolls arund
Eventually, it will have customisable stats
Unlike the current system where you get ultimate weapons from tokens or drops, we plan for this to be a 3rd route where you can nurture/cultivate it to your preference
Tomes
No more Philosophy after 2.2
Myth will take Philosophy's place
There will be an NPC around to trade Phil for Myth.
Gear
DL will become dungeon drops
il70 from high level dungeons
il80 from CT
il90 from Bahamut
other stuff exchanged via new Tomes
I am liking the fact that he stuck to his promise to not make relic weapons obsolete.
Quote:
News about Phantasia potions during the PLL the 21st
More retainers via micro transactions
Mirage Prism
Even blue items like Allagan gear can be changed.
Zodiak weapons
Simply put, it's relic weapons being reforged. We expect the quest to take some time to complete.
Incremental improvements in 2.25, 2.3, etc.
Most people probably won't have even completed the quest by the time 2.25 rolls arund
Eventually, it will have customisable stats
Unlike the current system where you get ultimate weapons from tokens or drops, we plan for this to be a 3rd route where you can nurture/cultivate it to your preference
Tomes
No more Philosophy after 2.2
Myth will take Philosophy's place
There will be an NPC around to trade Phil for Myth.
Gear
DL will become dungeon drops
il70 from high level dungeons
il80 from CT
il90 from Bahamut
other stuff exchanged via new Tomes
Very good information though. Wonder if by fee he actualy means real money or gil? I dont mind cash shops as long as it doesnt become pay to win
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers and apperance change potions coming up. So already more pay-to-win elements than something like LoL with the former because it's actually gameplay related and not just cosmetic, but there's still a subscription fee. Kind of destroys the argument that a subscription model keeps this stuff out.
Gotta go but I firmly expect this post to be sub-defaulted because it's too truthful and people are upset. Use me as your punching bag but as of the next cash patch there will effectively be a cash shop/microtransactions that make you better, storage easier, etc. There are F2P games that manage to do 100% cosmetic microtransactions. Now $$$ real money retainers on top of a subscription fee doesn't seem like a big deal now, but it's a slippery slope. LoL only has costumes as microtransaction exclusive content after 5 years of F2P service and great profits. ARR is already releasing $$$ microtransactions which affect gameplay elements after less than a year in P2P.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 9:13am by LucasNox
Gotta go but I firmly expect this post to be sub-defaulted because it's too truthful and people are upset. Use me as your punching bag but as of the next cash patch there will effectively be a cash shop/microtransactions that make you better, storage easier, etc. There are F2P games that manage to do 100% cosmetic microtransactions. Now $$$ real money retainers on top of a subscription fee doesn't seem like a big deal now, but it's a slippery slope. LoL only has costumes as microtransaction exclusive content after 5 years of F2P service and great profits. ARR is already releasing $$$ microtransactions which affect gameplay elements after less than a year in P2P.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 9:13am by LucasNox
If that is true and not misquoted I agree.. If so SE is getting greedy and stupid. We pay a monthly fee and if they start adding stuff to the game we have to pay for... I may rethink this game, I need another retainer pretty bad too.. I dont think there is anyone who can spin micro-transaction on a monthly fee based mmo good. I can not even believe that crossed their mind. Honestly that has to be lost in translation and wrong.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 9:48am by Nashred
FFXI: Nashred
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
Actually, it's not that strange to me. In XI, we used our extra characters (mules) much like we use retainers in XIV. We paid an extra dollar per month for them.
#8REDACTED,
Posted: Mar 19 2014 at 8:17 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Sorry but Japanese isn't that hard to translate into English. He clearly says that retainers will be sold for real money/microtransactions. ARR is officially a Cash Shop game.
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers
Nashred wrote:
If that is true and not misquoted I agree.. If so SE is getting greedy and stupid.
No one seemed to mind when XI charged an extra $1/month to create additional characters which served basically the same purpose as retainers. If you look at it from that perspective, I've spent hundreds and hundreds on "Pay to Win" items in XI.
I'm not seeing much of a difference in this case. Certainly not anything so earth-shattering to make anyone but trolly-trolls start screaming F2P/P2W and doom.
#10REDACTED,
Posted: Mar 19 2014 at 8:33 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) OK? So because making extra characters in FFXI upped your subscription cost, a Cash Shop in FFXIV (a different game, which people have always loved pointing out to me) is somehow OK? These are Retainers for your main character and I somehow doubt they will be .99 cents a pop.
Extra storage for a fee is not game breaking and is exactly what we were all doing with mules in FFXI.
Extra characters are one thing, you should pay for them that's like having 2 accounts., or security tokens because they cost money to make, server transfers.
Retainers no, they are a in game item and most agree are needed. One of the biggest complaints is no storage space.
Here we go the spin on stuff..
The same people will defend this and spin this but ******* about the f2p micro transactions and this is why SE will get away with this.
Here comes clothes and hairstyle, color transactions.
I much rather have a monthly fee than micro transactions.. Well stand behind what you said.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 10:47am by Nashred
Retainers no, they are a in game item and most agree are needed. One of the biggest complaints is no storage space.
Here we go the spin on stuff..
The same people will defend this and spin this but ******* about the f2p micro transactions and this is why SE will get away with this.
Here comes clothes and hairstyle, color transactions.
I much rather have a monthly fee than micro transactions.. Well stand behind what you said.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 10:47am by Nashred
FFXI: Nashred
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
We're not talking about extra characters. We already pay extra in ARR if we want to create more than 1 character, just like FFXI.
This is the beginning of microtransactions on top of that for bonus retainers and most likely more. Someone who pays $30 a month will be able to much more efficiently store and sell and their items, etc. than me if I'm only paying $15. The game is officially pay-to-win.
This is the beginning of microtransactions on top of that for bonus retainers and most likely more. Someone who pays $30 a month will be able to much more efficiently store and sell and their items, etc. than me if I'm only paying $15. The game is officially pay-to-win.
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers and apperance change potions coming up. So already more pay-to-win elements than something like LoL with the former because it's actually gameplay related and not just cosmetic, but there's still a subscription fee. Kind of destroys the argument that a subscription model keeps this stuff out.
Gotta go but I firmly expect this post to be sub-defaulted because it's too truthful...
Gotta go but I firmly expect this post to be sub-defaulted because it's too truthful...
You'll have to enlighten us (when you get back) as to how having an extra retainer or ability to change your appearance is pay to win. :)
DomfranciscoOfIfrit wrote:
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers
Nashred wrote:
If that is true and not misquoted I agree.. If so SE is getting greedy and stupid.
No one seemed to mind when XI charged an extra $1/month to create additional characters which served basically the same purpose as retainers. If you look at it from that perspective, I've spent hundreds and hundreds on "Pay to Win" items in XI.
I'm not seeing much of a difference in this case. Certainly not anything so earth-shattering to make anyone but trolly-trolls start screaming F2P/P2W and doom.
I came to say something similar, but since you said it so eloquently, I'll just quote you and rate you up.
Pay-To-Win is a term thrown around alot by people who have no idea what that means.
The first FTP MMO's that came out in the mid-2000's were PTW... you couldn't do anything well unless you were buying the gear from cash shops to do so...
Even the FTP MMO's now are much more balanced than that, they realized that it was a complete turn-off.
FFXIV is not even a FTP MMO, so it's nowhere near the category some people are making it out to be.
Relax and enjoy the game, if you don't want to buy a retainer then don't... it's not game-breaking if someone has more retainers. If they started putting relic weapons in a cash shop then I would agree it's time to stop playing... but that's not what's happening.
Ok, but since we already pay a subscription to play the game shouldn't these new bonus retainers be obtained from an in-game quest and not in a web shop?
Hairspray wrote:
DomfranciscoOfIfrit wrote:
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers
Nashred wrote:
If that is true and not misquoted I agree.. If so SE is getting greedy and stupid.
No one seemed to mind when XI charged an extra $1/month to create additional characters which served basically the same purpose as retainers. If you look at it from that perspective, I've spent hundreds and hundreds on "Pay to Win" items in XI.
I'm not seeing much of a difference in this case. Certainly not anything so earth-shattering to make anyone but trolly-trolls start screaming F2P/P2W and doom.
I came to say something similar, but since you said it so eloquently, I'll just quote you and rate you up.
Pay-To-Win is a term thrown around alot by people who have no idea what that means.
The first FTP MMO's that came out in the mid-2000's were PTW... you couldn't do anything well unless you were buying the gear from cash shops to do so...
Even the FTP MMO's now are much more balanced than that, they realized that it was a complete turn-off.
FFXIV is not even a FTP MMO, so it's nowhere near the category some people are making it out to be.
Relax and enjoy the game, if you don't want to buy a retainer then don't... it's not game-breaking if someone has more retainers. If they started putting relic weapons in a cash shop then I would agree it's time to stop playing... but that's not what's happening.
May not be game breaking but having a extra retainer sure does give you a advantage.. It allows you too make more gil and store more stuff for crafting so there is another advantage.. It allows you to save more drops, it allows you to save more stuff till market conditions change.. Allows you to save more Gear.. If there wasn't a advantage people would not care about having a extra retainer or be one of the most anticipated thing. Are you going to buy one? and why? Because it give you an advantage in the game.
Problem is this is a in game item and once they start it wont end.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 11:17am by Nashred
FFXI: Nashred
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
Server: Phoenix
FFXIV : Sir Nashred
server: Ultros
Aren't there changes to retainers coming with 2.2?
As in they go gather stuff and do missions for you? If so that's bordering on p2w there Mr Yoshi.
In FFXI you bought extra characters that were for leveling, they were never sold as auction house brokers. This is a whole other thing, especially with the added featgures they are putting on retainers to make more people be practically forced to buy them.
I can't wait to see how Thayos rationalizes this, he flat out stated he was against anything that gave an advantage in a p2p game before. Instant turnaround incoming.
As in they go gather stuff and do missions for you? If so that's bordering on p2w there Mr Yoshi.
In FFXI you bought extra characters that were for leveling, they were never sold as auction house brokers. This is a whole other thing, especially with the added featgures they are putting on retainers to make more people be practically forced to buy them.
I can't wait to see how Thayos rationalizes this, he flat out stated he was against anything that gave an advantage in a p2p game before. Instant turnaround incoming.
What I want to know: is "3.0" the next expansion?
Friday is going to be interesting. I don't actually mind playing for a Fantasia (I still have 2 anyway) but if retainers can be used to farm for you (as well as extra AH slots) AND we have to pay extra real currency for them I won't be happy...
Blogging again! http://eldelphia.wordpress.com
Nashred wrote:
Hairspray wrote:
DomfranciscoOfIfrit wrote:
LucasNox wrote:
$$$ Cash Shop retainers
Nashred wrote:
If that is true and not misquoted I agree.. If so SE is getting greedy and stupid.
No one seemed to mind when XI charged an extra $1/month to create additional characters which served basically the same purpose as retainers. If you look at it from that perspective, I've spent hundreds and hundreds on "Pay to Win" items in XI.
I'm not seeing much of a difference in this case. Certainly not anything so earth-shattering to make anyone but trolly-trolls start screaming F2P/P2W and doom.
I came to say something similar, but since you said it so eloquently, I'll just quote you and rate you up.
Pay-To-Win is a term thrown around alot by people who have no idea what that means.
The first FTP MMO's that came out in the mid-2000's were PTW... you couldn't do anything well unless you were buying the gear from cash shops to do so...
Even the FTP MMO's now are much more balanced than that, they realized that it was a complete turn-off.
FFXIV is not even a FTP MMO, so it's nowhere near the category some people are making it out to be.
Relax and enjoy the game, if you don't want to buy a retainer then don't... it's not game-breaking if someone has more retainers. If they started putting relic weapons in a cash shop then I would agree it's time to stop playing... but that's not what's happening.
May not be game breaking but having a extra retainer sure does give you a advantage.. It allows you too make more gil and store more stuff for crafting so there is another advantage.. It allows you to save more drops, it allows you to save more stuff till market conditions change.. Allows you to save more Gear.. If there wasn't a advantage people would not care about having a extra retainer or be one of the most anticipated thing. Are you going to buy one? and why? Because it give you an advantage in the game.
Problem is this is a in game item and once they start it wont end.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 11:17am by Nashred
True, but I don't see how it's any different then having mules in FFXI...
You paid an extra $1/month for "Retainers" (mules)... so over the course of 7 or so years i played I probably paid upwards of $100 just in "retainer" fees. And I was happy to do it, because I was a crafter and I needed the extra storage and the extra sellers on the AH.
This is just a different way of selling us the same thing we were already circumventing the system to get anyways.
I was under the assumption that only one retainer could be used for ventures at a time, in which case someone having more than two is not game breaking.
Mules in XI were absolutely used in the exact same way we use retainers. I leveled one to 25 thf for farming in Sarutabaruta. He did harvesting and killed crawlers and bees. I had no room on my main for that.
Mules in XI were absolutely used in the exact same way we use retainers. I leveled one to 25 thf for farming in Sarutabaruta. He did harvesting and killed crawlers and bees. I had no room on my main for that.
Quote:
Extra storage for a fee is not game breaking and is exactly what we were all doing with mules in FFXI.
This.
If Yoshi-P starts talking about selling armor skins, gear, experience points, tomes, etc., for real money, then I'll start questioning the integrity of the game. But this is a business model SE used in XI, only in XI, we had to log out and log back in to access our mules. This just streamlines the process.
Thayos Redblade
Jormungandr
Hyperion
Jormungandr
Hyperion
I guess it still just seems like something a free MMORPG would do. I'm not seeing any good reason for needing to pay an extra Cash Shop fee when I already pay my subscription. If they want to give us new retainers with 2.2 it should be offered via a new quest.
You can keep calling FFXIV retainers and FFXI characters the same thing but they are not and the whole comparison comes off as a little bit desperate.
It's definitely pay-to-win, because you can sell and store things more easily than the normal people, if you pay a lot. I'm not sure how you can argue that that isn't pay-to-win.
I guess the pricing will determine how big the rift is between normal and high paying people though. I doubt they're going to cost $0.99 though (to go back to the silly XI character slot comparison... retainers aren't characters) and someone like Thayos will probably be able to sell and store items much more efficiently than a lowly normal-subscription player such as myself.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 12:21pm by LucasNox
You can keep calling FFXIV retainers and FFXI characters the same thing but they are not and the whole comparison comes off as a little bit desperate.
It's definitely pay-to-win, because you can sell and store things more easily than the normal people, if you pay a lot. I'm not sure how you can argue that that isn't pay-to-win.
I guess the pricing will determine how big the rift is between normal and high paying people though. I doubt they're going to cost $0.99 though (to go back to the silly XI character slot comparison... retainers aren't characters) and someone like Thayos will probably be able to sell and store items much more efficiently than a lowly normal-subscription player such as myself.
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 12:21pm by LucasNox
SaitoMishima wrote:
http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/20sqar/dengenki_online_article_with_yoship_regarding/
Dont think its already been posted.. But looks like relic upgrades with be a bit of a longer process (something like oldschool mythic in FFXI to some degree?) Also looks like 3 separate paths to reaching high level weapons. Also some info about fantasia potions coming out on the 21st.. Any translators in ZAM want to verify?
Dont think its already been posted.. But looks like relic upgrades with be a bit of a longer process (something like oldschool mythic in FFXI to some degree?) Also looks like 3 separate paths to reaching high level weapons. Also some info about fantasia potions coming out on the 21st.. Any translators in ZAM want to verify?
well if that link about relics its true Ill finally be getting what I wanted and thus finally be happy..... a "badass" weapon that actually takes some time and dedication to get.. and ill have 4 of em to upgrade -kills self- lol
Edited, Mar 19th 2014 11:22am by DuoMaxwellxx
#26DuoMaxwellxx,
Posted: Mar 19 2014 at 10:21 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) also if myth will take philos place does that mean you get 200 myth from doin main scenaroio instead of 200 philo?
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