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Daily NPC Diagnostics - Updated Everyday!Follow

#352 Jul 25 2005 at 7:45 PM Rating: Good
42 posts
BTW I think there are multiple factors acting on an NPC's leveling up. Killing things may be one but I think actions effect it as well.

People have said there is a "lag" between kills and leveling, often. I think that this is due to EXP or some other factor towards NPC leveling - because no one knows for certain that NPCs even level in the same EXP-based system that we do - which is gained from performing actions.

This happened for my first level up:

When I was with my NPC in yhoat as healer type, I killed a couple of white lizards at one point and had to rest. I sat down and so did she. She was still level 30 at this point. I waited till she was all ready, got up, and after a bit of running - just a few seconds, we hadnt faught anything since I rested which must have been a couple of minutes back - she cured III'd me for what I hadnt rested back and pow, she levels up! No delay after the action either.

I can see no reason why this might have been "delayed" from our previous kill, it really seems as though this action - which is core to a healer type - leveled her. I dont know for sure though, of course. Killing mobs may very well give bigger chunks towards a level though. Or perhaps only for "attacker" types? Leveling may be different between styles, and there is nothing that really indicates NPCs have the same leveling process as PC's. We KNOW that NPCs don't have jobs identical to the PC ones because no PC job combination can wear a Seer's Tunic and wield a GKT, for instance.

And Inuakurei, no need to get offended. I'm not saying your input isnt valuable or that you're definitely wrong, just that I disagree. In fact I CANNOT say that what you are saying is wrong, because there is very little concrete evidence at all here. I am merely saying that I disagree on one or two of your points.

Edited, Mon Jul 25 20:48:31 2005 by Sammich
#353 Jul 25 2005 at 8:12 PM Rating: Decent
hmmmm this is intriguing...

maybe she doesnt lvl up cos of exp at all...

perhaps she just lvls up when doing her job more... if that makes sense..

i duno how turtelin got his/hers leveled so fast...

iv had mine out like 10 times, bout 4 times with my 60PLD, 2 with 30WAR and 2 with 14-18 MNK and 2 other times and she is only lvl 31.. from the fights i did with war and mnk she wud def be getting exp, fairly sizeable too

i think we need to abandon looking for exp. patterns and look for new ones O.o

EDIT: he lvld up on the 3rd or 4th fight when i had him out with my WAR

hes elvaan male, on attacker mode if that helps

Edited, Mon Jul 25 21:13:26 2005 by djbenny
#354 Jul 25 2005 at 8:14 PM Rating: Default
Sammich wrote:
People have said there is a "lag" between kills and leveling, often. I think that this is due to EXP or some other factor towards NPC leveling - because no one knows for certain that NPCs even level in the same EXP-based system that we do - which is gained from performing actions.
Unless walking is an important skill for Attacker style, it's based on EXP.

Also, read my post. The effects were immediate after the mob died, just the message was delayed.

It's based on EXP.

Edited, Mon Jul 25 21:22:04 2005 by Priran
#355 Jul 25 2005 at 8:38 PM Rating: Decent
42 posts
Well, okay, I admit that in that case it couldnt have been any action leveling him up. But a "delay" makes no sense to me and absolutely doesnt explain the level my NPC got after such a long gap, and promptly following an action.

I think that killing mobs for "EXP" has something to do with it. But it doesnt, in my eyes, explain everything. If you can offer a valid explanation for the "delay" then maybe "EXP" is all of it, but otherwise it seems much more likely that other processes are at work.

In the end though, neither of us really have proof to any of these statements, just isolated instances which imply certain possibilities. So lets keep our minds open to various possibilities, I know I will.

Edit: It MIGHT also be time based! Hmm...

Edited, Mon Jul 25 21:42:36 2005 by Sammich
#356 Jul 25 2005 at 8:48 PM Rating: Decent
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1,809 posts
hey turtlelin, can the NPC dual wield two katanas if you trade two of them to luto?
#357 Jul 25 2005 at 9:01 PM Rating: Good
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903 posts
"Your NPC's leveling is based on EXP, not some other condition like some others said. Mine finished after a normal fight, didn't even use a WS, and leveled. What seems to be confusing people is the lag between the end of the fight and seeing the message for the level."

No offense intended but I disagree whole-heartedly. Again my NPC managed to level up today and there was no killing involved. We had stopped and taken a break. Literally minutes had passed so theres no way that a "ten second delay" or anything akin to that happened to for the XP to catch up to her.

We engaged a mob, she used Tachi: Goten and IMMEDIATELY leveled up after performing her action. The fight was not over yet; so there is NO POSSIBLE WAY she could have earned experience points akin to the way we do because the mob had not yet been killed; and it had been at least 3 minutes since our last kill.

I maintain that your NPCs gain "XP" by performing actions, as I said in my last post. After seeing it happen a second time. I really do think its akin to us skilling up---we get enhancing skill ups by casting buffs on our friends. We get healing skill ups by curing our friends. We get weapon skill ups by being involved in melee combat.

Obviously further testing needs to be done. But it seems this "Action Points" method of leveling is how they go about doing things. But again. More input is going to be needed before we make any real decisions on this I suppose.

Keep the posts coming.

~Myrrial
#358 Jul 25 2005 at 9:02 PM Rating: Decent
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179 posts
Well, more data.
Runs 4 and 5 were set with her as attacker.
Interestingly enough, I think I might have gotten 16 kills in on run 4. However, I probably miscounted. Run 5 had 15 kills.
Still no level up.
Attacker was quite amazing. She pulled hate once out of the 30 fights we had (I was just shooting arrows). I saw her use Counter during that time. She also had Double Attack...which was shooting off more than I'd ever seen before. Almost 1 in every 3 swings had DA kick in.
As far as damage goes, she's kept up quite well. She hits about as often as I do on Batallia Downs mobs, for about 1/3-1/2 of my damage. I'm using a Hosodachi as a level 39SAM/WAR, she's using a one-handed sword. She also gained TP half as fast as I did.
Attacker also has the only one that gives TP notifications.

About to take her out on Run 6 as a healer.
#359 Jul 25 2005 at 9:14 PM Rating: Decent
Its not based on exp. On run 4 i took my npc to the desert and after i killed a beetle, i casted utsu on me, then stoneskin and he leveled after i gained the effect of stoneskin my R/S was fine the whole time no 0 or even below 200
Dosnt lvl by exp.
BTW: Was on mode "Attacker"

Edited, Mon Jul 25 22:19:32 2005 by Feisei
#360 Jul 25 2005 at 9:36 PM Rating: Good
#361 Jul 25 2005 at 9:39 PM Rating: Decent
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179 posts
I think I may have forgotten to mention this previously, but I've got an Elvaan F NPC, long silver hair, named Liabelle.

Run 6 as healer.
Spells used: Shell, Protect II, Cure III (165 HP), Dia, Aquaveil, Slow, Silence, Paralyze, Paralyna, Blink
Her dammage was about a quarter of mine, doubling on the rare critical.
First spell count for low MP: Cure III x2, Shell x2, Protect II x2, Dia.
Second spell count for low MP: Aquaveil, Slow x2, Cure III x2, Silence, Dia, Paralyze, Paralyna*
Third spell count for low MP: Blink, Silence, Dia, Cure III** x2.
Fourth spell count for low MP: Cure III, Shell, Protect II, Dia, Cure III
Fifth spell count for low MP: Blink, Paralyze, Dia, Slow, Cure III
Note that I counted this when she said "Be careful. I'm almost out of magic."
*Paralyna was cast after the warning.
**Leveled up after casting the second Cure III. I wasn't given a warning at that time, so I chose to restart, since MP is restored at a level up. =\

She leveled up after casting that second Cure III.

Fifteen battles.

EDIT: After this run, I could trade weapons. Gave her a Butterfly Axe and I'm setting her back to attacker.

Edited, Mon Jul 25 22:42:18 2005 by DDRMachine
#362 Jul 26 2005 at 12:46 AM Rating: Decent
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239 posts
Might as well list what ive done with my NPC. I have only taken her out for 3 runs so far. All three times I was my lvl 63 BST.

The first two runs I took her out to Sauromugue Champaign just killing anything I came across. Then I read a post here about fighting mobs much higher lvl than your NPC.

The 3rd run I took her to west altep. I let carrie get hate then heeled him while my NPC whacked away.

I saw she was having a hard time hitting some of the mobs so I went after some lower lvl one there.

I figure if they are on a point lvling system it would be better for her to hit often.

Not long after that she hit lvl 31. When she left I went back to town to see if anything had changed. It gave me the option of changeing her style which I set to healer.

Now to wait for tomorrow to test it out.
#363 Jul 26 2005 at 1:00 AM Rating: Decent
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125 posts
i had a strange occurance that could mean something somewhat important.

today was my 6th and 7th run, on the 6th run my NPC finally reached level 31, then right after my NPC left i used the NPC pearl drop trick and just when he left he dinged level 32, so he essentially gained another level effortlessly on the 7th run. anyone had a strange occurance to level this fast?

i was killing dhalmel, antica, beetles in eastern altepa.

he is set to attacker mode
#364 Jul 26 2005 at 2:02 AM Rating: Decent
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2,742 posts
Just finished summon 6 :( level 32 (almost 33 I think)

But no option to switch weapons yet.
#365 Jul 26 2005 at 2:28 AM Rating: Good
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130 posts
Ok, I've had my npc for almost 7 days now, and I have taken her out each and every day, and for the last two days, twice a day by dropping the pearl. On the third day, I was able to change her job to healer. But she has yet to level up or change her armor at all. I was just wondering if anyone else has had these things happen to s/he. I just think it is strange that she will leave, I will go visit her, and she will be exactally the same as before. No armor changes, no level, nothing. :/
#366 Jul 26 2005 at 2:40 AM Rating: Decent
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3,640 posts
Quote:
Took my NPC to Altep with my blackmage today, no level up or anything.. he actually LEFT me in themiddle of battle this time... "it's getting late... i have to go" and leaves me after only 8 battles...


reminds me of my last trip to the dunes lol
#367 Jul 26 2005 at 2:41 AM Rating: Decent
42 posts
I would suggest you

A) Level in Yhoator or some equal or higher area where 30+ PC's could EXP.

and (AND mind you, not or!)

B) You let the NPC do it's job in battle. Dont slaughter your 15 enemies before NPC can touch them, if it's shield type let it take some hits, if it's attacker let it score some hits, and if it's healer give it a chance to heal and buff you!

I dont know for sure what causes leveling but those two should ensure both major possibilities (EXP and Actions). I'd hint towards the second but I dunno~ could be very wrong.
#368 Jul 26 2005 at 2:50 AM Rating: Decent
@The above:
My NPC levelled today on its 3rd run out. I was out in Sauromugue, and levelled it almost exclusively on ***** and Couerls. It was set on shield, and damned if I let it tank (It took a few hits, but definitely wasn't tanking).
#369 Jul 26 2005 at 2:57 AM Rating: Decent
42 posts
Like I said I'm just guessing. It may be they get advanced (their sort of exp...) from using any action, maybe it's weighted for their job so like tanking would be worth double. In any case, I dont think killing alone does it. Time, action, and killing are the 3 variables involved, at least one of them has to effect your NPC's leveling and maybe all 3!

Anyway. I'd still try to make my NPC actually *do* stuff. Thanks for the info~

EDIT: BTW Congratulations on 2005 posts Hunter o.o what an awesome coincidence. Woo~!

Edited, Tue Jul 26 03:59:42 2005 by Sammich

UPDATE: My NPC just leveled while sitting - and I mean sitting, doing nothing - about half a minute after making a kill. That's just too long for a delay... but she wasnt doing anything o_o I'm starting to think this is time based. Equipment seems to be more based on her actions though, maybe. I let her attack a LOT more than usual last run and she switched from Seer's to something wierd, not mage-ish. Maybe Mithra RSE or Nomad's. It's brown, short sleeved. Weird stuff, still very unknown.

Edited, Tue Jul 26 04:38:56 2005 by Sammich
#370 Jul 26 2005 at 7:32 AM Rating: Decent
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2,313 posts
NPC is level 33. I've taken him to west. altp desert. Healer seems to get less hate then melee.

I've been fighting too weak mobs (to me), however at his level he must be gaining exp.

Sessions last 45 min.

I'm hoping they last longer as the npc gains higher levels.
#371 Jul 26 2005 at 8:17 AM Rating: Decent
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133 posts
6th outing

Took Henrietta to Kazham to kill some goblins. To be exact 10goblin smithy and 5 furrier. She ding lvl31 on the 14th goblin ^^ /joy. This time round, I allowed her to do more damage by, hasting her and me using a low damage dagger (platoon dagger) and casting all normal enfeebling i normally would on a exp mob, so i would melee less.

Took 30mins to kill the 15 goblins. She did a couple of WS, from flat blade to burning blade.
Side note: she did not do any single fast blade and only red lotus blade once.

After she left, same thing, went to RV pt to check her out. And of course,
New set of armour ^^
actually just minor changes from her previous armour.

Went to Luto later (much much later ^^; went on a long mission 1st XD ) , after a short CS i realise i can trade weapons ^^ I bought 2 kunai and trade to Luto in hope i would see her dual wield those ^^ Tomorrow, I'll be able to see how it goes ^^
#372 Jul 26 2005 at 9:02 AM Rating: Decent
31 posts
My NPC hit level 31 last night and here is what I noticed:

We were fighting a goblin, i decided to target him to see how his hitpoints were doing. I was shocked to find he was very low, even though he had not been hit much during the battle.

I started to cast Cure III on him, about this time a goblin bomb dropped. This bomb would have killed him based on the HP I had observed, so my only guess is there was a lag, and it was actually this bomb that caused his HP to drop.

The bomb interrupted my cure III, and also caused the goblin to die :), so I went to cast cure again on my NPC. This time I targeted him and his HP were totally full.

And finally a few seconds later I get the message and animation that he had reached level 31.

In the end it was obvious to me that that there were several odd lag incidents here. First my NPC showed the HP loss from the bomb toss well before the bomb actually dropped. Two, As soon as the goblin died, my NPC's HP's were full. And Finally, my NPC did not get the level up animation for a couple seconds after the goblin died.

Anyway, that's just my observation. I'll try to watch again next time he levels to see if the behavior is similar.
#373 Jul 26 2005 at 9:15 AM Rating: Decent
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86 posts
i got mine to level yesterday. the npc is a fem taru in healer mode.

took her out to Rolanberry Fields the first two days (she had chainmail) with my 38 drg/whm

on the third day i took her out to west altepa with my 69 mnk/whm. big mistake took on a cactuar i got hit with 1000 needles. while she didn't have any damage previous the 500 hit took her out. went to r.p. and had ability to change job type.

took her back to r.f. and just kept killing eps and dcs.

it's funny when she leveled she immediately left just like some people do. lol.


#374 Jul 26 2005 at 11:28 AM Rating: Decent
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869 posts
Day 6...

First of all... Days 1-5 have been decidedly unproductive. I was killed twice as a 30 SMN with him (once after 1 fight ><), had to send him away after 2 fights so I could zone some skellies that were a little tougher than I'd thought, and likely wasted one day by calling him to help my 13 SAM.

Onward and upward...

Based on what I'm beginning to understand, the best way to go is to pit your NPC against mobs that a Lv 30 would gain XP from. So last night I took Wagwei out to Rolanberry to kill mobs that would be EM-VT to him, but are TWTBW to me. Targeted the higher-end Quads in the zone (Silver, Zircon, etc) most of which are supposed to be 30-36. Also fought a couple of Goobs. He stayed about 30-35 minutes... not sure how many kills. Still hasnt leveled (gotta be close), but I got the option to trade (am I crazy, or did Luto say 'Loan?') beginner weapons.

I'm debating between a GK and a GA. Being a mage, I know tragically little about SC. For now I'm more interested in the looks-badass-factor. meh. :D

I may try Yhoat or Yuhtunga tonight. If that doesnt push him to 31... nothing will. I just hope it goes better than Xarcabard.
#375 Jul 26 2005 at 12:30 PM Rating: Decent
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603 posts
From all I seen...

Your NPC has approx 45min~1 hour to lvlup

NPC limit of fights is 15

Since the NPC is Lv 15.. its best to fight stuff that an exp pt would around that lvl (maybe it gets exp chains faster you kill)

so like kill things a lv 35 party would kill and i'd lvlup faster.

I'm currently using a Lv 75 rdm fighting a lv40 exp party of beetles in altep desert near the platue, the NPC is already lv 33 and my guess is at the rate it lvls (every 2 calls) it will be 34 today
#376 Jul 26 2005 at 2:34 PM Rating: Decent
hey guys.... some of u try this plz..

id do it myself only iv just used both my pearls for the day..

ok wat someone said earlier has given me an idea

they said their NPC lvld after using a WS and also i think mine leveled only when it was usin Great Katana which was very accurate.

now im usin GS which is less accurate and no lvls in last 7 or 8 calls

so can someone please try usin a Dagger or sword, somethin that is quick and accurate with accurate WS and see if lvls are any faster.

this is only a hunch so dont everyone try it and waste ur calls >.< but someone plz do
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