On the subject of in-game same-sex marriage....Follow

Evidently you haven't taken a good look at the Mithra lately. We're not bad, we're just dressed that way. >*_*<



See, now here's one thing I don't understand about the whole gay rights debate, and is where I usually get myself in trouble on this topic. :) We all know that discussing sex is uncomfortable in America; it's why 'gay rights' has such a stigma. Considering this, is there a reason why a homosexual person *needs* to tell their sexual preference to every person they meet? Maybe it's just my Iowa naivete, but most people I know don't walk down the street talking about their favorite sexual positions.

I believe in acceptance in all forms, and respect for all beliefs even if you don't agree with them. Considering this, I don't see why homosexuality needs to be an issue. It's none of my business what anyone does in their beds, and I don't ask those kind of questions.

So, with that in mind...why would a homosexual person feel they were unaccepted when going to a resturant, or walking down the street? I've met people who were gay/lesbian, and maybe it's just me...but they seem just like everyone else on the outside. Must have something to do with the fact that they *are* just like everyone else.

Since it's not tattooed on one's forehead, why should anyone be worried that Joe-On-The-Street is going to think them a 'deviant'?

EDIT: YAY! This is a claimed page, in the name of ME! :) (I hope I'm following the rules right....)

Edited, Mon Aug 9 12:42:48 2004 by mtknife

Once again CBD, you are only basing this off of what you think or how you think God should be. That is what i mean by saying you think you know what God wants and what he wants to do. You cant define the biblical view of God on what you think.

God's law does not change, it is only clarified when Christ came. Christ himself said he did not come to abolish God's law but to fulfill it. He extended adultry to even lust, murder to hatred. I say extended, but this is no different than old testament law.


You do understand that Christ didn't fulfill us not being able to eat certain meats, correct?

You seem to have missed the entire point of what I wrote.

Edited, Mon Aug 9 12:45:29 2004 by CBD

Why are you playing this game? I doubt your answer will be "to express my sexuality."

In any medium, and definitely in this game, there are all kinds of underrepresented beliefs and mindsets.

What about all of the vegetarians who have to kill to get experience, eating meat to power up their attack and collecting hides and meat to get money. Should there be a way to level up without killing? Should there be a vegetarian alternative to Mithkabobs?

What about all of the black people forced to play light-skinned characters?

What about all of the gays out there who can't have a homosexual marraige ceremony?

What about people who play female characters and don't want to dress slutty, with underwear for AF pants and RSE that flaunts cleavage?

The list can go on and on, how there are real people out there whose beliefs can't be experessed in the game, and how there are controversial issues that don't seem to be addressed. The sad truth is that it is neither Squaresoft's priority or intention to address these issues. They implemented marriage in the traditional sense and moved on.

I think you should stop seeing your plight as unique and defining. I sympathize with your counterculteral lifestyle and beliefs, but there is no reason why they should be implemented into a game, or why their lack of implementation has to be a cultural statement. How do you think all of the vegetarians feel, defending their beliefs in the real world? I think it probably applies to any minority.

As a counterpoint, how would you feel if homosexual marraiges were implemented and all of the 12-year-old kids out used the system to mock your beliefs and lifestyle? There might even be more "joke" homosexual marraiges than real ones. Can't you see how Squaresoft catering to a default view and avoiding controversy is really best for everyone?

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't Galka genderless? Everyone refers to them as male, but they aren't. Sooo....shouldn't a Galka be able to marry anyone??

But who would want to marry a Galka? o.o

j/k big guys, don't eat me

Honestly, what's with all the religious citations? Since when is the bible the universal authority on God's word? The OP isn't asking if Christianity sanctions homosexual marriages, he's asking whether it's wrong to ban it in a game. Now that Al-Queda has officially hijacked this thread, maybe it should be moved to OTF.



The point is the game makers prevent people from partaking in an activity based on their class. How would you feel if all female characters got - points for all their attributes? Would "Don't be a female then, duh" be your response? No, it should be "WTF, why are females gimped!" He's upset at the game's condemning (through banning same-sex marriage) of his own lifestyle and has every reason to be.

I'd agree with you except they specifically ban same-sex marriage. It's not something unsaid --which in my eyes makes it "more right." Going out and saying "XXX is banned" as opposed to not mentioning it all together is two different things. The former implies more of a disregard than the latter. To use one of your examples, if SE specifically stated "There are no black character models" I'm betting the reaction wouldn't be one of approval.

You're right you shouldn't be playing the game to express your sexuality, but when the gamemakers are attacking your life style by specifically forbidding it in game, how can you not take offense?


Edited, Mon Aug 9 12:59:52 2004 by vxvenom

Guys, I'm not ant-gay marraige here. just getting that point across.


Square isn't going to allow it, so please let the undeadchobohorse rest in peace, ok? Whether right or wrong for them to do it, Square has made a choice and there's not a big chance they will change that decision. We've all seen how well they have rsponded to calls to put gil sellers out of business....


So just let it die!

Quote:
Or, alternatively, you know for a fact the doc who tells you how ill you are is a quack and decide to seek a second opinion.

So, basically, I can be as ***** as I want, and as long as I accept Jesus as my savior I'm good?

Does this apply to murder, rape, pillaging and theft? If I repent, and accept Christ into my heart I get to hang out in paradise with you?


You are very entitled to seek a second opinion. Ask the guy sitting behind you on the plane. You better just hope hes not a quack as well, of course he could be just as blind to the plane crashing itself.
All analogies break down, please understand i was only trying to give a reason, on why God's law condemns has to be told when talking christianity.

and your second quote. I was waiting for one of these. No you cant.
For another analogy, if you were to say your hobby was FFXI. Yet youve never sat down and played the game, really read about it, or applied your life to it. Would your hobby really be FFXI?

My point is, is that as Christ says, if you love me you will keep my commandments. Faith is given by the Grace of God, but it isnt some passive license to do whatever we want. Grace is sufficient, we no longer should sin. If we truly believe we are a christian, then we should be called to walk the talk and live alife according to how God wants.

But we do sin, becaues we still battle against sin in our own life in this world. The fact that we fail, doesnt excuse us, but it makes the cross of Christ all that much larger.

Paul considered to be quite in abidance with the law of God, called himself the chief of sinners. He killed other christians, yet God by his grace called him to repentance and to serve Him. God didnthave to, but he did. How did Paul live afterward? He still sinned, but he strove to do the things God required of him, not because he could, but because He loved Christ.

I hope that brief segement helps you understand that.

Back on topic....

I fell its not really fair to ask of SE to make a call that society hasnt made yet. Same-Sex marriages are a hot topic atm in NA and some to a certain extent some other countries.

I dont think SE as a company needs to make social statements. They, im sure, have no dislike towards the two main protagonist in this debate, the pro same sex mariage and the anti same sex mariage. Each have their reasons, and their support in the communities in the RL. But the fact of the matter is, its not a solved issue in RL just yet, and therefore i see no reason for SE to alienate any of the two groups.

SE has simply copied the traditionnal position of society on same-sex mariage. In a sense, Vanadiel is a mirror of the actual world. Same sex mariages are on the rise, but not yet there. When they will have a widespread acceptance in RL, you will see them pop in Vanadiel.

You've just invalidated your own statement. If the Bible says there's only one way to look at the world if you want to be Saved...then any straying from the 'approved path' leads to condemnation. I am a Christian, and I believe Jesus was sent to Earth by God to redeem us from sin. At the same time, I believe that God is called many other names by many other people on this planet (be it Allah, the state of Nirvana, or whatever) and that he's fine with this. (I believe the commandment "Thou shalt not have other Gods before me" refers to the choosing of vices over a living a godly life, but that's another topic.)

The gospel is *about* salvation, it isn't THE salvation in and of itself. One's salvation is strictly between oneself and the Lord, and what's the correct life path for one person isn't necessarily the correct life path for another.

Therefore....(to pull this horse back on topic before its inevitable death)....to me, one's sexual orientation, and how one handles their life and the expression of their love, is a topic between God and them. It's nobody else's business. So please check your Sin level before doing a Ranged Attack with a stone.

Quote:
*You do understand that Christ didn't fulfill us not being able to eat certain meats, correct?

You seem to have missed the entire point of what I wrote.*


You do understand that some laws given in leviticus were cultural, and some were sacrificial? Certain laws had to be in place, especially certain foods and cleanliness because of so many people iving in such a small area. disease spreads quickly.

the new testament discusses thats okay to eat any meat, as long as it doesnt affect your weaker brother..

Sacrificial laws passed away when Christ died, because he was the ultimate sacrifice. Therefore, they are no longer needed.

There is alot more that goes into this, thats why its important as you say not to just take whaty ou hear at face value that its hard to interpret Scripture when so many have different views it seems. (And it has gotten off topic for the most part) However, Scripture should be intepreted with other scripture, in light of cultural, language, and history. If you are really interested on having at least what the bible says as far as fundamental christian beliefs, then I encourage you to read it and to dive in under such a context.

I am also sorry there are morons in this world who would lable people as alqeda so i agree with you there. Thats uncalled for.

(At least if there is right or wrong iin this world) ;)