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Sickening truth behind mysuper*****.com I found out todayFollow

#1 Aug 08 2004 at 11:25 AM Rating: Default
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ok.. this my 1st post here so bear with me. Im not the kind who like to post but earlier today i was so **** that I have to post here. I'll make it as short as possible

I have been wondering why in ifrit server there are people with either a retarded or severely underleveled sub. when they level they don't give a sh*t about their job's role, do not speak english or japanese, only chinese, horrible equipment, rank 1 etc.

now before flaming me please read on first. nothing racist whatsoever.

I have ever ptied with these retards on my way to level 50 when suddenly they disappeared nowhere, so I thought they might be doing rank up or perhaps level cap items.. then when I do area search day by day ( 7 days already now), I realised these retards are here all the time and are always there whenever Im online

manday 50pld/15thf rank 1 castle birdhouse
azsx 50mnk/15thf rank 1 same place
xiaolei 50rdm/15thf same place
and I forgot who else will update later

seeing not many campers at castle oztro I decided to camp for kote there. I ptied with azsx before and all he ever said was yes, no, english no good. so Im pretty sure he doesn't speak english well.
while camping at oztroja I decided to /tell to him in jp to kill boredom and he replied with ??. so my last resort was to /tell in chinese.. and bingo he replied .. here's how the conversation goes roughly (translated to english)

him: how are you?
me: fine what about you?
him: not too good haven't met my target yet
me: ah good luck then Im sure u can do it
him: I hope so. how much boss target you?
me:..
"I was lost for a moment there.. kinda shocked.. my imagination started to run wild."
me: what do you mean? I don't understand? (pretending)
him: I said how much your boss target you?
me: target what exactly?
him: u pretending to be stupid or what? u playing the game for money rite?
me: not really
him: bs. if not for money for what? which batch u belong to?
me: no idea. hold on that means someone asked you to earn in game gil?
him: yes
me: where are you from
him: somewhere in china
me: so about that boss.. how much gil do you have to earn in a day?
him: 100K minimum
me: you do this for a living?
him: yes I have a wife and kids to feed so I hunt NM and farm till at least I have 100K Gil a day before I can take a break, else I might lose my job
me: lemme guess your boss is no other than mysuper*****.com?
him: why yes, how did you know that?
me: never mind how I knew that ( I made a wild guess actually)
him: tell me how did you know so much? which batch do you belong to?
me: nah Im not from mainland china so I don't belong to any batches whatsoever.. Im pretty sure manday and xiaolei is in the same batch as you huh? rank 1 with 15thf as sub never leave this castle..
him: yes, you are pretty smart to know this!
me: nah its pretty obvious lol
him: lol
me: so how many people are working for your boss inc yourself in this ifrit server?
him: about 5 people currently that I know of.
me: ok good luck
him: you too

forum readers seriously I don't have to say anything more about this. no jp no na camping for kote.. only these retards and me.. say whatever you want Im curious about your opinions
thank you


























Edited, Sun Aug 8 12:26:41 2004 by Rosx
#2 Aug 08 2004 at 11:36 AM Rating: Decent
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Dont really have anhing to add to that other than kudos for knowing chinese japanese and english :) i have problems learning other languages.
#3 Aug 08 2004 at 11:45 AM Rating: Decent
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strange..

If what he said to you was true, talk about sweat shop labor 100k is what like 20$ I'd guess he'd get about 1$ for it after what his boss takes. Not exactly gona feed the kids unless chinas econamy is more screwed up then I thought
#4 Aug 08 2004 at 11:48 AM Rating: Decent
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badspeller wrote:
strange..

If what he said to you was true, talk about sweat shop labor 100k is what like 20$ I'd guess he'd get about 1$ for it after what his boss takes. Not exactly gona feed the kids unless chinas econamy is more screwed up then I thought


He probably gets about $8-9 out of it.

AFAIK, $8/day in China will support you as well as minimum wage in most states in the US (i.e. if you have a second wage-earner as well, it will).
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#5 Aug 08 2004 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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you should post a copy of this or I would like to see if admin could move this to the Suggestions forum so the developers can see this. This is a ridiculously huge problem on Cerberus - There is a whole linkshell with about 10-15 people with Cn at the begin of their name - chinese gil sellers, and another group of people with cool in front of their name - i did /sea all cool one day there were 7 of them, all different classes level 44 rank 3 san doria. These guys as well as various others either camp davoi, castle oztroja, delkfutts tower, of zi'tah - ALL THE TIME. And its the dame thing - underlevelled subs, **** gear, do not respond to english or the translator.

And they always have a dragoon in their camping group to try to block your /targetnpc

if SE isn't going to block these people or investigate the actions of gil sellers ruining the economy and robbing the people actually playing to play there is going to be a very serious fallout.
#6 Aug 08 2004 at 11:54 AM Rating: Decent
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I read recently that the average yearly income of the Chinese peasant class is around $250. It was in the story about the kid who committed suicide because his family couldn't get together the money to pay for his college entrance exam.
#7 Aug 08 2004 at 11:55 AM Rating: Decent
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Check my thread "User Agreement". I think it will be enlightening.

EDIT : Sorry >< here's the URL

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1091983904688179698&num=0

Edited, Sun Aug 8 12:55:57 2004 by Yunchang
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#8 Aug 08 2004 at 11:58 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
He probably gets about $8-9 out of it.

AFAIK, $8/day in China will support you as well as minimum wage in most states in the US (i.e. if you have a second wage-earner as well, it will).


Wow. Of course, I can't say I'd blame him for doing the work. It probably does get a little boring, especially if he doesn't like these sort of games that much, but he's getting paid for a pretty easy job (if a long and boring one). Probably not a bad gig for him.



Edited, Sun Aug 8 13:02:48 2004 by qiqi
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#9 Aug 08 2004 at 12:22 PM Rating: Decent
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What really makes me crazy is that the chinese gil-sellers who I have to deal with on a semi-daily basis, may just be doing this to barely feed their family. Yet since I don't know this for a fact I can't help but feel an overwhelming amount of distaste for them. It would definitely explain their usual rudeness.
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#10 Aug 08 2004 at 12:25 PM Rating: Decent
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I do know one thing about the site you are speaking of, they do offer the option to sell your gil. So not all gil is from these people you ran into. Also I spoke with a person who works for this company, they say it's pretty laid back, they have enough people to supply gil to keep everyone happy.

Moral: Do not buy gil.
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#11 Aug 08 2004 at 12:27 PM Rating: Decent
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For reference

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1091983904688179698&num=0
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#12 Aug 08 2004 at 12:32 PM Rating: Decent
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Maybe you should show that to SE, Yun. Maybe it'll remind them that they made a rule against buying/selling gil.
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#13 Aug 08 2004 at 1:17 PM Rating: Decent
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the selling off gill online is a rampant problem, something that cannot just be solved by removing these people- problem is if you ban the account in question the person behind the computer will get a new account and continue this practice.

the only time square CAN ban someone for this sort of practice is when he hands the gill over to you but then again the payment of the gill was already made beforehand so square has no real way of solving the matter.

suing the company wont help either as i assume most of the websites are on dummy accounts and are usually hard to track to the person who is responsible plus suing someone in china will probably be very hard
#14 Aug 08 2004 at 1:28 PM Rating: Default
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These posts make me laugh.

Are you guys living under a rock? Do you realize that selling virtual cash has been in every single game? Why do you assume that just because people are camping a mob, they are doing it to sell GIL?

I think people are just making up B.S. now, and creating sockpuppets to try and reinforce their argument (this poster for example has 1 post ROFL).

Don't misunderstand, obviously "some" of the people are doing it for GIL to sell, but not everyone. In addition, there are NA players who do this too, there are TONS of NA players that fish BOT, think they are selling GIL? I do.... It's not limited to Asian people for christ sakes!

Now lets assume for the moment that nobody ever bought/sold GIL. Do you think there would be competition for spawns? Many farmers on 24/7? I do...

I also know guilds that share passwords to PL characters 24/7 in shifts. They don't do it for GIL, they do it to level up whatever class it is that they need in order to farm BCNM's and other things.

Any of you play EQ? Remeber when the uber guilds were blocking access to the elemental planes (by killing key mobs soon as they spawned) for months? They did this to FARM the zones and didnt want competition. Were they doing it to sell platinum? Nope! You guys arent playing with a full deck if you assume every **** camper is out there to sell GIL. Stop your crying already!

You want to blame someone? Blame Square, they designed a game with too many timesinks. Farming (countless HOURS) is required and is boring as hell. They drive people to buying GIL because nobody finds it fun to farm. And those who can't afford to buy GIL, and are too lazy to farm, come here and post these silly rumors.

Edited, Sun Aug 8 14:28:50 2004 by DaluinRizzo
#15 Aug 08 2004 at 1:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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heh, you're talking with someone studying this exact problem, the economics of crime.

In a rational situation, there will be gil sellers, and there will be gil buyers. People will get caught and banned, and others will go without getting caught. Eventually, the system will reach a relative equilibrium of gil sellers, based on the profit of gil selling versus the risk of being caught.

However, there are many reasons why this is not a rational situation.

1) There is no risk.

There is no risk in selling gil, because the only punishment Square Enix can offer is to ban that account. For the casual seller (read: marginal offender), this is a risk. To a business, this is not a risk, as accounts can be in steady supply, and because if the whole business is banned, they can simply move to another form of business. No punitive actions are taken against businesses.

2) There is no enforcement.

To reach an equilibrium state, SE would have to put money into enforcing the rules they have stated. However, SE has found no value in enforcing this rule, so that the perceived loss to this crime is zero, thus the rate of crimes is controlled solely by the criminals.
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#16 Aug 08 2004 at 2:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, being an oldschool EQ player (amoung many games) I can tell you that this poster is either full of **** or the guy he spoke with lied to him.

mysupersal**.com is not chinese based. Its based right here in the good old USA. Yantis (guy who owns it) 1st started selling platinum in everquest. There were many people selling EQ items & plat. mysupersal** just happen to become the most prosperous and most reconized in the EQ comunity.

Now he is simply branching out.
So unless he is employing chinese workers this is all fabricated. Either way the "big boss" is still an american guy. Who by the way has made millions of dollars from selling EQ stuff.

There are companies in China that hire chinese at extramly low pay rates to farm game money. Ask anyone that played lineage2. They were rampant in that game.



Edited, Sun Aug 8 15:29:01 2004 by OldSchoolGamer
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#17 Aug 08 2004 at 2:45 PM Rating: Decent
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It makes the game a little harder, but not impossible. More and more I know of casual players who find themselves with more gil then they need (say 3 million) and decide to sell some for quick cash. I don't think any less of them, I'm actually envious, cause I could have all my armor with that gil, instead I'm here fishing, cooking and farming to get it.

If I were strapped for cash, I might resort to that too. I might, but can't say for sure cause I aint quite there yet.

If that chinese kid had the option to sell gil to get cash for his college entrance exam, mabye he would have graduated by now instead of pusing up daises. Or maybe college would have sucked and he'd ended up in the same place. Ya just never know.
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#18 Aug 08 2004 at 2:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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I don't understand why the initial poster keeps referring to them as "these retards" when they are just people trying to make a living.
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#19 Aug 08 2004 at 3:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Its the beastmen! They are now selling GIL, they dont even have subjobs!
#20 Aug 08 2004 at 3:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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gil sellers ruin the game by speeding up the process of mudflation. I don't care if they are just trying to make a living, if they try and sell gil here they are going to have problems.

And Jonathan Yantis is the antichrist. Blame him for the whole thing. I do.
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#21 Aug 08 2004 at 3:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Another thing to point out. SE is well aware of the web sites that are selling gil. Stuff like that has to be dealt with through their legal department. So reporting these people to GMs does nothing.
#22 Aug 08 2004 at 9:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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so, if it is the beastment that are selling gil, they can just set a bit aside each time they respawn. Thats means they have less to drop when we kill them since they are just saving it up knowing that they will respawn in a couple of minutes with more gil.

I know from experience that these beastmen are onlone 24/7. Everywhere you go, there are a bunch of them just walking around.

Since SE is resposible for providing them with the gil they are selling in the first place, I dont think anything will be done about this problem. This also explains why they never drop any items worth keeping. I bet Goblin fishers spawn with mithran rods, but they just swap it out for a yew.

This game is geared to favor NPC's and it's not fair.

hhmm.should i even hit the post button....why not, the boards are already swamped with useless posts. one more isnt going to hurt.....especially if it exposes a conspiracy
#23 Aug 08 2004 at 11:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I find it funny every time I read a post that claims (or comes close to claiming) that farming mobs is the only way to make gil. Anyone who believes such needs to do more research. I can make a ton of gil on a good day and not lay a finger on a monster.

I also chuckle to myself when I see people posting "Im leaving FFXI because _________" and one of the reasons is that they got bored farming mobs for gil. There are many effective ways (and in some cases, more entertaining) ways of getting money. All you have to do is look a little harder.
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#24 Aug 09 2004 at 3:56 AM Rating: Decent
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crafting you mean? fishing? why not tell those dudes about it :)
#25 Aug 09 2004 at 4:27 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Now he is simply branching out.
So unless he is employing chinese workers this is all fabricated. Either way the "big boss" is still an american guy. Who by the way has made millions of dollars from selling EQ stuff.


1)azsx doesn't respond to english, translator or jp. only responded when I used chinese so he must be a chinese.

2) he admitted he's from mainland china, working for mysuper** so unless he lied about it which I don't see why.

3)
Quote:
Once we have picked up your gil at the Mog house, we will send you a Paypal payment (our rating is over 20,000) or we can send you a corporate check from our US or Hong Kong offices, whichever you prefer (checks can be in US Dollars, or Hong Kong dollars)


this is a quote from super** site.. ever wondered why US or hong kong offices? +)
#26 Aug 09 2004 at 9:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
mysupersal**.com is not chinese based. Its based right here in the good old USA. Yantis (guy who owns it) 1st started selling platinum in everquest. There were many people selling EQ items & plat. mysupersal** just happen to become the most prosperous and most reconized in the EQ comunity.

Now he is simply branching out.
So unless he is employing chinese workers this is all fabricated. Either way the "big boss" is still an american guy. Who by the way has made millions of dollars from selling EQ stuff.

There are companies in China that hire chinese at extramly low pay rates to farm game money. Ask anyone that played lineage2. They were rampant in that game.


January 22, 2004 11:12 AM US Eastern Timezone

Virtual Currency Pioneers to Join Forces; Internet Gaming Entertainment Ltd. Acquires Yantis Enterprises, Inc

BOCA RATON, Fla.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Jan. 22, 2004--Internet Gaming Entertainment, Ltd. ("IGE") (www.cannotlinkto), the worldwide leader in the market for buying and selling virtual property used in multiplayer online games, announced today that it has agreed to acquire substantially all of the assets of Yantis Enterprises, Inc. (www.cannotlinkto).


The deal involves both cash and equity in IGE's parent company, IGE U.S. LLC ("IGE U.S."), headquartered in Boca Raton, Florida, according to Randy Maslow, Senior Vice President and General Counsel of IGE U.S.

Massively multiplayer online role-playing games ("MMORPGs") like EverQuest and Ultima Online are filled with virtual property -- things like magic weapons, houses, in-game currency, and characters that are bought and sold on auction exchanges, with thousands of dollars trading hands every day. The total trade volume for virtual property is estimated by Professor Edward Castronova, professor of economics at Cal-State Fullerton, to exceed $400m annually, with an undetermined portion of that amount annually captured in real-world dollars by dealers in virtual currency and goods.

With more than 80 employees and thousands of suppliers, IGE is the largest provider in the world of virtual currency exchange and game-enhancement services to players of MMORPGs. The company provides 24x7x365 customer service and tech support from its state of the art operations center in Kowloon Bay, Hong Kong.

"Jonathan Yantis is an entrepreneur who blazed the trail in creating a market for the exchange of virtual currency and property," said Brock Pierce, CEO of IGE U.S. "This acquisition is a big step for both us and the virtual currency exchange market as a whole, and solidifies our position as the largest player in this market by far."

Mr. Yantis will be joining IGE U.S. as Chief Operating Officer and a member of the company's Board of Managers. The other members of the Board include Mr. Pierce, Mr. Maslow and Alan Debonneville, President of the IGE subsidiary in Hong Kong.

"This is a marriage of the two pioneers in this industry," said Jonathan Yantis. "I'm excited to be joining IGE and look forward to our future successes together."

About IGE

IGE is the worldwide leader in providing game-enhancement services to players of online massively multiplayer online role-playing games ("MMORPGs"). IGE has built an internet-based platform for the buying and selling of virtual currency and virtual goods used by players of MMORPGs. IGE is also the worldwide market leader in providing "power-leveling" services whereby players may increase the skill level of their own MMORPG characters without the investment of time usually required and without the risk of purchasing another gamer's account. IGE's services are provided from the company's state-of-the-art operations center in Kowloon Bay, Hong Kong. IGE is a wholly-owned subsidiary of IGE U.S., LLC, headquartered in Boca Raton, Florida. For more information, visit the website at http://www.cannotlinkto.

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#27 Aug 09 2004 at 12:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Registrant:
Mysuper****, LLC (MYSUPER****-DOM)
105 NW 43rd St.
Boca Raton, FL 33431
US

Domain Name: MYSUPER****.COM

Administrative Contact:
Yantis, Jonathan (37758755P) jonyantis@mysuper****.com
Mysuper*****, LLC
105 NW 43rd St.
Boca Raton, FL 33431
US
917-340-3400

Technical Contact:
Network Solutions, LLC. (HOST-ORG) customerservice@networksolutions.com
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Record expires on 12-Jan-2008.
Record created on 12-Jan-2001.
Database last updated on 9-Aug-2004 13:16:39 EDT.

OrgName: Rackspace.com
OrgID: RSPC
Address: 112 E. Pecan St.
Address: Suite 600
City: San Antonio
StateProv: TX
PostalCode: 78205
Country: US

NetRange: 69.20.0.0 - 69.20.127.255
CIDR: 69.20.0.0/17
NetName: RSPC-NET-4
NetHandle: NET-69-20-0-0-1
Parent: NET-69-0-0-0-0
NetType: Direct Allocation
NameServer: NS.RACKSPACE.COM
NameServer: NS2.RACKSPACE.COM
Comment:
RegDate: 2003-01-24
Updated: 2004-04-28

OrgAbuseHandle: ABUSE45-ARIN
OrgAbuseName: Abuse Desk
OrgAbusePhone: +1-210-892-4000
OrgAbuseEmail: abuse@rackspace.com

OrgTechHandle: IPADM17-ARIN
OrgTechName: IPADMIN
OrgTechPhone: +1-210-892-4000
OrgTechEmail: ipadmin@rackspace.com
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#28 Aug 09 2004 at 9:12 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks layoneil.. for spilling out a little more info about yantis +)
rate you up
#29 Aug 10 2004 at 11:44 PM Rating: Decent
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go ifrit >.>
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#30 Aug 11 2004 at 10:53 AM Rating: Decent
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YO man im on ifrit and I know EXACTLY what you are talking about.

Theres a group of chineese bots that run from jueno, through quifim, into the Tower. The run up the stairs and all. They fight, everything. My whole LS has seen them. I know EXACTLY what you are tlking about. RATE UP MAN


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#31 Aug 12 2004 at 12:26 AM Rating: Default
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thx for your comment and rate up naturi +). I have yet to meet a gil farming bot. these people that I met do respond so they are not bot obviously. they dont respond to you because they don't understand eng or jp.
if u can be bothered, the next time u see them

/tell ni hao ma? <how are you?>

I bet you get a response ^^
#32 Aug 18 2004 at 5:11 AM Rating: Decent
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the problem with SoE and other companies enforcing there user agreements is that they actulay have no legal basis. In more than one occasion where and account has been banned in other online line games, there have been court rulings in favour of the offender.

The reason being that user aggreements are rarely read, and easily skipped by. An agree button is simply not equal to an actual signature.

If User Agreements with legaly binding 100% of the time than perhaps you would see these companies be able to take game money sellers to court, but they don't. So just chew on that little timbit of info.
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#33 Aug 18 2004 at 5:50 AM Rating: Default
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#34 Aug 18 2004 at 6:29 AM Rating: Good
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The only reason you would be against this is jealousy... Sorry but who cares that someone sells their gil? I don't. Only people lazy enough not to earn their gil the hard way complain about this.

Let those chinese people farm money for their employee. Let them get payed. Let them earn their 8 dollars to feed their children for christs sake. You go ahead, you go force SoE to do something against these companies. They close, the people who earned their bread lose there income (even if it sucks) and their children are in hunger... Nice look in the future isn't it? You sitting there behind your 600 dollar PC, paying SoE every month the money those people earn in a year and tell them to stop doing it, cause they steal your NM or wathever. Send a small donations to organisations that help people forced in such situations. They got it much worse then we do.

Sorry but that attitude disgusts me more then the attitude that it is moraly incorrect to let people earn gil to sell it.

Besides, so what if gil gets sold? It's not gonna make the economy crash or something. It's just some smart fella that started the whole process and now makes good money over it. You think he sits in his deskchair with a big cigar spanking his secretaries behind and laugh evily? No he has to work too.

True it is sick to let people earn gil for you, pay them a mere 8 dollars and sell it for 100 times more... But again those people NEED those 8 dollars.

In stead of taking on the 'company' that sells the gil, do somethign about the people buying the gil. Those are the rotten apples.

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#35 Aug 18 2004 at 7:02 AM Rating: Decent
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382 posts

Whats up everyone,

I have a different opinion to this post.

We have to remember that we live in a country where our poor still has access to water, shelter, and food. Most other countries, don't.

If this guy is making money playing a video game to support his family, so be it. I wish I could make a living playing video games.

I'm new and I don't know what mysuper*****.com is.

Just my opinion.
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pitterchi
#36 Aug 18 2004 at 7:14 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
47 posts
Read over what you said again man. Going by your argument, how can it be "wrong" to buy the gil? You could say that the people who buy the gil are supporting those families. You could say that the people who buy the gil are feeding those families. You just can't call one half of a business wrong or against the rules. That's like saying "Ok, it's illegal to buy crack, but all cool if you want to sell it". WTF is that?
____________________________
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#37 Aug 18 2004 at 7:30 AM Rating: Decent
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147 posts
I'm sorry.. but I'm going to have to go with saying this is total BS, if for no reason other than that the conversation looks totally made up.
I haven't done much research into the exchange of real currency/virtual currency, but I'm sure there are probably more lucrative ways to make money (even in, gasp, China) than working in some computer sweatshop.
On Ramuh server, there as several people whose names start with Ls followed by chienjei, stank, meiyu(sp) with underlevelled subs. I naturally assumed they were chinese gil farmers because of all the rampant rumors warning me to be careful of anything remotely chinese. I recently PT'd with two members of the LS crew and did very well.
I am Chinese, I can speak Cantonese fluently and my Mandarin is decent. I can hold conversations in both languages online. I've spoken with people who I assumed were members of this um.. infamous Chinese gil selling ring; the majority are in fact, just playing the game for the **** of it.
I'm not saying that theres no chance in **** somewhere in China theres isn't a 300 pound overlord cracking whips because he doesn't heat the sounds of mouses clicking... but again, my personal experiences have shown me most of these people are just playing the game for fun. Dont automatically assume. I'd venture for every "Chinese gil farmer/botter" theres at least two or three NAs or JPs or blind, albino Eskimos selling gil online.

GL7
#38 Aug 18 2004 at 10:13 AM Rating: Decent
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171 posts
To: Randomplayerthree

Did you read my post properly? that conversation is not B.S
don't say it's BS unless u come into Ifrit, play with them and have conversation with them the way I did.

they admitted they are from mainland china and they worked for mysuper*****.com. period. geez I shld've captured chat log with fraps

Quote:
I haven't done much research into the exchange of real currency/virtual currency


then don't act like you know everything

Quote:
I am Chinese, I can speak Cantonese fluently and my Mandarin is decent


So what? Im chinese too, my mandarin is good while my cantonese sux

Quote:
Dont automatically assume


Im not assuming anything here if you care to read my post properly

*peace*




#39 Aug 18 2004 at 10:21 AM Rating: Good
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517 posts
To any of you that think this isn't true thats cool. This isn't to you.

To all of you that think down on these People in China that make a living working to make gil and sell it online you can F#@& off.

Stop being such a selfish ignorant ass. If you've never been to china and experienced what it's like to live in a country like that shut your mouth. I'm so sick of you guys (not naming names) crying about these people while you have obviously enought money to play this game have a decent computer, have a decent internet connection, have a easy **** decent job that you can sit around and post on these Forums all day... and i could go on and on.

These people have a family to support and they are doing it the best way possible. I am happy for them that they are making money off of people in this country that obviously have an excess of it to the extent that they can just throw it away on in game gil.

More power to them. I hope they make millions!

If you don't like what I said then Tough. Its the truth.
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#40 Aug 18 2004 at 10:30 AM Rating: Good
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3,032 posts
Quote:
I'm sure there are probably more lucrative ways to make money (even in, gasp, China) than working in some computer sweatshop.


depends on who you are. i'm sure there are poor people in the US that would like a job like that. and there are a lot more "poor people" in China than the US.

Quote:
I'm not saying that theres no chance in **** somewhere in China theres isn't a 300 pound overlord cracking whips because he doesn't heat the sounds of mouses clicking...


you're taking the "sweatshop" thing too literally.

the enviornment in these places can't be too bad, to keep PCs or PS2s running 24/7.

and farming in this game is not about clicking all the time, they get quotas like 100k a day and stuff like that. no one is going to care if you take a dump for an hour if you make your quota. if you don't meet your quota, you get fired, that's all.

this is not some huge illegal operation in China, the Chinese government isn't going to raid these places.

if you look at the article i put up, these things are run like normal businesses. they have real offices and real ads in newspapers that hire people. they openly advertise and operate as legitamite business, that provide a service for people who want to play the game but don't have the time to farm.

the big difference is SE has a statement against this type of action in the TOS. but until they start sueing people, it doesn't matter.
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#41 Aug 18 2004 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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1,720 posts
Quote:

These people have a family to support and they are doing it the best way possible. I am happy for them that they are making money off of people in this country that obviously have an excess of it to the extent that they can just throw it away on in game gil.


You can basically justify any job with that. "Oh but he's supporting his family" shouldn't be able to justify cheating.

Let me state this for you:

They are violating the ToS. They are not following the Terms they agreed to. They are breaching a contract. They are cheating in a game. All to feed their family? What else can they do to feed their family?

How about a company that buys thousands of dollars of things with a corporate credit card, then bankrupts to negate all debts. Screws the credit card companies over, but they have an excess of money anyway. Would this be fine if they used the money to feed their families?

There is a merit to being legitimate, and there is reason to criticize those who lack lack that merit. I fully believe that farming and selling gil in-game harms players. This right here harms players - people who are camping profitable NMs for money! It's frustrating to compete with a person when your intentions are to have fun and their intentions are to make a living. Frankly, their intentions are not welcome in this game - the Terms of Service say so.

To make a living for your family is a great thing, but to harm a majority of people for self profit is disgusting. To take the "fun" out of a game for your own profit is disgusting. To breach a contract designed to make the game fair is disgusting. These people are disgusting people.

Edited, Wed Aug 18 11:41:53 2004 by Jahava
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#42 Aug 18 2004 at 10:46 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
him: yes I have a wife and kids to feed


Maybe this was just mistranslated, but in mainland China each family is only allowed to have 1 child.
#43 Aug 18 2004 at 10:52 AM Rating: Default
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171 posts
Quote:
How about a company that buys thousands of dollars of things with a corporate credit card, then bankrupts to negate all debts. Screws the credit card companies over, but they have an excess of money anyway. Would this be fine if they used the money to feed their families?


/salute

Quote:
It's frustrating to compete with a person when your intentions are to have fun and their intentions are to make a living


this is what I've been trying to express but couldn't find the right solid words.. thumbs and rate up

Quote:
To make a living for your family is a great thing, but to harm a majority of people for self profit is disgusting. To take the "fun" out of a game for your own profit is disgusting. To breach a contract designed to make the game fair is disgusting. These people are disgusting people.


/hurray
#44 Aug 18 2004 at 10:56 AM Rating: Decent
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517 posts

Quote:
They are violating the ToS. They are not following the Terms they agreed to. They are breaching a contract. They are cheating in a game. All to feed their family? What else can they do to feed their family?


So what! While you worry about if you are going to find a good party tonight and get the next level they are worried about making enought gil today so that they can go home and feed their family.

Quote:
I fully believe that farming and selling gil in-game harms players. This right here harms players - people who are camping profitable NMs for money! It's frustrating to compete with a person when your intentions are to have fun and their intentions are to make a living. Frankly, their intentions are not welcome in this game - the Terms of Service say so.


Hmmmm Maybe its just me but in this world i think them making money to support themselfs is WAY more important than you recreational fun.

If I knew 100% that this was the case with these guys I would help them. I hate the seeing people living is some of the situations that people are forced to live in around this world. I hope the best for them and hope they take greedy people's money.
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#45 Aug 18 2004 at 10:58 AM Rating: Default
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171 posts
DanFitzGer wrote:

Quote:
"him: yes I have a wife and kids to feed"
Maybe this was just mistranslated, but in mainland China each family is only allowed to have 1 child.


lol didn't pay attention to plural singular since in chinese there's no kid/kids.. so yeah not sure how many kid/kids he actually has
#46 Aug 18 2004 at 11:03 AM Rating: Decent
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704 posts
Can I get some clarification on the ****?

Is it the s word?
#47 Aug 18 2004 at 11:08 AM Rating: Good
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1,720 posts
Quote:
So what! While you worry about if you are going to find a good party tonight and get the next level they are worried about making enought gil today so that they can go home and feed their family.

Hmmmm Maybe its just me but in this world i think them making money to support themselfs is WAY more important than you recreational fun.


There are hundreds of thousands of ways to make a living. Nobody is forcing people to run gil-making companies. Nobody is forcing people to work for them.

Do you think the people that started these companies started it thinking "Hey, I'll help all the Chinese people out there! They need jobs and this is a great idea for a job!" No ... they started it thinking "Online gil has a huge profit potential". I adamently refuse to forfeit both my own rights as a legitimate player and the legitimacy of the game itself so that these people can make illegitimate money! I can't see how you would see otherwise.

These people are making the game more difficult and less fun for you to play so they can make money. In other words, they are budening you so as to remove their own burden. And if that's not selfish enough, they are doing it illegally.

That doesn't upset you?

This isn't about the Chinese workers. This is about the people who run such companies. The Chinese workers in question are a means that the heads of such companies use to make money - nothing more.

Quote:
If I knew 100% that this was the case with these guys I would help them. I hate the seeing people living is some of the situations that people are forced to live in around this world. I hope the best for them and hope they take greedy people's money.


So I am greedy for wanting some legitimacy? I'm terribly sorry if I want to bar illegal means of profit in the interest of preserving something that I want to enjoy. I'm just a horrible rich greedy American.

There are other ways to make money. They chose one that would hurt you and me. Keep that in mind.
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#48 Aug 18 2004 at 11:08 AM Rating: Decent
40 posts
Can you post some screenshots of your conversation?
#49 Aug 18 2004 at 11:09 AM Rating: Default
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517 posts
Just thought about something else.

I think everyone would agree that killing another human Being is wrong. This is a blaket statement just like saying "Selling Gil on line is wrong"

I think everyone would agree that killing another inocent person is wrong, just like everyone would agree that Selling Gil on line for excess profit is wrong.

I think everyone would agree that killing another person out of self defense is justified is safe to say.

Now think about this one. Selling gil on line to support oneself finantially is justified.

Please don't make blanket statements people that involve moral issues unless you have thought your statement though all the way.

Do i think gil selling is wrong? It really depends. Do I care if these people are breaking the TOS? No. I'm happy for them. Am I happy for their boss that is most likly taking advantage of these people? No

There are so many sides to this people. Careful what you say.
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#50 Aug 18 2004 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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29 posts
One quick note, I haven't read much besides the OP but last week, an LS member brought up an idea that "Wangxiang" and "Wangxianga" on the Kujata server are gil-making slaves. It made sense; they were always in Pashow or Rolanberry, they were level 50 with a THF sub (around 18 or 19), they were rank 1, and any /tells to them elicted the response "I CHINESE."
After reading this thread, I'm convinced that they work for this company.
Just so you know that this is in no way limited to the Ifrit server...
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#51 Aug 18 2004 at 11:24 AM Rating: Default
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Tripple post sorry.

Edited, Wed Aug 18 12:32:49 2004 by Empyrean
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