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Rangers don't get enough credit!Follow
Hey but i don't think rangers 50+ tanks as much as they did when the were 1-50...correct?
Heh, part of the learning curve. Which, in a ranger's case, can be steep at times. *eyes Jennock*
Goal
Called 'sir' and liking it
Goal
Called 'sir' and liking it
hehe, thats all I have to say...sir =-). Hey but do you see rangers tank 50+? I don't believe so, correct me if im wrong
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They are excellent DPS, just as good as rouges
if the rogue is on crack, perhaps.
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Oh im sorry, i am a newb. I give up to your godly knowledge of EQ. Im sorry for being a jackass. An about AAs, it doesnt have to be an exact AA that says increased aggro....just a faster attack rate cuases more aggro in some cases
there are no ranger aas that cause a considerable increase to aggro unless you chain entrap, but that would only be done if you want aggro
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Knowing the Ranger, I've come to like them, my level 53 Ranger can hit for 500+ with his bow, and I know that when he is 60+ he will be hit for 1-2k dmg. They are exellent dps, lack hps but the dps makes up for that. My good friend, Skyark of Povar, 11k hp ranger is the best PvPer i've ever seen. 2hs he hits for 600's
and 1 hs he can hit up to 150-250. Niice dps, his bow crits for 3-4k and he only has about 543 aas lvl 70
and 1 hs he can hit up to 150-250. Niice dps, his bow crits for 3-4k and he only has about 543 aas lvl 70
maximum damage per hit does not matter. at all.
at the higher end, archery is a comparatively weak form of damage. On a 23 minute long parse of a m'sha 1grouped in qvic, the ranger (using archery specifically because I asked her to, time bow) did 173 dps. Me, tanking, with an EoE and a velitikorins femur, did 256.
On another parse of the same mob with the ranger meleeing (ikky rangerblade/quarm hammer,) I did 261 tanking and the ranger did 226. The ranger had more aas, and overall, better gear than my warrior. again, not exactly sterling.
oh, and just because he's the best pvper you've seen doesn't mean rangers are a good pvp class. pvp is heavily gear dependant, if he gets near a bard in the arena within two tiers of his gear, there's no way he'll win.
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hehe, thats all I have to say...sir =-). Hey but do you see rangers tank 50+? I don't believe so, correct me if im wrong
Occasionally yes they do. I have seen some mid 50s rangers tank PoInnvoation ZI quite effectively. Don't know if they were twinked though, and I suspect they spent some time getting a few AAs as soo as they could.
I spent an unhealthy amount of time with Jennock (ranger/friend/former guildie, use(d) to post here) in PoV, BoT and LDoN's, all with her tanking. Without any problems. Never ever lost aggro on me, even after I had accumulated the gear to start doing some decent DPS.
Rogues crush rangers DPS-wise, but when it comes to succesful tanking, that's a whole other matter.
Rogues crush rangers DPS-wise, but when it comes to succesful tanking, that's a whole other matter.
thats true...have a rougue friend on prexus...forgot his armor but hes a major twink ...lvl 68 i believe...he has some daggers that is a 15/15 weapon or somthing...he was backstabbing for a couple k at lvl 60 as far as i remeber
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Without any problems.
except for her occasionally missing a step on the stairs in the LDoN, and the fall killing her...
Haha. The memories.
"Inc a few" /shiver
Or, as MT, being charmed by one of those EF ugly monkeybirds and proceeding to slash me for 13's :D
Morrellmk: no such thing as backstabbing for 'couple K' at 60. Maybe in his wet dreams, but certainly not in reality.
"Inc a few" /shiver
Or, as MT, being charmed by one of those EF ugly monkeybirds and proceeding to slash me for 13's :D
Morrellmk: no such thing as backstabbing for 'couple K' at 60. Maybe in his wet dreams, but certainly not in reality.
ewwww...nevermind...backstabs now for 1k+ sorry...back then he was doing 400-700 i believe =-), sorry for mixup =-)
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Knowing the Ranger, I've come to like them, my level 53 Ranger can hit for 500+ with his bow,
Hmm at level 58(Magelo below) my largest bow shot to date on a crit was 270, but normally I hit for 30ish.
I hate you Goalkeeper! (he e-mailed me a link to this horrid thread).
And well
thank you for the compliment *hugs*
And Czae .. I know I only did that falling once or twice .... did you know that eivissa once decided to attack me in an ldon? Evil man ..
Well that is a good incoming message when you are not sure if you will gain the entire room or not .... weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Well, Czae knows more about EQ than most of you will, so I would not doubt most of what he has to say. I was laughing out loud IRL when I read that "AAs cause aggro". Well no, a badly played ranger causes aggro. With good weapon and spell selection you can gain or drop aggro very fast with a ranger.
Most people only meet bad rangers it seems ...
This is the problem with the Ranger class. A rangers true strength is subtle, unlike the *direct* classes. Rogues, clerics, enchanters and warriors are very simple classes, very direct in play. A Ranger is a jack of all trades, master of none utility class. A Ranger can perform many tasks *nearly* as well as so many other classes but never *as* well. Once you understand and accept that (WS and TS, and a few exceptions), you can play a ranger.
A ranger can tank, a ranger can crowd control, a ranger can pull, a ranger can emergency heal (when I played Jennock, myself and another ranger kept a warrior alive tanking an Msha - in Qvic).
The subtle spot that a rangers occupies is the group maker. Have no tank? Let the ranger tank. Have no CC, the ranger can.
The other subtle area is assisting the main classes. Add comes in? A ranger can kite or CC it, or if a train comes in, they can help kite and snare adds, root etc till the ench can tie them down. Crucially, a ranger snare kiting or rooting adds, is taking aggro from mobs that would kill the real CC (the ench).
Tank dies? Ranger can tank, healer lom or dead? Ranger patch heal. You help remove risk for the group and that is before you talk about the ranger group buffs that assist the group ....
I never played EQ as Czae did. I never parsed, I never researched but for basic spell lists on new releases. I learnt to play from just playing. And maybe that is why I never fell for this propaganda and glorified rumour I see in this thread. Not falling for "you cannot tank", I tanked anyway and did well. Not falling for "you cannot pull indoors", I learned to pull indoor zones, dungeons and ldons. I even tanked them, I loved it! That was the fun of everquest for me.
Anyone who plays a game only following a faulty guidebook and never experimenting will never be a good player. That is why there are so many bad rangers out there.
PoJennock (retired)
Edited, Wed May 18 12:11:44 2005 by JennockFV
And well
thank you for the compliment *hugs* And Czae .. I know I only did that falling once or twice .... did you know that eivissa once decided to attack me in an ldon? Evil man ..
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"Inc a few" /shiver
Well that is a good incoming message when you are not sure if you will gain the entire room or not .... weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Well, Czae knows more about EQ than most of you will, so I would not doubt most of what he has to say. I was laughing out loud IRL when I read that "AAs cause aggro". Well no, a badly played ranger causes aggro. With good weapon and spell selection you can gain or drop aggro very fast with a ranger.
Most people only meet bad rangers it seems ...
This is the problem with the Ranger class. A rangers true strength is subtle, unlike the *direct* classes. Rogues, clerics, enchanters and warriors are very simple classes, very direct in play. A Ranger is a jack of all trades, master of none utility class. A Ranger can perform many tasks *nearly* as well as so many other classes but never *as* well. Once you understand and accept that (WS and TS, and a few exceptions), you can play a ranger.
A ranger can tank, a ranger can crowd control, a ranger can pull, a ranger can emergency heal (when I played Jennock, myself and another ranger kept a warrior alive tanking an Msha - in Qvic).
The subtle spot that a rangers occupies is the group maker. Have no tank? Let the ranger tank. Have no CC, the ranger can.
The other subtle area is assisting the main classes. Add comes in? A ranger can kite or CC it, or if a train comes in, they can help kite and snare adds, root etc till the ench can tie them down. Crucially, a ranger snare kiting or rooting adds, is taking aggro from mobs that would kill the real CC (the ench).
Tank dies? Ranger can tank, healer lom or dead? Ranger patch heal. You help remove risk for the group and that is before you talk about the ranger group buffs that assist the group ....
I never played EQ as Czae did. I never parsed, I never researched but for basic spell lists on new releases. I learnt to play from just playing. And maybe that is why I never fell for this propaganda and glorified rumour I see in this thread. Not falling for "you cannot tank", I tanked anyway and did well. Not falling for "you cannot pull indoors", I learned to pull indoor zones, dungeons and ldons. I even tanked them, I loved it! That was the fun of everquest for me.
Anyone who plays a game only following a faulty guidebook and never experimenting will never be a good player. That is why there are so many bad rangers out there.
PoJennock (retired)
Edited, Wed May 18 12:11:44 2005 by JennockFV
Jennock
/cheers
WTF!!! Retired???
/cheers
WTF!!! Retired???
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or drop aggro very fast
jenny, dearest, I don't think dying counts as a legitimate method of dropping aggro =p
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On another parse of the same mob with the ranger meleeing (ikky rangerblade/quarm hammer,) I did 261 tanking and the ranger did 226. The ranger had more aas, and overall, better gear than my warrior. again, not exactly sterling.
bugs me to see ranger melee has lower dps than a tanking warrior. Does the parse include proc damage, and nuke damage on the ranger part? Or is she nuking at all?
about the agro comment,
my ranger never leaves the treehouse without Jolt.
and yes, rangers are greate utility class. I've pulled and CCed in LDoN, I've healed and snare/sit peeled mobs off healers, I've even tanked mini in BoT (with my gimp sub-par bazaar gear) with a great healer, I've kept improtant buffs safe from AE dispell (BoT lightning wind baby named) with group buffs.
but what I don't have, is a ture archer.
Edited, Wed May 18 15:08:16 2005 by Assailant
Edited, Wed May 18 15:12:54 2005 by Assailant
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bugs me to see ranger melee has lower dps than a tanking warrior. Does the parse include proc damage, and nuke damage on the ranger part? Or is she nuking at all?
it was pre-nuke changes, so I doubt she was nuking much, but if she did it would have been included in that. (It counted proc damage + quarm pet damage, too.)
My original guild, Keepers of Life on Veeshan, was led by a ranger who was the guild tank. Of course, he was geared specifically for the role, and did it very well. He was my role model, as my ranger was my first and favorite character, and I did a good deal of tanking with Belhade up through to the 50s.
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
Gear for tanking or not, rangers (and even knights) lack some much desired abilities of a warrir for raid tanking.
It is possible, though.
Most of the raiding we did behind Sojournsoul was Velious-era; we were farming ToV:HoT when PoP came out.
Most of the raiding we did behind Sojournsoul was Velious-era; we were farming ToV:HoT when PoP came out.
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
How much DPS did your Damage shield do Czae? Assuming riposte DPS was fairly dinky.
I know a ranger from Tide (Top guild on VS) that can tank fairly well in RS. Not as well as a comparably geared war / sk / pal, but in able to tank with a single cleric healing and remaining happy on mana.
That said, its the old regime of gear standard >>> zone makes a big difference.
I know a ranger from Tide (Top guild on VS) that can tank fairly well in RS. Not as well as a comparably geared war / sk / pal, but in able to tank with a single cleric healing and remaining happy on mana.
That said, its the old regime of gear standard >>> zone makes a big difference.
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How much DPS did your Damage shield do Czae? Assuming riposte DPS was fairly dinky.
about 9 dps, but even ripostes + that ds did not make up for the rear-advantage.
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On another parse of the same mob with the ranger meleeing (ikky rangerblade/quarm hammer,) I did 261 tanking and the ranger did 226. The ranger had more aas, and overall, better gear than my warrior. again, not exactly sterling.
Are you sure she only did 226 DPS meleeing? Seems very low to me. With comparable weapons (Ritual Spinesplicer, Jagged Timeforged Blade) I had multiple 450+ DPS parses on M'Sha's, and I thought that was low.
Lack of buffs, perhaps?
*hugs Jen*
Not totally retired, thankfully :)
Misc thoughts on the thread .. not coherent because I really should be asleep.
1) A good ranger should die: at least before the MH and CC
2) Reinmon: Checked out your Maeglo - You'll get much better crits if you use arrows instead of fishing grubs. JK, but get your archery skill up. 500+ at 53 is a lot of shooting expensive arrows, but you should have seen at least a high 300s on a TS by now.
3) Ranger tanking - rangers excel at the first requirement, holding aggro. Holding aggro without having good mitigation/avoidance = at least aggro-kiting, having good mitigation/avoidance without holding aggro = ??
4) "They are excellent DPS, just as good as rouges" ----
"if the rogue is on crack, perhaps. " --- More like if the rogue isn't on crack and the ranger is ... or the skill behind the keyboard factor comes into play (grouped with a rogue last night that insisted on offtanking rootparked mobs :cry: )
1) A good ranger should die: at least before the MH and CC
2) Reinmon: Checked out your Maeglo - You'll get much better crits if you use arrows instead of fishing grubs. JK, but get your archery skill up. 500+ at 53 is a lot of shooting expensive arrows, but you should have seen at least a high 300s on a TS by now.
3) Ranger tanking - rangers excel at the first requirement, holding aggro. Holding aggro without having good mitigation/avoidance = at least aggro-kiting, having good mitigation/avoidance without holding aggro = ??
4) "They are excellent DPS, just as good as rouges" ----
"if the rogue is on crack, perhaps. " --- More like if the rogue isn't on crack and the ranger is ... or the skill behind the keyboard factor comes into play (grouped with a rogue last night that insisted on offtanking rootparked mobs :cry: )
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grouped with a rogue last night that insisted on offtanking rootparked mobs :cry:
Hey, not all rogues are as good as myself.
/disc shameless ego stroke
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