And i can totally accept anything you say here.. your not gonna hurt my feelings, and i am not gonna flame any of you..
I Recently heard of a "Classy" HNM ls on the Bismarck Server.. So i decided to apply.. i am not gonna name names, because that would not be "Classy" . I respect thier decision of course, but i dont respect the reasons...
The reasons for being denied membership were these..
1. Casino spam...
I would like to know... when is the last time anybody saw me spam my casino.. seriously.. when... i think that is just silly.
2. The Astral Ring incident..
Why on earth would you not accept a member into a LS because of what they buy at the AH with thier own hard earned gil...
3. My Reputation...
Now that is the one that really offended me... the other 2, i can understand.. but i didnt know i had such a bad reputation.. From what i have seen, nobody has a real problem with me.. I just think its wierd..
So, i want your honest opinion Bismark.. The 3 reasons that were given.. . Does most of the Server see me that way? Am i really that terrible of a person? Do i not help enough people out?
I am seriously offended and think that it is very shallow to deny membership because of this.. So let me have it.. What does Bismarck think of me? Because i am one little hurt Tarutaru.
Edited, Wed Feb 23 19:52:04 2005 by Kaolian
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#2
Feb 22 2005 at 1:44 AM
Nothing you have ever done has offended me, sure I dont agree with casinos, but that has pretty much died all together...the Astral thing, I actually thought was kinda funny^^ I think I'm one of the most easy going people in this game though. I dont let anything bother me, so maybe my opinion dosent count?
Never run into you in game, but you seem to be a cool guy on here.
Never run into you in game, but you seem to be a cool guy on here.
#3
Feb 22 2005 at 1:55 AM
The reason for casino seems like a load of crap to me. However I can see them saying you have a rep due to the astral ring incident. The rings skyrocketed in price directly or indirectly due to your actions alone. They may have done so by themselves or because of gil farmers, but you were the one that became the scapegoat due to the vast amount of hoarding those rings. Regardless of these reasons, I still think its pretty foolish to deny you entry because of them. They obviously don't know you as a person, and simply judge you on second hand information due to some of the more questionable things you have done in the past.
#4
Feb 22 2005 at 2:01 AM
Damn Hip, That sux ***. If u ask me I find you to be a really great guy, a smart one at that too. If those are the reasons that they (LS) gave you then thats just low. They lost out on a great mage thats always willing to help others. Now about the A. rings if I would have that about it at the time I would have done the same, and I sure most would have as well. If your still looking for a HNM LS send me a tell. It would be an Honor to fight side by side with you. /salute!
The Great Archadian
The Great Archadian
#5
Feb 22 2005 at 2:33 AM
Eh, it's all politics.
Just like real life, people are judged by their past actions. Sadly, people remember the bad things and forget the good, which is a big problem we face every day.
Reminds me of the Pete Rose/Baseball Hall of Fame thing. They made a scapegoat out of him 'cuz of his personal life. Big fuc[/i]kin deal, he was a great player. It's the 'Baseball' Hall of Fame, not the 'Politically-correct-perfect-person' Hall of Fame.
Well, that's just how it is. Sad but true. Nothing you can do.
My opinion is that you have every right to be in that HNM LS, regardless of your past and if you were turned down, it should be for other reasons like being a bad player or just an as[i]s. You never did anything to violate the ToS (to my knowledge), ya just did things and made gil your own way.
Just like real life, people are judged by their past actions. Sadly, people remember the bad things and forget the good, which is a big problem we face every day.
Reminds me of the Pete Rose/Baseball Hall of Fame thing. They made a scapegoat out of him 'cuz of his personal life. Big fuc[/i]kin deal, he was a great player. It's the 'Baseball' Hall of Fame, not the 'Politically-correct-perfect-person' Hall of Fame.
Well, that's just how it is. Sad but true. Nothing you can do.
My opinion is that you have every right to be in that HNM LS, regardless of your past and if you were turned down, it should be for other reasons like being a bad player or just an as[i]s. You never did anything to violate the ToS (to my knowledge), ya just did things and made gil your own way.
#6
Feb 22 2005 at 2:35 AM
Your application was rejected based on the votes of the majority of the members, most of whom voted based on their previous dealing with you. Most feel that your primary goal in the game are not in conjunction with the LS's. Mainly from your past actions we see Money making as your number 1 priority, ofcourse there's nothing wrong with that. Well who am I to tell what your priorities in the game are, everyone likes money, but from what it looked like to members, they don't see you as a participator in our kind of HNM experience.
There are other HNM LS where you can go and camp Serket all you want and split the loot 8 ways, Milfhunter anyone? We exist on a system where members contribute to the overall health of the linkshell, through participation and merits. Now you Hip can provide all the counter points you want on how you helped your own LS do what ever,but the point is, if all they know of you are from schemes like the astral rings and casinos, well then that's what they have to go by. Just think of it like we are saving you the trouble of having to quit a few days later because our loot distribution probably won't agree with you. Well you should know about how basic HNM application process works since you've already been rejected from others based on similar things.
Also your history with members hasn't been that great. Personally, me and you are on good terms, and no doubt a few others. But lets see, the last time you join Forgottendreams just to leech rank 5 then immediately went back to Hynotiknation and never showed up again didn't sit too well with a few members that were from that LS, and well, when it time to ask their opinion of you, they will tell what they think from that incident, karma comes back to bite you doesn't it? They're not in Hypnotiknation, they don't know how helpful you might've been or how dedicated your are to the LS so its really irrelevant what you do that we don't know. If Hiptaru participated in a Hypnotiknation LS event and no one in AD knows about and vouch for you, does it really happened?
What some members do know is that you pearl hop on one of our old LS, and that is what they will tell people when asked. People are voting based on THEIR experiences with YOU, whether it be your reputation, their personal opinion or actualy experience, shouldn't that then be the only Legitimate reason to deny or accept someone into an LS? the member's opinions? You seemed to make it sound like no one in AD know of you and that we are only basing result on what we HEARD from other people, or read on the forums. You've been playing a while, no doubt you have a few runs in with our members, and thats when asked, they will tell what they thought of it. This process is the same for everybody, nobody is picking on you because of your "Genius" way of money making.
So from an average "classy" (dunno how we got that title) HNM LS point of view
Participation: Very important to an LS. Its not like all members of our LS participate in every planned events, I sure doesn't. What usually causes friction is what a member think they can GET out of the LS. I.E. What will attending this raid gained for ME. What the LS can do for THEM. You might not think like that at all but as I've said, from what members thought of you from their experiences: very much in your own self interest.
Reputation: Since when do you have a bad reputation? since the majority of members voted NO based on their personal opinions of you. Well regardless of what your definition of bad reputation is, when a majority doesn't speak well of you, that is called BAD reputation. They might not have known you,it might not be fair, but they're the one that have to deal with you on a regular basis if you are accepted, so what they think matters.
Casino Spam: Since when was the last time you spam? well does it really matter? since a majority probably already have you on Blist the first time you filled up their spam window. Again I see nothing wrong with that, might not be fair, but a majority of the Linkshell doesn't want to deal with that, and you have to respect their decision.
Well then when you think of it in the end: you fit all the qualifications, you apply, but just as in the real world application process, being eligible doesn't mean a thing, there's that extra little something that's require. Mainly, is it in the best interest of the LS's members to accept you. We're not selfish, we don't want anything from you. We're not looking at what YOU can do for US. The LS's members are primarily interested in how well you will fit in and how we all will get along. Based on most member's opinions, NO, so well then all you have to do is respect that and move on. Moving on is a nice thing, but you know I'm guessing this thread is just gonna become another fodder for anti HNM LS junk and AD bashing from certain people who still haven't GOTTEN OVER IT.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 03:06:05 2005 by Bowser
There are other HNM LS where you can go and camp Serket all you want and split the loot 8 ways, Milfhunter anyone? We exist on a system where members contribute to the overall health of the linkshell, through participation and merits. Now you Hip can provide all the counter points you want on how you helped your own LS do what ever,but the point is, if all they know of you are from schemes like the astral rings and casinos, well then that's what they have to go by. Just think of it like we are saving you the trouble of having to quit a few days later because our loot distribution probably won't agree with you. Well you should know about how basic HNM application process works since you've already been rejected from others based on similar things.
Also your history with members hasn't been that great. Personally, me and you are on good terms, and no doubt a few others. But lets see, the last time you join Forgottendreams just to leech rank 5 then immediately went back to Hynotiknation and never showed up again didn't sit too well with a few members that were from that LS, and well, when it time to ask their opinion of you, they will tell what they think from that incident, karma comes back to bite you doesn't it? They're not in Hypnotiknation, they don't know how helpful you might've been or how dedicated your are to the LS so its really irrelevant what you do that we don't know. If Hiptaru participated in a Hypnotiknation LS event and no one in AD knows about and vouch for you, does it really happened?
What some members do know is that you pearl hop on one of our old LS, and that is what they will tell people when asked. People are voting based on THEIR experiences with YOU, whether it be your reputation, their personal opinion or actualy experience, shouldn't that then be the only Legitimate reason to deny or accept someone into an LS? the member's opinions? You seemed to make it sound like no one in AD know of you and that we are only basing result on what we HEARD from other people, or read on the forums. You've been playing a while, no doubt you have a few runs in with our members, and thats when asked, they will tell what they thought of it. This process is the same for everybody, nobody is picking on you because of your "Genius" way of money making.
So from an average "classy" (dunno how we got that title) HNM LS point of view
Participation: Very important to an LS. Its not like all members of our LS participate in every planned events, I sure doesn't. What usually causes friction is what a member think they can GET out of the LS. I.E. What will attending this raid gained for ME. What the LS can do for THEM. You might not think like that at all but as I've said, from what members thought of you from their experiences: very much in your own self interest.
Reputation: Since when do you have a bad reputation? since the majority of members voted NO based on their personal opinions of you. Well regardless of what your definition of bad reputation is, when a majority doesn't speak well of you, that is called BAD reputation. They might not have known you,it might not be fair, but they're the one that have to deal with you on a regular basis if you are accepted, so what they think matters.
Casino Spam: Since when was the last time you spam? well does it really matter? since a majority probably already have you on Blist the first time you filled up their spam window. Again I see nothing wrong with that, might not be fair, but a majority of the Linkshell doesn't want to deal with that, and you have to respect their decision.
Well then when you think of it in the end: you fit all the qualifications, you apply, but just as in the real world application process, being eligible doesn't mean a thing, there's that extra little something that's require. Mainly, is it in the best interest of the LS's members to accept you. We're not selfish, we don't want anything from you. We're not looking at what YOU can do for US. The LS's members are primarily interested in how well you will fit in and how we all will get along. Based on most member's opinions, NO, so well then all you have to do is respect that and move on. Moving on is a nice thing, but you know I'm guessing this thread is just gonna become another fodder for anti HNM LS junk and AD bashing from certain people who still haven't GOTTEN OVER IT.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 03:06:05 2005 by Bowser
#7
Feb 22 2005 at 4:55 AM
43 posts
I know nothing about Hip, all I know is I won his astral ring. However, I've always been boggled about people who so disliked the Casino's etc. I honestly play almost any casino I find in game now just because I find it to be an amusing concept. I play Drebonds casino everytime I see it and essentially break even. Once I won 200k but the next two times I lost 100k, it entertains me, it doesn't provide me income.
Nextly, HNM ls's. I really have no appreciation for these groups. I like a linkshell to entertain me, that's why I play the game. Sadly I hear an almost constant stream of woes from HNM ls members about "so and so has this, I need it too." or "omg! so and so stole our kraken club/<insert item here>"
or "they are hax0r! they use crazy scripting to make mobs spawn claimed!" etc. ad infinitum. I like my ls because I like the people in it. Granted there are dramas, but it doesn't make the time any less enjoyable. And we even have our own "HNM Commitee" that would be the TeamJnag ls.
The point? "Classy LS's" are purely fiction ^^ there is no LS that is infalible. The quality of an LS is not something you can assign on a chart, it is arbitrary. Find an ls that does what you need it to, or that works well with your gaming type. It would seem that this ls is not that ls.
Nextly, HNM ls's. I really have no appreciation for these groups. I like a linkshell to entertain me, that's why I play the game. Sadly I hear an almost constant stream of woes from HNM ls members about "so and so has this, I need it too." or "omg! so and so stole our kraken club/<insert item here>"
or "they are hax0r! they use crazy scripting to make mobs spawn claimed!" etc. ad infinitum. I like my ls because I like the people in it. Granted there are dramas, but it doesn't make the time any less enjoyable. And we even have our own "HNM Commitee" that would be the TeamJnag ls.
The point? "Classy LS's" are purely fiction ^^ there is no LS that is infalible. The quality of an LS is not something you can assign on a chart, it is arbitrary. Find an ls that does what you need it to, or that works well with your gaming type. It would seem that this ls is not that ls.
#8
Feb 22 2005 at 5:55 AM
Quote:
Nextly, HNM ls's. I really have no appreciation for these groups. I like a linkshell to entertain me, that's why I play the game.
Get a useful job to lv75 and sit around doing nothing and see how entertained you are.
Our server is very good about endgame drama. Some servers have it far, far worse. It is nowhere near as bad as it may seem, based on the less-than-ten vocal people who post on forums like the end of the world happens every day. Consider also that despite anything that may happen, if stuff wasn't "entertaining" for people on at least some level, they wouldn't play.
#9
Feb 22 2005 at 6:32 AM
Bowser wrote:
Your application was rejected based on the votes of the majority of the members, most of whom voted based on their previous dealing with you. Most feel that your primary goal in the game are not in conjunction with the LS's. Mainly from your past actions we see Money making as your number 1 priority, ofcourse there's nothing wrong with that. Well who am I to tell what your priorities in the game are, everyone likes money, but from what it looked like to members, they don't see you as a participator in our kind of HNM experience.
There are other HNM LS where you can go and camp Serket all you want and split the loot 8 ways, Milfhunter anyone? We exist on a system where members contribute to the overall health of the linkshell, through participation and merits. Now you Hip can provide all the counter points you want on how you helped your own LS do what ever,but the point is, if all they know of you are from schemes like the astral rings and casinos, well then that's what they have to go by. Just think of it like we are saving you the trouble of having to quit a few days later because our loot distribution probably won't agree with you. Well you should know about how basic HNM application process works since you've already been rejected from others based on similar things.
Also your history with members hasn't been that great. Personally, me and you are on good terms, and no doubt a few others. But lets see, the last time you join Forgottendreams just to leech rank 5 then immediately went back to Hynotiknation and never showed up again didn't sit too well with a few members that were from that LS, and well, when it time to ask their opinion of you, they will tell what they think from that incident, karma comes back to bite you doesn't it? They're not in Hypnotiknation, they don't know how helpful you might've been or how dedicated your are to the LS so its really irrelevant what you do that we don't know. If Hiptaru participated in a Hypnotiknation LS event and no one in AD knows about and vouch for you, does it really happened?
What some members do know is that you pearl hop on one of our old LS, and that is what they will tell people when asked. People are voting based on THEIR experiences with YOU, whether it be your reputation, their personal opinion or actualy experience, shouldn't that then be the only Legitimate reason to deny or accept someone into an LS? the member's opinions? You seemed to make it sound like no one in AD know of you and that we are only basing result on what we HEARD from other people, or read on the forums. You've been playing a while, no doubt you have a few runs in with our members, and thats when asked, they will tell what they thought of it. This process is the same for everybody, nobody is picking on you because of your "Genius" way of money making.
So from an average "classy" (dunno how we got that title) HNM LS point of view
Participation: Very important to an LS. Its not like all members of our LS participate in every planned events, I sure doesn't. What usually causes friction is what a member think they can GET out of the LS. I.E. What will attending this raid gained for ME. What the LS can do for THEM. You might not think like that at all but as I've said, from what members thought of you from their experiences: very much in your own self interest.
Reputation: Since when do you have a bad reputation? since the majority of members voted NO based on their personal opinions of you. Well regardless of what your definition of bad reputation is, when a majority doesn't speak well of you, that is called BAD reputation. They might not have known you,it might not be fair, but they're the one that have to deal with you on a regular basis if you are accepted, so what they think matters.
Casino Spam: Since when was the last time you spam? well does it really matter? since a majority probably already have you on Blist the first time you filled up their spam window. Again I see nothing wrong with that, might not be fair, but a majority of the Linkshell doesn't want to deal with that, and you have to respect their decision.
Well then when you think of it in the end: you fit all the qualifications, you apply, but just as in the real world application process, being eligible doesn't mean a thing, there's that extra little something that's require. Mainly, is it in the best interest of the LS's members to accept you. We're not selfish, we don't want anything from you. We're not looking at what YOU can do for US. The LS's members are primarily interested in how well you will fit in and how we all will get along. Based on most member's opinions, NO, so well then all you have to do is respect that and move on. Moving on is a nice thing, but you know I'm guessing this thread is just gonna become another fodder for anti HNM LS junk and AD bashing from certain people who still haven't GOTTEN OVER IT.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 03:06:05 2005 by Bowser
There are other HNM LS where you can go and camp Serket all you want and split the loot 8 ways, Milfhunter anyone? We exist on a system where members contribute to the overall health of the linkshell, through participation and merits. Now you Hip can provide all the counter points you want on how you helped your own LS do what ever,but the point is, if all they know of you are from schemes like the astral rings and casinos, well then that's what they have to go by. Just think of it like we are saving you the trouble of having to quit a few days later because our loot distribution probably won't agree with you. Well you should know about how basic HNM application process works since you've already been rejected from others based on similar things.
Also your history with members hasn't been that great. Personally, me and you are on good terms, and no doubt a few others. But lets see, the last time you join Forgottendreams just to leech rank 5 then immediately went back to Hynotiknation and never showed up again didn't sit too well with a few members that were from that LS, and well, when it time to ask their opinion of you, they will tell what they think from that incident, karma comes back to bite you doesn't it? They're not in Hypnotiknation, they don't know how helpful you might've been or how dedicated your are to the LS so its really irrelevant what you do that we don't know. If Hiptaru participated in a Hypnotiknation LS event and no one in AD knows about and vouch for you, does it really happened?
What some members do know is that you pearl hop on one of our old LS, and that is what they will tell people when asked. People are voting based on THEIR experiences with YOU, whether it be your reputation, their personal opinion or actualy experience, shouldn't that then be the only Legitimate reason to deny or accept someone into an LS? the member's opinions? You seemed to make it sound like no one in AD know of you and that we are only basing result on what we HEARD from other people, or read on the forums. You've been playing a while, no doubt you have a few runs in with our members, and thats when asked, they will tell what they thought of it. This process is the same for everybody, nobody is picking on you because of your "Genius" way of money making.
So from an average "classy" (dunno how we got that title) HNM LS point of view
Participation: Very important to an LS. Its not like all members of our LS participate in every planned events, I sure doesn't. What usually causes friction is what a member think they can GET out of the LS. I.E. What will attending this raid gained for ME. What the LS can do for THEM. You might not think like that at all but as I've said, from what members thought of you from their experiences: very much in your own self interest.
Reputation: Since when do you have a bad reputation? since the majority of members voted NO based on their personal opinions of you. Well regardless of what your definition of bad reputation is, when a majority doesn't speak well of you, that is called BAD reputation. They might not have known you,it might not be fair, but they're the one that have to deal with you on a regular basis if you are accepted, so what they think matters.
Casino Spam: Since when was the last time you spam? well does it really matter? since a majority probably already have you on Blist the first time you filled up their spam window. Again I see nothing wrong with that, might not be fair, but a majority of the Linkshell doesn't want to deal with that, and you have to respect their decision.
Well then when you think of it in the end: you fit all the qualifications, you apply, but just as in the real world application process, being eligible doesn't mean a thing, there's that extra little something that's require. Mainly, is it in the best interest of the LS's members to accept you. We're not selfish, we don't want anything from you. We're not looking at what YOU can do for US. The LS's members are primarily interested in how well you will fit in and how we all will get along. Based on most member's opinions, NO, so well then all you have to do is respect that and move on. Moving on is a nice thing, but you know I'm guessing this thread is just gonna become another fodder for anti HNM LS junk and AD bashing from certain people who still haven't GOTTEN OVER IT.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 03:06:05 2005 by Bowser
Yes well Bowser, we have been on good terms, and let me be the first to correct you.. Its Hipnotik Nation , not Hypnotik Nation... that being said, i dont want to argue with you, i just think the reasons are ridiculous.. but that is my own opinion, and i kno that it doesnt matter in the eyes of many, and especially in they eyes of your LS..
I will still and always consider you a friend in game, and have no problem with you, we have partied together, and had good times. You feel like my Primary goal is to make gil, Sorry to burst your bubble, but i have more gil than i know what to do with, thats why i let people in my LS have 1 million gil to level up certain crafts, and thats why i go on binges at the AH when i have had a few to many drinks, what would you do with a basically unlimited amount of gil?
The whole reason i have been looking for a HNM ls, or End Game LS is because i want a little bit more excitement in the game, i could care less about the loot that you people get, i want the experience that i cannot get on my own.. I have been going to Dynamis with IRONDynamis, and i dont give a rats *** about the loot i get.. Sure, i would love get some AF2, but i havent, and oh well, i still get to go to Dynamis, and kick *** everysingle time with some really awesome people who i have a great time with.. As for you not seeing me as a participator in your HNM experience, well then oh well, i will just go Kite some HNM with other friends...
You talk about loot distribution.. and i will re-itterate, if thats how you spell that word... I DONT CARE about loot distribution, i perfectly well know that proably for a good 6 months i wouldnt get much out of the loot, thats just how things are, and i was very willing to accept that fact, and i was not in it for the gil, like i said before, i have more gil than i know what to do with...
Then you go as far as to say i LEECHED Rank 5 from ForgottenDream.. Let me be the one to remind you.. I went and did Rank 5 with you guys, and then while we were in the middle of it, ohh somebody told me, anytime you want a pearl Hiptaru, all you gotta do is ask... I wasnt coming into your ForgottenDream and asking for help with Rank 5, i just so happened to be in Jeuno, and came across you guys, and helped out.. And if i remember correctly, it started with a full alliance, and by the end of it.. there were about 7 people left, and guess who was there from the very beginning.. ME. Hiptaru...
Do dont even go there with me, i didnt LEECH a damn thing.
As for the term "Classy" let me look around here on the Allakhazam forums, and find the Signature of the person who actually puts that in it.. I might be incorrect but i believe its around her somewhere.. if i am wrong, then i apologize. I am sure if you have 60 members in your LS, then i have probably pissed a few of them off from time to time, people seem to get thier panties in a wad really fast in this game, and i know that i am one of them from time to time, i can admit it.. I mean, what is this entire thread all about... hmm...
Participation: The only thing I was seeking was something different, I wasn't looking what the LS could do for ME, but what i could do for THEM. Just wanted to go kill Fafnir a few times, and make a few friends, Just wanted to go on a few Sky raids with you guys, i prolly would have joined you all in alot of different things, Hell, i live on this game.. You should always know that Hipnotik Nation is my family, and i will be with them till the end, that is why i havent joined other HNM LS, because they have a 1 LS rule, one that i cannot abide by, because i love the members of my LS, and i would bend over backwards for them, and they all know that..
Casino Spam: If people still have ME on Blist for casino spam, that is just hilarious, because it has been like 6 months since i have spammed my casino, prolly longer, why dont you go Blist Drebond, or Casinotaru aka Longshanks for the Casinos Spam. Everybody knows i dont shout out for casinos anymore, and if they are that Shallow that they dont like me just because i ran a casino, then oh well, i dont need people like them around me in the first place..
Well if we look at everything in the end, Yes, looks like the majority of your LS does not want me to be in it, and i accept that.. Doesnt mean that i cant have my own opinion, just like everybody else does.. and yes, i will move on, and i will eventually find the people who can respect me for who i actually am, and not just because i go against the grain and do things the way i like to, Yes, i basically am responsible for the Casino's, Yes, i like to buy out expensive Items in the AH and watch the price go up.. Its just too bad that those are the reasons your LS decided to deny my membership, and say that i am not going to fit in well with you guys, when i could be Nuking the hell out of HNM's, and making it that much easier for all of you to gain success, and share the joy of another victory.. Something i was looking forward to, and will give my talents to a different LS.. Not saying i am the shiznit or anything, but i am well aware that i dont suck, and believe me, i have run across some pretty crappy players in my time...
anyways.. No hard feelings, just had to get it out, and it looks like other people agree with me that the reasons of being denied are pretty bogus, but its not my decision, it was you's guys, and i accept it..
{Peace} {See you again!}
Hiptaru.
Edit: i stand corrected.. it wasnt "Classy" it was "Fashionable" so please accept my apologies..
ArchDominus: Bismarck's Most Fashionable End-game Linkshell
thats where i got that from..
Edited, Tue Feb 22 06:44:54 2005 by Hiptaruu
#10
Feb 22 2005 at 6:39 AM
Well hip I dont know you apart from reading your posts on the forum, personally though I think they should at least have trialed you and given you a chance to prove you were commited to the LS and hey if you screwed up or were never in the LS its not hard to break a pearl.
I think a lot of your bad rep comes from people, blaming you for driving the price of astral rings up, but these people are basically hypocrites, I dont see them when they come to sell their items list them for 100k less than the going rate in the hope it drives the price down for the good of all mankind.
I have respect for the LS owner saying his/her members were against you, but I think they should at least ask why, first and then filter out the people who might just have "heard from a friend" or "read online he did this or that", and listen to the people who have real experience of you good or bad.
I'd also take the issue of you leeching rank 5 or whatever it was, i've used other pearls in my time, I dont take them with the intention of not being an active member of that LS, just I find fairly quickly that my original LS "calls me home", so maybe this is unfair to say he did it just for a mission i'm sure he could have gained through other means.
Anyway keep plugging away hip, as far as i've ever read you havent done anything wrong to give yourself a bad rep.
I think a lot of your bad rep comes from people, blaming you for driving the price of astral rings up, but these people are basically hypocrites, I dont see them when they come to sell their items list them for 100k less than the going rate in the hope it drives the price down for the good of all mankind.
I have respect for the LS owner saying his/her members were against you, but I think they should at least ask why, first and then filter out the people who might just have "heard from a friend" or "read online he did this or that", and listen to the people who have real experience of you good or bad.
I'd also take the issue of you leeching rank 5 or whatever it was, i've used other pearls in my time, I dont take them with the intention of not being an active member of that LS, just I find fairly quickly that my original LS "calls me home", so maybe this is unfair to say he did it just for a mission i'm sure he could have gained through other means.
Anyway keep plugging away hip, as far as i've ever read you havent done anything wrong to give yourself a bad rep.
#11
Feb 22 2005 at 8:02 AM
Short overview of what I saw in this:
Reputation is everything in this game. It only takes one big thing to really make things difficult for you, that much you have to agree with. When the majority's experience with a person has only been hearing about or watching some kind of money making scheme, they're gonna remember that. Might not be enough to make people hate you/not party with you, etc., but it's going to be enough to make them wonder "what's the catch?" when approached. And that seems what to be happened here. People seem to be leary of you, especially in the high-stakes HNM world. Outside of that, people drew on personal experiences. That's all the information I can offer.
You may not like people's logic or feelings on the topic, but that's just the way the wind blows. I have nothing against you as a person as I have no personal experiences with you, but I'm still leary of your motives and practices. It's human nature. And I'm sorry if that makes me "bad".
Reputation is everything in this game. It only takes one big thing to really make things difficult for you, that much you have to agree with. When the majority's experience with a person has only been hearing about or watching some kind of money making scheme, they're gonna remember that. Might not be enough to make people hate you/not party with you, etc., but it's going to be enough to make them wonder "what's the catch?" when approached. And that seems what to be happened here. People seem to be leary of you, especially in the high-stakes HNM world. Outside of that, people drew on personal experiences. That's all the information I can offer.
You may not like people's logic or feelings on the topic, but that's just the way the wind blows. I have nothing against you as a person as I have no personal experiences with you, but I'm still leary of your motives and practices. It's human nature. And I'm sorry if that makes me "bad".
#12
Feb 22 2005 at 8:13 AM
I for one, have never heard a bad thing about you and have always heard that you are a helpful and generous person.
We had our differences of opinion over your financial endeavors but its not like anything you did violated the ToS so your admittance to an HNM LS over those things just goes to show you how "classy" they are.
And when you think of all the recent accusations going around about confirmed botting in "every?" HNM LS (I know intensity doesn't :) ).
Then again rep is everything, here is a possibility: back when you were running casino a bunch of people probably blisted you. When your application came up them members may have looked, saw you on blist, and that was the end. I dunno just a thought.
Good Luck to you, hope you find a better shell ^^
We had our differences of opinion over your financial endeavors but its not like anything you did violated the ToS so your admittance to an HNM LS over those things just goes to show you how "classy" they are.
And when you think of all the recent accusations going around about confirmed botting in "every?" HNM LS (I know intensity doesn't :) ).
Then again rep is everything, here is a possibility: back when you were running casino a bunch of people probably blisted you. When your application came up them members may have looked, saw you on blist, and that was the end. I dunno just a thought.
Good Luck to you, hope you find a better shell ^^
#13
Feb 22 2005 at 8:25 AM
Meh...I used to think I wanted in an HNM LS but I'm not sure anymore.
Dorkz make my life fun, and if sitting at 75 gets boring then I'll just level another job, RNG I think, I'm having a blast with that one.
As far as the topic, I have no qualms with you Hiptaru. I'm not sure we could call ourselves friends as I believe the only time I've ever partied with you was when you gave my RNG a port once :) That being said, I wouldn't hesistate to help you out should you need it because as far as I'm concerned you haven't done anything wrong. Take care bud and stick with it, our server is more colorful with people like you in it :)
Dorkz make my life fun, and if sitting at 75 gets boring then I'll just level another job, RNG I think, I'm having a blast with that one.
As far as the topic, I have no qualms with you Hiptaru. I'm not sure we could call ourselves friends as I believe the only time I've ever partied with you was when you gave my RNG a port once :) That being said, I wouldn't hesistate to help you out should you need it because as far as I'm concerned you haven't done anything wrong. Take care bud and stick with it, our server is more colorful with people like you in it :)
#14
Feb 22 2005 at 8:30 AM
Bowser didnt you quit, BTW thank you for giving me Xxiii's Scorpion Harness +1 and his Ochiodo's Kote. Thank you man.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 08:31:34 2005 by JoLOveS
Edited, Tue Feb 22 08:31:34 2005 by JoLOveS
#15
Feb 22 2005 at 8:45 AM
38 posts
I just love how some people say how AD should have atleast given him a trial pearl and see how he did before rejecting him.
Sod off. How a LS goes about recruiting people is none of your business nor is it your place to tell them how to do it. He got rejected and that's it. He got rejected when he applied to the LS I'm in aswell for the same reasons (even made a whine post about it in the noble crusader Thends thread).
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:16:17 2005 by Tyraelle
Sod off. How a LS goes about recruiting people is none of your business nor is it your place to tell them how to do it. He got rejected and that's it. He got rejected when he applied to the LS I'm in aswell for the same reasons (even made a whine post about it in the noble crusader Thends thread).
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:16:17 2005 by Tyraelle
#16
Feb 22 2005 at 8:55 AM
Tyraelle wrote:
I just love how some people say how AD should have atleast given him a trial pearl and see how he did before rejecting him.
No offense, but sod off. How a LS goes about recruiting people is none of your business nor is it your place to tell them how to do it. He got rejected and that's it. He got rejected when he applied to the LS I'm in aswell for the same reasons (even made a whine post about it in the noble crusader Thends thread).
No offense, but sod off. How a LS goes about recruiting people is none of your business nor is it your place to tell them how to do it. He got rejected and that's it. He got rejected when he applied to the LS I'm in aswell for the same reasons (even made a whine post about it in the noble crusader Thends thread).
I'm rating you down for this because this is WAY off topic. He didn't even bring in the fact that it was AD that had rejected him, that was done by someone else. He just wanted to know what people thought of him as a person, citing his rejection from a HNM LS as the reason for wanting to know why.
And how is someone not supposed to take offense to being told to "sod off" ? You meant offense or else you would have said it differently.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 08:55:15 2005 by Wintaru
Edited, Tue Feb 22 08:56:35 2005 by Wintaru
#17
Feb 22 2005 at 9:22 AM
Quote:
Then you go as far as to say i LEECHED Rank 5 from ForgottenDream.. Let me be the one to remind you.. I went and did Rank 5 with you guys, and then while we were in the middle of it, ohh somebody told me, anytime you want a pearl Hiptaru, all you gotta do is ask... I wasnt coming into your ForgottenDream and asking for help with Rank 5, i just so happened to be in Jeuno, and came across you guys, and helped out.. And if i remember correctly, it started with a full alliance, and by the end of it.. there were about 7 people left, and guess who was there from the very beginning.. ME. Hiptaru...
Do dont even go there with me, i didnt LEECH a damn thing.
Do dont even go there with me, i didnt LEECH a damn thing.
Actually if an event started with LS alliance (most of whom were already rank 5) and you happened to be the only one outside of LS, and was admitted in during the course of event and never came back after the event, its called leeching.
Quote:
Sorry to burst your bubble, but i have more gil than i know what to do with, thats why i let people in my LS have 1 million gil to.....
Again does it really matter what your intentions are if we don't know about it and no one was there to vouch for you? If Hiptaruu giving away a million gil is proof that's he interested in more than just money but no one in AD knows about it, do you think it will be taken in to consideration in your application process? what most members saw were the casino spam and the astral rings incident, and the raffles, well if that's basically what all you stood for to people, then respect their right to think of you a certain way.
I still don't understand this post? what is the purpose? What are you saying? To me at least, it seemed like an "Oh AD is one of the last LS that hasn't had alot of ******** drama, so lets go be the Second one to start some on a public forum." Sure I am the one that named out the LS, but don't you think people already know by your post in our own forum of the same topic? Do you go back and ***** at a place after they've rejected your application? Everyone that have ever posted an application anywhere surely thought that they deserve the job or position what ever, do they always get it? NO because its not really up to what they think, its about other's opinion of them. I hate to say this but this application process as a whole was much more democratic than other LSses where people are accepted and booted on the whim of the creator or sackholders. I still don't know why suddenly people are ripping on us voting NO on someone we don't think will fit in with the majority of the LS. What? so next time we go camp something we will ask your permission too?
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:23:31 2005 by Bowser
#18
Feb 22 2005 at 9:25 AM
38 posts
Ok, edited since I did mean offense. Since that issue is done with I guess I'll redeem myself by posting on topic about what I think about Hiptaru.
You annoy me. I blacklisted you to get peace from your casino spam. THEN when I finally remove you since I heard you stopped doing it. Then you started your Astral Ring raffle. You made a post about it on a forum, I can live with that. But the spam ingame about how much time is left until the draw I cannot. Great. Back on blacklist.
The Astral Ring scheme. Now that was just plain idiocy. Buying your own rings for what I think was a 200k markup just to push them to an insane price. Not only that you screwed up and let someone snipe 2 rings for 100g and 100k respectively (which is no doubt what the incomes from that raffle was supposed to cover).
And these are just impressions I've gathered from you without ever even talking to you. I don't know what you're like, but from the first impressions you've left on me I don't really want to risk finding out either.
Edit: While you're right Wintaru, Hiptaru wasn't the one to say that AD was the LS he was talkig about it doesn't change the fact that people we're practically telling the LS in question to hand him a trial pearl.
And rate me down all you like. You'll notice from my post count that it doesn't really affect me at all.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:37:04 2005 by Tyraelle
You annoy me. I blacklisted you to get peace from your casino spam. THEN when I finally remove you since I heard you stopped doing it. Then you started your Astral Ring raffle. You made a post about it on a forum, I can live with that. But the spam ingame about how much time is left until the draw I cannot. Great. Back on blacklist.
The Astral Ring scheme. Now that was just plain idiocy. Buying your own rings for what I think was a 200k markup just to push them to an insane price. Not only that you screwed up and let someone snipe 2 rings for 100g and 100k respectively (which is no doubt what the incomes from that raffle was supposed to cover).
And these are just impressions I've gathered from you without ever even talking to you. I don't know what you're like, but from the first impressions you've left on me I don't really want to risk finding out either.
Edit: While you're right Wintaru, Hiptaru wasn't the one to say that AD was the LS he was talkig about it doesn't change the fact that people we're practically telling the LS in question to hand him a trial pearl.
And rate me down all you like. You'll notice from my post count that it doesn't really affect me at all.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:37:04 2005 by Tyraelle
#19
Feb 22 2005 at 9:38 AM
Hiptau wrote:
"I Recently heard of a "Classy" HNM ls on the Bismarck Server.. So i decided to apply.. i am not gonna name names, because that would not be "Classy" . I respect thier decision of course, but i dont respect the reasons..."
First and for most Hip being classy is the only way to go. Staying civil... I give you mad props on that. First let's recap shall we?? I quoted you saying that you had to "apply"? Man what is this a d@#! job interview? No offense to you man.. but come one.. ***** them. What ever happened to "give me a pearl or not"? As far as your rep goes. I don't know jack, due to the reason I don't read all these threads. You can only read constant b!@#!ing on another people for so long. I don't "know" you or even partyed with you. I can say this though; buck up, move on and most importantly.. "bad" reps can only go so far.
Oh .. by the way if a d@#! linkshell has people "apply" to join... then their obviously taking themselves way too seriously. Chances are they may also take everything else the same way. Which means no fun in my opinion.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:39:58 2005 by dadrtystth
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:41:56 2005 by dadrtystth
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:42:35 2005 by dadrtystth
"I Recently heard of a "Classy" HNM ls on the Bismarck Server.. So i decided to apply.. i am not gonna name names, because that would not be "Classy" . I respect thier decision of course, but i dont respect the reasons..."
First and for most Hip being classy is the only way to go. Staying civil... I give you mad props on that. First let's recap shall we?? I quoted you saying that you had to "apply"? Man what is this a d@#! job interview? No offense to you man.. but come one.. ***** them. What ever happened to "give me a pearl or not"? As far as your rep goes. I don't know jack, due to the reason I don't read all these threads. You can only read constant b!@#!ing on another people for so long. I don't "know" you or even partyed with you. I can say this though; buck up, move on and most importantly.. "bad" reps can only go so far.
Oh .. by the way if a d@#! linkshell has people "apply" to join... then their obviously taking themselves way too seriously. Chances are they may also take everything else the same way. Which means no fun in my opinion.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:39:58 2005 by dadrtystth
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:41:56 2005 by dadrtystth
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:42:35 2005 by dadrtystth
#20
Feb 22 2005 at 9:50 AM
Tyraelle wrote:
Ok, edited since I did mean offense. Since that issue is done with I guess I'll redeem myself by posting on topic about what I think about Hiptaru.
Thanks, that's all I was getting at. Just a phrase we say but don't really mean :)
Tyraelle wrote:
Edit: While you're right Wintaru, Hiptaru wasn't the one to say that AD was the LS he was talkig about it doesn't change the fact that people we're practically telling the LS in question to hand him a trial pearl.
I see what you mean with that and I don't think you guys owed him anything. I'm not necessarily agreeing with Hiptaru airing this in the public, but I give him the benefit of the doubt because he truly didn't point fingers, I think he was probably honestly just wanting to know what people think of him.
Tyraelle wrote:
And rate me down all you like. You'll notice from my post count that it doesn't really affect me at all.
I know you don't care about karma as you obviously don't post much lol^^ I, however, don't blindly rate people down without giving due cause, even if they don't care what their karma is.
I'm the last person who gives a crap about what my karma is on a gaming website. Most people here know of me or have at least chatted with me briefly in game at one point or another and I hope I'm known as a fair individual. I'm not out to win a popularity contest but at the same time I would also like to know if someone thinks I'm an ******* and what I may have done to make them feel that way, much like what Hiptaru is trying to find out :)
Like me or dislike me, hope to meet you in game someday, you can never have too many friends on your friend list :)
Edit: Rated up your second post on this thread b(^.^)b
Edited, Tue Feb 22 09:56:36 2005 by Wintaru
#21
Feb 22 2005 at 10:02 AM
I have nothing against you Hiptaru, you may be the most skillful BLM in the game.
Your schemes have never hurt me in any way. I had bought my astral rings when they were 150K each.
I participate in your raffles, and it is great that you would lose some gil to make others happy.
On the other hand, last night when I checked the price of Raise III, I noticed someone had bought the last 4 scrolls for 2,000,000 gil, then relisted them for a higher price.
Thats right, someone is actualy jacking up the price of raise III to make a profit.
Well, my best friend is Leeluu, and for her to get raise III means me (level 71MNK, 122 days of play time) spending even more of my time farming, BCNMing and fishing so she can have it. Like I haven't spent enough friggin time farming for sh[b][/b]it, but now I'll have to farm even more, stop enjoying the game, to buy a scroll that benefits everyone but the person who pays for it!!
And when the LS saw this happening, the scroll being relisted and the price jacked up.
First thing someone said was
"It's probably one of Hiptaru's mules."
And while I do personaly like you, that is the rep you built for yourself.
Your schemes have never hurt me in any way. I had bought my astral rings when they were 150K each.
I participate in your raffles, and it is great that you would lose some gil to make others happy.
On the other hand, last night when I checked the price of Raise III, I noticed someone had bought the last 4 scrolls for 2,000,000 gil, then relisted them for a higher price.
Thats right, someone is actualy jacking up the price of raise III to make a profit.
Well, my best friend is Leeluu, and for her to get raise III means me (level 71MNK, 122 days of play time) spending even more of my time farming, BCNMing and fishing so she can have it. Like I haven't spent enough friggin time farming for sh[b][/b]it, but now I'll have to farm even more, stop enjoying the game, to buy a scroll that benefits everyone but the person who pays for it!!
And when the LS saw this happening, the scroll being relisted and the price jacked up.
First thing someone said was
"It's probably one of Hiptaru's mules."
And while I do personaly like you, that is the rep you built for yourself.
#22
Feb 22 2005 at 10:05 AM
The sole purpose behind having people "apply" to the shell is because most shells have a good solid base of people that they want to keep. Is it unfair to possible new members that these peoples' opinions count more than their own? Yeah probably.
However, if you want to run a good linkshell full of friends and free of drama, you'll have to take into account the opinions of the members you want to keep. I ran my own shell for a while and I had core members in mind with every decision I made. If anyone had a problem with things, I tried to alleviate it because I knew that more than anything else I wanted to keep these people in the shell because they were just that valuable.
If adding a new member means adding needless drama for existing members, why would you add them?
However, if you want to run a good linkshell full of friends and free of drama, you'll have to take into account the opinions of the members you want to keep. I ran my own shell for a while and I had core members in mind with every decision I made. If anyone had a problem with things, I tried to alleviate it because I knew that more than anything else I wanted to keep these people in the shell because they were just that valuable.
If adding a new member means adding needless drama for existing members, why would you add them?
#23
Feb 22 2005 at 10:13 AM
I think Hiptaru's reputation is less than deserving, and its just from reading these threads. I personally think its a touch of jeolousy that makes Hiptaru disliked by many. I mean, for people to still bring up those casino's is digging pretty deep to find something. He's an entrepeneur and a damn good one at it. I would re-read the OP because I see this veering into a HNMLS vs. Hiptaru discussion
This is all he's asking. Nothing more. He made it clear from the beginning he has respect for the decision.
Personally, I've never met Hiptaru and I must of been stuck in some godforsaken Leveling area for weeks during the time he was spamming casino's cause you know what, I never EVER heard him shout...or you know what, I probably just ignored it like i would ignore any shout that I really didn't want anything to do with. Here's where I get my respect for Hiptaru:
1.Even with most people against him, I've only ever seen him lost his cool once (altho I still think it was funny when he posted a picture of himself giving the finger...very creative) when there were many times he could have taken the infamous/beatdown/etc.. route and act very childish.
2.What he did for Infamous. He took the most hated player on this server and decided to give this guy a chance. Something I believe NONE of us would have done. Granted Infamous probably has/will ***** his chance, but at least Hiptaru gave him one.
3.His loyalty to his LS. This is obviously shown in his posts. I have never heard anyone refute this. I respect that.
So yes, i respect Hiptaru. If I was still playing I'd even like to meet him in-game.
For those you rating down opinions, I'm right behind and reversing those. I especially didn't like that Wintaru's or Tse's post got rated down for absolutely nothing. Don't you realize yet that when you rate non-contreversial posts down (simply unfounded rate-downs), you're gonna get a grove of people rating them back up like me. Live and learn i guess
edit: double-negative..ugghh..I'm SMRT
Edited, Tue Feb 22 10:17:55 2005 by Vimien
Hiptaru wrote:
I respect thier decision of course
Hiptaru wrote:
What does Bismarck think of me?
This is all he's asking. Nothing more. He made it clear from the beginning he has respect for the decision.
Personally, I've never met Hiptaru and I must of been stuck in some godforsaken Leveling area for weeks during the time he was spamming casino's cause you know what, I never EVER heard him shout...or you know what, I probably just ignored it like i would ignore any shout that I really didn't want anything to do with. Here's where I get my respect for Hiptaru:
1.Even with most people against him, I've only ever seen him lost his cool once (altho I still think it was funny when he posted a picture of himself giving the finger...very creative) when there were many times he could have taken the infamous/beatdown/etc.. route and act very childish.
2.What he did for Infamous. He took the most hated player on this server and decided to give this guy a chance. Something I believe NONE of us would have done. Granted Infamous probably has/will ***** his chance, but at least Hiptaru gave him one.
3.His loyalty to his LS. This is obviously shown in his posts. I have never heard anyone refute this. I respect that.
So yes, i respect Hiptaru. If I was still playing I'd even like to meet him in-game.
For those you rating down opinions, I'm right behind and reversing those. I especially didn't like that Wintaru's or Tse's post got rated down for absolutely nothing. Don't you realize yet that when you rate non-contreversial posts down (simply unfounded rate-downs), you're gonna get a grove of people rating them back up like me. Live and learn i guess
edit: double-negative..ugghh..I'm SMRT
Edited, Tue Feb 22 10:17:55 2005 by Vimien
#24
Feb 22 2005 at 10:16 AM
38 posts
Quote:
dadrtystth wrote:
Hiptau wrote:
"I Recently heard of a "Classy" HNM ls on the Bismarck Server.. So i decided to apply.. i am not gonna name names, because that would not be "Classy" . I respect thier decision of course, but i dont respect the reasons..."
First and for most Hip being classy is the only way to go. Staying civil... I give you mad props on that. First let's recap shall we?? I quoted you saying that you had to "apply"? Man what is this a d@#! job interview? No offense to you man.. but come one.. ***** them. What ever happened to "give me a pearl or not"? As far as your rep goes. I don't know jack, due to the reason I don't read all these threads. You can only read constant b!@#!ing on another people for so long. I don't "know" you or even partyed with you. I can say this though; buck up, move on and most importantly.. "bad" reps can only go so far.
Oh .. by the way if a d@#! linkshell has people "apply" to join... then their obviously taking themselves way too seriously. Chances are they may also take everything else the same way. Which means no fun in my opinion.
Obviously they have people apply to join to weed out people like you. (I sense a ratedown coming from posting that) >.>
Edit: Wasn't a crack at Wintaru :x
And fixed quote. Made it seem like Hiptaru wrote that when he didn't. :x
Edited, Tue Feb 22 11:25:56 2005 by Tyraelle
#25
Feb 22 2005 at 10:36 AM
Normally I like to stay out of the high-drama threads, but for whatever reason (possibly because I drank too much coffee this morning), I thought I might chime in on this one.
First of all, I'll give my opinion of Hiptaru. I've only talked to him a few times in the game, and he seems like a nice enough guy. As far as that goes, I have no problems with Hip. He's come with my LS to help out a few times, and he's always been fun to have around. I can't really speak for his skill as a BLM, but I've certainly never heard any complaints.
As far as his gil-related actions go, I can start seeing some areas that can cause controversy. Casino spamming? Never really cared. I can turn shouts off if I want, but mostly, I expect shouts in Jeuno. Jeuno is the spam capital of Vana'diel. Cornering the market on astral rings and raising prices? Pretty shrewd. A little too cut-throat for my taste, but I'm not going to call him a horrible person for it. Bidding on his own rings to inflate the prices? Pretty ugly tactic. Not technically a violation of the terms of agreement, but try it on Ebay someday. The way he handled getting caught and having someone buy one for 100 gil? Pretty cool. I thought he showed a lot of class there. Raffles? I kind of liked that idea. Showed some nice thinking, and he made an event out of it. Admittedly, I wasn't there, but I heard it was fun.
Hip obviously at some point decided his goal in the game was to make obscene amounts of money. Nothing more American than that, really. I'm sure most people don't agree with the actions of a lot of large companies, but you still buy their products.
I have problems with his sort of self-appointed taru Santa Claus role. I know people like to help their friends, and I know Hip won't miss the money, but to me, it's just a form of economic powerleveling, and I dislike it just about as much as actual powerleveling. Moreover, to me, one of the great things to do in the game is set a goal to have an item, whatever it is, and then work for however long to earn it. Anyone who hands out multi-million dollar gifts, in my opinion, is just cheapening the accomplishment of every person who actually worked his or her *** off for several months to actually earn the same item. Of course, I understand that different people play FF for different reasons. Some people won't accept high-dollar gifts because they want that sense of accomplishment for earning it; others will because it means they can get to level 75 more quickly.
This thread? Accuse me of being cynical (it won't be the first time), but I think it was partially lashing out. While Hip never named the LS, he did provide the information that he was denied admission into a LS. If he was honestly just concerned about what people thought of him, he could've left that part out entirely. He also kept calling it a "classy" LS, and though he admitted later he was wrong on the word used, at the time he thought he was quoting a member's signature. Surely he expected at least one or two people to make the connection. And, of course, there's always the human factor: I certainly would've expected a knee-jerk reaction from a member of the LS defending the LS's actions, and sure enough, it was provided. That fact that it wasn't particularly grammatically sound is just a plus.
Oh, and just because I can't resist, the whole "leeching" accusation on a Rank 5 mission. My LS has had people come along who weren't LS members on quests. Do I consider these people as "leeching"? Um...no. We were able to get their help in doing a difficult mission, we were able to help them achieve something, and in return we spent an extra five minutes killing mobs we'd already killed twice. Being bitter because you had to kill those two oh-so-tough Quadavs in Beadeaux an extra time is a bit on the silly side. Just because someone isn't in your LS doesn't mean you can't help him out, and just because you help someone out and he doesn't join your LS doesn't make him leech.
And now to my second point...whether I, or anyone else, should even be wasting their time with this. I'm somewhat off my caffeine high, so I guess it was a positive thing for me. But for the most part, it's not really going to matter for any of us. Just like Hip won't be investigated for unfair trading practices, no one's going to look at a LS for discriminatory admission procedures. It doesn't matter how great a player is or how nice a guy he is, if the LS doesn't want him in, why should they be forced to? Whether they're justified in thinking Hip has a bad reputation or not, it's their opinion, and if they don't want to see him in the LS list, that's their business. There's obviously a lot of positive feeling toward Hip from people who know him better than I do, so in that case I hope he finds a different HNMLS, if that's what he chooses to do, that he can help and that will appreciate him.
In the end, people will read this thread, they'll come away with positive or negative feelings toward Hip and the LS involved, they'll rate up the people they agree with, they'll rate down the people they don't, they'll move on, and if anyone loses sleep over it, I'll be concerned for the mental well-being of that person.
EDIT: Just to prove my last point, I was rated down in the time it took me to reload the page. o.O
And here I thought I actually took a pretty moderate stance.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 11:19:20 2005 by Vimesrdm
First of all, I'll give my opinion of Hiptaru. I've only talked to him a few times in the game, and he seems like a nice enough guy. As far as that goes, I have no problems with Hip. He's come with my LS to help out a few times, and he's always been fun to have around. I can't really speak for his skill as a BLM, but I've certainly never heard any complaints.
As far as his gil-related actions go, I can start seeing some areas that can cause controversy. Casino spamming? Never really cared. I can turn shouts off if I want, but mostly, I expect shouts in Jeuno. Jeuno is the spam capital of Vana'diel. Cornering the market on astral rings and raising prices? Pretty shrewd. A little too cut-throat for my taste, but I'm not going to call him a horrible person for it. Bidding on his own rings to inflate the prices? Pretty ugly tactic. Not technically a violation of the terms of agreement, but try it on Ebay someday. The way he handled getting caught and having someone buy one for 100 gil? Pretty cool. I thought he showed a lot of class there. Raffles? I kind of liked that idea. Showed some nice thinking, and he made an event out of it. Admittedly, I wasn't there, but I heard it was fun.
Hip obviously at some point decided his goal in the game was to make obscene amounts of money. Nothing more American than that, really. I'm sure most people don't agree with the actions of a lot of large companies, but you still buy their products.
I have problems with his sort of self-appointed taru Santa Claus role. I know people like to help their friends, and I know Hip won't miss the money, but to me, it's just a form of economic powerleveling, and I dislike it just about as much as actual powerleveling. Moreover, to me, one of the great things to do in the game is set a goal to have an item, whatever it is, and then work for however long to earn it. Anyone who hands out multi-million dollar gifts, in my opinion, is just cheapening the accomplishment of every person who actually worked his or her *** off for several months to actually earn the same item. Of course, I understand that different people play FF for different reasons. Some people won't accept high-dollar gifts because they want that sense of accomplishment for earning it; others will because it means they can get to level 75 more quickly.
This thread? Accuse me of being cynical (it won't be the first time), but I think it was partially lashing out. While Hip never named the LS, he did provide the information that he was denied admission into a LS. If he was honestly just concerned about what people thought of him, he could've left that part out entirely. He also kept calling it a "classy" LS, and though he admitted later he was wrong on the word used, at the time he thought he was quoting a member's signature. Surely he expected at least one or two people to make the connection. And, of course, there's always the human factor: I certainly would've expected a knee-jerk reaction from a member of the LS defending the LS's actions, and sure enough, it was provided. That fact that it wasn't particularly grammatically sound is just a plus.
Oh, and just because I can't resist, the whole "leeching" accusation on a Rank 5 mission. My LS has had people come along who weren't LS members on quests. Do I consider these people as "leeching"? Um...no. We were able to get their help in doing a difficult mission, we were able to help them achieve something, and in return we spent an extra five minutes killing mobs we'd already killed twice. Being bitter because you had to kill those two oh-so-tough Quadavs in Beadeaux an extra time is a bit on the silly side. Just because someone isn't in your LS doesn't mean you can't help him out, and just because you help someone out and he doesn't join your LS doesn't make him leech.
And now to my second point...whether I, or anyone else, should even be wasting their time with this. I'm somewhat off my caffeine high, so I guess it was a positive thing for me. But for the most part, it's not really going to matter for any of us. Just like Hip won't be investigated for unfair trading practices, no one's going to look at a LS for discriminatory admission procedures. It doesn't matter how great a player is or how nice a guy he is, if the LS doesn't want him in, why should they be forced to? Whether they're justified in thinking Hip has a bad reputation or not, it's their opinion, and if they don't want to see him in the LS list, that's their business. There's obviously a lot of positive feeling toward Hip from people who know him better than I do, so in that case I hope he finds a different HNMLS, if that's what he chooses to do, that he can help and that will appreciate him.
In the end, people will read this thread, they'll come away with positive or negative feelings toward Hip and the LS involved, they'll rate up the people they agree with, they'll rate down the people they don't, they'll move on, and if anyone loses sleep over it, I'll be concerned for the mental well-being of that person.
EDIT: Just to prove my last point, I was rated down in the time it took me to reload the page. o.O
And here I thought I actually took a pretty moderate stance.
Edited, Tue Feb 22 11:19:20 2005 by Vimesrdm
#26
Feb 22 2005 at 10:41 AM
29 posts
Hip, you have nothing but my upmost respect due to the reasons Vimien already listed. I admire greatly your entrepeneurship skills being a business student myself, and would be honored to be in the same shell as you.
And while it boggles me why you would get denied, you of all people should understand that applications can (and do) get denied for some very questionable reasons sometimes. Best to just say "its their loss" and move on.
Personally, I'm suprised you haven't already started your own HNMLS with the resources available to you. But like i stated before, either way its gonna be best for this issue to die. Complainin about not gettin entry into AD isnt going to do anything but have a negative impact.
But what do I know, I'm just a drg
And while it boggles me why you would get denied, you of all people should understand that applications can (and do) get denied for some very questionable reasons sometimes. Best to just say "its their loss" and move on.
Personally, I'm suprised you haven't already started your own HNMLS with the resources available to you. But like i stated before, either way its gonna be best for this issue to die. Complainin about not gettin entry into AD isnt going to do anything but have a negative impact.
But what do I know, I'm just a drg
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