I posted a while ago about needing a new LS. I do have one now, and I'm getting a bit fed up with it. It's very small...and group activities are practically never. I personally enjoy helping people with quests, missions, item getting, etc. And of course, there being enough people to help you when you need something is nice. The LS I'm in now is just too small and unorganized for much of this to go on. For example, for a few weeks I've still needed papyrus for Genkai 1... and yes I know it's the worst one to get, and yes I know I'm not 50 yet (I'm working on it)...but I wanna get it done and over with. Whenever I mention it all I get is a >.< or a {No thanks.}. Now, to me, that's not what an LS should be about. If it's in my ability to help an LS member, then I'm there.
I've felt a bit stuck lately, really because I'm getting into a bit higher levels and I know once I reach the 50's (if I ever get anyone to help me get that damned papyrus) I'm gonna be the one shouting in Jeuno, {Help me out!} ...and I really don't wanna have to do that. I want an LS that can and will actually help each other with these things, and that can be organized.
I really don't wanna quit this game. I wanna be playing for a long time, but I've been thinking about it if I can't have a solid LS to rely on. Maybe I'm expecting to much...but that's what I figured what a big part of having an LS should be about. Of course it's always nice to have a fun time chatting too. :P
Anyway..blah blah blah... I think I've made my point. Current jobs at the bottom. I'm usually on after approx. 7pm PST. So feel free to send me a /tell, a message, or I'll be checking back at this post as well. Thanks for reading!
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{edit}I completely neglected emilyia's Chain Help Thread. It is a very good starting point if people would simply make more use if it. {/edit}
>>> Warning. This became very long very quick. I'm sorry, please feel free to skip reading it as it contains mostly my opinions on help and linkshells. I'm going to post it anyway for those with nothing better to do at work. <<<
I guess there are a couple of things to consider, if you don't mind me putting my two cents in.
Warning: Much opinionated (random) information follows :-)
It seems that you are looking for a linkshell that is about helping one another. There are several linkshells out there that were not established for this purpose. So when you start looking, find one with a clear cut "help-out" mandate.
Ask yourself what you are going to offer to a linkshell. Personally I don't feel that an answer like "I can help out when I'm level 60." is acceptable. You are level 48 now, so you should consider joining a linkshell that has several level 30 people as well as level 50+. If you are not offering help with Missions, advanced job quests, genkai, and AF (still a few levels away) etc to the level 30-50s (and I'm not saying that you aren't), then you should not expect to get any help from the level 60s. Also, consider this question: "Have I helped at least five people for every one time I have received help?" Why this question? Glad you asked. Typically, there are at least five people giving their time to help you get something done. In my opinion you now owe at least five other people your time. In the case where you have nothing to offer the members helping you, I think you should pass that help along to those that do need it. And you should do it in a proactive way. "Woah Timmy! You are only rank 2? Let's go kill your dragon." "Man, your armor kind of sucks, lets go camp some Martial Slacks for you." You get my point.
I sometimes feel that my time is not respected by some members in my linkshell. I really do want to help people out. I received a bit of help getting all the stuff done to get to 60, but for the most part I made my own way (Thanks specifically to Harax for helping out with that papy!). I have gone through a bit of trouble setting up forums and such for my linkshell and trying to organize events and such, but nobody ever uses them. Instead, I log in and often get requests for help with some mission or nm or whathaveyou. While I do want to help, I typically make my plans for playing this game on a forum during the day. I end up turning people down because I already have commitments and it makes me feel that I have let them down. It also makes me feel like they think that they "never get any help from the ls". My point here is that I think any linkshell that is constructed to benefit all the members must use some outside form of communication and scheduling and everyone must use it. Furthermore, I would go so far as to suggest tracking the "help" that people give and receive and schedule people's requests based on the karma they have attained. Granted, I would only do this for a truly help oriented LS, not just a friendly group of people :-)
Another thing to consider is what it means to indebt yourself to 5-10 other people. Take this example:
On Monday, Player1 receives help from 5 people to camp and kill a NM that drops a rare/ex item that is specific to Player1's job. This take the entire night of gameplay.
Player1 agrees that he will help Players2-6 with similar quests.
On Tuesday, Player1 helps Player2
On Wednesday, Player1 helps Player3
On Thursday, Player1 helps Player4
On Friday, Player1 helps Player5
On Saturday, Player1 helps Player6
On Sunday, Player1 gets and exp party and makes 6000 experience points.
When do you farm for gil? When do you craft? When do you work on your fame?
If you were to "get help" doing something once a week as per the example above, you might make level 75 before the sun burns out, but it isn't very likely.
In practice, it isn't going to work out this way. Many people are just going to help out of the goodness of their hearts or to skill up (or whatever). The point is that you should be prepared for the example given above when you ask for help and be preapred to do what it takes to pay it back.
Ok. Back to reality.
Finding a LS as structured as the one I have described above will most likely be very difficult. I think most of the linkshells of that caliber are HNM shells with level 65 minimum application limits. If there is a linkshell out there that has some/most/all of these controls in place, I would be very interested to hear about it.
As for shouting in jeuno (yes, i have shouted in jeuno plenty T_T), try searching out other players that have the same goal as you. For example, you are trying to finish G1 now, so do "/sea all 45-50" and start asking people if they need it. Put forth the effort to organize and schedule the event. Don't expect to do it an hour after you decide to get it started. Expect to pin down a time in the next day or two and get everybody prepared and on track. Give a couple of /shouts anyway an hour or so before you are ready to go. There might just be somebody level 60+ looking to skillup a weapon, and they are always a welcome addition (even if they miss a lot). Also, in this example, be prepared to go back to CN or GC to get mold and coal for the people in the papyrus party. At the end of the day, you will feel a lot more accomplishment. It seems odd that someone would want to sit at the front door and lot on the item while other people went to do their mission for them, but maybe that is just me.
Use all your opportunities to build up a large friends list. While many of the Artifact quests overlap, remember that at least one of the AF quests is specific to the job and typically takes an alliance of 12 or more people. You will want a large base of people to call on when that time comes. Of course, that means that you must not ignore their requests when they ask of things from you.
Well, that was a lot of nothing I just said. Sorry for being longwinded, but I'm a big believer that time equals life. Hence, asking for someone's time is like asking for a little bit of their life (even if it is the part of theif life they squander playing a game) and you should be prepared to repay it with a little bit of your life.
So does anybody want to start a ls that is this rigid and structured? Probably not, but if anybody wants to at least approximate it, let me know. {I'm Interested} I'm also willing to take on most of the administrative and tracking duties of said ls, but there would be several requirements and conditions. Kinda like an end-game linkshell for levels 30-75 I guess *shrug*.
Thanks for taking the time to read all that garbage :-)
Edited, Fri Oct 22 15:03:11 2004 by Idwa
>>> Warning. This became very long very quick. I'm sorry, please feel free to skip reading it as it contains mostly my opinions on help and linkshells. I'm going to post it anyway for those with nothing better to do at work. <<<
I guess there are a couple of things to consider, if you don't mind me putting my two cents in.
Warning: Much opinionated (random) information follows :-)
It seems that you are looking for a linkshell that is about helping one another. There are several linkshells out there that were not established for this purpose. So when you start looking, find one with a clear cut "help-out" mandate.
Ask yourself what you are going to offer to a linkshell. Personally I don't feel that an answer like "I can help out when I'm level 60." is acceptable. You are level 48 now, so you should consider joining a linkshell that has several level 30 people as well as level 50+. If you are not offering help with Missions, advanced job quests, genkai, and AF (still a few levels away) etc to the level 30-50s (and I'm not saying that you aren't), then you should not expect to get any help from the level 60s. Also, consider this question: "Have I helped at least five people for every one time I have received help?" Why this question? Glad you asked. Typically, there are at least five people giving their time to help you get something done. In my opinion you now owe at least five other people your time. In the case where you have nothing to offer the members helping you, I think you should pass that help along to those that do need it. And you should do it in a proactive way. "Woah Timmy! You are only rank 2? Let's go kill your dragon." "Man, your armor kind of sucks, lets go camp some Martial Slacks for you." You get my point.
I sometimes feel that my time is not respected by some members in my linkshell. I really do want to help people out. I received a bit of help getting all the stuff done to get to 60, but for the most part I made my own way (Thanks specifically to Harax for helping out with that papy!). I have gone through a bit of trouble setting up forums and such for my linkshell and trying to organize events and such, but nobody ever uses them. Instead, I log in and often get requests for help with some mission or nm or whathaveyou. While I do want to help, I typically make my plans for playing this game on a forum during the day. I end up turning people down because I already have commitments and it makes me feel that I have let them down. It also makes me feel like they think that they "never get any help from the ls". My point here is that I think any linkshell that is constructed to benefit all the members must use some outside form of communication and scheduling and everyone must use it. Furthermore, I would go so far as to suggest tracking the "help" that people give and receive and schedule people's requests based on the karma they have attained. Granted, I would only do this for a truly help oriented LS, not just a friendly group of people :-)
Another thing to consider is what it means to indebt yourself to 5-10 other people. Take this example:
On Monday, Player1 receives help from 5 people to camp and kill a NM that drops a rare/ex item that is specific to Player1's job. This take the entire night of gameplay.
Player1 agrees that he will help Players2-6 with similar quests.
On Tuesday, Player1 helps Player2
On Wednesday, Player1 helps Player3
On Thursday, Player1 helps Player4
On Friday, Player1 helps Player5
On Saturday, Player1 helps Player6
On Sunday, Player1 gets and exp party and makes 6000 experience points.
When do you farm for gil? When do you craft? When do you work on your fame?
If you were to "get help" doing something once a week as per the example above, you might make level 75 before the sun burns out, but it isn't very likely.
In practice, it isn't going to work out this way. Many people are just going to help out of the goodness of their hearts or to skill up (or whatever). The point is that you should be prepared for the example given above when you ask for help and be preapred to do what it takes to pay it back.
Ok. Back to reality.
Finding a LS as structured as the one I have described above will most likely be very difficult. I think most of the linkshells of that caliber are HNM shells with level 65 minimum application limits. If there is a linkshell out there that has some/most/all of these controls in place, I would be very interested to hear about it.
As for shouting in jeuno (yes, i have shouted in jeuno plenty T_T), try searching out other players that have the same goal as you. For example, you are trying to finish G1 now, so do "/sea all 45-50" and start asking people if they need it. Put forth the effort to organize and schedule the event. Don't expect to do it an hour after you decide to get it started. Expect to pin down a time in the next day or two and get everybody prepared and on track. Give a couple of /shouts anyway an hour or so before you are ready to go. There might just be somebody level 60+ looking to skillup a weapon, and they are always a welcome addition (even if they miss a lot). Also, in this example, be prepared to go back to CN or GC to get mold and coal for the people in the papyrus party. At the end of the day, you will feel a lot more accomplishment. It seems odd that someone would want to sit at the front door and lot on the item while other people went to do their mission for them, but maybe that is just me.
Use all your opportunities to build up a large friends list. While many of the Artifact quests overlap, remember that at least one of the AF quests is specific to the job and typically takes an alliance of 12 or more people. You will want a large base of people to call on when that time comes. Of course, that means that you must not ignore their requests when they ask of things from you.
Well, that was a lot of nothing I just said. Sorry for being longwinded, but I'm a big believer that time equals life. Hence, asking for someone's time is like asking for a little bit of their life (even if it is the part of theif life they squander playing a game) and you should be prepared to repay it with a little bit of your life.
So does anybody want to start a ls that is this rigid and structured? Probably not, but if anybody wants to at least approximate it, let me know. {I'm Interested} I'm also willing to take on most of the administrative and tracking duties of said ls, but there would be several requirements and conditions. Kinda like an end-game linkshell for levels 30-75 I guess *shrug*.
Thanks for taking the time to read all that garbage :-)
Edited, Fri Oct 22 15:03:11 2004 by Idwa
hey man, alot of people like to help each other out in my LS.. i mean we dont have set times for it or anything.. like the other day, somebody needed thier subjob items..
so 3 of us went out to the dunes, and in 15 mins, we got them all of thier items.. and just the other day, i helped Kattiebree, a mithra in my LS get about 200 yag necklaces..
stuff like that.. if you would like to join my LS, and put together some LS events yourself, and sorta get things more organized in that area, i welcome you..
just give some of us a /tell in game..
hiptaru
szandor
malic
kattiebree
spudz
those are just a few that can get you a pearl.
so 3 of us went out to the dunes, and in 15 mins, we got them all of thier items.. and just the other day, i helped Kattiebree, a mithra in my LS get about 200 yag necklaces..
stuff like that.. if you would like to join my LS, and put together some LS events yourself, and sorta get things more organized in that area, i welcome you..
just give some of us a /tell in game..
hiptaru
szandor
malic
kattiebree
spudz
those are just a few that can get you a pearl.
Speaking as somebody in X's LS, I'm quite saddened to see she's not getting any help. I'm a new member of the LS (hell, I'm new to the game period) and was feeling a little like everyone was far too high above me for me to be even a remote priority.
But then I happened to casually mention I hadn't gotten my Kazham Keys yet. After getting a stern "why the hell didn't you tell us?" The LS guys were all over it. X was the first one to drop whatever she was doing to help me out.
And yes, that was a pretty good example of the kind of attitude I got from my LS.
It meant a lot and I really hoped to do something for her in return once I was a high enough level to actually be of use.
I have been getting a fair bit of help from the LS lately though. Special mention goes to Mags for wasting 2 hours of her time to help me level my sub as my gimpness was costing me pt invites ^_^
Anyway, you know them all better than I do, but I get the impression that if you told the LS this was something important to you, they'd set a date and go do it. Hell, if a lv27WAR is any use to you at any time, you can always give me a holler. ^^
Edited, Fri Oct 22 17:07:04 2004 by Rasen
But then I happened to casually mention I hadn't gotten my Kazham Keys yet. After getting a stern "why the hell didn't you tell us?" The LS guys were all over it. X was the first one to drop whatever she was doing to help me out.
Quote:
And you should do it in a proactive way. "Woah Timmy! You are only rank 2? Let's go kill your dragon." "Man, your armor kind of sucks, lets go camp some Martial Slacks for you." You get my point.
And yes, that was a pretty good example of the kind of attitude I got from my LS.
It meant a lot and I really hoped to do something for her in return once I was a high enough level to actually be of use.
I have been getting a fair bit of help from the LS lately though. Special mention goes to Mags for wasting 2 hours of her time to help me level my sub as my gimpness was costing me pt invites ^_^
Anyway, you know them all better than I do, but I get the impression that if you told the LS this was something important to you, they'd set a date and go do it. Hell, if a lv27WAR is any use to you at any time, you can always give me a holler. ^^
Edited, Fri Oct 22 17:07:04 2004 by Rasen
It's also important to note that many things in the game can be done on your own. It just takes longer to do.
I will be honest. I have received help on Genkai 1 with the Paper and help killing the 2 NM's for my AF2. This assistance came from a party that I had met doing mission 5-1 in Fei-Yin. Not only did I make some new friends in that party, but I was able to contribute to the second killing of the bones after I had already completed the mission.
Come to this forum and see how many people are meeting for events like AF, Genkai, etc. Make friends with some of them.
I personally would like to do everythimg myself, but as a MNK, I absolutely need a healer to assist so I don't die. My RL hub usually helps me out. I feel sorry for him because he has done most of the things for his RDM all by himself without high level assistance.
Hell, I even felt guilty about asking for help with AF2. Krack and Jubon were more than wiling to help, and I in return would help them anytime they needed it, even if I was doing something else.
"The more you give, the more you will receive."
I will be honest. I have received help on Genkai 1 with the Paper and help killing the 2 NM's for my AF2. This assistance came from a party that I had met doing mission 5-1 in Fei-Yin. Not only did I make some new friends in that party, but I was able to contribute to the second killing of the bones after I had already completed the mission.
Come to this forum and see how many people are meeting for events like AF, Genkai, etc. Make friends with some of them.
I personally would like to do everythimg myself, but as a MNK, I absolutely need a healer to assist so I don't die. My RL hub usually helps me out. I feel sorry for him because he has done most of the things for his RDM all by himself without high level assistance.
Hell, I even felt guilty about asking for help with AF2. Krack and Jubon were more than wiling to help, and I in return would help them anytime they needed it, even if I was doing something else.
"The more you give, the more you will receive."
10 posts
If you still need help with papyrus, send me a /tell ingame sometime, will be glad to help out :).
Actually, my LS is level range 30-50, with 1 or 2 above 50. And was created specifically in order to be a quorum wherein players could get help.
I'm happy to say that we typically have reasonably organized group events where we try to attain this goal or that.
For example tonight we're attempting to get a newer member their rank 3, and sometime next week we'll probably be getting his keys.
On the level 50 end of things, a couple of our members are getting close to doing their G1. Not enough lvl 50's yet to accomplish it with LS only members, but it might provide you with a core group to which you could add a couple of pick-up members.)
It is still a fairly new LS though (less than a month old) with roughly 15 members, so things aren't entirely organized yet. A message board is in the works, for example. I just haven't found the time to put it up. (should be up this week).
I'd be more than happy to give you a pearl to our LS, to see if you like it. And no hard feelings if you feel it's not a good fit for you. The only stipulation I have is that you try and help out with missions, quests, etc, that you CAN help out with, should you decide to stay with us.
99% of the time any large-scale help is scheduled ahead of time. (Minus tonight's impromtu dragon-slaying.)
Assuming I can even log in tonight (crappy ISP + Halloween fest = FFXI being chucked out the window in frustration), send me a /tell if you're interested.
[Edit for clarity. Because I'm picky like that.]
[Editted AGAIN because despite how often I use the word, I have yet to spell quorum right the first time in any typed conversation.]
Edited, Mon Oct 25 00:21:50 2004 by nataraja
Edited, Mon Oct 25 00:24:01 2004 by nataraja
I'm happy to say that we typically have reasonably organized group events where we try to attain this goal or that.
For example tonight we're attempting to get a newer member their rank 3, and sometime next week we'll probably be getting his keys.
On the level 50 end of things, a couple of our members are getting close to doing their G1. Not enough lvl 50's yet to accomplish it with LS only members, but it might provide you with a core group to which you could add a couple of pick-up members.)
It is still a fairly new LS though (less than a month old) with roughly 15 members, so things aren't entirely organized yet. A message board is in the works, for example. I just haven't found the time to put it up. (should be up this week).
I'd be more than happy to give you a pearl to our LS, to see if you like it. And no hard feelings if you feel it's not a good fit for you. The only stipulation I have is that you try and help out with missions, quests, etc, that you CAN help out with, should you decide to stay with us.
99% of the time any large-scale help is scheduled ahead of time. (Minus tonight's impromtu dragon-slaying.)
Assuming I can even log in tonight (crappy ISP + Halloween fest = FFXI being chucked out the window in frustration), send me a /tell if you're interested.
[Edit for clarity. Because I'm picky like that.]
[Editted AGAIN because despite how often I use the word, I have yet to spell quorum right the first time in any typed conversation.]
Edited, Mon Oct 25 00:21:50 2004 by nataraja
Edited, Mon Oct 25 00:24:01 2004 by nataraja
I think Idwa covered everything I could hope to, but I'll toss this in more on the emotional side of things.
My LS started out as a friends thing. It was created to stay in touch with some cool people, not necessarily to get help with things or have an organized base from which to operate.
However, as the game went on...that expectation sort of manifested in the middle of things for me, and probably for a few of the other members too.
I remember soloing my RSE, growling to myself all along about my friends, none of whom were on at the time; because I spent so much time in-game with them, and I so rarely felt alone, the experience of needing help for something difficult and not necessarily having it was tough.
The same happened with my AF2; I spent eleven hours doing it alone. And inside I fumed, although I didn't erupt about it, for which I'm glad to this day; the whole idea behind this LS is freedom. When we help one another we do it because we're friends, not because we have obligations; and although 'friendship' help isn't anywhere near as reliable as 'obligation' help, it's still preferable for a lot of reasons.
It depends basically on what you want out of the game, as has been said. If you want friends, go for a friendly LS, but don't expect help every time you need something! If you're looking for help, go to a 'help' LS, but as has also been said, be prepared to repay those obligations ON DEMAND. You must return what you're given.
I love my friends on the LS, every one of them, but I don't always get help, and I don't always have the time to give it. I know when I'm free to help with something I do though, and I know the same is true for them.
My LS started out as a friends thing. It was created to stay in touch with some cool people, not necessarily to get help with things or have an organized base from which to operate.
However, as the game went on...that expectation sort of manifested in the middle of things for me, and probably for a few of the other members too.
I remember soloing my RSE, growling to myself all along about my friends, none of whom were on at the time; because I spent so much time in-game with them, and I so rarely felt alone, the experience of needing help for something difficult and not necessarily having it was tough.
The same happened with my AF2; I spent eleven hours doing it alone. And inside I fumed, although I didn't erupt about it, for which I'm glad to this day; the whole idea behind this LS is freedom. When we help one another we do it because we're friends, not because we have obligations; and although 'friendship' help isn't anywhere near as reliable as 'obligation' help, it's still preferable for a lot of reasons.
It depends basically on what you want out of the game, as has been said. If you want friends, go for a friendly LS, but don't expect help every time you need something! If you're looking for help, go to a 'help' LS, but as has also been said, be prepared to repay those obligations ON DEMAND. You must return what you're given.
I love my friends on the LS, every one of them, but I don't always get help, and I don't always have the time to give it. I know when I'm free to help with something I do though, and I know the same is true for them.
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