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WoW Ninja'd my loot.Follow

#52 Mar 30 2012 at 10:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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someproteinguy wrote:
Mazra wrote:
So, instead of rolling against one to four players on some bosses, I now have to roll against everyone, every time, on every boss, whether I need something from that boss or not?


Not really. You only roll against yourself. Nobody cares what that other hunter got because you'll never see him again, and it has no affect on what you win.

Think of it this way:

You have like a 10% chance of getting 1 item, a 10% chance of getting a different item, 20% chance of getting something else interesting, 60% you have only your gold, and will walk away with that. Everyone who completes the boss gets their own goodie bag to loot. All 20 hunters in the raid could win the same item from the same boss, or none. Loot tables are for the individual, not the group.

The way I understand it, Maz isn't completely off-base. Dev comments suggest to me that, for a boss that drops, say, five items in a 25-man raid, either the RNG will pick the top five rolls before displaying the results or each individual's percentage chance will be set so that on average there will be five winners out of 25. Basically, if they want to avoid loot inflation, they have to rein in the drop chances somehow - your chance of winning is not completely divorced from everyone else's, but your individual loot tables are.

The big difference is that no one takes away "your" loot. If the other hunter wins, there's a chance he gets the polearm - but if you also win there's a chance you get one too. And if only clothies win, none of them take an unusable polearm away from hunters.

One knock-on effect that I hope they start allowing for early in profession balancing - high-end crystals for use as Enchanting mats will be an order of magnitude rarer than today unless they change something. Maybe a recipe that's the opposite of "Shatter".

Hmm. Will there be an option "I don't need anything that this boss might drop - just cut to the chase and give me a shard"?
#53 Mar 30 2012 at 10:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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ElMuneco wrote:

The way I understand it, Maz isn't completely off-base. Dev comments suggest to me that, for a boss that drops, say, five items in a 25-man raid, either the RNG will pick the top five rolls before displaying the results or each individual's percentage chance will be set so that on average there will be five winners out of 25. Basically, if they want to avoid loot inflation, they have to rein in the drop chances somehow - your chance of winning is not completely divorced from everyone else's, but your individual loot tables are.

The big difference is that no one takes away "your" loot. If the other hunter wins, there's a chance he gets the polearm - but if you also win there's a chance you get one too. And if only clothies win, none of them take an unusable polearm away from hunters.


Where did you see that? I'm a bit behind in following. I was going off of this from the blog:

Quote:

-> The boss dies.
-> Each player has a chance to win loot, independent of the other players.
-> For each player who wins loot, the game randomly assigns them a spec-appropriate item from that boss's loot table. This subset contains only items that the game (meaning the designers in this case) thinks are appropriate for your class and current spec.
-> Notice that you aren't rolling Need or Greed. You don't have an option to Pass. The game just says "Take this."
-> You can't trade this item, or that would defeat the purpose of removing the social pressure on groups of strangers. If you don't want the item, you are free to vendor, delete, or disenchant it.


The "independent of other players" part is what inferred an individual loot table to me at least. And this examples they used as well:

Quote:
Let's say Naomi is frustrated because Bob and Stan both won loot and because the trinket she wants won't ever drop. So, she decides to use a Charm of Good Fortune. Let's say she gets lucky and the game decides that she won an item instead of gold, flasks, etc. (Thanks, game!) She might get the trinket she wants, or she might get an Agility neckpiece that is also on the Council of Kings loot table. Her winning an item doesn't affect Stan or Jim Bob or anyone else, even if they use their Charms as well.


I dunno, maybe I've simplified things too much, but it sounded pretty straight-forward to me at least.




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#54 Mar 30 2012 at 12:26 PM Rating: Good
There's been blue chatter that they're not certain if it'll finalize as "each person has an X% chance" or "Y people get loot" but that the only reason they'd go away from the former is the chance of everyone or nobody getting loot.
#55 Mar 30 2012 at 3:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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selebrin wrote:
There's been blue chatter that they're not certain if it'll finalize as "each person has an X% chance" or "Y people get loot" but that the only reason they'd go away from the former is the chance of everyone or nobody getting loot.


I don't see how the "all or none" potential is really a bad thing anyway. Seriously, how often do you see stuff drop now that nobody can use? I see it pretty frequently myself. How often do you have a run where everybody gets an upgrade? Ever? Anyone? I don't think I have.

Depending on what percentages they land on for the (invisible) loot rolls, the frequency of their all-or-none scenarios are likely to be pretty uncommon anyway and I'm guessing it would end up adding more "omg we all won!!!!" scenarios than the "QQ no loot!!!!" ones which, if you look at the current rate of upgrade wins now, would probably not change much. Yes, it would suck to have a boss kill with no loot, but realistically now we get a lot of boss kills with loot that just gets sharded or vendored anyway so gear-wise there's no difference.
#56 Mar 30 2012 at 6:23 PM Rating: Good
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I'm thinking that what I would like to see is something similar to the holiday boss goodie bags. That way, no one would see what anyone else got unless they opened it while still in raid. That way, even if they went with the everyone has a set chance of getting something, a kill with no loot going out wouldn't really be as noticeable. It would be cool if the bags always contained a little something tangible (beyond JP or VP) even if it were only a couple of random potions or trade goods.
#57 Mar 30 2012 at 10:05 PM Rating: Decent
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Only problem I see is for example there are 2 mages in the raid. Mage 1 has the best armor in the game and is only raiding for points (or perhaps for fun, rep, it doesn't matter). Mage 2 could use several pieces of loot. Boss goes down and the game awards Mage 1 the loot. Mage 1 has no use for it at all while MAge 2 could have used it. From what I read that is something that can very well happen?
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#58 Mar 30 2012 at 10:36 PM Rating: Good
Yes, that could happen. I think it's stupid that they're doing away with letting people trade boss loot after the fact, because of this very thing. Mage 1 shouldn't feel obligated to trade loot he or she doesn't need, but there should at least be the option. I know I'd want to trade the loot to someone who could use it.
#59 Mar 31 2012 at 8:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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LFR LFD I don't see anyone trading loot anyway, it's if you can click need your clicking need and taking the drop, I lost out on a couple upgrades like a +strength trinket for my paladin to a rogue who clicked need and bailed as soon as the item was looted.
If you form up a guild group and go do a dungeon /raid loot appears to drop as it does normally and your guild can do their usual distribution rules. Including the ability to get off-spec gear just by needing while in your main spec etc.
#60 Mar 31 2012 at 11:02 AM Rating: Good
I'm probably too nice. When I do LFD, I always just Greed on everything. I have trouble enough keeping up with everyone that I don't have time to really evaluate loot. I'm mostly playing for the satchel and the experience (both XP and learning experience), rather than specific loot. Of course that means I usually don't get anything, but I usually still enjoy myself, and I don't really need great loot for soloing, anyway. To be honest, I'd rather err on the side of not getting loot and having a positive run than getting loot and having a bad time. When I get to level cap, I figure my attitude and choices will change, but then I only have to research the dungeons at that level, and I won't have to worry about outleveling them, like I do for the earlier dungeons. It just seems like a lot of unnecessary work, when the real reason I'm doing dungeons is to increase my ability at my class and to just have fun with other people.
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