idiggory wrote:
A. I live in NJ, an hour away from NYC. Most of my town's fire department was at Ground Zero for two+ weeks following the attack, and my mother helped at a soup kitchen there. Some of the people in our town actually commuted to Manhattan for work everyday (though none of them worked in the WTC). Some of the people who died my father knew from childhood. I'm not some foreigner person telling the US to stop whining. I'm an American saying that it doesn't do the memories of the dead justice by giving into the terror the attack was designed to create. The US did exactly what they wanted.
I didn't mean to imply you were not involved. I was replying to other posts by those who weren't from America.
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B. There have been bomb attempts nonstop since before 9/11 too. That's irrelevant information. The attack just made Americans hyper aware of it. The fact is that the number of successful attempts before then was minimal (if not zero). The same after it. Poor airport security for passengers had nothing to do with the 9/11 attack--it was poor security for airport personnel. These security measures have nothing to do with that--the old technologies were frankly just as good. At the very least, any minor increase in safety these scanners provide isn't even remotely worth the complete loss of human rights.
Please give me a list of significant bombing attempts in the United States prior to 9/11. Because beside the occasional local nut job there have been no significant attempts. There was the first WTC bombing, but any other attempts were few and far between. Since 9/11 there have been a whole slew of attempts.
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In order to justify this kind of invasion of privacy, they'd need to be a hell of a lot better than older security methods. And they aren't. You cited the shoe bomber? Useless here. Underwear bomber? He boarded abroad, and the EU has made it pretty clear that they have no intention of using these methods. Furthermore, his "bomb" was in the form of a powder he stitched into his underwear. I seriously doubt a scanner could pick that up.
I don't disagree with you on this. I am not a fan of the methods of the TSA in any way shape or form. All I'm saying is I understand their paranoia. Understanding the reasons for it and agreeing with it are two very different things. I agree they have gone way too far. We should be taking a look at Israel's airport security. Their methods have been successful for a long time and go nowhere near as extreme as ours have.
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C. I didn't say there was nothing to worry about. I said that, realistically, we are no more at risk than any other of the powerful western nations. And that's true. There have been more terrorist attacks in European nations in the past decade than there have been in the US. Furthermore, even if the US is a higher risk target than, say, Britain or France, we are WAY larger. That makes each airport a much lower risk target than single airports in those countries.
That logic doesn't really seem accurate. Just because a single airport is theoretically a lower risk target doesn't mean the overall risk of an attack is lower. We're evaluating threats from a baseline of pre-9/11. The fact of the matter is we are far more at risk of a terrorist attack than two decades ago.
In the end, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree. Both of us are looking at this from different perspectives. I do agree with some of your points. I agree that the TSA has gone way too far, but I also believe that increased security is needed. Just not necessarily in the form it is today.