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In 4.2, T11 will be the new T7Follow

#1 May 24 2011 at 11:33 AM Rating: Good
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http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2580598159?page=1#1
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/2723732#dungeons
Quote:

With the upcoming content patch, 10- and 25-person Normal mode raid encounters will be receiving a comprehensive set of tuning adjustments to decrease their difficulty.

These changes will allow players, groups, and guilds who have yet to experience the content in Blackwing Descent, Bastion of Twilight, and Throne of the the Four Winds an opportunity to do so.

With the addition of a new tier of armor and weapons, we want to make the previous tier more accessible in ways other than just a shift of currency type, so we are making item level 359 gear purchasable for Justice points in the upcoming content patch.

Read the updated patch notes here http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/2723732#dungeons to see the current list of changes. Please note that all adjustments are subject to change based on the current 4.2 testing on the PTR.


Quote:

Dungeons & Raids
Bastion of Twilight
The damage modifier on Normal has been reduced for Arion, Elementium Monstrosity, Feludius, Ignacius, and Terrastra.
Removed one of each type of Bound elemental from the Ascendant Council chamber.
Arion
Chain Lightning damage has been reduced.
Cho’gall
Health, melee damage, Health of Corrupting Adherent, Depravity damage, Corrupting Crash damage, Flaming Destruction damage, and Unleashed Shadows damage has all been reduced by 20%.
Corrupting Crash and Depravity
Halved the amount of Corruption they give to 5 from 10.
Corrupted Bite effect caused by Blood of the Old God reduced.
Damage Taken from Corruption of the Old God per Corrupted Blood has been reduced from 3% per stack to 2% per stack.
Debilitating Beam damage has been reduced by 20% to 6,400.
The duration of Twisted Devotion has been reduced by 25%.
Dragon Siblings
Health, melee damage, Twilight Meteorite damage, Devouring Flames, Blackout damage, Unstable Twilight damage, Twilight Zone damage, Twilight Blast damage, Fabulous Flames damage, has all been reduced by 20%.
Elementium Monstrosity
Electrical Instability damage has been reduced.
Feludius
Damage due to being Frozen while Waterlogged has been reduced.
Halfus
Health, melee damage, Fireball/Fireball Barrage damage, Furious Roar damage, Scorching Breath damage, Shadow Nova damage, has all been reduced by 20%.
Nether Scion, Slate Dragon, Storm Rider, Time Warden, and Orphaned Emerald Whelp health has been reduced by 20%.
Shadow Nova base cast time has been increased.
Ignacious
Rising Flames now increases damage by 3% per stack, down from 5%.
Terrastra
Harden Skin now increases Physical damage dealt by 20% (down from 100%.)

Blackwing Descent
Atramedes
Health, melee damage, modulation damage, Roaring Flame Breath damage, and Searing Flame damage has all been reduced by 20%.
Modulation no longer causes Sound in normal difficulty.
Sound given by Sonar Pulse has been reduced to 3 (from 5.)
Chimaeron
Health reduced by 20% and melee damage reduced by 10%.
Chimaeron will now only cast two caustic slimes per 30 second cycle, at second 17 and second 23.
Drakeadon Mongrel
Time Lapse no longer stuns.
Frost Burn silence is now 3 seconds
Dwarven Kings
Whirlwind no longer drops threat.
Execution sentence now deals damage only.
Shield of Light absorption now reduced.
Magmaw
Damage and hit points reduced by 20%.
Lava Parasites have been diminished
Lava Spew damage, Magma Spit damage, Massive Crash damage, and Infectious Vomit damage have all been been reduced.
Mangled Lifeless no longer instantly kills, and damage has been reduced.
Parasitic Infection has been decreased.
Maloriak
Health, damage, Aberation health/damage, Arcane Storm damage, Prime Subject damage, Flash Freeze/Shatter damage, and Scorching Blast damage has all been decreased by 20%.
Aberration stacking damage buff decreased.
Prime Subjects no longer fixate, and are no longer immune to taunt.
Nefarian
Animated Bone Warriors take 33 seconds to fall over, (down from 50.)
Blast Nova cast time increased.
Chromatic Prototype Health reduced 20%.
Electrocute damage reduced 30%.
Fewer Animated Bone warriors spawn.
Magma Stacking debuff effect reduced 75%.
Nefarian health and melee damage reduced by 20%.
Nefarian's Shadowblaze cast frequency cannot increase beyond 1 per 15 sec.
Onyxia health and melee damage reduced by 20%.
Shadowflame Barrage damage reduced 20%.
Tail Lash damage reduced 50%.
Omnotron Council
Barrier absorb amount increased by 100%.
Increased the cooldown on Power Conversion (Converted Power chance).
Health, Melee damage, Electrical Discharge damage, Lightning Conductor damage, Health of Poison Bomb, Incineration Security Measure damage, Arcane Annihilator damage, has all been reduced by 20%.
Flamethrower damage has been reduced by 40%.
Static Shock caused by Unstable Shield damage and Poison Bomb damage has been decreased by 50%.

Throne of the Four Winds
Al’Akir
Acid Rain now stacks every 20s (up from 15s.)
Electrocute now pulses every 1s (up from 0.5s.)
Feedback duration increased to 30s (from 20s.)
Health, damage, and Wind Burst damage have all been reduced 20%.
Lightning and Lightning Rod recast time has been increased.
Lightning Strike friendly chain damage has been halved.
Will no longer use Static Shock on normal difficulty in phase 1 or phase 2.
Conclave of the Four Winds
Gathering Strength cast time has been increased
Ice Patch slow is now 5% per stack, up to 10 stacks (down from 10% per stack, up to 30 stacks), damage reduced by 20%.
Rohash, Anshal, Nezir melee, Ravenous Creeper health/damage, Ravenous Creeper toxic spores damage, Hurricane damage, Sleet Storm damage , Permafrost damage , Slicing Gale, and Wind Blast damage have all been reduced by 20%.
Wind Chill damage decreased by 20%and now increases damage taken by 5% per stack.


Edit: Damnit, I cant make this post not look a huge wall of text with no meaning.
Meh.

Edited, May 24th 2011 2:38pm by Brisin
#2 May 24 2011 at 11:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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I had a whole screed written out and was about to send it, but then I had me an apostrophe(*).

As far as I've heard, there won't be any new 5-man content. Non-raiders will have the troll dungeons and the new Quel'danas-style quest hub. Well, these changes scale the ilvl-359 raids back to being ilvl-359 heroics, only with 10 people instead of 5. They'll even be puggable up to Atrameides, at least (your server may vary).

It's explicitly a gearing path to the new current raiding content. Ties right in with the Valor->Justice conversion and T11 being available from Justice vendors.

And really - and I say this as someone whose guild is still working on this tier due to attendance issues - at this point, will completing this tier months from now give you any real sense of accomplishment, or will it be closure and an end to frustration? If this gets us into Firelands faster and gets us motivated beyond the heart of our core team, I'm all for it.

(*) "You mean an epiphany." "Yeah, lightning struck me brain."
#3 May 24 2011 at 12:04 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
And really - and I say this as someone whose guild is still working on this tier due to attendance issues - at this point, will completing this tier months from now give you any real sense of accomplishment, or will it be closure and an end to frustration? If this gets us into Firelands faster and gets us motivated beyond the heart of our core team, I'm all for it.


^^
This.

Back when I used to raid, I got tired of praying that people didn't have lag, that people showed up, that people didn't get discouraged every wipe.

I just wanted to log on, get into the raid group, and go kill some *bleeep* and get some kind of tangible reward for my time spent.

I was never one of those people who want to always barely make it by the skin of their teeth, I was never a person who enjoyed the frustration of getting killed repeatedly on a boss, and when a boss finally DID die, it wasn't "YAY, we won!" it was more "Thank GOD that is over with, hope I don't have to do that again".

To me, that's the difference between "casual" and "hardcore" .... casuals just want to have some... uh, casual fun killing crap and getting minor rewards from it. Kinda like doing Normal Dungeons instead of Heroics. Hardcores like to be challenged to the max, only the best shall win, etc.
#4 May 24 2011 at 12:04 PM Rating: Good
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ElMuneco wrote:
I had a whole screed written out and was about to send it, but then I had me an apostrophe(*).

As far as I've heard, there won't be any new 5-man content. Non-raiders will have the troll dungeons and the new Quel'danas-style quest hub. Well, these changes scale the ilvl-359 raids back to being ilvl-359 heroics, only with 10 people instead of 5. They'll even be puggable up to Atrameides, at least (your server may vary).

It's explicitly a gearing path to the new current raiding content. Ties right in with the Valor->Justice conversion and T11 being available from Justice vendors.

And really - and I say this as someone whose guild is still working on this tier due to attendance issues - at this point, will completing this tier months from now give you any real sense of accomplishment, or will it be closure and an end to frustration? If this gets us into Firelands faster and gets us motivated beyond the heart of our core team, I'm all for it.

(*) "You mean an epiphany." "Yeah, lightning struck me brain."

I dont think the problem with your attendance issues will be solved with Firelands. This is why: http://wow.joystiq.com/2011/05/23/officers-quarters-firelands-will-not-save-your-guild/
#5 May 24 2011 at 12:11 PM Rating: Good
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Oh good. Farming alt gear on super easy mode. Ultra tank gears, omw.
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#6 May 24 2011 at 12:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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Brisin wrote:
I dont think the problem with your attendance issues will be solved with Firelands. This is why: http://wow.joystiq.com/2011/05/23/officers-quarters-firelands-will-not-save-your-guild/

I had read that, and in general I agree. Our problem isn't exactly the same - we've got a very small progression group, just about 10 people. And we got hit bad by real life (one just started leveling from 80 five days ago, three more have missed a month, and three others consecutive weeks). The people we use as fillins are nice people, but somewhat, umm, inconsistent performancewise, even by our standards.

So all I hope for is that we get to a point where almost all the core people are there every week, and we stop losing momentum when a raid is called off due to attendance.
#7 May 24 2011 at 12:38 PM Rating: Good
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Return of the LiCh KinG!!!

I know people who will be very upset by this, but I love it. The hardcores get to be the first to have it all and the only in full heroic, and those who don't have the time can get the normal stuff after a few months. Sounds reasonable to me. Some seasons I have time to raid, some I don't. I did not this season :/
#8REDACTED, Posted: May 24 2011 at 1:30 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I think this news totally turned me of. Idiots will get free tier gear and compete for the second raid because the first step is so watered down that even the most challenged keyboard drooler will be able to make it.
#9 May 24 2011 at 1:45 PM Rating: Excellent
And how does this affect you? Again, it doesn't. Plus I really doubt that with these nerfs that *anybody* will be able to down T11. That's like people saying back in Wrath that when ToC came out and they made the changes to badges that *anybody* would be able to go into Ulduar and down all the content. It wasn't true then, it isn't going to be true now. Were idiots able to get farther in Ulduar? Sure. But they still weren't able to down Yogg, even with all four keepers. I know for a fact because my guild at the time was pretty casual, but idiot-less and the farthest in Uld we ended up getting was to the General. Of course we only tried Yogg a few times. I'm sure if we had kept at it we could have gotten him down.
#10REDACTED, Posted: May 24 2011 at 1:59 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) It affects me in the way that this totally destroys any sense of accomplishment. That's the whole point. It used to "mean" something if you had some bosses down. Then if you were lucky you were able to do it whenever the next tier came in, but mostly you could do it after about two tiers or maybe more. If you were lucky. Now you're almost guaranteed to down content only one skip away. That's too crazy for me.
#11 May 24 2011 at 2:10 PM Rating: Decent
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3,157 posts
I'm all for this, now maybe those of us who just LOVE raiding, but also LOVE their family guild, can get in on some pugs.
I do wish that more people pugged out now so I could experience the content in a manner closer to how it was designed, though.

Am I the only one very NOT surprised that certain posters are glad the game is going back to LK easy mode? (Even though it's not, per say).
#12 May 24 2011 at 2:17 PM Rating: Excellent
samperor wrote:
It affects me in the way that this totally destroys any sense of accomplishment. That's the whole point. It used to "mean" something if you had some bosses down. Then if you were lucky you were able to do it whenever the next tier came in, but mostly you could do it after about two tiers or maybe more. If you were lucky. Now you're almost guaranteed to down content only one skip away. That's too crazy for me.

I dunno, the whole paying for the dungeon thing, the nerfing of everything and the kitchen sink is just draining me. I loved this game for 4,5 years or more and now it's done :)


That doesn't diminish your achievement. You still downed the bosses BEFORE the nerf. Provided you earn your Defender title before 4.2 hits, on your achievement it shows the date you earned it. Even if you don't, for each of the raids you defeat all the bosses on, you get the same thing.

Besides, what does it matter if someone accomplishes something after you do, when it's easier? It was still challenging for you.

Does the fact that 10 level 85's can go into ICC and roflstomp heroic LK take away the achievement for those who did it when the content was still current? I don't think so.

No offense meant towards you personally, but it seems to me that the people who care about this are just e-peen measuring and it gets their panties in a wad that someone can do the same thing they did previously, once it's easier. I just don't get it.
#13 May 24 2011 at 2:23 PM Rating: Excellent
samperor wrote:
It affects me in the way that this totally destroys any sense of accomplishment. That's the whole point. It used to "mean" something if you had some bosses down. Then if you were lucky you were able to do it whenever the next tier came in, but mostly you could do it after about two tiers or maybe more. If you were lucky. Now you're almost guaranteed to down content only one skip away. That's too crazy for me.

I dunno, the whole paying for the dungeon thing, the nerfing of everything and the kitchen sink is just draining me. I loved this game for 4,5 years or more and now it's done :)


When was this time when it meant something? In Wrath people only cared about the latest tier even when it came too fast like the Tournament. In TBC they whined when Blizz added "welfare epics" because it meant people could raid current content without finding 25 folks for Gruul, but if someone wasn't already in Sunwell their opinion didn't matter. Vanilla? Vanilla was a clusterfrak.

Why the hell should I care what other people are doing? Is it to judge their worth of opinions? Is a good idea only good when it comes from the mouth of the leet? I've seen fresh 85s with a solid grasp of the class and where it's lacking, and I've seen folks with full heroic clears whose "expert opinion" is "I want more stuff, I'm not #1 in everything yet." Do you run an instance with someone from another guild and go "wow, this guy really knows his stuff, communicates well, is willing to teach others without just hurling insults and has a solid awareness of what everyone else is doing during the fight. I'd respect him if he only had a shinier hat?"
#14 May 24 2011 at 2:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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samperor wrote:
It affects me in the way that this totally destroys any sense of accomplishment. That's the whole point. It used to "mean" something if you had some bosses down. Then if you were lucky you were able to do it whenever the next tier came in, but mostly you could do it after about two tiers or maybe more. If you were lucky. Now you're almost guaranteed to down content only one skip away. That's too crazy for me.

I dunno, the whole paying for the dungeon thing, the nerfing of everything and the kitchen sink is just draining me. I loved this game for 4,5 years or more and now it's done :)







Yeah it does mean something when you have some bosses down... when the content is current. Going into a previous tier and killing stuff doesn't hold the "sense of accomplishment" that you apparently have. That accomplishment comes from completing current tier of raiding. Like I posted in a different tread on the same subject, you're delusional if you think that allowing people who struggle a better chance at seeing old content will affect you.
#15 May 24 2011 at 2:29 PM Rating: Good
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Wonder Gem PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
samperor wrote:
It affects me in the way that this totally destroys any sense of accomplishment. That's the whole point. It used to "mean" something if you had some bosses down. Then if you were lucky you were able to do it whenever the next tier came in, but mostly you could do it after about two tiers or maybe more. If you were lucky. Now you're almost guaranteed to down content only one skip away. That's too crazy for me.

I dunno, the whole paying for the dungeon thing, the nerfing of everything and the kitchen sink is just draining me. I loved this game for 4,5 years or more and now it's done :)


That doesn't diminish your achievement. You still downed the bosses BEFORE the nerf. Provided you earn your Defender title before 4.2 hits, on your achievement it shows the date you earned it. Even if you don't, for each of the raids you defeat all the bosses on, you get the same thing.

Besides, what does it matter if someone accomplishes something after you do, when it's easier? It was still challenging for you.

Does the fact that 10 level 85's can go into ICC and roflstomp heroic LK take away the achievement for those who did it when the content was still current? I don't think so.

No offense meant towards you personally, but it seems to me that the people who care about this are just e-peen measuring and it gets their panties in a wad that someone can do the same thing they did previously, once it's easier. I just don't get it.


Not responding to you, Pigtails, but only using your quote.
Why should matter to anyone if your achivement shows that you got it before or after 4.2?
If it matters to you to get the achievement before the nerf, go there and beat the boss. You will know that you got it before. If it doesn't matter, wait till next patch and it will easier to get things done and you will still get your achievement.
It makes me giggle that it matters to people what the achivement page says regarding when you got the achivement. Do you need to prove to others that you were capable to get it before the nerf? You get the sense of accomplishment only if people care?
I'm all for this change. Doesnt affect me, already downed the bosses and am trying some heroics mode just to keep doing something while Firelands is not here. I dont really care if I dont get the heroic bosses down, though I would like to at least see Sinestra, too bad I think I wont.

I mean, I was away from most ICC content. Was away for almost one year. And late last year I got back to the game and was able to raid ICC and get LK down. Yes, he was utterly nerfed. So what? I still saw the content, I saw what the game was made to show me. Why should I care I only saw it around 2 months before Cataclysm?

Edited, May 24th 2011 5:30pm by Brisin
#16 May 24 2011 at 3:02 PM Rating: Good
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#17 May 24 2011 at 3:08 PM Rating: Good
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I'm satisfied with the changes that Blizzard has announced. I'm satisfied with the way this game has changed since start. Everyone who currently pays a subscription can only say the same thing, or explain the disfunction that causes paying for something they aren't satisfied with.

I don't understand complaining about something that you accept and are satisfied with. The only recourse is to show defiance by no longer supporting a product. So, if you aren't cancelling a subscription over this, then why complain. Blizzard can't please each individual. As a business, they have to please the majority (before arguing this, I say explain current player base as other than satisfied customers.)

Not calling anyone out and no, I don't generally downrate on these boards, but I did rate up:
Quote:
No offense meant towards you personally, but it seems to me that the people who care about this are just e-peen measuring and it gets their panties in a wad that someone can do the same thing they did previously, once it's easier. I just don't get it.
#18 May 24 2011 at 3:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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That was one whiny sage.
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#19 May 24 2011 at 3:23 PM Rating: Good
Remember that one time we downrated a sage with less than 100 posts (or was it a guru?) to scholar for being dumb? That was fun. I'm not suggesting we do that to samperor, it just reminded me of that. =x
#20 May 24 2011 at 3:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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Wonder Gem PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
Remember that one time we downrated a sage with less than 100 posts (or was it a guru?) to scholar for being dumb? That was fun. I'm not suggesting we do that to samperor, it just reminded me of that. =x


I best watch my step then. :*( I have a tendency to say type stupid things. :P
#21 May 24 2011 at 3:56 PM Rating: Good
I'd guess that as long as you have over 250-500 posts you're not likely to lose a karma ranking in one thread lol. And this guy wasn't a known poster over here (I think he was one of the FF MMO boards) so that didn't help his case much either.
#22 May 24 2011 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
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This will be nice. Maybe I can see something else down than just Halfus. My guild is ultra-casual. On good days, we get enough people for a nonhero guild group. Raiding is right out, and with the difficulty of the current raid tier ATM, I'm relucant to try my luck with randumbs.
#23 May 24 2011 at 6:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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samperor wrote:
I think this news totally turned me of. Idiots will get free tier gear and compete for the second raid because the first step is so watered down that even the most challenged keyboard drooler will be able to make it.

I'm a casual raider with 11/12 down atm and i cant motivate myself to play on. Damn it. I guess it's Total war 2 and the playstation again. I hear Mortal Kombat is nice :)


Idiots. People are idiots if they haven't raided the new content in World of Warcraft? I think you should spend your free time away from WoW exploring the meaning of that word. Maybe even take a look in the mirror and see if it fits. Good riddance.
#24 May 24 2011 at 7:34 PM Rating: Decent
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I just love the 'welfare epics' whiners. If you're all so good then get to clearing heroic raids and shut up. I can assure you those 'bads' and 'casuals' won't be clearing out the tier 11 heroic versions until they're decked fully in t12 if not 13. So you still have your (worthless in real life) accomplishment of doing something they can't. Congratulations. Now let them have their shiny, not hideous gear and go raid some firelands heroic.

Honestly, you act like your E-Peen is all that's keeping you alive. Like if it shrinks it will unplug a dam and drown you.
#25 May 24 2011 at 7:48 PM Rating: Good
Sirfailalot wrote:
I just love the 'welfare epics' whiners. If you're all so good then get to clearing heroic raids and shut up. I can assure you those 'bads' and 'casuals' won't be clearing out the tier 11 heroic versions until they're decked fully in t12 if not 13. So you still have your (worthless in real life) accomplishment of doing something they can't. Congratulations. Now let them have their shiny, not hideous gear and go raid some firelands heroic.

Honestly, you act like your E-Peen is all that's keeping you alive. Like if it shrinks it will unplug a dam and drown you.


u mad brah?

Seriously, ragerant is just lulz here.

Edited, May 24th 2011 9:48pm by IDrownFish
#26 May 24 2011 at 7:56 PM Rating: Good
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Mad? Hardly. Amazed at how butthurt these 'hardcore' raiders get when people get purples that aren't them. They act like WoW is a hard mmo. I'll admit it, I'm not exactly 'good'. Do I care? No. I also know there are MMOs out there so hard they'd make them run back to WoW crying for their mommies. I do find it lulzy that these people somehow think that people getting easy access to T11 is somehow diminishing what they've done. *shrugs* The only thing that has me mad is that Blizzard has clearly lost their minds in terms of other changes. This latest Keyring thing for one. But that's another thread and rant altogether.

I don't tend to make jokes like that E-Peen thing when I'm pissed :P You'll know when I am.
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