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Heroics nerfed...lolFollow

#1 Jan 12 2011 at 7:32 AM Rating: Decent
Told you!
  • http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/2145-Patch-4.0.6-Notes-Update-January-11
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    General
    •Guild bank vouchers that players unlock as guild rewards now correctly state that they can only be used by Guild Leaders.
    •Many rare creatures that went into hiding upon Deathwing's emergence into Azeroth have made a return! In addition to finding new homes in a post-Cataclysm world, they drop new, improved loot, provide a healthy experience bonus, and respawn much more quickly when killed. Happy hunting!

    Dungeons & Raids
    •Level 85 players can now choose any normal dungeon via the Dungeon Finder. Choosing Random Dungeon will still not add Blackrock Caverns or Throne of the Tides into the rotation.

    Blackrock Caverns
    •Beauty now spawns with only two pups in Heroic difficulty. Not to worry though, the missing pup has been adopted by a wonderful, if not insane family.

    Grim Batol
    •Faceless Corruptors now move 10% more slowly.
    •Players may still use spell and abilities while afflicted by Forgemaster Throngus's Impaling Slam.
    •Valiona's Devouring Flame damage has been reduced by 20%.

    Halls of Origination
    •The duration of the Flame Wardens' Raging Inferno has been reduced by 80%.
    •Anraphet's Nemesis Strike now does 75% of weapon damage, up from 50%. In addition, the damage-over-time effect applied by this ability does 15,000 damage every 2 seconds, up from 9,000.
    •Earthrager Ptah's Flame Bolt now deals more damage per second on Heroic difficulty.
    •Setesh seeks a portal every 25 seconds, up from 20.

    Lost City of the Tol'vir
    •Lockmaw no longer tolerates fighting in his treasure room.

    Shadowfang Keep
    •Baron Ashbury
    •Sadly, in his hubris he has forgotten how to Mend Rotten Flesh.
    •Lord Walden
    •Conjure Poisonous Mixture now deals more initial damage.
    •Frost Mixture is now area-of-effect damage.
    •Toxic Catalyst now deals less damage over time.

    The Stonecore
    •Stonecore Earthshapers' Dust Storm does slightly less damage.
    •Corborus
    •The warning time for Thrashing Charge has been increased by 1 second. In addition, Thrashing Charge now happens 4 times, down from 5.
    •The visual for Rock Borers spawning during the submersion phase is now different from the Thrashing Charge visual.
    •High Priestess Azil
    •She grew! She's now 175% the size of a human, up from 125%.
    •Gravity Wells should kill Devout Followers more quickly.
    •The cast time of Force Grip is now 1.5 seconds, up from 1.
    •The size of the warning visual for Seismic Shard has been increased to more accurately reflect the area it affects.
    •Slabhide
    •The ground phase lasts longer and has fewer stalactites.
    •Ozruk
    •There is now a precast visual on the ground to make it clear how far away a player must get to be clear of Shatter.
    •The cast time of Shatter has been increased to 3 seconds, up from 2.5.
    •Shatter damage is now reduced by armor, but has been increased by 33.3% (repeating, of course) as a result.
    •Bug Fixes
    •Fixed a bug that made Ozruk's Shatter knockback component 10-yard range while the damage had a 15-yard range. Both are 15 yards now.

    Throne of the Tides
    •The damage done by Lady Naz'jatar's Shock Blast and Naz'jar Tempest Witch Chain Lightning has been reduced.
    •Tainted Sentries Swell damage has been reduced.
    •The damage of Blight of Ozumat has been reduced by 25% per stack.

    The Vortex Pinnacle
    •Creatures
    •Desperate Speed cast by Temple Adepts has had its duration reduced significantly.
    •Altairus
    •The visual effects in this encounter have been adjusted to make the wind direction easier to read.
    •Cyclones now knock players straight up, and players hit by a cyclone cannot be hit again for a few seconds.
    •Asaad
    •Skyfall Stars are now summoned to help him defeat players.
    •Static Cling has had its cast time increased to 1.25 seconds, up from 1.
    •Grand Vizier Ertan
    •His health has been reduced slightly.
    •He now knocks away players standing too close to him when he retracts his Cyclone Shield, which now inflicts Nature damage if it touches players.
    •Bug Fixes
    •Fixed a bug that made Ozruk's Shatter knockback component 10-yard range while the damage had a 15-yard range. Both are 15 yards now.

    #2 Jan 12 2011 at 7:35 AM Rating: Good
    We all knew it was going to come sooner or later, just looks like it came about 5 weeks after launch, which I suppose makes sense in the timing. Most of the players are probably 85 by now (that level just one character at a time) and have done a decent amount of heroics being able to give feedback on what is too hard/too easy/broken in the dungeons. Maybe this will decrease the 45 minute waits for DPS!
    #3REDACTED, Posted: Jan 12 2011 at 7:51 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Players told him to go F@#k himself and whithin hours, GC bend over and took it like a man.
    #4 Jan 12 2011 at 7:59 AM Rating: Good
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    Anobix wrote:
    Most of the players are probably 85 by now (that level just one character at a time) and have done a decent amount of heroics being able to give feedback on what is too hard/too easy/broken in the dungeons.

    That's my initial thought. Not all of these changes were nerfs.

    Quote:
    •Anraphet's Nemesis Strike now does 75% of weapon damage, up from 50%. In addition, the damage-over-time effect applied by this ability does 15,000 damage every 2 seconds, up from 9,000.
    •Earthrager Ptah's Flame Bolt now deals more damage per second on Heroic difficulty.
    For instance.
    #5 Jan 12 2011 at 8:22 AM Rating: Decent
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    There aren't too many heavy nerfs there, and has already been said a few buffs to certain easier bosses. Though something that stands out is baron ashbury losing mend rotten flesh. I thought that fight was perfect, requiring you to catch that cast or risk the shadow debuff stacking to dangerous levels making phase 2 much harder. Without his big heal that fight will be a joke now.
    #6 Jan 12 2011 at 8:28 AM Rating: Good
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    ArtemisEnteri wrote:
    There aren't too many heavy nerfs there, and has already been said a few buffs to certain easier bosses. Though something that stands out is baron ashbury losing mend rotten flesh. I thought that fight was perfect, requiring you to catch that cast or risk the shadow debuff stacking to dangerous levels making phase 2 much harder. Without his big heal that fight will be a joke now.
    It could be a case of group makeup ******** runs(in the vein of "bring the player" and all that)? I'm not 100%, but I know when I did it, I was unable to interrupt both that and the other heal thingy on my own, so if a tank and healer found themselves in a group with no interrupts(beyond the tank), perhaps it could have been a problem for them?
    #7 Jan 12 2011 at 8:47 AM Rating: Excellent
    I'm actually happy to see them tuning it a bit. Some heroic bosses are too easy, and others could use a slight nerf. It is supposed to be a challenge, but also supposed to be attainable and a reasonable way to gear up.

    Quote:
    Shadowfang Keep
    •Baron Ashbury
    •Sadly, in his hubris he has forgotten how to Mend Rotten Flesh.


    I really want to go back now.

    Quote:
    The Vortex Pinnacle
    •Altairus
    •The visual effects in this encounter have been adjusted to make the wind direction easier to read.


    Wow, I wonder what cutting edge technology will be used for this?
    Screenshot





    #8 Jan 12 2011 at 8:51 AM Rating: Decent
    The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
    ArtemisEnteri wrote:
    There aren't too many heavy nerfs there, and has already been said a few buffs to certain easier bosses. Though something that stands out is baron ashbury losing mend rotten flesh. I thought that fight was perfect, requiring you to catch that cast or risk the shadow debuff stacking to dangerous levels making phase 2 much harder. Without his big heal that fight will be a joke now.
    It could be a case of group makeup ******** runs(in the vein of "bring the player" and all that)? I'm not 100%, but I know when I did it, I was unable to interrupt both that and the other heal thingy on my own, so if a tank and healer found themselves in a group with no interrupts(beyond the tank), perhaps it could have been a problem for them?



    I think this is the idea behind it, since the fight became impossible if you didn't have at least two reliable interrupts. As for the rest of the changes, they really are just minor changes, the same people will still be complaining they are too hard.
    #9 Jan 12 2011 at 9:26 AM Rating: Good
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    I liked the state of heroics. They took coordination and a solid party. A heroic boss should be challenging and yes, a few wipes might be needed to get the fight down.

    I'll gladly do with shorter queues and smoother runs, but I was fine with the difficulty before.



    Edited, Jan 12th 2011 10:27am by Pyrenus
    #10 Jan 12 2011 at 10:01 AM Rating: Good
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    Altairus and Corborus changes make me happy. Exactly the kind of frustrating fights I was complaining about and now they're being changed, so my rage on heroics has lessened.

    And it's not like they were really nerfed. Standing on Corborus when he does the dolphin thing will still kill you, and you can't ignore Altairus' mechanic either. It's just easier to adapt to, meaning higher chance of people following the rules and succeeding instead of failing because of latency or buggy animations.

    Also, Beauty spawning with just two adds will hopefully make it easier. I've done that boss once with guildies (<3 Delinja and Aeth) where we effectively CC'd all three mobs for the duration of the fight. However, I've also tried to do it without enough CC to incapacitate more than one pup and it was hell. Tank and healer couldn't handle the incoming damage from two pups and Beauty.

    All in all, I'd say it's a huge improvement.
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    #11 Jan 12 2011 at 11:32 AM Rating: Default
    Mazra wrote:
    All in all, I'd say it's a huge improvement.
    Still have 2hrs of useless pack of trash (not hard but time consuming). I can't log in and expect to do 1 heroic in less than 3 hrs. The hardcore with more time/skills have already started raiding, so I would love from Blizz to cut down the time (not difficulty) of heroics or give me a dozen of regular dungeons.
    #12 Jan 12 2011 at 11:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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    I did Throne of the Tides Heroic last night an hour before server shutdown. We finished with enough time to spare for me to go do some quests in Uldum.

    Commander Schnottz yells: You only brought me eight idols!
    Commander Schnottz yells: Zhe ritual specifically calls for NINE!!
    Commander Schnottz yells: NINE! NINE! NINE! NINE! NINE!!!

    Best movie reference ever.
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    #13 Jan 12 2011 at 11:56 AM Rating: Default
    RAWDEAL wrote:
    Mazra wrote:
    All in all, I'd say it's a huge improvement.
    Still have 2hrs of useless pack of trash (not hard but time consuming). I can't log in and expect to do 1 heroic in less than 3 hrs. The hardcore with more time/skills have already started raiding, so I would love from Blizz to cut down the time (not difficulty) of heroics or give me a dozen of regular dungeons.



    Sorry, but if you are spending three hours in a heroic, you are doing something wrong. Even with wipes, I rarely have a heroic take longer then one and a half, two hours at most.
    #14 Jan 12 2011 at 12:19 PM Rating: Decent
    ukikithemonkey wrote:
    RAWDEAL wrote:
    Mazra wrote:
    All in all, I'd say it's a huge improvement.
    Still have 2hrs of useless pack of trash (not hard but time consuming). I can't log in and expect to do 1 heroic in less than 3 hrs. The hardcore with more time/skills have already started raiding, so I would love from Blizz to cut down the time (not difficulty) of heroics or give me a dozen of regular dungeons.



    Sorry, but if you are spending three hours in a heroic, you are doing something wrong. Even with wipes, I rarely have a heroic take longer then one and a half, two hours at most.
    45 mins queue to be add.
    #15 Jan 12 2011 at 12:50 PM Rating: Decent
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    It depends. Especially when your DPS are lowly geared, some heroics do actually take three hours *cough* Grim Batol *cough*. As it is now it's kind of based on luck - with a decent group I can clear Tol'Vir City in 45 mins to an hour, while a similar group takes at least two hours to get through Deadmines or Grim Batol.

    Also, QQ more, there's a bunch of buffs in there too. It's more tuning if everything else. The nerfs that are there are really only things like removing Ashbury's heal, which just means that groups with only one reliable interrupter are no longer ****** on him.
    #16REDACTED, Posted: Jan 12 2011 at 2:34 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Rawdeal: "Heroics are too hard for me, I suck and can't play the game as it is now, so heroics are just too hard overall."
    #17 Jan 12 2011 at 2:38 PM Rating: Good
    I have to admit that Corboros nailed me a couple times when I was not in the dust. I play with about 200-300ms latency though thanks to transversing the entire country to my server which was "recommended" when I was a noob and thought "I will just play WoW as a break from FFXI once in a while." Smiley: rolleyes

    I rerolled a couple toons on west coast data center servers but all my freinds are back on my original server and we have too much fun together. Most of those lucky bastiches get 20-30ms. :(

    So yeah getting lag humped by Corbo can be pretty frustrating. I run much farther away now just to try and be sure the server has caught up with my real position.
    #18 Jan 12 2011 at 4:24 PM Rating: Good
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    Getting nailed by latency is also present on the boss in Grim Batol who spawns those elementals that go boom if they reach their leashed target.

    Was well out of melee range when one decided to go boom. I was 20 yards to the right of the tank, elemental was on top of the tank and healer. Boom. Wipe. Tank bails, group falls apart and I'm back in the 30-minute queue.

    Smiley: thumbsup
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    #19REDACTED, Posted: Jan 12 2011 at 5:54 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Go **** yourself troll, tell me you are raiding and life is good! But you don't, you are one of those posers who makes believe your it...get a life!
    #20REDACTED, Posted: Jan 12 2011 at 8:28 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Sacre bleu! Such anger out of one so meager.
    #21 Jan 13 2011 at 1:42 AM Rating: Excellent
    If you kids don't stop this fighting, I will turn this forum around and no McDonalds for you both!


    Yep while a guild that can build a group with proper CC has no problems with Ashby and Beauty, PuG's that get set up without suffered. Out of all boss encounters those would have been the two to change because of a lack of CC and/or inturrupt issue. Nothing really major nerfwise, and some buffs to bosses too.

    Guild is still trying to down Al'akir in TotFW. First phase is gravy, but we are lacking the timing on thunderling killing to properly stack the debuff and maintain it for the 2nd phase. Otherwise we can't get him below 30% because of acid rain stacks. Loving the whole Heroic and Raid scene so far in Cata.
    #22 Jan 13 2011 at 2:11 AM Rating: Excellent
    31 posts
    You know, when I read about the upcoming nerfs to many of the heroic dungeons, I was rather disappointed, as I enjoyed the moderate challenge they posed as a fresh 85.

    That is, until I did my PUG heroic of the day.

    The group consisted of a shadow priest as the only non-PUG, a prot pally tank, kitty druid and mage. The instance was SFK. No problem, I thought, since interrupts should have been plentiful and if people were new to the place, well, it's not like I've not explained these before. We got to Baron Ashbury, and I did my quick spiel asking the tank to please interrupt the Stay of Execution and the kitty druid to please interrupt the Mend Rotten Flesh cast. Both agreed in party chat, and we were off. Fight starts, we get the first asphyxiate, and no one interrupts the Stay of Execution cast. Okay, people miss a cast now and then, no big deal. I ask again in party chat that the tank please interrupt the cast. Mend Rotten Flesh comes up, and goes merrily on its way with no interruption. I'm starting to lose a little patience, and request once more that the feral druid please interrupt that. Second casts of each heal run to their completion, and about this time, the kitty druid finally says 'how do we win?' I must admit that I did sigh here, but I reminded the group that the interrupts were key to actually proceeding through the encounter. Pally tank then asks how to interrupt at about the same time the druid says he doesn't have an interrupt. I inform the tank that he can use avenger's shield to interrupt and the cat can use skull bash. I wasn't exactly having mana problems, as I'm rather beyond needing heroics gear at this point, but having the boss at a consistent 90% health was really getting old, and finally my guildie and I dropped group. I ported out to Stormwind and was informed by DBM that combat against Baron Ashbury ended after 14 minutes and 44 seconds.

    Yeah...maybe Ashbury losing that Mend Rotten Flesh cast isn't all bad. :P

    In all seriousness though, it is too bad that the content needs to be watered down so much, but at the same time, stalemate situations like that one aren't precisely fun. Ah well. At least heals queues don't take tooo long.
    #23 Jan 13 2011 at 3:18 AM Rating: Decent
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    Mazra wrote:
    I did Throne of the Tides Heroic last night an hour before server shutdown. We finished with enough time to spare for me to go do some quests in Uldum.

    Commander Schnottz yells: You only brought me eight idols!
    Commander Schnottz yells: Zhe ritual specifically calls for NINE!!
    Commander Schnottz yells: NINE! NINE! NINE! NINE! NINE!!!

    Best movie reference ever.

    The whole zone of Uldum is just awesome with all the movie references.

    Well, the Harrison Jones quest chain, at least.

    On the subject of heroics, I'm happy they're at least tuning them. Not that I would find the mechanics hard, but anything to make it easier on my other group members so my brain doesn't explode is welcome in my book.
    #24 Jan 13 2011 at 4:05 AM Rating: Decent
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    i dont see any "nerfed to wotlk level or nerfed to easy mode" going on here or listening to QQ-ers about difficulty. I certainly dont see it watered down. Sprinkled maybe.

    If anything, all iam seeing is them loosening up the corset so groups dont get utterly screwed if they don't manage to get the right make up [either through invite of available friends/guildies or random lfg] for CC, interrupts or lack of a particular factor present in certain classes [like getting full melee or full ranged which can make some encounters impossible]

    What nerfs there are, are light. And the rest is just balancing for more variety of group makeup. Some aspects have been buffed and some reduced.

    Edited, Jan 13th 2011 10:10am by Tenjen
    #25 Jan 13 2011 at 5:27 AM Rating: Good
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    Not too surprised by changes, but far from happy since at the moment I'm stuck raid-less and having HCs be a wee more challenging has been fun. I haven't failed to finish an instance more than twice since I started doing HCs (that's two times more than in the entire Wotlk though) so I might be a notch luckier than many of you with the LFG tool I guess.
    #26 Jan 13 2011 at 6:55 AM Rating: Good
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    I guess some people will complain about anything. A damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. Yes, some of the changes are going to make encounters easier. But they are far from a "lol nerf". The changes I saw are more of a balancing issue. Guild groups should not have the trouble that PuGs have in heroics. These changes are to help those of us that PuG our heroics. After this patch is out you are not going to go into Stonecore and blow through the bosses, ignoring the mechanics, in record time. The same mechanics will still be there and the same mechanics will still rip your face off if you fail to avoid them.
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