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Princess DVEight wrote:
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Nope, now it is though
42 posts
Can blizzard do anything about IGE? Sure them? Shut 'em down? They have a bunch of information about them. I don't see what's stopping them.
What can you legaly do to a company that's based out of Hong Kong? I doubt enforcing a MMORPG EULA is very high on interpol's list of things to do. Besides China's cheap labor, I'm sure it offers them excellent legal advantages as well.
Even if they did manage to do something, do you think it would be worth it to them in legal expenses? Blizzard doesn't stand to gain much monetarily by prosecuting and IGE stands to lose everything by not defending. Not a good mixture for a law suit.
Edited, Wed Feb 16 12:57:05 2005 by HalfEmpty
Even if they did manage to do something, do you think it would be worth it to them in legal expenses? Blizzard doesn't stand to gain much monetarily by prosecuting and IGE stands to lose everything by not defending. Not a good mixture for a law suit.
Edited, Wed Feb 16 12:57:05 2005 by HalfEmpty
42 posts
ok, after reading that last post, this all seems very stupid. We can't do anything about it.
Well, I use both Alla and Thottbot but I do feel more comfortable with Thottbot. Fact is, I get my answers much faster and more detail from Thottbot than Alla. One of the thing that pisses me off with Alla is that frigign "Search function has been disable at this time due to high volume.....blah blah blah" that ********* Come on, I paid and I'm a premium user on this site.. you telling me I can't search? This site is gonna die if ***** continue like this.
Stop blaming on other sites, improve your own site first!
Stop blaming on other sites, improve your own site first!
HalfEmpty wrote:
What can you legaly do to a company that's based out of Hong Kong? I doubt enforcing a MMORPG EULA is very high on interpol's list of things to do. Besides China's cheap labor, I'm sure it offers them excellent legal advantages as well.
Even if they did manage to do something, do you think it would be worth it to them in legal expenses? Blizzard doesn't stand to gain much monetarily by prosecuting and IGE stands to lose everything by not defending. Not a good mixture for a law suit.
Edited, Wed Feb 16 12:57:05 2005 by HalfEmpty
Even if they did manage to do something, do you think it would be worth it to them in legal expenses? Blizzard doesn't stand to gain much monetarily by prosecuting and IGE stands to lose everything by not defending. Not a good mixture for a law suit.
Edited, Wed Feb 16 12:57:05 2005 by HalfEmpty
You know, because Interpol is in charge of civil matters and all.
Extabyte wrote:
ok, after reading that last post, this all seems very stupid. We can't do anything about it.
Sure you can. If it matters to you, stop supporting them by using thottbot to update their database. Of course, it's not going to stop them but at least you can know that you're not knowingly contributing to them.
Quote:
You know, because Interpol is in charge of civil matters and all.
Interpol is charged with enforcing international intellectual property crimes. From violating the license agreement (might be a civil only matter, I don't know. I'm not a lawyer), to using blizzard's copyrighted and trademarked materials to make their money, I'd believe that IGE is breaking some sort of law that Interpol is capable of enforcing. The point was that this would probably be pretty low on their list of things to enforce.
Besides that, let's say that blizzard won a civil suit against them but they refused to stop or pay up. Who do you think would enforce such matters?
Edited, Wed Feb 16 15:38:53 2005 by HalfEmpty
Thank you for the informative first post.
I know that there are a few people who say that IGE does not matter in the scheme of things - that thotbott is useful and basically ... so what ?
I'm not one of them.
There are two sides to the IGE mechanism that have make me mad.
1) They sell in game artifacts & currency. As IGE hoards these resources rather than spend it - they end up giving chunks of resources to people who, no matter how much they think they know, have little repect for how a normal gamer values that item. They squander it - they inflate prices - they devalue the work I and many, many other players put into feeling good about their gameplay.
2) They encourage people to strip mine game resources - the best way to earn money by selling resources is as much as possible, as fast as possible, yes ? Whether it be by fishing-bots, gangs of gold miners or whatever. Whether these guys are direct employed or not - they would not do this if if IGE was not paying them. The tales of the antics some of these groups get up to are infamous throughout MMORPGs all over the 'net. And I use strip mining because their methods are as damaging to the in game environment as strip mining is in the real world.
So .. is it significant that a company that makes money by taking enjoyment away from normal gamers WHO ARE PAYING GOOD MONEY TO ENJOY THEMSELVES IN A GAME ENVIRONMENT has acquired a lot of information about where all the good stuff is in WOW by issuing thotbott under a false flag ? Damn right it is.
IGE are making money by ruining MMORPGs. Complacency to that helps them destroy this hobby we invest a chunk of our time, money and identity in. The devil does not buy your soul all at once - he buys it a sliver at a time with a little bit of honey.
I wouldn't p*ss on IGE if they were on fire. And supporting anything they run under a false flag is a lot nicer than p*ssing on them.
I know that there are a few people who say that IGE does not matter in the scheme of things - that thotbott is useful and basically ... so what ?
I'm not one of them.
There are two sides to the IGE mechanism that have make me mad.
1) They sell in game artifacts & currency. As IGE hoards these resources rather than spend it - they end up giving chunks of resources to people who, no matter how much they think they know, have little repect for how a normal gamer values that item. They squander it - they inflate prices - they devalue the work I and many, many other players put into feeling good about their gameplay.
2) They encourage people to strip mine game resources - the best way to earn money by selling resources is as much as possible, as fast as possible, yes ? Whether it be by fishing-bots, gangs of gold miners or whatever. Whether these guys are direct employed or not - they would not do this if if IGE was not paying them. The tales of the antics some of these groups get up to are infamous throughout MMORPGs all over the 'net. And I use strip mining because their methods are as damaging to the in game environment as strip mining is in the real world.
So .. is it significant that a company that makes money by taking enjoyment away from normal gamers WHO ARE PAYING GOOD MONEY TO ENJOY THEMSELVES IN A GAME ENVIRONMENT has acquired a lot of information about where all the good stuff is in WOW by issuing thotbott under a false flag ? Damn right it is.
IGE are making money by ruining MMORPGs. Complacency to that helps them destroy this hobby we invest a chunk of our time, money and identity in. The devil does not buy your soul all at once - he buys it a sliver at a time with a little bit of honey.
I wouldn't p*ss on IGE if they were on fire. And supporting anything they run under a false flag is a lot nicer than p*ssing on them.
Congratulations to the original poster for some good detective work. Ogaming just posted a press release stating that yes indeed they are owned by IGE. It doesn't mention Thottbott, but the only way they have the number of page views they are claiming is if the are including Thott.
[wowsig]1855[/wowsig]
2 posts
I really HATE stuff like IGE.
A very good post. linked to it on the forums on(swedish sites) warcraft.nu and worldofwar.se
A very good post. linked to it on the forums on(swedish sites) warcraft.nu and worldofwar.se
Ah that's disappointing to hear about thott. Maybe Cosmos has been corrupted as well? If so, it might be time for me to work on my own UI.
5 posts
Hmmm.... all very interesting!
I started WoW in phase 1 beta. From the beginning. Almost as soon as I got a client installed, I found out about Cosmos. Not too long afterwards I was using it.
Today, I wouldn't be happy playing WoW with the default UI. Not even close.
And I like the integrated data collection when you turn Thottbot collection on. You don't have to, of course.
As far as who to search with, I search whoever has the best information about what I need to know about.
For almost 8 years I've searched Alla for quest information and some zone information and lots of item information for Everquest. Because it was the best source.
Now days, I tend to search Thottbot first and if they provide me with dubious information (like telling me a static quest npc that I KNOW is in a town - just not where - is in an *instance* /snicker) then I go to Alla.
If some point Alla gets as much relevant content for WoW as they have to EQ regarding quests and items, then I'll prolly just forget who Thottbot is.
But lets be honest, WoW isn't that important to the MMOG world. Thing about it. Its way too easy to play, you can be level 60 in one month easy if you simply have enough hours in the day to play, and you don't hardly need gold for anything except a mount. By the time you can buy a good mount IGE will be selling the gold needed for like $25 because the demand in WoW is exactly that low.
What I'm interested in is what happens with Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. WoW is just a distraction until Saga comes out.
YMMV, this is only my 2 coppers.
I started WoW in phase 1 beta. From the beginning. Almost as soon as I got a client installed, I found out about Cosmos. Not too long afterwards I was using it.
Today, I wouldn't be happy playing WoW with the default UI. Not even close.
And I like the integrated data collection when you turn Thottbot collection on. You don't have to, of course.
As far as who to search with, I search whoever has the best information about what I need to know about.
For almost 8 years I've searched Alla for quest information and some zone information and lots of item information for Everquest. Because it was the best source.
Now days, I tend to search Thottbot first and if they provide me with dubious information (like telling me a static quest npc that I KNOW is in a town - just not where - is in an *instance* /snicker) then I go to Alla.
If some point Alla gets as much relevant content for WoW as they have to EQ regarding quests and items, then I'll prolly just forget who Thottbot is.
But lets be honest, WoW isn't that important to the MMOG world. Thing about it. Its way too easy to play, you can be level 60 in one month easy if you simply have enough hours in the day to play, and you don't hardly need gold for anything except a mount. By the time you can buy a good mount IGE will be selling the gold needed for like $25 because the demand in WoW is exactly that low.
What I'm interested in is what happens with Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. WoW is just a distraction until Saga comes out.
YMMV, this is only my 2 coppers.
Quote:
But lets be honest, WoW isn't that important to the MMOG world. Thing about it. Its way too easy to play, you can be level 60 in one month easy if you simply have enough hours in the day to play, and you don't hardly need gold for anything except a mount. By the time you can buy a good mount IGE will be selling the gold needed for like $25 because the demand in WoW is exactly that low.
cough cough more people play WoW than any other MMORPG.
except L,L2 but no one counts them
Scholar
27 posts
Definitely an interesting detective story! Thanks for informing all of us.
WoW isn't important to the MMORPG world as far as gil-selling is concerned, because most things are relatively easy to achieve. Reaching max level in Final Fantasy XI took literally thousands of hours, so theres a market for lv 75 characters.
(And at the rate the economy is inflating, the gil is pretty valuable too)
As far as Blizzard tackling IGE, I wrote a pretty lengthy email to them on the topic. I got next to no information about it...here was the response:
Hi (me),
I'm unsure about the specifics regarding IGE, but from what i understand it takes a little more time and resources in order to prevent companies like IGE from selling gold or items compared to smaller auctions found on EBay. These actions are in violation of our TOS and EULA, and steps are taken to prevent this from affecting our user base.
Regards,
Stanley F.
Online Support
Blizzard Entertainment
http://www.blizzard.com/support
I assume that means they are too lazy to go after a large company and would rather slam the ebayers.
(And at the rate the economy is inflating, the gil is pretty valuable too)
As far as Blizzard tackling IGE, I wrote a pretty lengthy email to them on the topic. I got next to no information about it...here was the response:
Hi (me),
I'm unsure about the specifics regarding IGE, but from what i understand it takes a little more time and resources in order to prevent companies like IGE from selling gold or items compared to smaller auctions found on EBay. These actions are in violation of our TOS and EULA, and steps are taken to prevent this from affecting our user base.
Regards,
Stanley F.
Online Support
Blizzard Entertainment
http://www.blizzard.com/support
I assume that means they are too lazy to go after a large company and would rather slam the ebayers.
Quote:
except L,L2 but no one counts them
I do! I do!
But half of them are farmers anyways :P
Chtulhu the Quick wrote:
1) Create another link to the search area by the other database searchs. Possibly even make the search appear on the sidebar for even more ease of use.
Mukiryoku wrote:
Ah that's disappointing to hear about thott. Maybe Cosmos has been corrupted as well? If so, it might be time for me to work on my own UI.
You know, I always kept hoping that eventually someone would join KT that would be able to create a guild UI. Though i'm greatful enough that you are putting that website together.
Now we just need proof that EA owns IGE, then we can organize the villagers and slay the beast that is Electronic Arts!
MaztaCazta what's with the random capitalization? Strange!
this is a very old thread. i wonder at the reasoning behind creating an account specifically to dredge it up again, morgaine.
Sorry about the (semi) necro posting here, but with the recent news now I think this thread needs to be back up on the forums.
Alla is a part of that now?
Why!
Why!
19 posts
Allakhazam wrote:
Interesting. I've know IGE owned Thottbot for quite a while now, but didn't want to post about it. I knew they were advertising on ogaming at one point, but didn't realize they had bought them outright. IGE tried to buy us a while ago and when we refused to have anything to do with them vowed to create a network to rival ours. Looks like they are on their way to doing so. I suggest you spread the word so others know about this too. I know people playing EQ2 would be interested in this info too.
indeed. spread the word about this, because it's horrible news, isn't it? how could they do that? bastards.
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