Regarding Notorious Monsters

From PlayOnline.com:

The past two weeks have seen considerable feedback from players regarding the amount of time required to combat the Pandemonium Warden, a recently implemented Notorious Monster (NM). Discussion has spread significantly throughout forums, and it has become apparent that this is indeed an issue of major unrest in the community.

We would like to assure players that the development and management teams place a high value on their feedback, and the issue has since been taken under serious consideration. Together with Absolute Virtue, it has been deemed that the combative techniques for weakening these NMs are too difficult. As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times. It is by no means the desire of the development team to see players involved in encounters that require an excessive amount of time and effort to complete. It was for this reason that previous measures were put into practice which prohibited NMs from being held in battle for prolonged periods. In response to these events, we have determined that further alterations are required to prevent such battles from exceeding a certain predetermined length of time.

Included in the version update scheduled for early September will be modifications to the degree of difficulty of Pandemonium Warden (and associated pets), Absolute Virtue (and associated pets), and Jailer of Love. The aim of these changes is to create battles where a decisive outcome may be reached within a shorter period of time.

The development and management teams would like to take this opportunity to express their commitment to a healthy and wholesome game environment for players everywhere to enjoy, and to thank them for the continued feedback.

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idiots
# Aug 24 2008 at 12:38 PM Rating: Good
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you are all stupid, there has to be some way to kill it faster its just nobody's found it yet... all they are gunna do is add a rage mode to it after a few hours and then what? you are all gunna ***** because it killed you then, its the linkshell own fault that they got sick if they dont have the common sense to stop after a while then they are dumbasses

Edited, Aug 24th 2008 4:36pm by yamahmoto
Way to go!
# Aug 23 2008 at 7:32 PM Rating: Decent
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Wow. Nice one guys.

SE puts in some time to make 3 monsters out of thousands difficult and what do we do? ***** because a linkshell that didn't plan properly made themselves play for 18 hours straight because they were repeating themselves rather than trying different strategies...

SE said in their latest update: "it has been deemed that the combative techniques for weakening these NMs are too difficult. As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times." Which means they tested it, it was fine, but the players were doinitrong...

That's my 2 cents.

G'night.

Edit: What's the top tier for an Average player? HNM's? AV, PW and possibly JoL we're put in place to test the Elite's which the LS in question obviously weren't...

Edited, Aug 24th 2008 2:48am by Miyozaki
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# Aug 24 2008 at 11:03 AM Rating: Default
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Miyozaki wrote:
Wow. Nice one guys.

SE puts in some time to make 3 monsters out of thousands difficult and what do we do? ***** because a linkshell that didn't plan properly made themselves play for 18 hours straight because they were repeating themselves rather than trying different strategies...

SE said in their latest update: "it has been deemed that the combative techniques for weakening these NMs are too difficult. As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times." Which means they tested it, it was fine, but the players were doinitrong...

That's my 2 cents.

G'night.

Edit: What's the top tier for an Average player? HNM's? AV, PW and possibly JoL we're put in place to test the Elite's which the LS in question obviously weren't...

Edited, Aug 24th 2008 2:48am by Miyozaki


You're an idiot. Go read what the fight was about, what caused it to took too long, before you look even more moronic than you already did.

Being a mindless fanboi and defending a sadistic development team gets you nowhere but a bus to "Stupid Town".

"LS in question." Ell. Ohh. Ell. Each of those players are better than you could ever dream of being, kiddo. Don't try to fool yourself.

This is nothing more than a blanket statement to cover their asses. Square-Enix did indeed fully intend those fights to take forever, and to suggest otherwise is foolish. They only make this statement to cover their asses in the media's eyes.

Stated that fighting an encounter straight up isn't "anticipated" is bullsh*t. It's a bullsh*t card, and a bullsh*t statement, and if you don't understand why it was "anticipated" that linkshells would attempt to fight it *NORMALLY* then you're clearly a Darwin Award winner.

Edited, Aug 24th 2008 3:03pm by StrijderVechter

Edited, Aug 24th 2008 3:03pm by StrijderVechter
Way to go!
# Aug 25 2008 at 7:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Nice rant. Now, while I don't particularly agree with either of you, and definitely don't condone the hostility and accusations, you both have valid points. What SE meant, and I do believe them, is that it was unanticipated that a LS would be able to ever beat these mobs in any way other than the way they had designed. They had intended for people to go through a lot of difficult and separate steps that had never been discovered to make it a much easier fight, and thus take much less time. Instead, however, clever and skillful players managed to devise a strategy to beat these mobs without going through SEs intended method. The only problem is that it makes the fight take an eternity. Personally, I see no problem with this. I think it's great that people are resourceful enough to find a way around a problem. However, other people that are unwilling to fight the mobs in this manner will constantly search for a new way to do it. In this pursuit they would have undoubtedly eventually uncovered SEs intended method. That's what keeps the game interesting for people with 10+ 75s. Of course it's frustrating...but that's what makes it so much more satisfying when you solve the problem. Unless, of course, you're the kind of person that buys the strategy guide with a brand new game. Personally, I always like to play it through once on my own before I look up all the hidden secrets.
decisive in what way?
# Aug 23 2008 at 9:20 AM Rating: Decent
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of course, desicive could just mean that after X amount of time, it just does ultra-killga spam that takes down reraise of everyone in the zone. >.> <.<

ok, I am just tired and need some sleep.
been up for, >.> <.< 17 hours.

*dontkillme*
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# Aug 22 2008 at 8:27 PM Rating: Good
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I completly agree if there was a different method to defeating the nms they wouldnt be puting some work into them. They realize they finaly over steped thier bounds and the FF community has spoke its mind. So if they wish to continue on having costumers and stop supporting full time players and stick with alot of thier casual players they need to fix the nms. I mean look at it this way that is why thier changing the price of dynamis and limbus to make it more accessible and make it more appealing to new players. I for one hope they make it to where even common players with the more recent strategys can defeat these mobs with alot more relative ease. im not saying make the mobs completly easy but make them take at least something like 3 to 4 hrs kinda like dynamis. if anything.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 4:43 PM Rating: Default
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Why does JOL need to be nerfed? You can kill it in 30-40 minutes with a RNG burn.
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
Decisive Outcome?
# Aug 22 2008 at 4:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Why is everyone assuming "nerf"?

Quote:
As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times


The player base wasn't using the gimmicks SE had in place for winning these fights.

Quote:
The aim of these changes is to create battles where a decisive outcome may be reached within a shorter period of time.


Since the player base was trying to use normal fighting strategies that resulted in things taking too long, I interpret this to mean that there will be some sort of timer which will make the mobs go into rage mode or whatever it's called, so the players HAVE to use the gimmick to win rather than engaging in marathon sessions using normal means. Note they say "decisive outcome " - they don't say who the outcome is going to favour.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 2:06 PM Rating: Decent
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Lecan wrote:
Quote:
Instead of making the mobs easier, why don't they just be less cryptic in their 'explanations' of how to weaken PW and AV? Better yet, make it something that players can figure out in game from the minute the NM is patched in. Clearly, their methods of disseminating information on AV (and everything in game, really) are flawed.


As long as they don't make it so you need some bizarre combo like 10 BRDs merited out the wazoo + 5 similarly-merited DRG's doing Agnon, I agree, the weakening tactics should be easier to figure out.... with out resorting to things that SE later bans... ahem AV.

Edit:
Just because SE didn't fully test every possible scenario & we figure new ones out that they didn't imagine...doesn't mean we should be punished because we, as a player-base entity, don't think like SE, we're not Dev's & we're not the story author's, so maybe we shouldn't, but ... ; it doesn't mean we should be punished with arcane ways to weaken/pop (/em glares at Salvage/Einherjar) an HNM or NM like AV or PW... etc. /em points a history and has a good laugh.

But, in any case, read my sig before deciding to say I'm a flaming idiot.
I'd usually agree.


Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 6:09pm by Crouchingllama
Get a clue, SE
# Aug 22 2008 at 1:10 PM Rating: Decent
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Oh, so it took media coverage for SE to get a clue? Oh well, whatever works.

Now if only they'd look at other MMO sites and notice how they show you everything available and what it does, maybe they'd clue in that keeping everything secret just annoys the crap out of their playerbase.

Then again, it IS SE we're talking about here. -_-;

The idea that somehow we're supposed to draw out a detailed strategy when we run across a mob for the first time, as opposed to fighting it straight up is one of the stupider things they've ever said, I've got to admit. I'm glad they apparently got some flak over this stuff.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 1:08 PM Rating: Decent
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SE wrote:
The aim of these changes is to create battles where a decisive outcome may be reached within a shorter period of time.

Note that it does not say that the players will win in a shorter amount of time. Something to look out for might be mobs that have reduced HP and/or defense ratings, but that hit significantly harder as well.

So when you jump in on those fights, don't think quite yet that it's going to be any easier. Remain prepared for anything!
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I dunno....
# Aug 22 2008 at 12:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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I've gotten pretty good at reading between SE's lines now... to me that actually sounded like they are going to add rage timers XD

SE wrote:
The aim of these changes is to create battles where a decisive outcome may be reached within a shorter period of time.


A rage timer on either mob would make for a decisive end all right.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 12:09 PM Rating: Good
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(double post but this needs to be said)Ah. I do believe AV should be modified to an extent. People have lives and for those who don't, SE should delete and their char with a message saying "go get laid" or "get a life" something along those lines. Not to bring this up(because I hate the game) WoW is popular is it relative ease for casual players to get things. SE claims they don't want people to spend too much time on game but w/o doing so, you get nothing
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4ys for this crap
# Aug 22 2008 at 11:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Yay, nerfed mobs, so people like me(the casual player) can get something

Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 4:03pm by Sicdemocia
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well
# Aug 22 2008 at 11:19 AM Rating: Decent
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hard is good challange but yes noone will spend 24h+ to kill stupid monster, make JoL easy, i thought it was easy with magic burn setup, Av okej could be easy if it hadent unlimited 2h and PW owell only people with no life and no future would spend 24h+ to kill it..
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good intention, wrong method
# Aug 22 2008 at 10:57 AM Rating: Good
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Instead of making the mobs easier, why don't they just be less cryptic in their 'explanations' of how to weaken PW and AV? Better yet, make it something that players can figure out in game from the minute the NM is patched in. Clearly, their methods of disseminating information on AV (and everything in game, really) are flawed.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 4:48 PM Rating: Default
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Lecan wrote:
Instead of making the mobs easier, why don't they just be less cryptic in their 'explanations' of how to weaken PW and AV?




Because they're full of sh*t and AV can't be beaten without haxxor developer characters.

If all we needed to do was "figure it out" then a nerf would not be needed. All they would have to do is tell us. But they're not, they're just making it easier. Therefor SE was full of crap all along and AV was not beatable by player characters.

Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 8:47pm by Lobivopis
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
Poor Word Choices
# Aug 22 2008 at 10:38 AM Rating: Good
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Sqeeunix wrote:
Included in the version update scheduled for early September will be modifications to the degree of difficulty of Pandemonium Warden (and associated pets), Absolute Virtue (and associated pets), and Jailer of Love. The aim of these changes is to create battles where a decisive outcome may be reached within a shorter period of time.


They are making JoL easier? pffft

Also, I'm fairly sure that Absolute Virtue battles reach a decisive outcome in a short period of time already.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 10:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Quote:
As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times.


Fighting a mob straight up is now an unanticipated method?


well what they meant by that is Zombie Zerging. They did not want people to kill themselves constantly like a certain LS (totally not starting another discussion about this ><) did to take it down as much as they did. Measures like that and lets not forget the wall trick (Don't rate me down because I'm not taking sides on this!!!!) thats what they meant by that
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# Aug 22 2008 at 9:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
As a result, some players have engaged these enemies using unanticipated methods which led to extended battle times.


Fighting a mob straight up is now an unanticipated method?
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wtf?
# Aug 23 2008 at 5:52 PM Rating: Default
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I'm pretty sure there talking about groups fighting AV with 60 people so they can use 2hrs over and over again.
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# Aug 22 2008 at 9:29 AM Rating: Good
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Need I say more?

Addendum: Hmmm, SE sure got a lot of media coverage off of this. ;)

Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 10:31am by AngusX
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# Aug 22 2008 at 12:23 PM Rating: Decent
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The development and management teams would like to take this opportunity to express their commitment to a healthy and wholesome game environment for players everywhere to enjoy, and to thank them for the continued feedback.


For once.
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