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The Saronite ShuffleFollow

#1 Dec 06 2009 at 2:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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Anyone use it?

I recently powerleveled an alt to 450 JCing, and since my main was already enchanting, I figured I'd give this thing a whirl. Has anyone here had any major success doing this thing?

Right now using a spreadsheet, my projected profits are through the roof. Part of this is due in part to how Saronite is dirt cheap on my server right now, with gems being pricey.
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#2 Dec 06 2009 at 6:12 AM Rating: Good
IDrownFish wrote:
Has anyone here had any major success doing this thing?


Prospecting and using the mats produced to craft items for sale? I can't say I've done that, but it looks fun. Give it a try and see which items sell the best. It's nice to find ways to utilize your professions for good profit.
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#3 Dec 06 2009 at 2:12 PM Rating: Good
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The Honorable dadanox wrote:
IDrownFish wrote:
Has anyone here had any major success doing this thing?


Prospecting and using the mats produced to craft items for sale? I can't say I've done that, but it looks fun. Give it a try and see which items sell the best. It's nice to find ways to utilize your professions for good profit.


It's kinda like that, I guess I should have explained it more.

You need a JC high enough to create the needed items, an Enchanter high enough to disenchant everything you can make, and about 2 to 3k in startup money.

Essentially, you just go to the AH and buy all the Saronite Ore that's not ridiculously overprices. Prospect it all, and make the listed items on the chart. Send it all to the D/E'er and disenchant it all. Sell the enchanting mats.

Doing that, you should break even, leaving all the blue gems for cutting and selling, which is pure profit.

It's a neat, fairly complicated way of making a steady income. I've got a projected income of about 1.5k profit for every 75 stacks of ore. The worst part is having to go through and actually craft and DE everything. But the complexity adds security in that it's difficult for people to discover this method on their own and give you competition.

Now that I think about it, you can probably sell the items in the chart for a larger profit. I'll have to go back and check the prices on the AH, maybe post a few next time.
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#4 Dec 06 2009 at 2:15 PM Rating: Decent
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How do cut blue gems sell on your server. They're kinda meh on mine.
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#5 Dec 06 2009 at 2:19 PM Rating: Good
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idiggory wrote:
How do cut blue gems sell on your server. They're kinda meh on mine.


Fairly well. But I've recently considered selling them uncut, as they seem to be in higher demand.
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#6 Dec 06 2009 at 4:26 PM Rating: Decent
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I can see that. They've actually gone up since I last checked, on mine, so this could be decent money. But 1.5K from 75 stacks seems high, unless you get the ore really cheap (it's 14-18G on my server). And, if you end up with the less valuable gems, that could be an issue (off-color gems, icy prism gems).

But, as long as you are highly unlikely to lose money, it may be worth trying.
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#7 Dec 08 2009 at 12:57 AM Rating: Default
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Effort to reward ratio doesn't seem to be there - this seems VERY time intense and while it is completely risk free, eh, seems like I could probably do better on an 80 just running old quests.
#8 Dec 08 2009 at 10:01 AM Rating: Decent
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Doesn't seem like too bad a plan, especially if you get involved enough to start selling enchants on vellums as well. I might sink 1500G into this tonight and try it out. :P
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#9 Dec 08 2009 at 12:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Your time would be better spent, atm, working to buy/sell/cut+sell blue/epic gems and enchants. ICC is gonna offer a lot of gear upgrades for people in the weeks to come. They'll want to gem/enchant it. ;)
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#10 Dec 08 2009 at 12:43 PM Rating: Decent
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This is probably not feasible any more. With 3.3 here, i expect the price of saronite to rise to the point where it isnt profitable to do this.
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#11 Dec 08 2009 at 2:13 PM Rating: Good
Yes I had been doing this like nuts, but I've been holding off because Saronite has been suddenly raising in price :(

Ever since the mmo-champion guy posted his guide on making money (which basically consisted of doing everything I do GRRRRRRRR) the prices have been nearly upside down. Hint: Telling everyone in the world how to make a buck = that method being worthless. Thanks for that.
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#12 Dec 08 2009 at 4:43 PM Rating: Good
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I've been doing this for quite a while now as part of my effort to reach the gold cap. It was a great money-maker, took a bit of a hit with patch 3.2 and is likely going to take a larger hit now. I have around 600 stacks of saronite waiting for the dust to settle from 3.3
#13 Dec 10 2009 at 10:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Still considering trying this out, as saronite is only about 15G a stack on my server again.

Problem is though, infinite dust is 33G a stack and most all blue quality gems are <10G. Seems like it could be a fairly big loss trying this. ><
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#14 Dec 10 2009 at 11:19 AM Rating: Good
I've been doing something similar, but instead of items, I prospect all of my saronite and send the blue gems to my alchemist. She takes those and any eternals she needs and transmutes the gems to epic quality versions. These either get sent to my bank alt (if they sell for about the same uncut as they would cut) or sent back to the JC to cut into profitable cuts and then sold.
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#15 Dec 10 2009 at 1:16 PM Rating: Good
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I do this as well, I have 5 transmute mastery alchemists and an elixir mastery. I need to do the saronite shuffle just to supply all of them with gems! Having 5 transmute alchemists is amazing, minimum 5 epic gems per day, some days I get up to 10. I think my best day I got 12, one of them got a x5 proc!
#16 Dec 14 2009 at 8:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, like I said I would, I tried it. Started with 1k gold and am finally back up to that amount, except that I have 10-30 blue quality uncut gems of each type in my bags right now(after selling a bunch of cut ones already), and 12+ stacks of dust and 2 stacks of essences. Made friends with a few peeps who farm some 20-50 stacks a day and buying all their saronite and eternals at low prices.
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#17 Dec 15 2009 at 7:59 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
This is probably not feasible any more. With 3.3 here, i expect the price of saronite to rise to the point where it isnt profitable to do this.


It wont last - as titanium keeps falling in price (averaging around 20g a bar on my server) the cost of saronite to the cost of xmuting bars won't be worth it.
It takes 48 ores to xmute one titanium meaning that at 20g a bar for titanium, meaning that saronite ore has to fall to 8.33g a stack in order for those xmuting it to break even.

We know that at 12.5g per stack you're selling your saronite at a loss since you can simply smelt it into bars and sell a stack of bars to the vendor for 25g.

As such, once most players learn how to do basic math, the price of titanium should settle in at around the 27g range (maybe slightly lower as xmute specialists can afford to undercut by 10-20% due to procs).
#18 Dec 15 2009 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
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rusttle wrote:
It takes 48 ores to xmute one titanium


One Titanium = 8 Saronite bars

8 Saronite bars = 16 Saronite ore


You must have been thinking about Titansteel

#19 Dec 15 2009 at 8:43 PM Rating: Good
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Erf - that's what I get for trying to do math in my head before my morning caffeine and nicotine. >_<
#20 Dec 16 2009 at 12:26 PM Rating: Good
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Update: Still doing this, still making gold.

After a really good round of selling cut blue quality gems(there is another person doing the same thing as I am obviously, because they are selling gems of every kind on the AH and we are constantly competing for the sale. At least we both know to undercut by a few silver only every time.), I'm up to about 2k gold, 10 stacks of dust, 2 stacks of essences, and anywhere from 10-30 blue quality gems of each kind.(been doing the JC daily, although I haven't for months. I need more cuts!!). I also have over 100 of the crafted greens to DE when I get back home. Really gotta start researching which scrolls sell for good coin, I could stand to make a lot of gold from the enchanting mats.

Overall it has been a very profitable experience. I think I'll keep going until I have a good stockpile. Since these toons aren't on my main server anymore, I'm mostly doing this just to stockpile the gold. I've been thinking about transferring one of them(my pally) to my main realms, but I haven't gotten around the idea of spending another 50$ just to move a toon. It'll be a lot easier to do once he's sitting on a mountain of gold.
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#21 Dec 16 2009 at 5:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Slightly OT, but how do others find prospecting titanium? Worth it, or no? Only if you have the cuts?

I'm thinking I might plow some profits into titanium ores to prospect. I thought I'd try it out today and bought two stacks for 520G, what I thought was a great price. I didn't even cover my costs though, as I only got one epic gem.

What do others think about this? I could really use the dust to increase my cuts.
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#22 Dec 27 2009 at 12:08 PM Rating: Decent
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All right. I tried a small batch of this. this is what I ended up with.

17 Stacks Saronite Ore x 17g/stack = 289g

Prospected
Dark Jadex12        17g 
Bloodstonex15       27g 
Sun Crystalx8       15g 
Huge Citrinex10     15g 
Shadow Crystalx12   11g 
Chalcedonyx16       92g 
Autumn's Glowx6     91g 
Scarlet Rubyx3     144g 
Forest Emeralx3     24g 
Twighlight Opalx1   12g 
Monarch Topazx3     37g 
Sky Sapphirex1      11g 
 
Pure Gem Value =   494g  
Net gain           205g

Looking good so far! :)

From here I determined which of the items/transmutes were profitable based on cost of mats vs. server price. I found the Crystal Chalcedony Amulet, Skyflare Diamond and Jade Dagger pendant not to be profitable. I also excluded Icy Prism from this data due to its 20h CD, taking away ones ability to actually farm this.


Items created
Earthsiege Diamondx10 400g
Bloodstone Bandx15
Sun Rock Ringx8

Items Used
Elemental Firex10        (300)g 
Crystallized Earthx46     (46)g 



Disenchant Results

Infinite Dustx32 86g
Small Dream Shardx1 5g(value derived from price of Dream Shard)
Lesser Cosmic Essencex10 52g(derived from price of GCE)

Grand Totals

Gold Spent:
17 Stacks of Saronite Ore  (289)g 
10 Elemental Fire          (300)g 
46 Crystallized Earth       (46)g 
 
Total Spent                (635)g



Gold Attained:
10 Earthsiege Diamond      400g 
 2 Dark Jade                 3g 
12 Shadow Crystal           11g 
16 Chalcedony               92g 
 6 Autumn's Glow            91g 
 3 Scarlet Ruby            144g 
 3 Forest Emerald           24g 
 1 Twighlight Opal          12g 
 3 Monarch Topaz            37g 
 1 Sky Sapphire             11g 
32 Infinite Dust            86g 
 1 Small Dream Shard         5g 
10 Lesser Cosmic Essence    52g 
 
Total Attained             968g 
 
Net Total                  333g 
 
Net Prospecting            205g 
Net Saronite Shuffle       118g



Really, for the time it took to make the items, disenchant the items, and all the time it'll take to post and sell the various mats, I can't see the Saronite Shuffle being worthwhile. Will it make you money? Yes. Will it make you more money than other professions or farming? Probably not.

Some things to take into account are server prices. On another server, this process could yield greater or less net gains. Another note is that I obtained 17 Blue gems. That's a rate of 1 per stack of ore(4 prospects), which is a 25% rate. The tooltip shows these to be only a 4% drop. I think recently they changed the rate on them and may not have updated the tooltip. Even so, I can't imagine it actually being a 25% drop rate on blue gems, so this data may be skewed in favor of the Saronite Shuffle being viable. Some more data would be nice if somebody else can contribute.
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#23 Dec 27 2009 at 5:09 PM Rating: Good
I never really found the meta gem part worthwhile- mainly because they sell slowly. If you cut that part out and don't buy the fires, instead use all the gems for turning into greens> dusts, I think you'll find the rate slightly better.

Edited, Dec 27th 2009 3:15pm by digitalcraft
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#24 Dec 27 2009 at 6:07 PM Rating: Decent
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Really, though, that is where the majority of the difference between prospecting and shuffling comes from. Without the metas, the profit would only be 18g. You'd get a couple extra gems for each xmute not done, so let's be generous and call it 50g. It really isn't worth the time it takes to craft items and disenchant them. Plus, my figures for dust are a bit high. Most servers wont get nearly that much out of them.
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#25 Dec 29 2009 at 8:12 PM Rating: Good
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I thought of the Alchemy transmute thing when I saw this thread's topic.

How many Alchemists out there are making a killing making Titanium? I've sold 19 bars already.

I bought 112 Saronite Bars, enough to transmute 14 times. The Mastery procs gave me 5 additional bars, making it a total of 19 Titanium Bars. Now, the AH takes a couple of percentage off of any sale, so I got around 19g from each bar sold.

19 x 19g = 361g

The Saronite Bars cost me no more than 32g per stack.

32g / 20 = 1.6g each
112 x 1.6g = 179g

Profit:
361g - 179g = 182g

For two minutes of transmuting, heh.

AH taxes not included.

Now I just need to level up Herbalism again and I'll get my share of the 50g each Frost Lotus market that runs right now.

Edited, Dec 30th 2009 3:20am by Mazra
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#26 Dec 30 2009 at 1:56 AM Rating: Good
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Kinda forgot about this thread, but just posting to say that the Saronite Shuffle is now, for the most part, defunct. 3.3 has drastically reduced the demand fro Infinite Dust and made the Saronite Shuffle, while still profitable, not nearly the cash cow it once was.
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#27 Dec 30 2009 at 12:06 PM Rating: Good
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Mazra wrote:
I thought of the Alchemy transmute thing when I saw this thread's topic.

How many Alchemists out there are making a killing making Titanium? I've sold 19 bars already.

I bought 112 Saronite Bars, enough to transmute 14 times. The Mastery procs gave me 5 additional bars, making it a total of 19 Titanium Bars. Now, the AH takes a couple of percentage off of any sale, so I got around 19g from each bar sold.

The market on my server is pitched a bit lower than Mazra's, but I'm generally able to cherry-pick about 15 Titanium bars per day (sell for about 18g) by buying all the Saronite I see on the AH (bars under 30, ore under 15). If I'm too tired to think but not tired enough to sleep, it's now a toss-up between herbing Storm Peaks and mining Sholazar.

As for the Saronite shuffle itself, I've cut my disenchanting way back because all the added instancing has led to more ID being supplied than demanded (note to those who are still thinking that the DE option has anything to do with this, it still doesn't - the price of greens has dropped in half and the number available on the AH has tripled - i.e. there's a glut of /everything/). It's still profitable, around 25-30%, but that's not enough to justify investing much time. I'm down to about 5 minutes a day, which I spend while I'm in the LFG queue on my hunter.

Mazra wrote:
Now I just need to level up Herbalism again and I'll get my share of the 50g each Frost Lotus market that runs right now.

I don't know when, but it seems to me the drop rate is /way/ down on Frost Lotus. I get less than one per circuit of Storm Peaks, and I'm sure it used to be more back when my guild was in Naxx. I think there's a good reason it's 50g besides the increased flask demand.
#28 Dec 30 2009 at 12:23 PM Rating: Decent
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This made me about 25,000g total a few months back, but I fell off lately. Ever since 3.3 I'm not sure how the infinite dust market is. When I was back selling it was stacks of dust for 80-95g/stack. Now they are down to 23-35g/stack. I'm sure the cycle still works (it's been ages since I logged on my JC'er). And now my enchanter has transfered factions. Made such a killing off this for a while though. There was a period of golden days when eternal earths were dirt cheap like 2g/each in bulk. Infinite dust was still over 100g/stack, and saronite was around 21g/stack.

Now everyone knows about this method. Cost of dust has bottomed out due to disenchanting in the LFG tool. Even non-enchanters have 7 stacks in the bank simply from chain running heroics for 3 days. Demand for eternal earth is high. Demand for rare gems has dropped (I'd estimate dropped by 60% considering the iLvl of loot dropping now, and the fact most people gem that loot with epic gems).


Short version, this market used to be way better. But for the dedicated person I'm sure theres still profits to be made in there. I don't miss my days of disenchanting 150-300 items in a row though =O I never did get the macro for it, which was probably stupid of me.
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