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Price Jacking stories ; ;Follow

#1 Dec 29 2004 at 10:28 AM Rating: Decent
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I have been the victim of pricejacking many times, be it on food, gear, almost everything. This has got to stop.

I paid 6.3 million for my harness right before it went down in price ;;. Now I'm looking for a pair of earrings, elusive. They seemed to be 380k, now they have shot up over 450k. I could not afford that last night. Everything seems to be going up in price. Has anyone had similar experiences?
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#2 Dec 29 2004 at 11:26 AM Rating: Default
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nope :D
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#3 Dec 29 2004 at 12:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Eh... I've noticed that prices tend to fluctuate a lot... and of course it always seems to be on an upswing when I need something.

Like the Teleport Mea scroll... I didn't have enough fame to get it by quest, so I decided to buy one... I check one day, and it's going for 90k... go farm up the rest of the cash I needed and a day later it's selling for 125k. ><

But what are you gonna do... at least some items are going down in price. I just gotta shrug my shoulders and move on.
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#4 Dec 29 2004 at 1:01 PM Rating: Decent
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MemnochTheDevil wrote:
Like the Teleport Mea scroll... I didn't have enough fame to get it by quest, so I decided to buy one... I check one day, and it's going for 90k... go farm up the rest of the cash I needed and a day later it's selling for 125k. ><


Yep yup, same thing happened to me, well it was going for 70k, then when i had the gil to buy it it jumped to 80-90k.
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#5 Dec 29 2004 at 4:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Emperor Hairpin - 300k to 410k in about two weeks.
Leaping Boots - 300k to 450k in about two months
Genin Earring - 90k to 350k in about two months.
Warp Scroll - 8k to 20k in about two months.(Don't know if it stayed the price but ****...)

Same price hike on Amenit Mantle +1, Brigadine +1, etc...

Don't even get me started on the super rare, never-show-up at the AH items like the Agile Mantle and the Sniper's Mantle.
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#6 Dec 30 2004 at 6:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Raise III, I saw it listed with the most recent being 250k. I was angry but I tried to bid and didn't have enough. I went back a few weeks later and it was 430k, I wasn't angry anymore just horrified, I bought it. Two weeks later I was glad I bought it, it was listed for 800k.
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#7 Jan 02 2005 at 10:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Erase has gone up from 200k to 400k and above, I [aid 400k for mine -.-

Though I did get a bit lucky with my earrings. Bought 2 Melody earrings +1 for 200k each, now they're like 350k each.
#8 Jan 03 2005 at 5:31 AM Rating: Good
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It's gil-seller inflation. Plain and simple. Desperate players are buying gil to meet the outrageous prices that gil sellers are setting on high-demand items like amemit mantles, snipers rings, and the drops from Castle O/Beadeaux/Davoi.

It's not going to stop until RMT is destroyed. If history is any teacher, that's not going to happen very soon.
#9 Jan 10 2005 at 10:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I'll tell you a couple... for me there was first the holy ampulla which I was saving up for when I was lvl 38 WHM. I was like a typical white mage at that level and did teleports to buy this 40k item (or so it was at the time). So I teleport only on weekend nights to get the money (usually 10k max >< a week). so almost a month later I have earned around 35kish and I decide to check the auction house since I can't wait to get it. I look at the price history and I feel like i'm in a horrible nightmare. The price for holy ampulla went to 86k!! and to this day it still is rising (I think its 100k now). I have it now and all is well (yay happy ending) but this kind of money is hard for me to get. I have no idea how some people can get millions of gil when all I ever had max was 250k and that was mainly because of utsusemi and tonko quests. To wrap it up... there was Holy Shield which was PREVIOUSLY 50k in the past few months.. now its like 100k... I don't know what to do ; ; my future spells have gone up as well such as Raise III by 700k... Erase has gone up 90k. And that's my (sad) story O=(^.^Q)
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#10 Jan 11 2005 at 12:48 AM Rating: Good
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Everything seems to have gone haywire lately. Even fire crystals are ridiculous, but from the looks of things, it's affecting everything, not just high end items, and not even items that higher level players are farming up to try and afford the high end itmes.

I don't anticipate that we'll be seeing any kind of significant deflation over time, but at least it's good to know that there's money to be made as well as spent on Siren.

Now if only some people would synth up some Venom Dust and put it on AH >.<
#11 Jan 11 2005 at 9:37 PM Rating: Good
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It's simple. SE's plan to try to stablize the economy and keep items from being over inflated to try to halt the gil-seller controlled items on AH has backfired. People are jacking up the prices on AH to cover the AH listing taxes and make a few thousand extra gil while there's some confusion on the new taxes. Most of the confusion has died down now, but the toll has already taken it's effect. Think of gas prices and how they fluctuate. They rise to absurd prices and when they drop 40 cents per gallon, we're relieved... but the gas prices are still 30 cents higher per gallon than it was before the initial increase. The same is happening here on FFXI.

It all starts with the gil-sellers that control the AH on certain big-ticket items. They do this because they know other people rarely get the drops on some of these items and they can sell the items for whatever they please. So they jack up the prices of these items to cover the new taxes because of the lack of competition AND add few thousand gil over the new listing fees because they know there's still confusion about the new lsiting fees. It will stablize once people start realizing how much it costs to list a certain item on AH and sales slow down. But by then, it's too late: a new "going rate" has already been established and that "going rate" covers the new taxes with a few thousand gil added to that. So items that sold for 1 million gil now cost 100k+ more than what they did pre-update. Now people have to buy even more gil from them to pay for desired items.

This starts a snowball effect. Taking Archer's Rings as an example since the gil-sellers control the AH on this item, the price rises another 50k: 10k or so to cover the new listing fees and they pocket an extra 40k during the confusion of the new listing fees and since they control the market on this item they know people will pay that.

Now take the person crafting Sniper's Rings. He/She has to pay an extra 50k to buy the ring, so the price rise on the Sniper's Ring by 70k: 50k to pay for the extra cost that the gil-seller sells the Archer's Ring at, 15k to cover the new taxes for the Sniper's Ring itself and an extra 5k added to the cost of the ring during the confusion of the new taxes.

Even if the seller only jacks the price of an item up 5k to help recoup some of the loss of the 20k listing fee on AH, that's still an increase. And if it's a crafting item, it's even worse because the other items needed for crafting are going to be jacked up as well and this is all added into the final product. By the time the final product is made, the crafter might have had to pay an extra 15k for items due to these new taxes. Now that's an additional 15k the crafter has to list his/her item for just to make a profit. And of course, there will be the recoup of the new listing fee that will only add more.

That's what is happening on nearly everything major. Not to mention that SE has very nearly taken the point of having Jeuno out of the game. Jeuno is supposed to be the hub where everything comes together. It's the center to where one can find anything. Now many people are moving stacks of crafting items to the starting cities to avoid the high Jeuno tax prices AND make more of a profit. This drives up the prices on crafting materials (especially crystals) because it looks like the supply is low when in all reality the supply has just been scattered through the starting cities. Lower supply means higher prices.

I personally don't fault anyone here but the gil-sellers. I mean if the gil-sellers can jack up the prices on their items, then I can't fault everyone else for wanting a piece of the pie while it lasts.

I mentioned that I thought would happen on the day the information was released about the Dec update in Nov. Many people were optimistic that this would be a change for the better thinking that the consequences of a 1 million gil item not selling would drive prices down. SE thought this too, so I can understand why people thought this. All that being said, I'm still clinging to hope that I am dead wrong. We've only had this new update for a month and it has not had near enough time to stablize the economy. Let's see how everything turns out another 2 months from now and perhaps things will settle down and get more manageable.
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#12 Jan 13 2005 at 8:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Emperor Hairpin - 300k to 410k in about two weeks.
Leaping Boots - 300k to 450k in about two months
Genin Earring - 90k to 350k in about two months.
Warp Scroll - 8k to 20k in about two months.(Don't know if it stayed the price but ****...)

Same price hike on Amenit Mantle +1, Brigadine +1, etc...

Don't even get me started on the super rare, never-show-up at the AH items like the Agile Mantle and the Sniper's Mantle.


Most of those price changes had little to do with the patch(the subject of this thread). The Emp Pin dropped in price before the patch. It's just gone back to what it was.
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#13 Jan 13 2005 at 9:07 AM Rating: Default
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It's simple. SE's plan to try to stablize the economy and keep items from being over inflated to try to halt the gil-seller controlled items on AH has backfired. People are jacking up the prices on AH to cover the AH listing taxes and make a few thousand extra gil while there's some confusion on the new taxes. Most of the confusion has died down now, but the toll has already taken it's effect. Think of gas prices and how they fluctuate. They rise to absurd prices and when they drop 40 cents per gallon, we're relieved... but the gas prices are still 30 cents higher per gallon than it was before the initial increase. The same is happening here on FFXI.

It all starts with the gil-sellers that control the AH on certain big-ticket items. They do this because they know other people rarely get the drops on some of these items and they can sell the items for whatever they please. So they jack up the prices of these items to cover the new taxes because of the lack of competition AND add few thousand gil over the new listing fees because they know there's still confusion about the new lsiting fees. It will stablize once people start realizing how much it costs to list a certain item on AH and sales slow down. But by then, it's too late: a new "going rate" has already been established and that "going rate" covers the new taxes with a few thousand gil added to that. So items that sold for 1 million gil now cost 100k+ more than what they did pre-update. Now people have to buy even more gil from them to pay for desired items.

This starts a snowball effect. Taking Archer's Rings as an example since the gil-sellers control the AH on this item, the price rises another 50k: 10k or so to cover the new listing fees and they pocket an extra 40k during the confusion of the new listing fees and since they control the market on this item they know people will pay that.

Now take the person crafting Sniper's Rings. He/She has to pay an extra 50k to buy the ring, so the price rise on the Sniper's Ring by 70k: 50k to pay for the extra cost that the gil-seller sells the Archer's Ring at, 15k to cover the new taxes for the Sniper's Ring itself and an extra 5k added to the cost of the ring during the confusion of the new taxes.

Even if the seller only jacks the price of an item up 5k to help recoup some of the loss of the 20k listing fee on AH, that's still an increase. And if it's a crafting item, it's even worse because the other items needed for crafting are going to be jacked up as well and this is all added into the final product. By the time the final product is made, the crafter might have had to pay an extra 15k for items due to these new taxes. Now that's an additional 15k the crafter has to list his/her item for just to make a profit. And of course, there will be the recoup of the new listing fee that will only add more.

That's what is happening on nearly everything major. Not to mention that SE has very nearly taken the point of having Jeuno out of the game. Jeuno is supposed to be the hub where everything comes together. It's the center to where one can find anything. Now many people are moving stacks of crafting items to the starting cities to avoid the high Jeuno tax prices AND make more of a profit. This drives up the prices on crafting materials (especially crystals) because it looks like the supply is low when in all reality the supply has just been scattered through the starting cities. Lower supply means higher prices.

I personally don't fault anyone here but the gil-sellers. I mean if the gil-sellers can jack up the prices on their items, then I can't fault everyone else for wanting a piece of the pie while it lasts.

I mentioned that I thought would happen on the day the information was released about the Dec update in Nov. Many people were optimistic that this would be a change for the better thinking that the consequences of a 1 million gil item not selling would drive prices down. SE thought this too, so I can understand why people thought this. All that being said, I'm still clinging to hope that I am dead wrong. We've only had this new update for a month and it has not had near enough time to stablize the economy. Let's see how everything turns out another 2 months from now and perhaps things will settle down and get more manageable.


Actually, I chalk much of the rise in crafting items to more ppl crafting, the boost in Cooking, and the guild system. Don't just watch the prices, but watch how quickly items are bought up. I rarely see more than 20-30 stacks of Fire Crystals in Bastok(or anywhere). Before the patch there was usually 80+ stacks. Check any city and you'll notice a shortage of fire crystals. Also more gil is being taken out of the game so eventually the prices will have to come down or stabalize. If not, the market will crash. As far as the AH goes I don't even consider the tax when pricing the stuff other than having the gil to pay. You have to remember everyone else who is selling the item also paid the cost. I do sell a variety of high priced items so I know it effects me but it is also in my best interest to move my inventory quickly.

I have the capabilty to craft every consumable I use already. I have 4 extremely reliable sources of income so to be honest I haven't felt the sting. In fact I'm better off than I ever was before the patch. The only cost I've noticed is the price of beetle jaws and fire crystals. Beetle jumped from 6K a stack to 14K a stack. That IS NOT due to the patch. That is tons of people all the sudden taking up bonecraft.

I think you're also being very selective in what items you bring up when discussing the prices of items. For example Haubergeon has remained very stable. People will jack up prices because they can. I don't think a 10K tax justifies someone jacking up the price on an item 50K. It's the fact that they can if ppl will pay it. Archer and sniper rings are the worse example you could have used knowing who controls the market. They're going to jack up prices if ppl are willing to pay up no matter what.

To be honest I haven't seen a big plunge in the Jueno AH supply. From what I've seen, it looks about the same as pre-patch. The vast majority of items are still sold in Jueno.

Edited, Thu Jan 13 13:38:02 2005 by DieselEdge
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#14 Jan 13 2005 at 7:06 PM Rating: Good
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Actually, I chalk much of the rise in crafting items to more ppl crafting, the boost in Cooking, and the guild system. Don't just watch the prices, but watch how quickly items are bought up. I rarely see more than 20-30 stacks of Fire Crystals in Bastok(or anywhere). Before the patch there was usually 80+ stacks. Check any city and you'll notice a shortage of fire crystals. Also more gil is being taken out of the game so eventually the prices will have to come down or stabalize. If not, the market will crash. As far as the AH goes I don't even consider the tax when pricing the stuff other than having the gil to pay. You have to remember everyone else who is selling the item also paid the cost. I do sell a variety of high priced items so I know it effects me but it is also in my best interest to move my inventory quickly.


I realize this has something to do with it and I hope it has a lot more to do with the rising prices than the patch. I just don't see it that way because the huge boosts in prices came after the patch. I don't ever see the market crashing because there is always gil to buy from somewhere. As long as one can buy gil, people will buy it and prices will continue to rise.

The taxes don't effect me all that much either because I quit listing items on the AH in Jeuno unless it's a single item. Any stackable crafting items gets shipped to a mule and listed in the starting cities.

And there have always been a decent supply of crystals in every city. The reason you saw so many Fire Crystals in Bastok prior to the update is mainly because there was no reason for crafters in Jeuno to travel anywhere else to buy crystals. There was not enough difference in the crystal prices between Jeuno and the starting cities to make someone log onto a mule or travel to the starting cities to buy them. Post patch, there are couple of reasons that make it worth the effort to log onto that Bastok mule to buy Fire Crystals: the difference in crystal prices between Jeuno and the starting cities are more pronounced than they were pre update and the supply is lower than what it used to be in Jeuno.

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I have the capabilty to craft every consumable I use already. I have 4 extremely reliable sources of income so to be honest I haven't felt the sting. In fact I'm better off than I ever was before the patch. The only cost I've noticed is the price of beetle jaws and fire crystals. Beetle jumped from 6K a stack to 14K a stack. That IS NOT due to the patch. That is tons of people all the sudden taking up bonecraft.


Beetle Jaws did not jump 8k a stack simply because there are more bone crafters. With such a significant jump in price then that would mean there are a lot of people crafting with Beetle Jaws, correct? Then that means there would be an overabundance of the final product which would ultimately cause the prices on the final product to drop significantly because it would take a LOT of crafters to raise the price of Beetle Jaws 8k. How many people are going to pay 14k for a stack of items if there's an over abundance of the finished product on AH? Not many.

It's a combination of reasons that have caused the prices to rise so much: The update, more crafters as you said and the fact that materials can now be used in more crafts. I personally think the new taxes are the main reason items have risen.

And of course you're going to benefit from the update if you're selling those items that have went up a lot due to this update. That's a given. I am the same way. I've found an item that has jumped up 3-5k a stack. But just because we're benefiting from it doesn't mean everyone is benefitting. You, I and everyone else farming mobs that drop items with new high prices do not make up the entire FFXI economy.

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I think you're also being very selective in what items you bring up when discussing the prices of items. For example Haubergeon has remained very stable. People will jack up prices because they can. I don't think a 10K tax justifies someone jacking up the price on an item 50K. It's the fact that they can if ppl will pay it. Archer and sniper rings are the worse example you could have used knowing who controls the market. They're going to jack up prices if ppl are willing to pay up no matter what.


I am hardly being selective when I am talking about most items. The items I have selected make the point I am trying to get a cross more clear because there's a bigger gap between what items used to cost before the update and what they cost now. That's part of the point I was making about the gil-sellers controlling the market on certain items. They are a big part of the reason items have gotten out of control. I never said everyone will jack up their prices well above the costs of the new taxes except for the gil-sellers. In fact, I even gave an example that if someone only lists an item 5k above what the item costs before the patch to help recoup the 20k listing fee. While the seller isn't getting all of their gil spent on taxes back, the price has STILL went up. That's the entire point. One doesn't have to list the items to recoup all their losses, just a little bit is all it takes. On crafting items, this is detrimental because it all snowballs into the final product. So if an item costs 20k to list and the seller only lists it for 5k above what the past going rate was, the seller still loses 15k above what he/she should've made and the buyer pays an addition 5k for the item. Sure, this drains gil out of the economy, but as long as there are gil-sellers, it doesn't matter how much gil quits revolving through the economy because people will always buy the gil to pay for something.

Perhaps the Haubergeon has stayed the same, I've never looked into this item, but have you looked at the Hauberk, Hauberk+1 and the Juggernaut? These are items I've paid close attention to before and after the patch because they're items I've wanted. Next time you log on, check the price history of these items before and after the update and then come back and tell me I'm wrong. The Hauberk+1 alone jumped from around 3million to 4.5 million to 6 million. The NQ Hauberk was 1.1 million before the update (I paid 1.17million for mine 2 days after the update) and it's now up to 1.3-1.4 million after the update and it continues to rise.

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To be honest I haven't seen a big plunge in the Jueno AH supply. From what I've seen, it looks about the same as pre-patch. The vast majority of items are still sold in Jueno.


I never said there was a big plunge in supply. I said people are starting to move items from Jeuno to the starting cities. It's slowly but surely headed to the "big plunge." I've started doing it and so have a lot of other people because I've noticed a decrease in items and and increase in prices.

Perhaps it will all stabilize in the coming weeks and I hope it does. But the new going rate has been established. Right before the economy starts to stabilize, expect a drop in prices on items on the AH. But that drop in prices will still be more than what it was pre-update and it's not only because there are more crafters.
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#15 Jan 13 2005 at 10:21 PM Rating: Default
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Actually, I chalk much of the rise in crafting items to more ppl crafting, the boost in Cooking, and the guild system. Don't just watch the prices, but watch how quickly items are bought up. I rarely see more than 20-30 stacks of Fire Crystals in Bastok(or anywhere). Before the patch there was usually 80+ stacks. Check any city and you'll notice a shortage of fire crystals. Also more gil is being taken out of the game so eventually the prices will have to come down or stabalize. If not, the market will crash. As far as the AH goes I don't even consider the tax when pricing the stuff other than having the gil to pay. You have to remember everyone else who is selling the item also paid the cost. I do sell a variety of high priced items so I know it effects me but it is also in my best interest to move my inventory quickly.
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I realize this has something to do with it and I hope it has a lot more to do with the rising prices than the patch. I just don't see it that way because the huge boosts in prices came after the patch. I don't ever see the market crashing because there is always gil to buy from somewhere. As long as one can buy gil, people will buy it and prices will continue to rise.

Wow, guess what? People could buy gil before the patch. If you think big price fluctuations are something that didn't happen before the patch you weren't paying attention. Juggernaut had a huge price jump before the patch(2-3 mil jump)n't jacking up items 3 million gil to fund the cost of their AH tax. They're doing it because they can just like pre-patch.

The taxes don't effect me all that much either because I quit listing items on the AH in Jeuno unless it's a single item. Any stackable crafting items gets shipped to a mule and listed in the starting cities.

And there have always been a decent supply of crystals in every city. The reason you saw so many Fire Crystals in Bastok prior to the update is mainly because there was no reason for crafters in Jeuno to travel anywhere else to buy crystals. There was not enough difference in the crystal prices between Jeuno and the starting cities to make someone log onto a mule or travel to the starting cities to buy them. Post patch, there are couple of reasons that make it worth the effort to log onto that Bastok mule to buy Fire Crystals: the difference in crystal prices between Jeuno and the starting cities are more pronounced than they were pre update and the supply is lower than what it used to be in Jeuno.

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Um hate to break this news to you, but the prices are the same throughout all the cities. Trust me I've been using alot of them. The prices are pretty much equal everywhere. In fact if I want to get cheaper fire crystals, the Jueno AH is actually better than Windy and Bastok at times if not just as bad.



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I have the capabilty to craft every consumable I use already. I have 4 extremely reliable sources of income so to be honest I haven't felt the sting. In fact I'm better off than I ever was before the patch. The only cost I've noticed is the price of beetle jaws and fire crystals. Beetle jumped from 6K a stack to 14K a stack. That IS NOT due to the patch. That is tons of people all the sudden taking up bonecraft.
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Beetle Jaws did not jump 8k a stack simply because there are more bone crafters. With such a significant jump in price then that would mean there are a lot of people crafting with Beetle Jaws, correct? Then that means there would be an overabundance of the final product which would ultimately cause the prices on the final product to drop significantly because it would take a LOT of crafters to raise the price of Beetle Jaws 8k. How many people are going to pay 14k for a stack of items if there's an over abundance of the finished product on AH? Not many.

It's a combination of reasons that have caused the prices to rise so much: The update, more crafters as you said and the fact that materials can now be used in more crafts. I personally think the new taxes are the main reason items have risen.

Really? Then explain why Wind Crystals are still dirt cheap? Archer knives have dropped from 60K to 33K and Hawker's have dropped a bit too.

And of course you're going to benefit from the update if you're selling those items that have went up a lot due to this update. That's a given. I am the same way. I've found an item that has jumped up 3-5k a stack. But just because we're benefiting from it doesn't mean everyone is benefitting. You, I and everyone else farming mobs that drop items with new high prices do not make up the entire FFXI economy.

Few of the items I sell have risen in value. I have simply improved myself dramatically since then. Second, I don't farm in a conventional manner that's so yesterday :p


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I think you're also being very selective in what items you bring up when discussing the prices of items. For example Haubergeon has remained very stable. People will jack up prices because they can. I don't think a 10K tax justifies someone jacking up the price on an item 50K. It's the fact that they can if ppl will pay it. Archer and sniper rings are the worse example you could have used knowing who controls the market. They're going to jack up prices if ppl are willing to pay up no matter what.
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I am hardly being selective when I am talking about most items. The items I have selected make the point I am trying to get a cross more clear because there's a bigger gap between what items used to cost before the update and what they cost now. That's part of the point I was making about the gil-sellers controlling the market on certain items. They are a big part of the reason items have gotten out of control. I never said everyone will jack up their prices well above the costs of the new taxes except for the gil-sellers. In fact, I even gave an example that if someone only lists an item 5k above what the item costs before the patch to help recoup the 20k listing fee. While the seller isn't getting all of their gil spent on taxes back, the price has STILL went up. That's the entire point. One doesn't have to list the items to recoup all their losses, just a little bit is all it takes. On crafting items, this is detrimental because it all snowballs into the final product. So if an item costs 20k to list and the seller only lists it for 5k above what the past going rate was, the seller still loses 15k above what he/she should've made and the buyer pays an addition 5k for the item. Sure, this drains gil out of the economy, but as long as there are gil-sellers, it doesn't matter how much gil quits revolving through the economy because people will always buy the gil to pay for something.

Perhaps the Haubergeon has stayed the same, I've never looked into this item, but have you looked at the Hauberk, Hauberk+1 and the Juggernaut? These are items I've paid close attention to before and after the patch because they're items I've wanted. Next time you log on, check the price history of these items before and after the update and then come back and tell me I'm wrong. The Hauberk+1 alone jumped from around 3million to 4.5 million to 6 million. The NQ Hauberk was 1.1 million before the update (I paid 1.17million for mine 2 days after the update) and it's now up to 1.3-1.4 million after the update and it continues to rise.

As for gil sellers effecting the market, they didn't arrive yesterday. It's not the update. They would be jacking up prices regardless. Remember snipers hitting 650K? lol Juggernaut launch in value right before the patch from 3 million to 6 million. That is a 3 million gil jump. It was right before the patch update. Gil buyers maybe, ppl with too much gil and time on their hands, maybe, but not the AH tax is to blame.

The Hauberk only cost that much because of the mild panic in the market before the patch. Haubergeon AND Hauberk both dropped in price before the patch. The 1.3-1.4 is what it has been on Siren for months before the last patch. On the day of the patch somone had bought a Haubergeon for 1.1 mill. 2 weeks pryor I paid 1.370K. You're argument there is shot, sorry.



Quote:
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To be honest I haven't seen a big plunge in the Jueno AH supply. From what I've seen, it looks about the same as pre-patch. The vast majority of items are still sold in Jueno.
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I never said there was a big plunge in supply. I said people are starting to move items from Jeuno to the starting cities. It's slowly but surely headed to the "big plunge." I've started doing it and so have a lot of other people because I've noticed a decrease in items and and increase in prices.

Perhaps it will all stabilize in the coming weeks and I hope it does. But the new going rate has been established. Right before the economy starts to stabilize, expect a drop in prices on items on the AH. But that drop in prices will still be more than what it was pre-update and it's not only because there are more crafters.


I sell more regular items in Jueno than I did before the horrible AH tax. Before the patch I hardly sold anything in Jueno unless it was equipment. For any antedotal evidense I can find a way to contradict it.



Edited, Fri Jan 14 00:00:16 2005 by DieselEdge
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#16 Jan 14 2005 at 12:21 PM Rating: Decent
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#17 Jan 14 2005 at 8:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Wow, guess what? People could buy gil before the patch. If you think big price fluctuations are something that didn't happen before the patch you weren't paying attention. Juggernaut had a huge price jump before the patch(2-3 mil jump)n't jacking up items 3 million gil to fund the cost of their AH tax. They're doing it because they can just like pre-patch.


What exactly are you trying to point out about saying that people bought gil before the patch? That has absolutely nothing to do with what I said. Nothing. To spell it out for you, the point I was making is that after the patch, it's costing more for people to list items and the prices are going up whether you can see it or not. People now have more of a reason to buy gil due to the new high prices which are a result of the new taxes. It's really not that hard of a concept to comprehend.

As I said last night, after you sent me a /tell, the price jump on the Juggernaut was only briefly and it was not the "going rate." Just because the price of the Juggernaut jumped in price a time or two before the patch doesn't mean that that is what it sold for all the time especially when all auction history proves differently. You told me last night you've been watching the the items I mentioned in my last post for a couple of months and I told you I've been watching these since June. Didn't the price history show the last 2 months worth of purchases on the Juggernaut anyway? lol, talk about proving yourself wrong. A simple economics class will clear the confusion if there's any after you read this. And I'm talking ALL the price history. I've watched this item since June. I took a 2 month break and when I came back, the half the auctions that were on the price history when I left were still there.


Quote:

Um hate to break this news to you, but the prices are the same throughout all the cities. Trust me I've been using alot of them. The prices are pretty much equal everywhere. In fact if I want to get cheaper fire crystals, the Jueno AH is actually better than Windy and Bastok at times if not just as bad.


Funny. yet another "trust me" statement. Everytime I need crystals they're always more expensive in Jeuno than everywhere else and they were about the same pre-patch. Light Crystals are the only crystals I've seen cheaper in Jeuno. And no, I'm not going to take your word for it, lol.


Quote:
Really? Then explain why Wind Crystals are still dirt cheap? Archer knives have dropped from 60K to 33K and Hawker's have dropped a bit too.


When I first started the game in March of 2004, Wind Crystals were about 800g a stack and they sometimes went up to 1k or so. A month or so after that, they jumped to 1500g-1700g and have stayed there. After the patch they go for 1500g-2200g. I list my Wind Crystals on AH for 1900g and they within a few hours. Just because they didn't jump 2k like Fire Crystals doesn't mean they're "dirt cheap."

I've never had any interest in the Archer's or Hawker's Knives. I bought 2 Archer's Knives a couple weeks ago because I was leveling my Marksmanship skill. *IF* (heavy emphasis on "IF") they were 60k before, then that falls right along the lines of what I was talking about when I said an overabundance of items on AH will cause the price of items to drop. There were 15 Archer's Knives for on AH and the price History reveealed that 10 more had been sold that same dday for 35k. So that's AT LEAST 25 total Archer's Knives that have passed through the AH in a 24 hour period. There's your overabundance of an item and there's the reson for your price drop. I've no idea about the prices of Hawker's Knives and I still fail to see what this all has to do with the reasoning of Beetle Jaws jumping 8k .


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Few of the items I sell have risen in value. I have simply improved myself dramatically since then. Second, I don't farm in a conventional manner that's so yesterday :p



Congratulations on your unconventional farming techniques. *golf clap*

Those Beetle Jaws you sell more than doubled in price so I think we can safely say that you're going to benefit more from the update than most people. Hence, my point.


Quote:

As for gil sellers effecting the market, they didn't arrive yesterday. It's not the update. They would be jacking up prices regardless. Remember snipers hitting 650K? lol Juggernaut launch in value right before the patch from 3 million to 6 million. That is a 3 million gil jump. It was right before the patch update. Gil buyers maybe, ppl with too much gil and time on their hands, maybe, but not the AH tax is to blame.


What are you talking about? It jumped from 4 million to 4.5 million AFTER the patch and it was 3-4 million before the patch. I thought the Hauberk +1 was the item that jumped from 4.5-6 million (6 million being the last one sold). It's still all there on the AH price history both before and after the update. I don't recall seeing the Juggernaut selling for 6 million. Just check the prices before the update and after the update. Those numbers will show that the price has indeed risen since the patch which is the entire point.

And yes I remember the Sniper's hitting 650k. Are you going to use that saying that the Sniper's had a going rate of 650k now to try to prove that the price has significantly dropped since the update? lol. 650k was never a sustained price and it didn't last more than a few days. Everything I have mentioned has steadily climbed in price since the update with a few price spikes here and there. If you can't tell the difference between what is normal and what a price spike is, then that's an issue you have to deal with and it's nothing I can help remedy.

Quote:
The Hauberk only cost that much because of the mild panic in the market before the patch. Haubergeon AND Hauberk both dropped in price before the patch. The 1.3-1.4 is what it has been on Siren for months before the last patch. On the day of the patch somone had bought a Haubergeon for 1.1 mill. 2 weeks pryor I paid 1.370K. You're argument there is shot, sorry.


Um, no, my arguement is not shot because I have the price history of the Hauberk to prove what I've said. And just because you got bent on the price of your Hauberk doesn't mean everyone paid that. As I told you last night, there will be some cases where the price will spike but that by no means the normal price. You bought it on a price spike. If a THF pulls hate off the tank briefly after using SA, then that doesn't mean he has hate? Nope, it emeans the THF created a hate spike. The tank still has hate and he simply created a hate spike. The same principle applies here.

There was no "panic" before the update, lol. People listed their big ticket items the day before the update so they didn't have to pay through the nose on the new taxes. One the day of the update, there were 12, yes, TWELVE Hauberks for auction and many did not sell. People were trying to get one last shot at getting more than the going rate on this item and it backfired because some people listed their Hauberks for barely over 1 million.

You're saying "trust me" on this and that when I KNOW you're wrong. Saying that is like telling me Barry Bonds decides to hit a homerun with me nugget and a 36" Louisville, it won't hurt. That's how I see what your saying because I know what I've seen in the past and I know what I see now. I know the prices of these items I'm mentioning because I've had my eye on them since June, yet you're trying to tell me I'm wrong, lol. The Hauberk was a steady 1-1.2 million (1.2 million was the most common price) before the update. It actually dropped to 1.1 million on the day of the update and I paid 1.17mill for mine two days after the update. It's at 1.3-1.4 million now and it is steadily rising in price. It might drop back down to 1.2 million, but instead of 1-1.2 million, this item will now sell for 1.1x million to 1.4 million. That's an increase whether you see it that way or not. If the economy every decides to settle down, it will likely drop to a steady 1.25-1.3 million but you know what? That's still an increase above what it was before the patch.


Quote:
I sell more regular items in Jueno than I did before the horrible AH tax. Before the patch I hardly sold anything in Jueno unless it was equipment. For any antedotal evidense I can find a way to contradict it.


Indeed. You look for any way to contradict anything I say to try to prove your right even when you're wrong. That much is painfully obvious. I have the price history of the items I've mentioned. What have you got?

Sorry, but "trust me" doesn't cut it with me especially after this last paragraph. This last paragraph of yours states that you will go out of your way to prove that you're right no matter how you have to go about it. And I came to this conclusion last night when I talked to you in /tells. You'd look for any reason to prove that you are right no matter how minute and silly those reasons are... It's quite amuzing actually.
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#18 Jan 15 2005 at 10:19 AM Rating: Decent
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The story on Archer's Knife - Pre-COP they went for 5k to 8k. Once COP and the Level 30 capped Promy's came out, they leaped to 40k to 50k. They reached an all-time high of 70k before settling in where they currently are, which is still more than triple the pre-COP prices. Demand also flexes according to the price of Dragon's Blood. You'll notice a whole mess of them on the AH at the moment because Dragon's Blood is running 190k, so no high level alchemist are making Hawker's Knifes because they would lose 40k or more per synth.
Meh, I'm a ranger, I tended to watch the prices.
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#19 Jan 15 2005 at 1:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Let's not forget that a lot of the people buying the hi-end (max-end) gear are higher level players leveling another job.

I was wandering around Jeuno all proud of the Trailer's Kukri I had dangling from my hip only to pass by someone at the Guidestone in Lower Jeuno with 2 of them. While that's not the 6 million it would cost for a pair of Hawkers +1, it's still 800k worth of gear.

Imagine where you would be in terms of levels and gil resources 2 years from now. Heck, even 1 year from now. There are people who play the game on our server who are more than capable of fully decking out a lvl 60-75 job with all of the best items available at DOUBLE the current AH prices and not really notice the gil.

The only way to really understand what is going on with the prices is to talk to the buyer and seller and find out what happened.

The AH tax was implemented for 2 reasons. It's a more balanced way to draw gil out of the economy (making up for the gil that is brought into the economy via sales of items to NPC, etc). Not only that, it's a very effective way to discourage people from listing items on the AH way above current market value. That's not to say it will stop that from happening entirely (obviously it hasn't), but it has certainly discouraged it.

Think about it...you have something to sell that usually goes for 500k. Are you going to risk the additional tax to try and list it for 800k "just for the **** of it", only to find the item back in your delivery box 3 days later unsold?

What DOES happen, however, is for sellers to notice an upward trend in the price of something, and follow it. Using my Trailer's Kukri as an example again, I read some information in the RNG forum that made me question it's usefulness. I pondered selling it on AH and noticed that the price was rising on a fairly consistant basis. It reached a peak for 400k, but there were still some lower prices in the sales history. If I had listed it on AH, I would have listed it for ~500k gil.

I wouldn't consider that price gouging. Obviously the market value for the item hasn't been set yet, and I'm being a savvy merchant by using that in my favor to maximize the rewards from the BCNM 60 that I got the Kukri from in the first place. If nobody was willing to pay that much for it, or if too many others got the Kukri and listed it for less than me, it wouldn't sell. Plain and simple.

Do you guys remember Stanislav? He used to brag about being the wealthiest NA player on the server. And he also used to pick a job and level it to 75 in a couple of weeks. Do you think in the process of doing that he would wait around for 3 weeks hoping that the price of a piece of gear he needed would come down? Of course not...he'd just buy it, use it, and re-sell it once he had replaced it with the next upgrade a few levels later. There are other players on our server (quite a number of them) that are able to do something similar.

If you really wanted to find out what is going on, again, you should talk to the buyer and seller whose names are listed in a given transaction that causes the price to jump. Not that they are necessarily going to want to talk to you about it, or even be honest about it, but it would be far more effective than the speculation that is running rampant as to what is causing the recent inflation.

Here's a thought to ponder. It's not intended to be inflammatory, but a useful thought to ponder nonetheless.

How long has CoP been out? And who joined us when it was released? That's right...the Europeans. I'm not sure how things work in Japan, but I have a pretty good understanding about how they work here in North America, and I can tell you from talking with a number of Europeans that our impression of reasonable compensation for our efforts and their impression of it are two entirely seperate dynamics. Many Europeans expect much more for their efforts than NA are willing to settle for, which would account for the spike in the cost of crystals.

Not only that, but there are a lot more english speaking/reading Europeans taking advantage of the vast amount of information already circulating about this game and how to be successful. I see a lot of them taking up crafting at low levels, which was the LAST thing most NA players had on their minds when they first started. Now supply and demand is starting to enter the equation. On one hand, you have a group of people expecting more for their efforts (ie farming crystals) and the demand for crystals has increased rather dramatically.

Who are the #1 providers of fire crystals at the starting city AHs? That's right...low level players. It's certainly not the higher level players. I can't farm up a fire crystal to save my life. Even Fire Clusters are extremely elusive. But the people leveling from 5-8 in S. Gustaberg know by now that Vultures are pretty good money. A great many of these people (perhaps even the majority) are European, just starting the game, or coming back and leveling sub-jobs/advanced jobs after progressing over the last couple of months.

Any time the base price in manufacturing goes up, it starts an inflation spiral of sorts. Every single person involved in the creation of a particular item is going to tack on a little extra to their selling price to compensate for the increase in the price of raw materials. If it takes a person to harvest the raw materials and crystals, another person to buy those raw materials and crystals and synth them into basic items, followed buy another person to buy those basic items and more crystals to synth them into intermediate level items and finally one last person to buy those intermediate level items and synth them into hi-end, sought after items, the process has passed through 3 levels of production after harvesting, and each person is tacking on their little bit more to compensate for the increase at the base level. By the time it reaches the end user, it can be a very noticeable increase.

I'm not offering this as the end-all and be-all cause of the inflation we are seeing on our servers. I offer it only as another point to ponder, because there are a lot of things I have touched on here that haven't entered the discussion in the past. That's not to say I'm right, but if we haven't taken it into consideration, how can we offer any pat answers as to what is causing the problem?
#20 Jan 16 2005 at 10:57 AM Rating: Decent
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I personally haven't had too much of any issue with this, simply because the items that I sell, also went up in price. But I can see a silver lining to all of this. While many AH prices have risen, players that sell to NPCs are the real losers here, so fish botting is not as profitable as it used to be. Unfortunately though, true fishermen are hurt by this too.
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#21 Jan 16 2005 at 10:59 PM Rating: Default
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How does .2% tax justify jumping the price 1.5 million? People are going to charge what they want. "OMG! I have to pay 20K to put to put this up! I'm being raped! I'll jacked the price up 500K!" Sorry, that makes no sense. There are many other market forces you're not considering. The CoP release, the Europeans joining, and the NAs continuing to evolve.

I went to Jeuno not long ago. Fire Crystals were 3500 so I bought a bunch of stacks. Why!?! Because they were 4K in Bastok! If you don't want to believe go on. You can go on ******** and moaning about a patch that seems to be the bane of so many ******** and moaners.

Wind Crystals have hovered around 1500-2000 for almost 6-7 months. WTF does that have to do with the Patch?

Explain why beetle jaws jumped 8K in Windurst, because of the measely gil tax you pay there. Don't try to say it's the tax in Jueno because a 150-200 gil tax is not going to do that. Ever think to take a look at how cheap online gil has become? Ever consider the fact that a much larger bulk of the NA community has reached the stage where they actually have gil to spend?

Quote:
Congratulations on your unconventional farming techniques. *golf clap*

Those Beetle Jaws you sell more than doubled in price so I think we can safely say that you're going to benefit more from the update than most people. Hence, my point.


Are you a dumb ***? I rather punch myself in the balls than farm for beetle jaws. I rarely kill things to make gil.

Quote:
What are you talking about? It jumped from 4 million to 4.5 million AFTER the patch and it was 3-4 million before the patch. I thought the Hauberk +1 was the item that jumped from 4.5-6 million (6 million being the last one sold). It's still all there on the AH price history both before and after the update. I don't recall seeing the Juggernaut selling for 6 million. Just check the prices before the update and after the update. Those numbers will show that the price has indeed risen since the patch which is the entire point.


<sarcasm>OMFG! No way! I have NEVER seen an item jump 500K before the patch! I HAVE NEVER SEEN AN ITEM INCREASE IN VALUE BEFORE THIS GODFORSAKEN PATCH!<sarcasm>

Quote:
Are you going to use that saying that the Sniper's had a going rate of 650k now to try to prove that the price has significantly dropped since the update? lol. 650k was never a sustained price and it didn't last more than a few days.


Fact is it was there on an item selling every single day which is a far bigger deal than something that only sell 2-3 times a week. Many times you won't see the items you're talking about on the AH at all. It was at 650K and could have gone higher easily. Take a look at other servers where the economies went to **** and snipers were selling for 1 million consistantly. Prices fluctuate. They aren't going to stay where their at forever. They will rise and fall.

Quote:
Um, no, my arguement is not shot because I have the price history of the Hauberk to prove what I've said. And just because you got bent on the price of your Hauberk doesn't mean everyone paid that. As I told you last night, there will be some cases where the price will spike but that by no means the normal price. You bought it on a price spike. If a THF pulls hate off the tank briefly after using SA, then that doesn't mean he has hate? Nope, it emeans the THF created a hate spike. The tank still has hate and he simply created a hate spike. The same principle applies here.


I didn't buy a Hauberk. Congratulations! You're argument is shot. And no the item I bought (if you can try to remember) was consistently selling at that rate at the time.

Quote:
There was no "panic" before the update, lol. People listed their big ticket items the day before the update so they didn't have to pay through the nose on the new taxes. One the day of the update, there were 12, yes, TWELVE Hauberks for auction and many did not sell. People were trying to get one last shot at getting more than the going rate on this item and it backfired because some people listed their Hauberks for barely over 1 million.


WRONG! They were listing the entire week BEFORE the patch on many high priced items. And what you descibed is panic. Another example "Hello 300-350 Sniper Rings." Haubergeon went from 1.4 Mill to 1.1 Mill. Right now Haubergeon is consistently at 1.2-1.25 mill.

Quote:
You're saying "trust me" on this and that when I KNOW you're wrong. Saying that is like telling me Barry Bonds decides to hit a homerun with me nugget and a 36" Louisville, it won't hurt. That's how I see what your saying because I know what I've seen in the past and I know what I see now. I know the prices of these items I'm mentioning because I've had my eye on them since June, yet you're trying to tell me I'm wrong, lol. The Hauberk was a steady 1-1.2 million (1.2 million was the most common price) before the update. It actually dropped to 1.1 million on the day of the update and I paid 1.17mill for mine two days after the update. It's at 1.3-1.4 million now and it is steadily rising in price. It might drop back down to 1.2 million, but instead of 1-1.2 million, this item will now sell for 1.1x million to 1.4 million. That's an increase whether you see it that way or not. If the economy every decides to settle down, it will likely drop to a steady 1.25-1.3 million but you know what? That's still an increase above what it was before the patch.


I don't care what you SAY you saw. There I used your own little stategy against you.

Oh no! Your little obsession has gone up in price! I remember seeing Hauberk go from 1.2-1.3 and dance a little above that. It was 1.38 last I checked from 1.4 mill. That's a 20K drop. NOW! Hello scarcity it jumps to 1.5 mil. Not because ppl are selling in Windurst. Not because of 10-20K tax. Because it was the only one in stock.

Let's take a look at Haubergeon...........hmmmmm it appears to be selling for 1.2 to 1.250 mil. That's lower than anything I've seen since the patch start when everyone was trying to dump their stuff. There are currently 4 in stock.

So why is Hauberk going up but Haubergeon is going down?

<sarcasm>It must be the tax!<sarcasm>

What it actually is you have a bunch of people selling their Haubergeons and buying Hauberk. When someone buys a Hauberk, it's very likely that's the best armore they're ever goign to have unless they get EXTREMELY lucky. They aren't going to sell it.

Hello Haubergeon price drop.

Hello, Hauberk increase.

When I reached lvl 54 I watch within week RK breeches go from 50K to 90K(hit 100K for a bit) and stay in that range for a month. I waited and eventually it cme down to 75K. This kind of thing happens all the time

Quote:
Indeed. You look for any way to contradict anything I say to try to prove your right even when you're wrong. That much is painfully obvious. I have the price history of the items I've mentioned. What have you got?

Sorry, but "trust me" doesn't cut it with me especially after this last paragraph. This last paragraph of yours states that you will go out of your way to prove that you're right no matter how you have to go about it. And I came to this conclusion last night when I talked to you in /tells. You'd look for any reason to prove that you are right no matter how minute and silly those reasons are... It's quite amuzing actually.


I have the price histories I mentioned above. WTF do you have? The fact that a Hauberk +1 which is extremely rare jumped in price? Please explain to me how a 20 gil tax results in 1K jump in the cost on an item. Are you aware it's cheaper to list Fire Crystals in Jueno NOW than it did before the patch?

Edited, Mon Jan 17 09:44:18 2005 by DieselEdge
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#22 Jan 16 2005 at 11:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Let's not forget that a lot of the people buying the hi-end (max-end) gear are higher level players leveling another job.

I was wandering around Jeuno all proud of the Trailer's Kukri I had dangling from my hip only to pass by someone at the Guidestone in Lower Jeuno with 2 of them. While that's not the 6 million it would cost for a pair of Hawkers +1, it's still 800k worth of gear.

Imagine where you would be in terms of levels and gil resources 2 years from now. Heck, even 1 year from now. There are people who play the game on our server who are more than capable of fully decking out a lvl 60-75 job with all of the best items available at DOUBLE the current AH prices and not really notice the gil.

The only way to really understand what is going on with the prices is to talk to the buyer and seller and find out what happened.

The AH tax was implemented for 2 reasons. It's a more balanced way to draw gil out of the economy (making up for the gil that is brought into the economy via sales of items to NPC, etc). Not only that, it's a very effective way to discourage people from listing items on the AH way above current market value. That's not to say it will stop that from happening entirely (obviously it hasn't), but it has certainly discouraged it.

Think about it...you have something to sell that usually goes for 500k. Are you going to risk the additional tax to try and list it for 800k "just for the **** of it", only to find the item back in your delivery box 3 days later unsold?

What DOES happen, however, is for sellers to notice an upward trend in the price of something, and follow it. Using my Trailer's Kukri as an example again, I read some information in the RNG forum that made me question it's usefulness. I pondered selling it on AH and noticed that the price was rising on a fairly consistant basis. It reached a peak for 400k, but there were still some lower prices in the sales history. If I had listed it on AH, I would have listed it for ~500k gil.

I wouldn't consider that price gouging. Obviously the market value for the item hasn't been set yet, and I'm being a savvy merchant by using that in my favor to maximize the rewards from the BCNM 60 that I got the Kukri from in the first place. If nobody was willing to pay that much for it, or if too many others got the Kukri and listed it for less than me, it wouldn't sell. Plain and simple.

Do you guys remember Stanislav? He used to brag about being the wealthiest NA player on the server. And he also used to pick a job and level it to 75 in a couple of weeks. Do you think in the process of doing that he would wait around for 3 weeks hoping that the price of a piece of gear he needed would come down? Of course not...he'd just buy it, use it, and re-sell it once he had replaced it with the next upgrade a few levels later. There are other players on our server (quite a number of them) that are able to do something similar.

If you really wanted to find out what is going on, again, you should talk to the buyer and seller whose names are listed in a given transaction that causes the price to jump. Not that they are necessarily going to want to talk to you about it, or even be honest about it, but it would be far more effective than the speculation that is running rampant as to what is causing the recent inflation.

Here's a thought to ponder. It's not intended to be inflammatory, but a useful thought to ponder nonetheless.

How long has CoP been out? And who joined us when it was released? That's right...the Europeans. I'm not sure how things work in Japan, but I have a pretty good understanding about how they work here in North America, and I can tell you from talking with a number of Europeans that our impression of reasonable compensation for our efforts and their impression of it are two entirely seperate dynamics. Many Europeans expect much more for their efforts than NA are willing to settle for, which would account for the spike in the cost of crystals.

Not only that, but there are a lot more english speaking/reading Europeans taking advantage of the vast amount of information already circulating about this game and how to be successful. I see a lot of them taking up crafting at low levels, which was the LAST thing most NA players had on their minds when they first started. Now supply and demand is starting to enter the equation. On one hand, you have a group of people expecting more for their efforts (ie farming crystals) and the demand for crystals has increased rather dramatically.

Who are the #1 providers of fire crystals at the starting city AHs? That's right...low level players. It's certainly not the higher level players. I can't farm up a fire crystal to save my life. Even Fire Clusters are extremely elusive. But the people leveling from 5-8 in S. Gustaberg know by now that Vultures are pretty good money. A great many of these people (perhaps even the majority) are European, just starting the game, or coming back and leveling sub-jobs/advanced jobs after progressing over the last couple of months.

Any time the base price in manufacturing goes up, it starts an inflation spiral of sorts. Every single person involved in the creation of a particular item is going to tack on a little extra to their selling price to compensate for the increase in the price of raw materials. If it takes a person to harvest the raw materials and crystals, another person to buy those raw materials and crystals and synth them into basic items, followed buy another person to buy those basic items and more crystals to synth them into intermediate level items and finally one last person to buy those intermediate level items and synth them into hi-end, sought after items, the process has passed through 3 levels of production after harvesting, and each person is tacking on their little bit more to compensate for the increase at the base level. By the time it reaches the end user, it can be a very noticeable increase.

I'm not offering this as the end-all and be-all cause of the inflation we are seeing on our servers. I offer it only as another point to ponder, because there are a lot of things I have touched on here that haven't entered the discussion in the past. That's not to say I'm right, but if we haven't taken it into consideration, how can we offer any pat answers as to what is causing the problem?


****, Aurelius.........

/em bows before Aurelius

Excellent job.
____________________________
Fatale: Mithra Siren/Windurst/Rank7-1
MerlinsMagic/Sky Pass/CoP3-3
70 Ranger/Ninja Retired
38 Whm/Blm Retired
62 Warrior, Ninja, Thief, Monk Retired
79+1 Alchemy/60 Woodworking/29 Smithing/51 Goldsmithing/21 Bonecraft/16 Cooking
#23 Jan 17 2005 at 8:03 PM Rating: Decent
***
1,395 posts
First off, I find your post here incredibly amuzing. Why? Because the night you posted your first post you sent me a /tell in the game saying "I hope my post doesn't offend you" and talking about how you make smartassed comments. I told you I didn't take offense to it and that I'm the sameway when it comes to being a smartass. Well it looks like you can dish it out, but you can't take it and THAT, my friends, is why this is so amuzing, lol. You're nothing more than a 12 year old insult slinging twit that resorts to flaming others when the debate doesn't go your way. But I will grace you with one last reply. After this, you can go play in traffic. Chump.

Quote:
How does .2% tax justify jumping the price 1.5 million? People are going to charge what they want. "OMG! I have to pay 20K to put to put this up! I'm being raped! I'll jacked the price up 500K!" Sorry, that makes no sense. There are many other market forces you're not considering. The CoP release, the Europeans joining, and the NAs continuing to evolve.


Either you didn't read my both my posts or your just plain stupid. My gil is on the latter. I've already answered this in my first post. Read, comprehend, post and in that order please. If that doesn't work, then too bad because I'm can't make what I'm saying any more simple than that. And the tax is 1% + 400g on stacked items, 2% +100g on single items in Jeuno.

Quote:
I went to Jeuno not long ago. Fire Crystals were 3500 so I bought a bunch of stacks. Why!?! Because they were 4K in Bastok! If you don't want to believe go on. You can go on ******** and moaning about a patch that seems to be the bane of so many ******** and moaners.


******** and moaning? Wow, you're a thick one, no? I never once ******* or moaned about anything. I gave MY OPINION on why I think the prices have gone up. Sure there are other reasons and I've never denied that, but I think this update is the main reason for prices jumping. Are there other factors involved? Yes. Did I ever say there weren't? No. Do try to pay attention once in a while.

I'm not gunna mention the Fire Crystals because as you said, "For any antedotal evidense I can find a way to contradict it." (yes, that's a copy and paste). So no matter what, you're going to do whatever it takes to "prove" that you are right.

Quote:
Wind Crystals have hovered around 1500-2000 for almost 6-7 months. WTF does that have to do with the Patch?


Um, no. They haven't been 1500-2000 for 6-7 months. They have risen since the patch. Period. And they were 2600g last night, 2300g-2500g the two nights before. I'm not saying that's the going rate, but that's well above your 1500-2000g comment and it's a bit above mine from my previous post, too.

Quote:
Explain why beetle jaws jumped 8K in Windurst, because of the measely gil tax you pay there. Don't try to say it's the tax in Jueno because a 150-200 gil tax is not going to do that. Ever think to take a look at how cheap online gil has become? Ever consider the fact that a much larger bulk of the NA community has reached the stage where they actually have gil to spend?


It costs 400g to list a stack of ANYTHING in Jeuno plus an additional 1% of what you're listing the stack of items for.. So if a stack of Beetle Jaws go for 12k a stack costs 520g to list. Get your facts straight before speaking, m'k?

You're basing your entire arguement on assumptions. I never said the update was the sole reason for these increases, yet you're ranting like I did. I even said it was a number of things. I also said that people will list their items above what the AH taxes are and that will be what starts it all. 520g to list a stack of Beetle Jaws in Jeuno and people took advantage of the confusion on the new taxes. Seller A might list the jaws for 520g to recoup their loses due to the new taxes, and Seller B might list them for 1000g over what they used to cost due to the confusion of the new taxes. This continues for a couple of weeks and the items have a significant jump in price. Is the full 8k jump on these items due to the update alone? No, I never said it was and quit putting words in my mouth. But the update does have something to do with the increase, but how much of a factor the update was will never be known. Got it now? Or am I going to have to spell it out even more?

Quote:
Are you a dumb ***? I rather punch myself in the balls than farm for beetle jaws. I rarely kill things to make gil.


Same here. Your balls, not mine.

Quote:
<sarcasm>OMFG! No way! I have NEVER seen an item jump 500K before the patch! I HAVE NEVER SEEN AN ITEM INCREASE IN VALUE BEFORE THIS GODFORSAKEN PATCH!<sarcasm>


Avoid the subject all you want, the increase has steadily risen after the patch when it was pretty **** stable before the patch. Check the price history and prove yourself wrong.

Quote:
Fact is it was there on an item selling every single day which is a far bigger deal than something that only sell 2-3 times a week. Many times you won't see the items you're talking about on the AH at all. It was at 650K and could have gone higher easily. Take a look at other servers where the economies went to **** and snipers were selling for 1 million consistantly. Prices fluctuate. They aren't going to stay where their at forever. They will rise and fall.


And since when has the Hauberk been an items that sells only 2-3 times a week? Um, never. Try 2-4 times a day. And other servers don't matter. We're not "other servers."

Quote:
I didn't buy a Hauberk. Congratulations! You're argument is shot. And no the item I bought (if you can try to remember) was consistently selling at that rate at the time.


My argument is not shot just because you didn't buy the Hauberk. The Hauberk has still went up in price (and is still going up) whether you bought it or not. There's no denying this. I've given items to where anyone can go search the price history that gives specific dates to prove that what I say has happened. All we get from you is your word which is not good enough. And I believe the Haubergeon was up to 1.2-1.3 mill now. I checked it the other day but didn't pay much attention to it. I'll check it again tonight. Regardless, you saying that it dropped to 1.1 million means nothing to me because your word means squat in my eyes after your "I can find a way to contradict it" statement. I've given items to where ANYONE can chack for themselves and you're giving us your "trust me" statement. Trust you? Yeah, get bent.


Quote:
WRONG! They were listing the entire week BEFORE the patch on many high priced items. And what you descibed is panic. Another example "Hello 300-350 Sniper Rings." Haubergeon went from 1.4 Mill to 1.1 Mill. Right now Haubergeon is consistently at 1.2-1.25 mill.


No the Sniper's Rings did not, lol. They were 400k pre-patch and they're what? 450-500k now? And why the **** would someone list their items for cheaper BEFORE the update? That makes absolutely zero sense. Anyone with half a brain knew to list their items for more than the going rate BEFORE the update because they wouldn't have to pay the huge taxes. Listing them for cheaper while the taxes are basically nil is asinine. What I described is not "panic" lol. Do you even know what "panic" is in the business world? I'm not talking about giving your lunch money to the middle school bully either.

Quote:
I don't care what you SAY you saw. There I used your own little stategy against you.


The difference is, mine is warranted. Yours is not. I've offered proof to where ANYONE can go and check the price history. You've offered "Trust me." Again, get bent.

Quote:
Oh no! Your little obsession has gone up in price! I remember seeing Hauberk go from 1.2-1.3 and dance a little above that. It was 1.38 last I checked from 1.4 mill. That's a 20K drop. NOW! Hello scarcity it jumps to 1.5 mil. Not because ppl are selling in Windurst. Not because of 10-20K tax. Because it was the only one in stock.


My little obsession? WTH are you talking about? What I've offered has steadily climbed in price. If you can't see that then I suggest you take a trip to your local optometrist... or proctologist to have him remove your head from your backside.

Quote:
Let's take a look at Haubergeon...........hmmmmm it appears to be selling for 1.2 to 1.250 mil. That's lower than anything I've seen since the patch start when everyone was trying to dump their stuff. There are currently 4 in stock.

So why is Hauberk going up but Haubergeon is going down?

<sarcasm>It must be the tax!<sarcasm>


You say the Haubergeon is going down, but I don't believe you. You will, after all, "find a way to contradict it" if I say said anything against that your claim that the Haubergeon has went up. I don't care either way. The new taxes hurt the game more than it helps and that's the entire point of what I'm saying. The items cost more to list, which drives up the price, which causes the buyer to have to pay more while the seller gets less. The rich will stay rich and the rest will continue to stay where they are unless they want to farm for weeks on end.

Quote:
What it actually is you have a bunch of people selling their Haubergeons and buying Hauberk. When someone buys a Hauberk, it's very likely that's the best armore they're ever goign to have unless they get EXTREMELY lucky. They aren't going to sell it.

Hello Haubergeon price drop.

Hello, Hauberk increase.


Whatever you think. You've got your mind made up that you know WTF you're talking about. Fact is, the price of the Hauberk didn't starting rising steadily until after the update. Coincidence? I think not when there are many other items doing the samething.

[quote]
When I reached lvl 54 I watch within week RK breeches go from 50K to 90K(hit 100K for a bit) and stay in that range for a month. I waited and eventually it cme down to 75K. This kind of thing happens all the time[/quote]

I know this kind of thing happens all the time. You're not telling me anything I don't already know. I have taken all this into consideration, but what is happening now is not the samething.

[quote]I have the price histories I mentioned above. WTF do you have? The fact that a Hauberk +1 which is extremely rare jumped in price? Please explain to me how a 20 gil tax results in 1K jump in the cost on an item. Are you aware it's cheaper to list Fire Crystals in Jueno NOW than it did before the patch?[/quote]


I've explained it all before. If you want to see it, go read my other posts. I'm not going to explain it to your worthless hide again because you're not worth the effort. If you could actually sit down and have a rational debate about something instead of calling people dumbasses then perhaps I'd have some sympathy for your uneducated ***. But slinging insults only serves to **** people off and I don't have the time for it. If you want to flame and called people dumbasses, fine, by my guest. But I'm not going to waste anymore time on the likes of you. I've proved my point and anyone that wants to check the items out for themselves can do so and all you offer us is your word. Those two infamous words are coming back to mind again... oh, what were they? Oh yeah! "Get" and "Bent."

EDIT: Meh, tried to fix the quotes twice and it's not working and I'm done trying to fix it. It comes out fine on "preview" but it screws up when I post.

Edited, Mon Jan 17 20:12:06 2005 by Climhazard
____________________________
WoW: Climhazzard - Koral. Server - Night Elf - Lv70 BM Hunter

WoW: Shinerbock - Tich. Server - Orc - Lv80 SV Hunter

FFXI: Climhazzard - Hume - Siren - 146 levels of retired BST
#24 Jan 17 2005 at 10:41 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
***
1,494 posts
First off, I find your post here incredibly amuzing. Why? Because the night you posted your first post you sent me a /tell in the game saying "I hope my post doesn't offend you" and talking about how you make smartassed comments. I told you I didn't take offense to it and that I'm the sameway when it comes to being a smartass. Well it looks like you can dish it out, but you can't take it and THAT, my friends, is why this is so amuzing, lol. You're nothing more than a 12 year old insult slinging twit that resorts to flaming others when the debate doesn't go your way. But I will grace you with one last reply. After this, you can go play in traffic. Chump.

Anyway.....our tell convo was before you decided to act like a complete condescending ******* so please spare your claim to morale superiority.

And in case you haven't noticed. Gil Buyers are greatly responsible for the existence of gil sellers. That why I brought it up. Gil buyers, gil sellers, same problem.




Quote:
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How does .2% tax justify jumping the price 1.5 million? People are going to charge what they want. "OMG! I have to pay 20K to put to put this up! I'm being raped! I'll jacked the price up 500K!" Sorry, that makes no sense. There are many other market forces you're not considering. The CoP release, the Europeans joining, and the NAs continuing to evolve.
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Either you didn't read my both my posts or your just plain stupid. My gil is on the latter. I've already answered this in my first post. Read, comprehend, post and in that order please. If that doesn't work, then too bad because I'm can't make what I'm saying any more simple than that. And the tax is 1% + 400g on stacked items, 2% +100g on single items in Jeuno.

I read your post. All it was is the same old complaint about gil sellers, etc. and some search in vain for a thought that links it to the patch. Fact is gil sellers have always systematically tried to jack up the prices on items. This is nothing new.

Welcome to yesterday. It cost more pre-patch for low end items. It cost 500 gil to put them up before the patch in Jueno and 440 AFTER the price increase(not much of one). Your argument is shot. So a lower tax in Jueno is causeing a price increase?



Quote:
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I went to Jeuno not long ago. Fire Crystals were 3500 so I bought a bunch of stacks. Why!?! Because they were 4K in Bastok! If you don't want to believe go on. You can go on ******** and moaning about a patch that seems to be the bane of so many ******** and moaners.
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******** and moaning? Wow, you're a thick one, no? I never once ******* or moaned about anything. I gave MY OPINION on why I think the prices have gone up. Sure there are other reasons and I've never denied that, but I think this update is the main reason for prices jumping. Are there other factors involved? Yes. Did I ever say there weren't? No. Do try to pay attention once in a while.

I'm not gunna mention the Fire Crystals because as you said, "For any antedotal evidense I can find a way to contradict it." (yes, that's a copy and paste). So no matter what, you're going to do whatever it takes to "prove" that you are right.

If the tax was the cause of all the price jacking it would be completely widespread. That's the point. It has nothing to do with the recent increase in items. And yes you are ******** and moaning. It's not like this is the first time I've seen you outright ***** about how much you hate the patch.


Quote:
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Wind Crystals have hovered around 1500-2000 for almost 6-7 months. WTF does that have to do with the Patch?
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Um, no. They haven't been 1500-2000 for 6-7 months. They have risen since the patch. Period. And they were 2600g last night, 2300g-2500g the two nights before. I'm not saying that's the going rate, but that's well above your 1500-2000g comment and it's a bit above mine from my previous post, too.

Um yes they ******* have. I haven't been living in a bubble having done Woodworking since June. Have a glass of stfu. I just bought a stack of wind crystals at 1.9K. I buy crystal regularly or least check for any bargains on crystal and I've never seen them go beyond 2100. Must be that **** tax.

Clim=Liar



Quote:
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Explain why beetle jaws jumped 8K in Windurst, because of the measely gil tax you pay there. Don't try to say it's the tax in Jueno because a 150-200 gil tax is not going to do that. Ever think to take a look at how cheap online gil has become? Ever consider the fact that a much larger bulk of the NA community has reached the stage where they actually have gil to spend?
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It costs 400g to list a stack of ANYTHING in Jeuno plus an additional 1% of what you're listing the stack of items for.. So if a stack of Beetle Jaws go for 12k a stack costs 520g to list. Get your facts straight before speaking, m'k?

They were listing at 6-7K a stack(600 for single)sometime before the patch. Netherless what's your point? Before the price increase it would have cost less to put them up in Jueno than pre-patch(460 in Jueno, less than pre-patch), and the tax on low end items in starting cites is barely noticable. Get it? Again even if they were 8-9K the tax would not cause a jump or aid it. READ and COMPREHEND! Why would a drop in the tax cause it to jump 5-6K in cost?

Question: Have you ever sold stacks in Jueno pre-patch?


You're basing your entire arguement on assumptions. I never said the update was the sole reason for these increases, yet you're ranting like I did. I even said it was a number of things. I also said that people will list their items above what the AH taxes are and that will be what starts it all. 520g to list a stack of Beetle Jaws in Jeuno and people took advantage of the confusion on the new taxes. Seller A might list the jaws for 520g to recoup their loses due to the new taxes, and Seller B might list them for 1000g over what they used to cost due to the confusion of the new taxes. This continues for a couple of weeks and the items have a significant jump in price. Is the full 8k jump on these items due to the update alone? No, I never said it was and quit putting words in my mouth. But the update does have something to do with the increase, but how much of a factor the update was will never be known. Got it now? Or am I going to have to spell it out even more?

No, because your reasoning does not work in reality. You're searching in vain for an explaination for these price fluctuations and they fact is there are far too many factors to consider. The tax in no way causes these kind of increases on their own.


Quote:
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Are you a dumb ***? I rather punch myself in the balls than farm for beetle jaws. I rarely kill things to make gil.
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Same here. Your balls, not mine.

What's wrong your little come back there fall flat on it's face? Yeah thought so. STFU


Quote:
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<sarcasm>OMFG! No way! I have NEVER seen an item jump 500K before the patch! I HAVE NEVER SEEN AN ITEM INCREASE IN VALUE BEFORE THIS GODFORSAKEN PATCH!<sarcasm>
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Avoid the subject all you want, the increase has steadily risen after the patch when it was pretty **** stable before the patch. Check the price history and prove yourself wrong.

Market economies don't stay stable forever. Get over it.


Quote:
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Fact is it was there on an item selling every single day which is a far bigger deal than something that only sell 2-3 times a week. Many times you won't see the items you're talking about on the AH at all. It was at 650K and could have gone higher easily. Take a look at other servers where the economies went to **** and snipers were selling for 1 million consistantly. Prices fluctuate. They aren't going to stay where their at forever. They will rise and fall.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



And since when has the Hauberk been an items that sells only 2-3 times a week? Um, never. Try 2-4 times a day. And other servers don't matter. We're not "other servers."

I was referring to things like Juggernaut. I think that would be quite obvious. I'm sorry if you're so centered arounf the price of one item in your thought process.


Quote:
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I didn't buy a Hauberk. Congratulations! You're argument is shot. And no the item I bought (if you can try to remember) was consistently selling at that rate at the time.
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My argument is not shot just because you didn't buy the Hauberk. The Hauberk has still went up in price (and is still going up) whether you bought it or not. There's no denying this. I've given items to where anyone can go search the price history that gives specific dates to prove that what I say has happened. All we get from you is your word which is not good enough. And I believe the Haubergeon was up to 1.2-1.3 mill now. I checked it the other day but didn't pay much attention to it. I'll check it again tonight. Regardless, you saying that it dropped to 1.1 million means nothing to me because your word means squat in my eyes after your "I can find a way to contradict it" statement. I've given items to where ANYONE can chack for themselves and you're giving us your "trust me" statement. Trust you? Yeah, get bent.

I watched the Haubergeon the entire 2 months I was saving for it and it was always in the 1.35-1.4 range. Please go back to your fairy tale land where it never went above 1.2 Mill.

Aren't you one bitter little rat.....



Quote:
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WRONG! They were listing the entire week BEFORE the patch on many high priced items. And what you descibed is panic. Another example "Hello 300-350 Sniper Rings." Haubergeon went from 1.4 Mill to 1.1 Mill. Right now Haubergeon is consistently at 1.2-1.25 mill.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



No the Sniper's Rings did not, lol. They were 400k pre-patch and they're what? 450-500k now? And why the **** would someone list their items for cheaper BEFORE the update? That makes absolutely zero sense. Anyone with half a brain knew to list their items for more than the going rate BEFORE the update because they wouldn't have to pay the huge taxes. Listing them for cheaper while the taxes are basically nil is asinine. What I described is not "panic" lol. Do you even know what "panic" is in the business world? I'm not talking about giving your lunch money to the middle school bully either.

You are either lying out your *** or are completely ignorant of what was going on lol They dropped to 300-350K the week before the patch because everyone and their mother was trying to get rid of them. Why because they were all assuming some acc ring was going to come and de-value the ring. It wasn't because of the ******* tax. You say it's asinine, but it happened. Sorry if that doesn't happen to fit into your pre-conceived notions of what should happen before the patch.

Quote:
I don't care what you SAY you saw. There I used your own little stategy against you.


The difference is, mine is warranted. Yours is not. I've offered proof to where ANYONE can go and check the price history. You've offered "Trust me." Again, get bent.

What proof? You have none zero nada. The prices are up on Hauberk and that relates to the patch because........right you have no proof other than the jump happened sometime after the patch.

Quote:
Oh no! Your little obsession has gone up in price! I remember seeing Hauberk go from 1.2-1.3 and dance a little above that. It was 1.38 last I checked from 1.4 mill. That's a 20K drop. NOW! Hello scarcity it jumps to 1.5 mil. Not because ppl are selling in Windurst. Not because of 10-20K tax. Because it was the only one in stock.


My little obsession? WTH are you talking about? What I've offered has steadily climbed in price. If you can't see that then I suggest you take a trip to your local optometrist... or proctologist to have him remove your head from your backside.

What I see is a stable selling history on the hauberk. It could drop, it could rise but it's not steadily rising.

More cute little little insults. Whatever man the fact that you're still complaining about this patch says enough.


Quote:
Let's take a look at Haubergeon...........hmmmmm it appears to be selling for 1.2 to 1.250 mil. That's lower than anything I've seen since the patch start when everyone was trying to dump their stuff. There are currently 4 in stock.

So why is Hauberk going up but Haubergeon is going down?

<sarcasm>It must be the tax!<sarcasm>


You say the Haubergeon is going down, but I don't believe you. You will, after all, "find a way to contradict it" if I say said anything against that your claim that the Haubergeon has went up.

you know you can only use that quote so many times before you start looking like a little *****.

I don't care either way. The new taxes hurt the game more than it helps and that's the entire point of what I'm saying. The items cost more to list, which drives up the price, which causes the buyer to have to pay more while the seller gets less. The rich will stay rich and the rest will continue to stay where they are unless they want to farm for weeks on end.

Again proof. You're warped reasoning is not proof. A price history showing a rise in cost is not proof.

Quote:
What it actually is you have a bunch of people selling their Haubergeons and buying Hauberk. When someone buys a Hauberk, it's very likely that's the best armore they're ever goign to have unless they get EXTREMELY lucky. They aren't going to sell it.

Hello Haubergeon price drop.

Hello, Hauberk increase.


Whatever you think. You've got your mind made up that you know WTF you're talking about. Fact is, the price of the Hauberk didn't starting rising steadily until after the update. Coincidence? I think not when there are many other items doing the samething.

Items drop and rise together all the time. You just noticed this more because you have this fear the tax is going to destoy FFXI.

Quote:

When I reached lvl 54 I watch within week RK breeches go from 50K to 90K(hit 100K for a bit) and stay in that range for a month. I waited and eventually it cme down to 75K. This kind of thing happens all the time


I know this kind of thing happens all the time. You're not telling me anything I don't already know. I have taken all this into consideration, but what is happening now is not the samething.

Why?

Quote:
I have the price histories I mentioned above. WTF do you have? The fact that a Hauberk +1 which is extremely rare jumped in price? Please explain to me how a 20 gil tax results in 1K jump in the cost on an item. Are you aware it's cheaper to list Fire Crystals in Jueno NOW than it did before the patch?



I've explained it all before. If you want to see it, go read my other posts. I'm not going to explain it to your worthless hide again because you're not worth the effort. If you could actually sit down and have a rational debate about something instead of calling people dumbasses then perhaps I'd have some sympathy for your uneducated ***. But slinging insults only serves to **** people off and I don't have the time for it. If you want to flame and called people dumbasses, fine, by my guest. But I'm not going to waste anymore time on the likes of you. I've proved my point and anyone that wants to check the items out for themselves can do so and all you offer us is your word. Those two infamous words are coming back to mind again... oh, what were they? Oh yeah! "Get" and "Bent."

Blah blah blah yadda yadda. Skimmed through that since it was looking like some diatribe about how you're a much better person than me. I read your posts and I say you're full of it.

Not only are you bitter you're also lame.


Edited, Tue Jan 18 10:02:09 2005 by DieselEdge
____________________________
Fatale: Mithra Siren/Windurst/Rank7-1
MerlinsMagic/Sky Pass/CoP3-3
70 Ranger/Ninja Retired
38 Whm/Blm Retired
62 Warrior, Ninja, Thief, Monk Retired
79+1 Alchemy/60 Woodworking/29 Smithing/51 Goldsmithing/21 Bonecraft/16 Cooking
#25 Jan 18 2005 at 6:30 PM Rating: Decent
***
1,395 posts
Me condesending? Yup, but not until you started being the condescending *** first. I'm not one that starts things, but if you wanna be condesending asshat, then I'm going to be twice as bad. If you're a smartass, then I'm twice the smartass. ***** me over, I'm going to ***** you over twice as hard. Be nice to me, I'll be twice as nice to you. It's all part of making little snot-nosed brats like you STFU because you can dish it out but you can't take it and it works. I've dealt with your kind many times and there's no point in trying to have a rational debate about anything with you or people like you... You're 100% convinced your right and there's nothing anyone can say to change your narrow-mindedness. There can't possibly be more than one explanation as to why the prices on AH are rising can there? Keep your "I will find a way to contridict anything I say" attitude and see just how far you make it life. And good luck keeping your teeth when you pop off to someone in real life in a patronizing fashion.

Just to clear things up, I haven't complained once in this entire thread about the prices. I stated what I think is the main reason the prices rising. That's it. Nothing else. You're looking too deep for something that isn't there. It's not my fault you can't read past the 3rd grade level. Try Hooked-on-Phonics, it did wonders for my 7 year old niece and nephew.

As for the rest of your post, meh... you're rehashing your same tired old BS and exaggerations to make your point seem valid. I don't have time for Middle School semantics. I've got better things to do and I'm sure you do too.
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WoW: Climhazzard - Koral. Server - Night Elf - Lv70 BM Hunter

WoW: Shinerbock - Tich. Server - Orc - Lv80 SV Hunter

FFXI: Climhazzard - Hume - Siren - 146 levels of retired BST
#26 Jan 18 2005 at 9:02 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
1,494 posts
Quote:
Me condesending? Yup, but not until you started being the condescending *** first. I'm not one that starts things, but if you wanna be condesending asshat, then I'm going to be twice as bad. If you're a smartass, then I'm twice the smartass. ***** me over, I'm going to ***** you over twice as hard. Be nice to me, I'll be twice as nice to you. It's all part of making little snot-nosed brats like you STFU because you can dish it out but you can't take it and it works. I've dealt with your kind many times and there's no point in trying to have a rational debate about anything with you or people like you... You're 100% convinced your right and there's nothing anyone can say to change your narrow-mindedness. There can't possibly be more than one explanation as to why the prices on AH are rising can there? Keep your "I will find a way to contridict anything I say" attitude and see just how far you make it life. And good luck keeping your teeth when you pop off to someone in real life in a patronizing fashion.

Just to clear things up, I haven't complained once in this entire thread about the prices. I stated what I think is the main reason the prices rising. That's it. Nothing else. You're looking too deep for something that isn't there. It's not my fault you can't read past the 3rd grade level. Try Hooked-on-Phonics, it did wonders for my 7 year old niece and nephew.

As for the rest of your post, meh... you're rehashing your same tired old BS and exaggerations to make your point seem valid. I don't have time for Middle School semantics. I've got better things to do and I'm sure you do too.


You are taking this way too seriously, but you have a history of doing that. Someone rubs you the wrong way, and you write a book about how you're being screwed over.

I may have been confrontive in my tone, but that is all. You're the one who has completely gone off the deep end and has completely relied on ad hominem attacks. You also have a history of resorting to condescending posts like your posts here. The "You'd get your *** kicked in real life" comment is real cute. Such a ridiculous statement I just smiled at the screen. Thanks for the laugh. Whatever floats your boat. You have completely avoided the argument that I placed before you, resorting to outright lying and silly grand standing.

To tell you the truth, I will forget what exactly you said before I finished typing this. That's about as much as I care about what someone types about me, personally, over the internet. I'm the same way in real life. Very forgiving to a fault and not one to hold a grudge(not for an extended period of time :p). Believe it or not I still hold some respect for your exploits as a Bst and gil seller agitator.

Netherless the smartest person here is Aurelius.

Edited, Tue Jan 18 22:56:21 2005 by DieselEdge
____________________________
Fatale: Mithra Siren/Windurst/Rank7-1
MerlinsMagic/Sky Pass/CoP3-3
70 Ranger/Ninja Retired
38 Whm/Blm Retired
62 Warrior, Ninja, Thief, Monk Retired
79+1 Alchemy/60 Woodworking/29 Smithing/51 Goldsmithing/21 Bonecraft/16 Cooking
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