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Book prices and market manipulation...Follow

#1 Aug 11 2011 at 7:37 AM Rating: Good
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This is kind of interesting because of the parties involved and the intricacy of the plot.

Here's the story in a nutshell:

Earlier this decade, Amazon, trying to scoop up e-book sales (generally for the kindle) was able to offer e-books cheap - much cheaper than paper books.

Some of the big publishers apparently got nervous, as did Apple who's new gadget the ipad was about to hit the market with one of it's key features being a competitive e-reader.

So, Apple makes a deal with these publishers to buy their books at the publishers price and just skim a percentage of the top (versus the more typical business model where the seller will buy an allotted number of books at a specific price and sell them for whatever they can).

Apparently e-book prices skyrocketed. This was before I had an e-reader, but I do remember e-book prices being much lower a few years back.

The current lawsuit claims that Apple and 5 publishers manipulated the market. Did they?

Read MORE...
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#2 Aug 11 2011 at 8:06 AM Rating: Good
Over pricing E anything is a great idea. Pirates Bay doesn't get enough traffic.

From what you posted, I don't think Apple did anything wrong, however. Changing from 'buy wholesale and mark up' to 'sell consignment and take a cut' isn't really nefarious.
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#3 Aug 11 2011 at 10:13 AM Rating: Good
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Vestal Chamberlain Lubriderm wrote:

From what you posted, I don't think Apple did anything wrong, however. Changing from 'buy wholesale and mark up' to 'sell consignment and take a cut' isn't really nefarious.

They colluded with the publishers to fix the price of e-books. It actually sounds like there is a pretty good case against them.

Amazon is not part of the lawsuit (it's a class action suit filed by customers). However, they're also not taking this lying down. They've come up with an e-book browser app that will allow e-book reading on-line with some limited amount of content available for later off-line reading. This will totally bypass the Appstore.

It's kinda fun to see these e-giants battling.
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#4 Aug 11 2011 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
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Elinda wrote:
It's kinda fun to see these e-giants battling.


Which is usually best for the customers, since it generally means better prices and better products for customers.

On another note, though, I can't fathom why anyone would want an iPad as an E-reader. The Nook/Kindle are great because the screen is designed to cause as little stress to your eyes as possible--they frankly look more like book pages than screens.

The iPad, on the other hand, is going to hurt to stare at intently for long periods of time.

I get using it for an e-reader if you already have one. But buying it for an e-reader (which I have seen a lot of) just seems weird to me.
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#5 Aug 11 2011 at 6:38 PM Rating: Default
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Elinda wrote:
It's kinda fun to see these e-giants battling.


Which is usually best for the customers, since it generally means better prices and better products for customers.

On another note, though, I can't fathom why anyone would want an iPad as an E-reader. The Nook/Kindle are great because the screen is designed to cause as little stress to your eyes as possible--they frankly look more like book pages than screens.

The iPad, on the other hand, is going to hurt to stare at intently for long periods of time.

I get using it for an e-reader if you already have one. But buying it for an e-reader (which I have seen a lot of) just seems weird to me.

I've never had eye strain from reading on my iPad, nor has anyone else I know. You'd have to read for 4+ hours at a time without breaks to stress your eyes.

Saying "I can't fathom why anyone..." without having tested said product is pretty asinine.
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#6 Aug 11 2011 at 6:53 PM Rating: Default
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I use an ipod touch for e-books. Once you turn on sepia, it's easy enough on the eyes. I've gotten headaches from it, but only after 6+ hours of continued reading. It's certainly much easier on the eyes than a monitor.

I only wish there was some sort of decent composition app, so as one could do some writing on it beyond just notes.


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#7 Aug 12 2011 at 6:45 AM Rating: Good
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I have a Nook Color. The screen is the same glossy one that the ipad has (versus the e-ink of the Kindle or STNook). I don't have any problems with headaches, though I have stressed a neck muscle just from holding the thing for too long. I think my neck muscle is developed enough now though that it's no longer a bother. Smiley: clown

The back-lighting that comes with the glossy screen is pretty important for me.

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#8 Aug 13 2011 at 11:36 AM Rating: Decent
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I never liked nor trusted Apple, this tale really doesn't help at all.

www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/06/john-naughton-apple-dominates-market

I'm just saying....


(I have a kindle btw, definitely will never ever get an iphone, not at those prices anyway)
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#9 Aug 13 2011 at 1:35 PM Rating: Good
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Overlord Theophany wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Elinda wrote:
It's kinda fun to see these e-giants battling.


Which is usually best for the customers, since it generally means better prices and better products for customers.

On another note, though, I can't fathom why anyone would want an iPad as an E-reader. The Nook/Kindle are great because the screen is designed to cause as little stress to your eyes as possible--they frankly look more like book pages than screens.

The iPad, on the other hand, is going to hurt to stare at intently for long periods of time.

I get using it for an e-reader if you already have one. But buying it for an e-reader (which I have seen a lot of) just seems weird to me.

I've never had eye strain from reading on my iPad, nor has anyone else I know. You'd have to read for 4+ hours at a time without breaks to stress your eyes.

Saying "I can't fathom why anyone..." without having tested said product is pretty asinine.


Reading that long at a time isn't really THAT uncommon for me. But it's not like reading will be the only thing you do using a screen. If you only read and then go do something else, it's one thing.

Also, everyone I know who uses their iPad as an eReader can only go for about 45 minutes to an hour and a half before their eyes begin to strain. Maybe they are all just prone to eye stress (they do all wear glasses--dunno what the prescriptions are). But that's pretty much the data pool I am working with.

But the major problem? I have no clue how you are supposed to be able to use the ipad as an e-reader when outside/near windows. If you are the type that commutes and might be forced to read next to a window, an ink reader is going to be far more useful than an iPad. Granted, that's not due to eye strain, it's due to the nature of the screen.
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#10 Aug 14 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Decent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Overlord Theophany wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Elinda wrote:
It's kinda fun to see these e-giants battling.


Which is usually best for the customers, since it generally means better prices and better products for customers.

On another note, though, I can't fathom why anyone would want an iPad as an E-reader. The Nook/Kindle are great because the screen is designed to cause as little stress to your eyes as possible--they frankly look more like book pages than screens.

The iPad, on the other hand, is going to hurt to stare at intently for long periods of time.

I get using it for an e-reader if you already have one. But buying it for an e-reader (which I have seen a lot of) just seems weird to me.

I've never had eye strain from reading on my iPad, nor has anyone else I know. You'd have to read for 4+ hours at a time without breaks to stress your eyes.

Saying "I can't fathom why anyone..." without having tested said product is pretty asinine.


Reading that long at a time isn't really THAT uncommon for me. But it's not like reading will be the only thing you do using a screen. If you only read and then go do something else, it's one thing.

Also, everyone I know who uses their iPad as an eReader can only go for about 45 minutes to an hour and a half before their eyes begin to strain. Maybe they are all just prone to eye stress (they do all wear glasses--dunno what the prescriptions are). But that's pretty much the data pool I am working with.

But the major problem? I have no clue how you are supposed to be able to use the ipad as an e-reader when outside/near windows. If you are the type that commutes and might be forced to read next to a window, an ink reader is going to be far more useful than an iPad. Granted, that's not due to eye strain, it's due to the nature of the screen.

I read outside with my iPad all the time. I have to jack the brightness all the way up, but it's pretty doable, much as using an iPhone outside is completely doable.

That said, I won't push an iPad on anyone. Kindles/Nooks are way cheaper, and not everyone is interested in doing more than just reading with them.

Also yes, I would assume it's your data pool. No one I know has ever said they get eye strain from using an iPad.

If you're prone to eye strain from using a computer, it's likely that that'll happen on an iPad as well. If you use a computer for hours and are fine, you'll be fine on an iPad.

Edited, Aug 14th 2011 12:45pm by Theophany
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#11 Aug 15 2011 at 7:35 AM Rating: Good
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What's the battery life of an iPad? I can see having a reading app on it, and using it occasionally for that purpose, but I don't think I would be using it as my primary reading apparatus.
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#12 Aug 15 2011 at 4:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Monsieur Spoonless wrote:
What's the battery life of an iPad? I can see having a reading app on it, and using it occasionally for that purpose, but I don't think I would be using it as my primary reading apparatus.

Easily 10+ hours of reading. It'll keep a charge for a month or so when it's sleeping.

I've watched two full movies on a plane flight and come out of it with ~80% of my battery left.
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#13 Aug 15 2011 at 5:33 PM Rating: Good
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I don't understand the appeal of a tablet computer. I guess it has to do with being able to watch videos without a keyboard in the way.

In every way it seems like you're getting screwed. If you consider the difference between a laptop and a smart phone you're getting slightly more performance than a smart phone at slightly less cost than a laptop.
#14 Aug 15 2011 at 5:57 PM Rating: Good
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I'll admit I never got the appeal of the iPad, honestly. I would understand it if it had the accuracy of tablets for art purposes, but it doesn't.

I can only assume that some people hate keyboards.
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#15 Aug 15 2011 at 6:00 PM Rating: Good
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
I can only assume that some people hate keyboards.

Well, without trying to completely derail the thread, I'd say it has more do with with Apple's strong brand image than anything that recently became exceptional in tablet pcs.
#16 Aug 15 2011 at 6:26 PM Rating: Good
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I guess I'm just not overly impressed with apple as a company then. I think they make great mp3 players (perhaps no longer the best, like they definitely were early on, but still pretty good ***all relative to the cost).

But I HATE their business practice of releasing a new model for all their products every year. I think it's absurd instead of releasing an ipod with a camera this year and video next year, just wait the two years and release the ipod with the camera and video. You shouldn't feel like you are being punished for buying early and supporting the company. I mean, it was like months after the iPad was released that they announced the iPad 2, set for the next year. That's absurd.

That goes for Nintendo as well, recently. Primarily with their rampant DS model releases, but also with them releasing the Wii U just 4 years after the Wii.

Idk, maybe I'm the one being unrealistic. But I don't feel like it's too much to demand quality products from companies without fear them holding back on you because they are already nearly done with their preparations for the next model.
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#17 Aug 16 2011 at 2:04 PM Rating: Decent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
I'll admit I never got the appeal of the iPad, honestly. I would understand it if it had the accuracy of tablets for art purposes, but it doesn't.

I can only assume that some people hate keyboards.

Er, iPads have less accuracy than "tablets"? That's totally why Adobe is making Photoshop apps for the iPad, and why tons of design studios are snapping up iPad 2s in droves, right?

When you have a seriously huge budget for tech that makes your job easier, an iPad is an excellent device for sketching and displaying ideas to clients where a laptop would be much more clunky and unintuitive.

Unless you're running a MacBook Air with an i7 in it and you feel like dragging your Wacom tablet everywhere with you, an iPad is a totally reasonable alternative for most designers who do sketching most of the time and sit down at a workstation (i.e. iMac or Mac Pro with multiple monitors) to refine their sketches into final design work.
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#18 Aug 17 2011 at 9:11 PM Rating: Good
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I've never been impressed by a single Apple product.

And now we play the waiting game.
#19 Aug 17 2011 at 10:26 PM Rating: Decent
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Kavekk wrote:
I've never been impressed by a single Apple product.

And now we play the waiting game.

RAR RAR RAR ANGRY COMMENTARY AND LOUD NOISES.

That's what you were hoping for, right?
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#20 Aug 17 2011 at 11:16 PM Rating: Good
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Overlord Theophany wrote:
That's what you were hoping for, right?

Apple products just seem like a really expensive way to buy a logo.

Take it; take the bait.
#21 Aug 18 2011 at 8:01 AM Rating: Good
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I like my iphone. It's probably overpriced for what it does, as most luxury products are, but I received it as a gift.
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#22 Aug 18 2011 at 7:16 PM Rating: Good
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Overlord Theophany wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
I'll admit I never got the appeal of the iPad, honestly. I would understand it if it had the accuracy of tablets for art purposes, but it doesn't.

I can only assume that some people hate keyboards.

Er, iPads have less accuracy than "tablets"?


Of course they do. Assuming we're talking about actual special purpose tablets designed for CAD work. It's not even a question.

Quote:
That's totally why Adobe is making Photoshop apps for the iPad, and why tons of design studios are snapping up iPad 2s in droves, right?


Because Adobe's primary customer base works on Apple products, and Apple consumers tend to be rabid fanboys who'll buy whatever new thing Apple puts their logo on and swear it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. Same deal with the design studios. Most of their designers are those same apple fanboys so they're stuck buying them ipads because that's what they want and they need their hands held for them or something.

You can always tell the apple fans because they're the ones who'll insist on using whatever latest apple dodad is out no matter how inefficient it is for the job they're actually doing. I actually give the design guys a bit of slack since that's at least an area Apple does do very well in. I work with a bunch of unix admins. You can't imagine the conversations I've had with some of them. They go something like this:

Fanboy: Look at this! It took me 6 months but I got approval to get the latest coolest <insert Apple product here> instead of a standard workstation. Isn't it great? I can do photo editing and sound mixing and it can run all these apps!

Me: Um... Your job is writing perl code.

Fanboy: Sure. But now I can customize the colors of each terminal and set up all sorts of cool features, and check out all those wallpaper selections!

Me: Ok. But you could have done all that on the standard workstation.

Fanboy: But it's got shell emulation in the new OS so I can do everything I used to.

Me: The workstation has native shells in an X environment. It's a unix box.

Fanboy: But now I can connect from my Apple into our unix server and do everything I could before.

Me: Yeah, but that's what... never mind. What's with the mouse?

Fanby: Oh. Isn't it cool? It's got just one button, which is artistically simplistic in design and superior in all ways.

Me: But how do you right click? Or middle click?

Fanboy: You don't have to. You just hold this key, twist your wrist like so, turn your head sideways and then click. And there's a whole bunch of other features too! By doing this, you're not limited to just one operation with that mouse button. You can do an infinite number of things! Isn't that the greatest?

Me: Yeah. That's "great". I suppose. But doesn't that make cut and paste harder, and given your job is writing perl...

Fanboy: Oh. No problem, I downloaded this emulator which allows me to simulate the native X screen inputs so I can use a simple combination of 8 keystrokes and 3 mouse clicks to accomplish what used to take just one double click and one middle click. Isn't that great!?

Me: Not really.

Fanboy: You're just a hater, aren't you?



I joke about the Apple guys really. There are some good uses for the systems, but I'm still not sold on the ipad thing. I've just noticed that their user base is very loyal. Almost fanatically so. I'll use pretty much whatever works for what I'm doing. Most people will. The Apple guys will spend enormous amounts of effort to find ways to use their Apple's to do things that they aren't well suited for, pretty much just to have an Apple on their desk. It's hard not to conclude that it really is just about the logo.
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#23 Aug 19 2011 at 11:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
I joke about the Apple guys really. There are some good uses for the systems, but I'm still not sold on the ipad thing. I've just noticed that their user base is very loyal. Almost fanatically so. I'll use pretty much whatever works for what I'm doing. Most people will. The Apple guys will spend enormous amounts of effort to find ways to use their Apple's to do things that they aren't well suited for, pretty much just to have an Apple on their desk. It's hard not to conclude that it really is just about the logo.


Off topic, but you writing this is deeply funny to me.
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#24 Aug 19 2011 at 11:37 AM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
I like my iphone. It's probably overpriced for what it does, as most luxury products are, but I received it as a gift.


I like my iPhone, but when the amount of apps and music I put on my phone start interfering with my ability to use my phone AS a phone, I get a little miffed.

IMHO, the phone functions should override anything else, take the first memory, all that. But when I call my husband and get his voicemail and all he hears is an incessant tapping and me cursing in the background because my phone is lagging out and it won't hang up, that's ****** up. And embarrassing. I'm glad it happened to my husband's voicemail and not my boss.
#25 Aug 19 2011 at 9:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
I like my iphone. It's probably overpriced for what it does, as most luxury products are, but I received it as a gift.


I like my iPhone, but when the amount of apps and music I put on my phone start interfering with my ability to use my phone AS a phone, I get a little miffed.

IMHO, the phone functions should override anything else, take the first memory, all that. But when I call my husband and get his voicemail and all he hears is an incessant tapping and me cursing in the background because my phone is lagging out and it won't hang up, that's @#%^ed up. And embarrassing. I'm glad it happened to my husband's voicemail and not my boss.
I've never had that problem...
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#26 Aug 20 2011 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
I joke about the Apple guys really. There are some good uses for the systems, but I'm still not sold on the ipad thing. I've just noticed that their user base is very loyal. Almost fanatically so. I'll use pretty much whatever works for what I'm doing. Most people will. The Apple guys will spend enormous amounts of effort to find ways to use their Apple's to do things that they aren't well suited for, pretty much just to have an Apple on their desk. It's hard not to conclude that it really is just about the logo.

The same could be said for any company. Google has fanboys, as does Microsoft. There's just more hype around Apple products, that's really the only reason people notice it more.

But yes, it's annoying.
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#27 Aug 20 2011 at 3:03 PM Rating: Excellent
gbaji wrote:
Me: But how do you right click? Or middle click?

Fanboy: You don't have to. You just hold this key, twist your wrist like so, turn your head sideways and then click. And there's a whole bunch of other features too! By doing this, you're not limited to just one operation with that mouse button. You can do an infinite number of things! Isn't that the greatest?


OK; I Smiley: loled
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#28 Aug 23 2011 at 1:38 PM Rating: Good
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
I like my iphone. It's probably overpriced for what it does, as most luxury products are, but I received it as a gift.


I like my iPhone, but when the amount of apps and music I put on my phone start interfering with my ability to use my phone AS a phone, I get a little miffed.

IMHO, the phone functions should override anything else, take the first memory, all that. But when I call my husband and get his voicemail and all he hears is an incessant tapping and me cursing in the background because my phone is lagging out and it won't hang up, that's @#%^ed up. And embarrassing. I'm glad it happened to my husband's voicemail and not my boss.



On a similar note, the dashboard of our car was acting up and the blue tooth receiver would kick on for no reason to setup a connection between the car and phone. The setup messages from the console is rather loud. I was driving to work one day when it turned on and the following message played.

Your phone name is (a loud smack as if someone is punching the console) $%#$ stupid $#%^ piece of @#$@ in my wife's voice.

First time I had heard my wife curse. I was kind of sad to actually get it fixed.
#29 Aug 23 2011 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
First time I had heard my wife curse. I was kind of sad to actually get it fixed.


Seriously?
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#30 Aug 24 2011 at 1:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
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First time I had heard my wife curse. I was kind of sad to actually get it fixed.


Seriously?
Maybe hearing those filthy filthy words come out of his wife's mouth turned him on?
#31 Aug 24 2011 at 6:03 PM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Quote:
First time I had heard my wife curse. I was kind of sad to actually get it fixed.


Seriously?
Maybe hearing those filthy filthy words come out of his wife's mouth turned him on?


Errr, bolded for clarification.
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#32 Aug 25 2011 at 12:39 AM Rating: Excellent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Errr, bolded for clarification.
Ah. Maybe she's a lady, a relic from a bygone age where people were polite and cursing was not to be done by or in front of women?
#33 Aug 26 2011 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
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So, iPhone users, my phone finally got to the point where I couldn't swipe it to unlock it. Any one know how to fix this? Or if it's even fixable?

I got a new one, since I was eligible for an "upgrade," but now I have this iPhone sitting on my counter that doesn't do anything...
#34 Aug 26 2011 at 11:24 AM Rating: Good
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When mine does that I usually just have to hit the lock button to turn off the screen, then try again. If it's a persistent problem, I'm afraid I can't help you :(.
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#35 Aug 26 2011 at 11:27 AM Rating: Good
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Vataro wrote:
When mine does that I usually just have to hit the lock button to turn off the screen, then try again. If it's a persistent problem, I'm afraid I can't help you :(.


It's persistent, all right. I even reset it twice.

It's not a huge deal, I do have a phone that works now. But it'd be nice to have the other one just to upload games and play when I feel like it. Smiley: lol
#36 Aug 26 2011 at 6:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
So, iPhone users, my phone finally got to the point where I couldn't swipe it to unlock it. Any one know how to fix this? Or if it's even fixable?

I got a new one, since I was eligible for an "upgrade," but now I have this iPhone sitting on my counter that doesn't do anything...

Have you tried restoring the phone using iTunes?

Just make sure you back the phone up before, since restoring is basically doing a reinstall of the OS.
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#37 Aug 26 2011 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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Overlord Theophany wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
So, iPhone users, my phone finally got to the point where I couldn't swipe it to unlock it. Any one know how to fix this? Or if it's even fixable?

I got a new one, since I was eligible for an "upgrade," but now I have this iPhone sitting on my counter that doesn't do anything...

Have you tried restoring the phone using iTunes?

Just make sure you back the phone up before, since restoring is basically doing a reinstall of the OS.


I have not. The phone is backed up (and everything is actually on the new phone now, anyway) so that's no problem. I'll have to look into that, thanks.
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