Gil farming -- Why not just put an end to it?Follow

Look at the threads currently posted here. You see a lot of threads about telespammers, NM-campers, and casinos. I think most of us agree gil-farming is a major issue to the FFXI community. Gil-farming hurts casual players. This is not a new idea, and I believe most people already agree with me on this subject. But is there really anything SE can do to help stop it?

Well I have an idea that would help to eliminate gil farming. Do not allow money to be sent via the mail system. Now the only way you could purchase gil off the Internet would be to meet up with the person (or company player) or are buying the gil from in-game and trade it. Much fewer people IMO would be willing to buy their gil online if they had to find the person to trade with. Even so it would be much easier to find people that were illegially selling gil off the Net. These guys would most likely need to be in one spot for the trades.

The downside of course is that your mule wouldn't be able send you money (and vice-versa). Now, I use mules like everyone else, but this trade-off seems just fine with me. When you really think about it, mules are basically a form of cheating. You get extra AH slots, a larger mog safe, and are able to access different city markets (by placing mules in different cities). Its just a form of cheating that almost everybody does.

Now, if we eliminated gil farmers, think of how the game would improve. It would still be challenging to make gil, but not nearly as much so. You could camp NM and only have to worry about competition from fellow players. No more "MrHappyNewYearChineseGilFarmingMan" stealing your favorite NM 24/7. You wouldn't see the same telespammers sitting in Jeuno for weeks at a time. The economy would balance out, and out of hand prices would be decrease as it becomes easier to hunt NMs and quest items yourself.

Will this ever happen? Probally not. With over a million people playing FFXI worldwide, with multiple mules, SE is making a lot of extra money. But to me, it would be a great idea.

Edited, Fri Oct 8 13:16:50 2004 by VawnLakshimi

this would.. effectively break mules for the purpose of extra AH selling slots.. since you couldn't send your main the money.. ~_~ Mules would then become nothing more than extra storage. My main is from Windurst. I keep two mules, one in Sandy, the other in Bastok, to take advantage of the price differences in various places. Alchemy items get sent to and sold in bastok, they sell faster there and for higher prices than in Sandy.. since there is no alchemy guild there.

in addition to that, it would do nothing to gil sellers except add a new step to the process, all they really would need to do is communicate via email to pick a time, and city to meet at:

"Mr <insert name>, we have secured your gil and would like to meet you in Southern Sandoria right outside the Mog House Zone line at "X" time on "Y" day. Your contact will be <insert name> who will trade you the gil. Please let us know if the time and place for the gil transfer is ok with you."

simple... so really blocking gil transfer via the in-game mail system would solve nothing.

Anywho... the big reason you see gil-farming is because gil *IS* such a high commodity. Gil is so rare and so precious in the game that it has taken on a real world value and created a business model... and it's a model that actually *works* 0_o.

for example, you don't hear of anyone in SWG farming for credits or buying credits online... reason? Because Creds are *EASY* to get... acquiring 30 to 50 thousand credits is a no-brainer in SWG.. a guild mate *GAVE* me 150,000 credits so I could buy something when I first started... he said don't pay it back.. it was just lying around... and you can spend it just as quickly as you can make it in SWG depending on what you buy. However in FFXI that kind of money is quite literally a fortune.. and when you have things that cost 2 to 6 *times* that amount or more.. oyi!!! @_@ makes me dizzy thinking about it.

Rare things have value...

Erase - Rare.. goes for 300k+
Dispel - Rare.. goes for 200k+
Monsters signa - rare.. goes for 300k+
Serket Ring - Rare.. I don't even know how much this goes for..
Dark Spirit Pact - Rare.. went for 16 MILLION when it first showed up on the AH in jeuno.

but people pay it.. cause it's the rare items that make you stand out and allow you to progress...

gil - rare.. and since it has no *easy* in-game equivalent, it takes on a value in real world currency.

and people buy it in order to afford the WAYYYYYY overpriced other rare items in the game that they would just love to have.. It's human nature to want.. and it's human nature to justify. "I make my money to spend how I choose.." and so.. they choose to buy gil to get the items they feel they need to progress and succeed in the game.... which simply makes the issue loop upon itself in a neat little circle.

does this make them a bad player.. nope, ability is determined by skill.. not by spare cash for buying gil.

Is it fair for them to have an easy gil source when the rest of us have to farm for days / weeks / months soley because they have a bank account big enough for a splurge spend. Nope not fair at all... but life is never fair.......

but unless someone actually *tells* you they bought gil... there's absolutely no way you'd ever know.

~SO then.. is there a solution to the issue...???~

**make gil easier to get.. so that it's real-world value will diminish to a point that gil-selling is no longer worth it because the client base can make their own.

this is actually a good idea, but it would require SE to make fundamental changes to the game which simply cannot be done... at best they could increase the drop amount for mobs that carry gil.. but it's simply not enough due to the price of AH items... in addition the fact that gil IS rare and typically you don't make much money leveling.. ensures that the player base plays longer.. you can either make gil.. or you can gain levels.. but RARE is the case where you can do both simultaneously.

**convince the in-game community to GREATLY lower the overall prices for everything they sell on AH.. which would diminish the value of gil as a whole inside and outside the game.

not gonna' happen, it's actually the solution that would work the best since it requires no coding changes what so ever.. but people by nature are greedy. Add to that the difficulty in obtaining all rare items and in addition to that the sheer rarity of getting gil overall.. and it's a recipe for sellers to price-jack (afterall they need gil too and lots of it).

so.. since it's obvious those solutions will not work because the first cuts into SOE's bottom line..and the 2nd cuts into the legit item sellers bottom line.. what's left as a viable solution?

good question..... /ponder

Very good points Iaini. You've thourghly explained why people are willing to pay for gil online and have given some theoretical solutions. Of course you dismissed how each wouldn't work, and you're right.

As for the point that not being able to send gil would effectively ruin the extra AH slots. Well this is one of the reasons why I said mules are a form of cheating. If SE wanted players to have 21 AH slots, they would not have given us that many in the first place.



My post wasn't to blame the gil sellers (or the gil buyers), but to think of ideas on how to stop them. I mean we can always say things like, "The best way to lower the crime rate is for people to quit commiting them" or "We would greatly reduce the suicide rate in this country if people would quit killing themselves".

I realize that my original idea of not allowing gil to be sent via the mail system wouldn't stop gil sellers (and buyers). However, I wish SE (or someone) would come up with a solution that could make gil-selling impossible (or at least very difficult). Just some thoughts, because I believe eliminating these gil-sellers would improve the FFXI-experience as a whole.

Edited, Fri Oct 8 15:49:37 2004 by VawnLakshimi

Another way would be to lower the price of things at shops, and/or increase how much you can sell things back to a shop.

I mean come on, 14 gil for a crystal? You get more money killing a too weak gob than killing an EP+ gob and selling its drop to an npc.

Good ideas. But if we put a cap on items we won't have those really elite items any longer. I think SE likes having items that are out of reach for the casual player. I mean sometimes its a very large price difference for an extra vit, dex, str, etc point. And I think thats a good thing. It means there are rewards for people who want to go the extra 10 miles, but those 10 miles are by no means necessary. If there was a cap then everyone would always be wearing the absolute best items. Unless the cap was too high, in which case it wouldn't be stopping the gil sellers.

I don't know what can be done, but it seems important enough to find a solution. If what many game compaines say is true, the future of video games is online. If SE would put effort into catching these sellers (maybe start by tracking sites that are known to sell gil) I think these games would be in a much better position. When anyone is caught buying or selling gil, kick them indefinitly from the game. But then, how many people would SE be willing to lose (and the high monthly charge)?

Right. But, SE wants gil to be hard to come-by. You might disagree, but I think to a certain point, FFXI gil issues are a good thing. If everyone could make money too easily it would cheapen the game in many ways.

First of all, like I said before, eventually everyone would be wearing +1 gear. Many players pride themselves on spending a lot of extra time on the extra Vit point (for example), while other players prefer to save a weeks-worth of work to get gear that is almost as good.

Second, if we can make a lot of gil just by killing gobs outside of Sandy, we are going to loose all the creativity and stratedgy that goes into making gil. How many threads have you seen by players asking for "the best way to make money"? These players assume that there is one "easy making gil stradedgy" and if everyone did it, everyone would have all the money they would ever want. But part of what makes FFXI great IMO, is that this is not true. All different players have come up with different ways of making money. All require work, and pretty much none are guaranteed to work well all the time. Players have to think, plan, and work for good making gil. Some players are better at this. If we made gil-making a non-issue, we would be loseing this part of the game, which would be a very bad thing IMO.

But, as I am the one who started this thread, I agree that gil farmers and sellers make it more difficult than its suppose to be. You also get these players that are getting praised for their ubber equipment, when in reality, they should consider getting help for spending quite a bit of RL money, to impress online friends in a video game.

Edited, Wed Oct 13 11:38:04 2004 by VawnLakshimi

If you can't get gil in your delivery box, how would you get your money from AH?

Edit* I got rated down for pointing out a flaw in the plan???

Edited, Fri Oct 15 17:32:27 2004 by Rair

im pretty sure SE would allow the AH to send gil to delivery boxes...or they could make it a lot better and give your money to you right then!!

The ONLY way to eliminate gil farmers is to stop gil buyers from buying online. The ONLY way to do that is to make making gil "slightly" more easy for the casual players and to encourage them to participate in other gil making activites this game offers.

While some people buy gil online because they believe its a luxury they can afford, i believe some do it because they dont have the patience to try out all the gil making opportunities this game offers and/or they are obessed with having that precious item for their job right away or intent on fast leveling.

I understand that at higher levels farming for silver coins, batwings, silk threads, cockatrice meat and tree cuttings wont get you that far. I also understand that all the good NMs unfortunatley are heavily camped by BOTS or JPs who are extremely quick on the voke. HOWEVER those two are NOT the only ways to make gil and if you have a little patience and determination you can make a TON of money and trust me it feels good to "earn ur gil" rather than putting it on your credit card.

My advice to all those who are not happy with the their gil earnings and are "considering" buying online is to have patience. There are other opportunities out there. I have a mule that i use for gardening, crafting and fishing and it makes me a ton of gil. All of these jobs require alot of patience and decipline. You have a wait weeks in RL to be able to reap the fruits but trust me it works and YOU WILL BE FILTHY RICH.

If sitting around in one spot and fishing or crafting isnt your cup of tea, then I suggest BCNMs. I havent done a single one yet but my LS just did 6 of em last week and in a mere 5 hours each made 400-500K. Thats only a BCNM 50. BCNM 60s and 70s give out even more gil per person. If you constanly want to be moving around and need some action while making gil, then my advice go for BCNMs.

I think SE has given plenty of opportunities for players to make gil. I do believe some items in the AH are rediculously over priced and i would never buy them unless i have gil to burn. 20 milion gil for scorpion harness +1 and 2.8 milion gil for sniper rings +1 is rediculous. I choose to craft these item rather than buying it. Atleast that way I'd have some crafts leveled up and the gil i put it to get there is an investment rather than a waste.

Bottom line. PLEASE DONT BUY GIL ONLINE. By doing so you are giving all the more reason for gil farmers to exist. Gil companies have recently lowered their prices to lure even more people into this trap, I highly recommend not to "waste" money and earn your item. If you are not crafting, fishing and doing BCNMs, you are not the playing the game the way its meant to be played.

To be completely honest, the best idea I think I've ever heard for a way to stop NM-campers is simply to make the expensive drop, like the Emperor's Hairpin for example, untradeable items. This way, even if the NM campers did get the drops, they couldn't sell them, problem solved for gil-farmers. This would also mean that the only people interested in hunting the NM would be people who need the item.

Now, I'm a lot of people are crying out at me right now, and I completely understand why. Getting those drops to us casual players is like winning the lottery, and some us of will never hold that much gil in one item again, so it seems cruel to take that dream away from us. But then, I can feel free to think what I do about this topic, but believe it or not, I'm in it for the fun of the game and the rage of battle, not for the piles of gil. If I can get by, I'm happy.

To be honest, the thrill of tracking and getting to battle something like the Valkurm Emperor holds far more interest to me than actually making money off it. Perhaps I'm alone.