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Jade Helm Conspiracy Non-TerroristsFollow

#77 Aug 25 2015 at 8:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
Eh, the State Guard is regulated by the National Guard Bureau.

Everything I've read (admittedly this isn't a big area of research for me) indicates that the State Guard is entirely under the auspice of the state.

Edit: Wiki apparently says kinda-sorta
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State defense forces (SDF; also known as state guards, state military reserves, or state militias) in the United States are military units that operate under the sole authority of a state government; they are partially regulated by the National Guard Bureau but they are not a part of the Army National Guard of the United States. State defense forces are authorized by state and federal law and are under the command of the governor of each state.

No indication of what "partially regulated" means.

Edited, Aug 25th 2015 9:53am by Jophiel
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#78 Aug 25 2015 at 8:52 AM Rating: Good
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blog wrote:
It’s like the Boy Scouts except with no adult supervision.
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Jophiel wrote:
No indication of what "partially regulated" means.
It pretty much means they're there to help the National Guard for training and pre- and post-deployment assistance. Like with medical and legal paperwork and junk. At least that's the NY Guard. I know they can also be activated to help during disasters, since I worked with a bunch the last time there was a flood around here. Help direct traffic and civilians to where they need to get to and all that. I was more just pointing out that there was a federal connection.

Edited, Aug 25th 2015 11:11am by lolgaxe
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#79 Aug 25 2015 at 10:36 AM Rating: Good
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Kavekkk wrote:
Even so, this is Texas. I'm sure someone will have rigged a gatling gun up to a cessna or something like that.

You mean by other than the A-37, or O2-B, right?
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#80 Aug 25 2015 at 11:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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I like the idea that Gbaji has "a friend" who feeds exclusively on conservative media.
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#81 Aug 25 2015 at 12:35 PM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
Kavekkk wrote:
Even so, this is Texas. I'm sure someone will have rigged a gatling gun up to a cessna or something like that.

You mean by other than the A-37, or O2-B, right?


Yeah, more a DIY conversion of a normal private plane; think a gun haphazardly duct taped to the nose of the plane.
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#82 Aug 25 2015 at 2:29 PM Rating: Good
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Kavekkk wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
Kavekkk wrote:
Even so, this is Texas. I'm sure someone will have rigged a gatling gun up to a cessna or something like that.

You mean by other than the A-37, or O2-B, right?


Yeah, more a DIY conversion of a normal private plane; think a gun haphazardly duct taped to the nose of the plane.


That's the O2-B/A skymaster conversion then.

Edited, Aug 25th 2015 4:44pm by Timelordwho
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#83 Aug 25 2015 at 5:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
I like the idea that Gbaji has "a friend" who feeds exclusively on conservative media.

That must be the person who regurgitates all the harmless talking points for gbaji to expound upon.
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#84 Aug 25 2015 at 6:28 PM Rating: Decent
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Friar Bijou wrote:
So, gbaji, can you explain why Governor Abbott thinks the "safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties" are in danger of being "infringed"?


I can't, because nothing in his letter states that he personally believes there is any danger of infringement. I suppose we could insist that he write a letter insisting that there's nothing to be concerned about, and anyone who thinks so is crazy in the head, but given that his responsibilities as governor with regard to these sorts of operations already require interaction and communication (monitoring even!) between his state forces and the federal forces engaged in said operation, he chose to write a letter basically telling people that he's doing things that he was already going to do anyway, so there's no reason for alarm. Um... Which is really nothing at all. Unless you're trying desperately to make it into something.

When a crazy person demands that you do something you were already going to do anyway, you can either argue with the person about his craziness, or you can just grin and nod and say "sure, I'll do that for you", and move on. That's basically what he did. Again, if you think that's somehow pandering, then shouldn't we be focusing more on all the media out there making this into a big deal in the first place? That's where the pandering is coming from. He's responding to the media coverage, not the relatively small number of actual crazies.

lolgaxe wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Could you please point out where the word "mobilize" appears in this letter?
That would be this part. I mean, if you want to cry "BUT IT DOESN'T LITERALLY SAY MOBILIZE!" then you're welcome to that.


Um... In a military context, "mobilize" has a very specific meaning beyond just "not being immobile". Don't be an ***. Mobilizing forces means reading them for military conflict. So yeah, I'm going to call Joph out on using that term in this case. Kinda obvious why you chose that particular word. Frankly, I'm a bit surprised that you of all people have chosen to pick up his torch on this one.

Edited, Aug 25th 2015 5:30pm by gbaji
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#85 Aug 25 2015 at 6:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, really, Lolgaxe. Why don't you learn something about the military, you big stupid-head? Smiley: mad
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#86 Aug 25 2015 at 7:21 PM Rating: Default
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xantav wrote:
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Funny story. I was talking with a friend late last week. This guy listens to nothing but conservative talk radio all day long, is up on all the latest issues, rants, etc. I asked him "So what do you think of this whole Jade Helm thing?" To which he was like "What's that?". He'd never heard of it.

I've noticed the same thing about a co-worker. Anything negative about conservatives or the republican party isn't discussed on conservative talk radio.


I maybe listen to conservative radio once or twice a week, maybe, and for like 15 minutes at most, but that's just not true. Not agreeing with it and not discussing it are two different things. It seems to me that most of what's discussed on conservative talk shows is about negative stuff liberals say about conservatives or the Republican party (and how they're wrong, of course). A huge segment of the discussion is about how the mainstream media seems to just parrot liberal/democrat talking points as fact, with conservative talk being one of the few places were any actual counter arguments can be heard.

There's plenty of discussion about what liberals are saying about conservatives. What's different is that instead of just stopping at the things liberals are saying, there's actual conservatives addressing those things and responding to them. If you want to hear both side of an issue, listen to conservative talk. Conservatives have to respond to what liberals are saying because it's so widespread, but liberals rarely have to do the same in reverse. That's why liberals do so poorly when asked predict conservative answers to moral/ethical questions. In fact, they do worse in direct proportion to how strongly they identify themselves as liberal (see research by Jonathan Haidt on the subject if you're curious).

Obviously, this doesn't say anything about any one single conservative, or one single conservative speaker (on the radio or otherwise), but to say that conservative talk in general fails to discuss negative things said about them is extremely questionable. Not joining in with the negative statements isn't the same as not discussing them.

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He is all about shouting Benghazi, but when I asked how he felt about the funding being cut for security, he looked at me like I had two heads.


Uh? Again, this is a topic I recall hearing about many many times back when it was a big topic. Are you sure he wasn't looking at you like you had two heads because he was mystified about how you could make assumptions about who or why that funding was cut? Here's a funny article, which discusses this sort of thing (and also references Haidt's research). Relevant bit:

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But let me present a complementary, more practical explanation: If you’re a conservative who lives in a major metropolitan area or who simply reads the New York Times, you get used to being outnumbered by liberals. Liberals, by contrast, get used to being surrounded by other liberals, both in person and in culture and the media. As a result, liberals speak their minds freely, often in ways that are harshly condemnatory of conservatives and their stands on issues. As a conservative, you can defend your values against friends and acquaintances who essentially just called you stupid and evil or you can keep quiet.

Most conservatives, most of the time, choose the latter. That is, they stay in the closet to avoid being accused of hating the poor, gays, or polar bears. As a result, liberals aren’t gaining any commensurate information. In fact, the silence of their conservative friends helps reinforce their views. Much of the time, liberals’ views of conservative positions and values are simply a caricature that bear little resemblance to what conservatives actually think and, more importantly, why they think it.


He may have just not wanted to get into an argument about the subject. But who knows? I suppose it's possible he honestly hadn't heard about it. Not likely though, given the whole "But republicans cut the funding" is more or less the immediate stock response obtained any time a conservative brings up the issue of security failures in Benghazi. It would be amazing for him to have heard anything at all about the topic and not heard that particular counter. Probably a hundred times.

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Cheney shooting his friend when they were hunting? I had to be making that up. His favorite host, Rush, gets outed as a drug addict? Nah, drugs are only a problem for poor minorities.


Again, I don't know your friend, but this all looks like projection to me. You're assuming what he must think based on your vision of what a conservative is. Have you actually stopped and asked him about these things? In a non-argumentative manner even? I think that if you don't start with accusations, you might find your conservative friend actually has opinions that aren't what you think they are. Or maybe he really is one of those caricature conservatives. It's possible.

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I don't read that as not a problem, I see it as ignoring it in hopes it will go away.


Assuming you're referring to the whole "not knowing what Jade Helm was", it's not about ignoring it, but that conservatives are talking about the entire topic differently than liberals are. For liberals, it's "OMG, there's this Jade Helm operation and conservatives think it's an armed attack by the US military against its citizens. Let's make fun of conservatives for this". For conservatives, it's "Once again, liberals are trying to pin some crazy position or idea on us, and here's this guy, and that guy, and these other guys, all talking about this. When are they going to take the time to actually talk to us conservative about what we think instead of just making it up and plastering that all over the place".

See for conservatives, the story isn't about the military operation, but about the liberal attempt to paint us as in alignment with some kind of conspiracy theory. I had heard the term Jade Helm before, but prior to it being written as the title of this thread, if you'd asked me to name it, I would not have been able to. It's just not the part of this story we care about. That's the point I'm trying to make. Liberals do not understand what conservatives really care about, and this topic is yet another example of this. We don't care about Jade Helm, so the name has little meaning for us. We care about this only as an example of liberals attempting (apparently deliberately in this case) to define us incorrectly so as to dismiss or diminish us and our positions.

I'd say that it's straight out of Rules for Radicals, but that would just be too obvious. Scary how many of the tactics of the modern left do appear to be perfectly in line with those rules though. It's not about being right or wrong, but about manipulating public opinion. And this is all that this issue is about. Make conservative look bad by association. So yeah, that's the aspect we conservatives are looking at. Not the operation itself. We don't care about that.
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#87 Aug 25 2015 at 7:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Yeah, really, Lolgaxe. Why don't you learn something about the military, you big stupid-head? Smiley: mad


Kinda the point. He should know that "directing the guard to monitor" is not a mobilization. It's not like the letter doesn't go on a couple times and mention "communication" between the federal and state levels as the clear objective. I get why one might wish to use language designed to perpetuate the false idea that this is some kind of military "defense" against potential invaders or something. I'm just pointing out how absurd it is.
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#88 Aug 25 2015 at 7:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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I don't think that anyone called it a "military defense". We mainly all called it a pathetic joke.
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#89 Aug 25 2015 at 7:39 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Mobilizing forces means read(y)ing them for military conflict.
The Quantico Marine Band were mobilized to perform over a hundred concerts December 2012.
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#90 Aug 25 2015 at 8:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sure, but how many men did they kill?
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#91 Aug 25 2015 at 10:28 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
That's why liberals do so poorly when asked predict conservative answers to moral/ethical questions. In fact, they do worse in direct proportion to how strongly they identify themselves as liberal (see research by Jonathan Haidt on the subject if you're curious).

Like this:
1. Study finds that liberals think conservatives are racist/homophobic/etc
2. Study finds that conservatives claim to not be racist/homophobic/etc
3. Study finds that liberals don't *really* know about conservatives

gbaji wrote:
Obviously, this doesn't say anything about any one single conservative, or one single conservative speaker (on the radio or otherwise), but to say that conservative talk in general fails to discuss negative things said about them is extremely questionable. Not joining in with the negative statements isn't the same as not discussing them.
If "conservatives" spent more time talking about positive things and workable solutions for the problems of the country (and maybe the world, hey?) I'd listen to them and take them more seriously.

gbaji wrote:
That is, they (conservatives) stay in the closet to avoid being accused of hating the poor, gays, or polar bears.
That's a lot of words to admit that they are cowards.


ALSO:
gbaji wrote:
they (conservatives) stay in the closet
Screenshot


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#92 Aug 26 2015 at 12:23 AM Rating: Good
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If "conservatives" spent more time talking about positive things and workable solutions for the problems of the country (and maybe the world, hey?) I'd listen to them and take them more seriously.


Plenty of them do. Most of them don't make the news.
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#93 Aug 26 2015 at 12:38 AM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
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If "conservatives" spent more time talking about positive things and workable solutions for the problems of the country (and maybe the world, hey?) I'd listen to them and take them more seriously.


Plenty of them do. Most of them don't make the news.
FOX doesn't want word getting out, then? "Actual compassionate conservatives are boring?"

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#94 Aug 26 2015 at 7:19 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Sure, but how many men did they kill?
The threat of snare drums kept terrorist axe throwers at bay.

Edited, Aug 26th 2015 9:20am by lolgaxe
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#95 Aug 26 2015 at 7:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
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If "conservatives" spent more time talking about positive things and workable solutions for the problems of the country (and maybe the world, hey?) I'd listen to them and take them more seriously.
Plenty of them do. Most of them don't make the news.

Bijou can of course speak for himself but I took that more as a comment about conservative media than a blanket statement about each and every conservative in the nation. Conservative media is filled with bashing and red meat because that's what sells and what listeners want to hear. I once participated in a brief email exchange with a conservative radio host here where he copped to basically being forced to roll with it because that's what the station was about:
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I hate all the predictable anti-Obama nonsense that many guests regurgitate but I'm afraid it's much like having to play the dismal, but programmed, musical product earlier in my career.

But, anyway, perhaps the same can be said for liberal opinion media although I don't think it's quite the mirror image -- attempts to create a "liberal" version of conservative talk radio met spectacular failure in Air America. For better or worse, I think liberal listeners are just a different audience and don't react the same to that sort of stimulus. Of course, no one else here is whining about how misunderstood they are either. If I was going to throw a snit each time I heard the usual voices on the radio (or, heck, Gbaji) tell me how angry I (as a liberal) am or how much I care about some topic or what my goals/desires were, I'd never get anything else done.

Edited, Aug 26th 2015 8:57am by Jophiel
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#96 Aug 26 2015 at 9:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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I didn't think you did get anything else done.
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#97 Aug 26 2015 at 9:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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almost 70K posts isn't nothing.
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#98 Aug 26 2015 at 9:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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Posting is a thing! Also, I have a couple kids... one is olderish and the other one is about yay-many years old.
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#99 Aug 26 2015 at 10:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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Should we consider mobilizing to stop the threat of your offspring?
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#100 Aug 26 2015 at 10:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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The one is on his cell phone a lot, does that count?
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#101 Aug 26 2015 at 10:39 AM Rating: Excellent
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Social media is the key to revolutions, you should probably contact the NSA
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