Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

SCOTUS aren't morons....today.Follow

#77 Jul 02 2014 at 7:14 AM Rating: Excellent
Will swallow your soul
******
29,237 posts
It was hardly the Enigma code, but nice of Atwater to lay it out so neatly.
____________________________
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

#78 Jul 02 2014 at 7:27 AM Rating: Good
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,594 posts
No one has to say it gbaji, GOP party leaders as well as followers have time and again been caught, on record, making alarmingly racist comments.

You can deny it all you want, but it's not healthy. It's also completely irrelevant.




____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#79 Jul 02 2014 at 7:31 AM Rating: Good
******
49,744 posts
Well golly, that can't be right with how specific and committed to his critically thought out his opinions are. Just a line of coincidences. A very long line of coincidences.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#80 Jul 02 2014 at 7:38 AM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
*******
TILT
Gbaji has argued with a straight face before that Atwater was actually laying out the plan there to attract voters in the face of Democratic racism. Of course, he also argued that the Southern Strategy was completely made up by Democrats despite multiple GOP party heads admitting to it and apologizing for it.

What I'm saying is, don't listen to Gbaji.

Edited, Jul 2nd 2014 8:40am by Jophiel
____________________________
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#81 Jul 02 2014 at 7:59 AM Rating: Good
******
49,744 posts
Jophiel wrote:
What I'm saying is, don't listen to Gbaji.
That's like 63% of what makes Asylum amusing 53% of the time.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#82 Jul 02 2014 at 9:28 AM Rating: Excellent
Meat Popsicle
*****
13,369 posts
Elinda wrote:
No one has to say it gbaji, GOP party leaders as well as followers have time and again been caught, on record, making alarmingly racist comments.

You can deny it all you want, but it's not healthy. It's also completely irrelevant.
I blame mob mentality, this whole perceived dilution of individual responsibility brings out the worst in people. Smiley: disappointed
____________________________
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
#83 Jul 02 2014 at 3:35 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
34,933 posts
Elinda wrote:
No one has to say it gbaji, GOP party leaders as well as followers have time and again been caught, on record, making alarmingly racist comments.


As have plenty of Dem party leaders and followers (arguably more frequently). There are asshats to be found everywhere. That does not mean that there is any inherent connection between racism and the GOP.

Quote:
You can deny it all you want, but it's not healthy. It's also completely irrelevant.


Deny what? That *I* am a racist? I'll absolutely deny that. The idea that because I'm a member of a party which has had a member or two who have said racist things makes me a racist by association? Guess what? We all are. If you are a Democrat you also are a member of a party which has had a member or two who have said racist things. Does that makes *you* a racist?

It's meaningless rhetoric, designed to avoid discussing the actual issue at hand. Instead of responding to my points about the rulings, I get called a racist, so my opinion apparently doesn't count. Isn't that a ridiculous way to argue? We can all sit here and call each other names, but that isn't terribly productive. And if the best response someone can come up with is to call the other person a racist, maybe that someone ought to stop and think about how weak their position must be.
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#84 Jul 02 2014 at 3:43 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
34,933 posts
Jophiel wrote:
Gbaji has argued with a straight face before that Atwater was actually laying out the plan there to attract voters in the face of Democratic racism. Of course, he also argued that the Southern Strategy was completely made up by Democrats despite multiple GOP party heads admitting to it and apologizing for it.


Read the **** thread. I didn't say it was "made up". I said that it was an idea that was proposed by one guy one time back in 1968, and was rejected by Nixon and never used. The GOP never adopted it, never used it, and forgot about it. But the Democrats have latched on to it as some kind of noose to hang around the necks of modern Republicans for some bizarre reason and have proceeded to selectively quote people out of context in order to create the perception that this has been some kind of driving strategy by the GOP for the last 40 years.

It hasn't. The only people who talk about the Southern Strategy are liberals attempting to hang it on Republicans.

What's funny is that your quote from Atwater has him saying that there's no need for the GOP to use such tactics to win votes in the south. We can win on positive platform issues like "... fiscal conservatism, balancing the budget, cut taxes, you know, the whole cluster". Notice how none of those issues involved "scare white people about black people". It's like you didn't bother to read the quote. He's saying "we don't need to use racial scare tactics to win because our platform itself resonates with voters". And guess what? It still does. It's the Left which uses race to scare people, not the Right.

Southern Strategy indeed.

Quote:
What I'm saying is, don't listen to Gbaji.


Sure. Because people might just realize that what I'm saying has merit and you wouldn't want that to happen!

Edited, Jul 2nd 2014 2:44pm by gbaji
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#85 Jul 02 2014 at 3:57 PM Rating: Excellent
Meat Popsicle
*****
13,369 posts
I think in general the Republican Party's positions generally favor the white population over minorities. Minorities will often see less relatively less benefit from Republican legislation, and feel negative affects more strongly. It's pretty much an unfortunate and unavoidable symptom of a traditionalist position. Things were generally worse for minorities in the past, and they had less political power. Any attempt to hold on to older moral values or fiscal practices is more likely to benefit the white population, as they were in a greater majority when those laws and ideas were put into practice in the first place.

There are certainly those that favor traditional values for reasons that have nothing to do with racism. However if those policies fall more heavily on the minority population, they are certainly racially-biased positions. That doesn't necessarily mean the people that hold those positions are racist, the degree to which that constitutes racism is going to be open to interpretation, and will vary from individual to individual. But there's a point where one should really acknowledge the disparity, and work to modify the law or whatever to minimize any unintended consequences.
____________________________
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
#86 Jul 02 2014 at 4:08 PM Rating: Good
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,297 posts
gbaji wrote:
What's funny is that your quote from Atwater has him saying that there's no need for the GOP to use such tactics to win votes in the south. We can win on positive platform issues like "... fiscal conservatism, balancing the budget, cut taxes, you know, the whole cluster". Notice how none of those issues involved "scare white people about black people". It's like you didn't bother to read the quote. He's saying "we don't need to use racial scare tactics to win because our platform itself resonates with voters". And guess what? It still does.

You don't know what a euphemism is, do you?

He's doing exactly what I said. The video clip outlined the concept by basically saying "don't say ni**er, say 'tough on crime' or 'cut welfare spending' because the folks we want votes from knows what we mean (do things that harm blacks, on purpose).

And, for the jillionth time, I not a Democrat, so you can't toss the racist by association label on me.Smiley: tongue
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#87 Jul 02 2014 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,884 posts
Friar Bijou wrote:
gbaji wrote:
What's funny is that your quote from Atwater has him saying that there's no need for the GOP to use such tactics to win votes in the south. We can win on positive platform issues like "... fiscal conservatism, balancing the budget, cut taxes, you know, the whole cluster". Notice how none of those issues involved "scare white people about black people". It's like you didn't bother to read the quote. He's saying "we don't need to use racial scare tactics to win because our platform itself resonates with voters". And guess what? It still does.

You don't know what a euphemism is, do you?

He's doing exactly what I said. The video clip outlined the concept by basically saying "don't say ni**er, say 'tough on crime' or 'cut welfare spending' because the folks we want votes from knows what we mean (do things that harm blacks, on purpose).


"You get so abstract now, you're talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you are talking about are totally economic things and the byproduct of them is; Blacks get hurt more than Whites"

You don't have to say outright that you hate them, just being a Republican hurts them, so it works.

Edited, Jul 2nd 2014 6:13pm by TirithRR
____________________________
Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
#88 Jul 02 2014 at 4:12 PM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
*******
TILT
As I was saying... Smiley: laugh
____________________________
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#89 Jul 02 2014 at 5:03 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
***
1,254 posts
Gbaji,

I am honestly not sure why you are getting so defensive. You do realize that most people a little racist?

Are you telling us you do not belong to the subset of most people?
____________________________
Your soul was made of fists.

Jar the Sam
#90 Jul 02 2014 at 5:13 PM Rating: Good
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,297 posts
angrymnk wrote:
Gbaji, Are you telling us you do not belong to the subset of most people?
Have you somehow missed his many posts extoling his genius and overall superior (X200!!!!) knowledge about -well- everything?
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#91 Jul 02 2014 at 5:15 PM Rating: Good
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,297 posts
ALSO: gbaji has told us many times that most conservatives are not racist because...

because...



hmmm.........
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#92 Jul 02 2014 at 5:23 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
***
1,254 posts
Friar Bijou wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
Gbaji, Are you telling us you do not belong to the subset of most people?
Have you somehow missed his many posts extoling his genius and overall superior (X200!!!!) knowledge about -well- everything?


Uhh..it is kinda hard to admit, but after first post I just skim through. In my defense, I do that on a daily basis with corporate emails so I kinda know what to pass.

That is also how reached my conclusion that Gbaji is in middle management.. Nugget of sense in a sea of verval bs
____________________________
Your soul was made of fists.

Jar the Sam
#93 Jul 02 2014 at 8:11 PM Rating: Excellent
******
49,744 posts
gbaji wrote:
The idea that because I'm a member of a party which has had a member or two who have said racist things makes me a racist by association?
No one believes you're racist by association any more than they believe you're an engineer by association. They believe you're racist by how you present yourself.

Personal responsibility, etc.

Edited, Jul 2nd 2014 10:12pm by lolgaxe
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#94 Jul 03 2014 at 5:02 AM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,884 posts
It has begun...


Smiley: laugh
____________________________
Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
#95 Jul 03 2014 at 5:34 AM Rating: Good
***
1,000 posts
Indeed http://www.moonmontchronicle.com/supreme-court-rules-jcpenney-allowed-to-sacrifice-employees-to-appease-cthulhu.html
____________________________
Come on Bill, let's go home
[ffxisig]63311[/ffxisig]
#96 Jul 03 2014 at 7:40 AM Rating: Good
******
49,744 posts
TirithRR wrote:
article wrote:
there is certainly demonstrable harm being done to these animals that are denied the tasty, nutrient-rich Christians that their diet requires
All that fatty and cholesterol filled meat is sure to do more harm than good to those poor cats.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#97 Jul 03 2014 at 7:52 AM Rating: Good
Lunatic
******
30,084 posts
What's funny is that your quote from Atwater

Completely shatters your worldview, entirely, leaving broken pieces of your integrity scattered on the floor?

Because that's the only thing it does.

Edit: I agree, though, it's pretty fucking comical watching your defense of it. To be clear, "integrity" is the ability to admit mistakes when proven wrong in large part. I mean it's more than that, but that's what someone of your intellectual ability is able to understand about it. People take seriously those who haven't been proven wrong, and those who modify positions once proven wrong. We just at laugh at people like you and small children who hold their breath and insist they are right regardless.

Edited, Jul 3rd 2014 9:54am by Smasharoo
____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? ***. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#98 Jul 03 2014 at 3:51 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
34,933 posts
someproteinguy wrote:
I think in general the Republican Party's positions generally favor the white population over minorities.


I disagree. The Democratic Party positions favor minorities. So by comparison a position which favors no one based on race appears less favorable to minorities. But that's not the Republican party being racist. That's the Democratic party being racist. The problem is that somewhere along the line the political Left has managed to redefine racism to mean "fails to help racial minorities", so by that bizarre definition the GOP is racist, while the Dems are not.

Quote:
Minorities will often see less relatively less benefit from Republican legislation, and feel negative affects more strongly.


Of course. The party that is *not* passing legislation that directly targets minority groups for benefits will always appear this way. But that's because the GOP is *not* being racist, not because we are. The problem is that we're being judged by a standard that is itself inherently racist.


Quote:
It's pretty much an unfortunate and unavoidable symptom of a traditionalist position. Things were generally worse for minorities in the past, and they had less political power. Any attempt to hold on to older moral values or fiscal practices is more likely to benefit the white population, as they were in a greater majority when those laws and ideas were put into practice in the first place.


This has nothing to do with anything though. The GOP isn't calling for a return to Jim Crow, or to segregation, or anything remotely like that. What we do is oppose the idea that the way to counteract those historical inequalities in our system is to balance them out with new inequalities today. We believe that equality under the law means just that: everyone is treated the same. Those are the kinds of traditional ideas we want this country to return to. Because we believe that we can't ever achieve anything remotely resembling actual racial equality as long as we're constantly rigging the system to benefit or disadvantage groups of people based on race. We believed this a hundred years ago when the Democrats were arguing for segregation, and we believe this today when the Democrats argue for affirmative action.


Quote:
There are certainly those that favor traditional values for reasons that have nothing to do with racism. However if those policies fall more heavily on the minority population, they are certainly racially-biased positions.


Except they only fall more heavily on the minority population in contrast to policies which actively target benefits to those minority populations. That's an incredibly unfair criteria to use though.


Quote:
That doesn't necessarily mean the people that hold those positions are racist, the degree to which that constitutes racism is going to be open to interpretation, and will vary from individual to individual. But there's a point where one should really acknowledge the disparity, and work to modify the law or whatever to minimize any unintended consequences.


How about we start the discussion with a workable definition of "racism" though. To me, racism involves treating people differently primarily based on their skin color. Period. Does not matter why it's done. Doesn't matter what the skin color is (cause that would violate the rule, right?). Doesn't matter what historical context may be present or what excuses are used. And by that definition, it's the Democrats positions which are racist, not the Republicans. The only way the Democrats come out as non-racist is by using a definition of racism which is itself racist.

And that's why I bristle a bit when people parrot the assumption that Republican positions are racist, and therefore those who support them are racist as well. It's just completely ridiculous from start to finish. There's no logical ground for it, but it's so politically valuable to repeat that it just keeps getting repeated. And sadly, most people don't stop and ask if it makes any sense.

Edited, Jul 3rd 2014 2:55pm by gbaji
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#99 Jul 03 2014 at 3:57 PM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
*******
TILT
Translation: Everyone else is just stupid and don't realize how non-racist the GOP is. Also: 47%, Party of Santa Claus, blacks were better off on the plantation because they had jobs, Obama wants to end welfare regulations, illegal immigrants are just like criminal pedophiles and axe-murderers, Obamaphone Outrage and don't forget that Cadillac Queens are stealing all your tax money.

But look at it logically! Smiley: laugh

Edited, Jul 3rd 2014 4:58pm by Jophiel
____________________________
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#100 Jul 03 2014 at 4:07 PM Rating: Good
Lunatic
******
30,084 posts
Translation: Everyone else is just stupid and don't realize how non-racist the GOP is. Also: 47%, Party of Santa Claus, blacks were better off on the plantation because they had jobs, Obama wants to end welfare regulations, illegal immigrants are just like criminal pedophiles and axe-murderers, Obamaphone Outrage and don't forget that Cadillac Queens are stealing all your tax money.


You forgot about women's automatic rape sensing fallopian tubes.
____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? ***. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#101 Jul 03 2014 at 4:23 PM Rating: Excellent
Meat Popsicle
*****
13,369 posts
gbaji wrote:
How about we start the discussion with a workable definition of "racism" though. To me, racism involves treating people differently primarily based on their skin color. Period. Does not matter why it's done. Doesn't matter what the skin color is (cause that would violate the rule, right?). Doesn't matter what historical context may be present or what excuses are used. And by that definition, it's the Democrats positions which are racist, not the Republicans. The only way the Democrats come out as non-racist is by using a definition of racism which is itself racist.
I'll just do this for now, the rest if I have the energy later on.

To start I'm not accusing Republicans of acting any differently than any other group in the world. Every ethnic group has a set of morals and values which are intrinsically beneficial to them. Traditional American values reflect moral stances that your stereotypical WASP would find very agreeable and preferable. That's the reason they became laws in this country in the first place. Every other culture in the world has a similar set of values that make the most sense to them.

However those same values aren't held by other groups to the same degree. Many things about WASP values will not sit well with people from a different background and they'll find adapting to those values more difficult. If given a voice in government they'll use that voice to attempt to alter the laws of the region to be more inline with values they feel are natural and intrinsic. This in turn will put more pressure on the WASP who now finds themselves adapting to cultural values they don't share.

In one sense this isn't racism *****, people aren't setting out to kill each other, deprive each other of jobs, etc. On the other hand it's very passive aggressive as these value conflicts weight more heavily on other groups. On the first hand though, many of these things are held as important beliefs that define a particular culture, and members of a group can hardly be blamed for upholding the things they believe in.

On the other hand again though, we all have to live together. Changing demographics will always result in people changing laws in ways that are more reflective of the current ethnic mix of the population and their new set of shared beliefs. Simply put the values that our country is founded on aren't as universally agreeable as they once were. Those who share the older set of values will view the intrusion of new laws as an attack on them, as it necessitates they act in ways that aren't natural to them. On the other hand those who have been struggling to adapt to values that aren't reflective of their own culture will view the older set of values as oppressive.

Myself, I would view this as passive racism.

However, it's also something that's universal across ethnic groups (as I mentioned earlier), and not necessarily evil. It's simply human nature, and something we're all guilty of to one degree or another. The best we can hope for is to minimize the parts of the different cultures that negatively impact others outside the group, while at the same thing trying to celebrate the things that make the different groups unique. There's no clear black line here, and people are often terrible at assessing things in their own culture that negatively impact other groups.

So that's the kind of "racism" I'm talking about, whether or not you'd consider that racism. I would certainly understand why someone would view it in a different manner.
____________________________
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 59 All times are in CDT
Anonymous Guests (59)