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#252 Mar 08 2014 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
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Well, I guess we did break up the Soviet Union...
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#253 Mar 08 2014 at 10:25 PM Rating: Decent
Timelordwho wrote:
Well, I guess we did break up the Soviet Union...

and we have a done a pretty decent job in the Middle East and Africa as well.
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#254 Mar 09 2014 at 1:02 AM Rating: Good
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Africa was done in by Europe. But we all sliced and diced the Middle East.
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#255 Mar 10 2014 at 11:04 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
You got me.

Well, yeah. I'm not saying you're wrong for being more invested but you definitely are. That's fine and all but you seem to think I share your zeal here when really I'm just having a laugh at your strange notions of how international affairs work. No offense to the fine vodka farmers of the Crimean peninsula but I don't terribly care if they end the month Ukrainian, Russian or Congolese.


Thats nice, I am invested in the politics of my Country, I don't agree that my government should on one hand attempt to promote democracy, while on the other hand say it only counts if its the outcome we support. Personally I don't care where Crimea ends up, I don't care if Ukraine gets split in half. I do care that my government has already made it clear that "we" will not respect the democratic decision of the people of Crimea. It makes my Country look incredibly weak as a proponent of Democracy in the world.



Edited, Mar 8th 2014 4:23pm by rdmcandie


This is what democracy looks like to you?
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#256 Mar 10 2014 at 11:10 AM Rating: Good
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So in about two weeks Crimea is gonna be lead by Pat Buchanan?
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#257 Mar 10 2014 at 11:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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About the same as choosing between a Democrat and a Republican.
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#258 Mar 10 2014 at 12:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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Potentially (again, didn't we fight a war over this?). Or, at the very least, the break should be negotiated better than "Welp, we decided we're Russia now.. see ya" with a line draw just a sitcom couple who runs tape down the apartment and one person lays claim to the bathroom and the other one has the kitchen.

You're the same guy who claimed Israel's right to exist validated it's excursions into Lebanon, though, correct? A country whose borders were literally drawn up arbitrarily by people in London. A country populated by a population that was essentially exiled and ghettoized without a voice. So THAT'S fine. If Crimeans want to be Russian, though, ha ha ha silly it doesn't work that way, you didn't have the sanction of the US or Western Europe. Surely the US should decide policy in Ukraine!

We both agree realpolitik means democracy has never mattered anywhere, including the US, but if we're going to play pretend that it somehow does, let's at least be consistent, eh?
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#259 Mar 10 2014 at 12:35 PM Rating: Good
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So my support of a nation to defend a border that was created decades before my birth means that now I should support splitting whatever nation today? Huh, okay then.
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#260 Mar 10 2014 at 5:50 PM Rating: Good
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So my support of a nation to defend a border that was created decades before my birth means that now I should support splitting whatever nation today? Huh, okay then.

Not at all. I had assumed you had judged Israel's creation as a nation state as valid because of the right of self determination even of a diaspora of people over their homeland. If the standard was "welp, they're a country now, aint they" that's different. I guess we'll all just have to check back in in 20 years or so to see what became of Crimea before we can decide they have the right to determine how they're governed and by whom.

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#261 Mar 10 2014 at 6:03 PM Rating: Good
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#262 Mar 10 2014 at 7:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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#263 Mar 11 2014 at 9:12 PM Rating: Excellent
Timelordwho wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
You got me.

Well, yeah. I'm not saying you're wrong for being more invested but you definitely are. That's fine and all but you seem to think I share your zeal here when really I'm just having a laugh at your strange notions of how international affairs work. No offense to the fine vodka farmers of the Crimean peninsula but I don't terribly care if they end the month Ukrainian, Russian or Congolese.


Thats nice, I am invested in the politics of my Country, I don't agree that my government should on one hand attempt to promote democracy, while on the other hand say it only counts if its the outcome we support. Personally I don't care where Crimea ends up, I don't care if Ukraine gets split in half. I do care that my government has already made it clear that "we" will not respect the democratic decision of the people of Crimea. It makes my Country look incredibly weak as a proponent of Democracy in the world.



Edited, Mar 8th 2014 4:23pm by rdmcandie


This is what democracy looks like to you?


You mean from this source? http://www.rada.crimea.ua/textdoc/ru/6/act/1702pr.pdf

Rada works but that source linked in the Kiev times doesn't go anywhere. Im not saying it isn't legit, hard to validate though when the documents source doesn't exist.

and if that is in fact what it is. Then no that isn't very democratic.

Edited, Mar 11th 2014 11:15pm by rdmcandie

Edit After spending some effort to get to the website here is an English Translation of the text.


Appendix 1
to the Resolution of the Verkhovna Rada
Autonomous Republic of Crimea
on March 6, 2014 № 1702-6/14

to vote on the referendum March 16, 2014
 
 1) Do you support the reunification of the Crimea with Russia on rights
subject of the Russian Federation?
 
 
2) Do you support the restoration of the Constitution
Republic of Crimea in 1992 and as part of the status of
Ukraine?
 
 Newsletter, which left unmarked or marked both choices,
considered invalid.
 
Bulletin manufactured size 210 x 150 mm on a paper white.


After some further research
In May 1992 Crimean Constitution states that Crimea is an Independent state of Ukraine.
In June 1992 Kiev ordered Crimea to remove that portion and become an Autonomous Republic within Ukraine.


Option 1) Join the Russian Federation
Option 2) Restore the Constitution AS PART OF Ukraine.
(Either as an independent state...or as an autonomous state...the difference really being Kiev would have no control over Crimea in the Former and Marginal control over Crimea in the latter.)

~I assume that this would be returning to Independent state OF Ukraine. (May 1992 Constitution)~

Doesn't seem that bad to me.
1) Leave.
2) Stay.

Hardly the:

Leave Now
Leave Later

Options the media is swinging at the moment.Not that it matters because the Leave now is going to win hands down anyway.

(Also I seriously just spent like 3 hours trying to get through to a Ukrainian Government website...@#%^ this sh*t im done.)





Edited, Mar 12th 2014 3:02am by rdmcandie

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 3:11am by rdmcandie
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#264 Mar 12 2014 at 3:12 AM Rating: Good
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Last time they voted for secession, it was 10-20% of the vote.

It will be "interesting" to see how this vote goes with Russia troops at the polling stations.
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#265 Mar 12 2014 at 5:57 AM Rating: Decent
Timelordwho wrote:
Last time they voted for secession, it was 10-20% of the vote.

It will be "interesting" to see how this vote goes with Russia troops at the polling stations.


Eh I think you put way to much into the troops being there to be honest. But hey everyone needs their villains I guess.
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#266 Mar 12 2014 at 6:33 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
Last time they voted for secession, it was 10-20% of the vote.

It will be "interesting" to see how this vote goes with Russia troops at the polling stations.


Eh I think you put way to much into the troops being there to be honest. But hey everyone needs their villains I guess.

Lol, you ever voted with an armed uniformed soldier watching?

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#267 Mar 12 2014 at 7:08 AM Rating: Good
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
Last time they voted for secession, it was 10-20% of the vote.

It will be "interesting" to see how this vote goes with Russia troops at the polling stations.


Eh I think you put way to much into the troops being there to be honest. But hey everyone needs their villains I guess.

Lol, you ever voted with an armed uniformed soldier watching?



Have you? Just because they are there doesn't mean they sway the vote.

Call me when Russians actually start doing anything oppressive to the people of Crimea.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 9:09am by rdmcandie
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#268 Mar 12 2014 at 7:20 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
Last time they voted for secession, it was 10-20% of the vote.

It will be "interesting" to see how this vote goes with Russia troops at the polling stations.


Eh I think you put way to much into the troops being there to be honest. But hey everyone needs their villains I guess.

Lol, you ever voted with an armed uniformed soldier watching?



Have you? Just because they are there doesn't mean they sway the vote.

Call me when Russians actually start doing anything oppressive to the people of Crimea.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 9:09am by rdmcandie
Let me ask you...

If there is an election with armed guards and an election without armed guards - which is more likely to be swayed by intimidation, which is more 'democratic'?
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#269 Mar 12 2014 at 7:31 AM Rating: Decent
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As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.
#270 Mar 12 2014 at 7:36 AM Rating: Good
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Let me ask you...

If there is an election with armed guards and an election without armed guards - which is more likely to be swayed by intimidation, which is more 'democratic'?


Let me ask you. Are the armed guards pointing guns at my back. Or are they pointing guns at potential threats who may disrupt my ability to exercise my vote? There is a huge difference depending on which way the guns are facing. We lauded Afghanistan and Iraq Elections as democratic while Western Armies pointed guns at would be disruptors.

Fact is only one government in the region has taken any steps of provocation at disruption of the nation of Ukraine on a whole, and that is the one in Kiev. However minor it may be when your first act as PM is to rescind equal language laws for roughly half your nations population, it sends a very ill message. Russia hasn't shown prejudice to any singular body in Crimea, but Kiev has already expressed disdain to some degree for ethnic Russians, and Russian speakers across the whole country.

As I said before, Call me when Russian troops actually do anything other than keep the peace.


Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides. On one hand some might feel intimidated by their presence, on the other hand some could feel their presence is a hint at the possibility of danger.








Edited, Mar 12th 2014 9:41am by rdmcandie
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#271 Mar 12 2014 at 7:41 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?




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#272 Mar 12 2014 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?


No. You think Russia is going to risk war over shooting people for voting in a referendum they "win" anyway.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 9:42am by rdmcandie
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#273 Mar 12 2014 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?


No.

You're a fool or a liar.
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#274 Mar 12 2014 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
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Consider that the last time Russian troops were peacefully occupying, the Ukrainians were being intentionally starved to death and being replaced (later) with Russians.
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#275 Mar 12 2014 at 7:44 AM Rating: Default
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?


No.

You're a fool or a liar.


A realist. If Russia wanted to take Crimea by force, then they would have. Why play a charade that everyone already assumes is one. Come on you are wiser than that I hope.

Fact is Russia dominates Crimea whether its Russian, or Ukrainian and this vote doesn't change that at all.
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#276 Mar 12 2014 at 7:47 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?


No.

You're a fool or a liar.


A realist. If Russia wanted to take Crimea by force, then they would have. Why play a charade that everyone already assumes is one. Come on you are wiser than that I hope.

Fact is Russia dominates Crimea whether its Russian, or Ukrainian and this vote doesn't change that at all.

Not if Crimea remains part of Ukraine, and the Ukraine joins NATO.
#277 Mar 12 2014 at 7:49 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Yodabunny wrote:
As long as the soldier's can't see the votes it should be a non-issue for those who show up for the vote. The concern there is voter turn out I think. I'd be hesitant to go to a polling station full of what are essentially occupying foreign forces no matter how peaceful they say they are.


Now this I can agree with. There is potential that the troops their could cause decline turnout, for both sides.
But not one side more than the other?


No.

You're a fool or a liar.


A realist. If Russia wanted to take Crimea by force, then they would have. Why play a charade that everyone already assumes is one. Come on you are wiser than that I hope.

Fact is Russia dominates Crimea whether its Russian, or Ukrainian and this vote doesn't change that at all.
What does this have to do with insisting that armed Russian guards are not going to intimidate native Ukrains whose desires might be to get to the polls and vote for the anti-Russian position?

On the other hand, you've basically admitted that the 'vote' is just a little democratic decoration and the referendums outcome already determined.




Edited, Mar 12th 2014 3:52pm by Elinda
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#278 Mar 12 2014 at 7:51 AM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
Why play a charade that everyone already assumes is one.
As a charade enough of the population believes you to delay any meaningful or timely reaction, whereas overt doesn't give you much protection against global retaliation.
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#279 Mar 12 2014 at 7:52 AM Rating: Decent
Timelordwho wrote:

Not if Crimea remains part of Ukraine, and the Ukraine joins NATO.


Um ya they do. If/When Ukraine joins NATO Crimea just has another referendum. Do you think that the Eastern States of Ukraine want to be in NATO? sh*t they don't even want to be involved with the EU. I think you seriously underestimate the division in Ukraine. Which is preyed upon by both sides. Its why the EU told Ukraine pick the Trade Deal OR Energy Deal, its why the US said in November Pick one or the other. Its why Russia calls the West anti Russian (granted Yats helped his case huge with the change to Russian language laws).

If Ukraine Joins NATO it won't just be Crimea jumping ship.

lolgaxe wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
Why play a charade that everyone already assumes is one.
As a charade enough of the population believes you to delay any meaningful or timely reaction, whereas overt doesn't give you much protection against global retaliation.


Yes and no, the US and EU were never going to actually do anything. **** even the sanctions are softball. Even if Russia rolled right into Kiev you would be hard pressed any foreign entity willing to go to War with Russia (and likely China). You could put sanctions on them, and they would just cut of energy supply to Europe. German Economy would fall to pieces, and with it the EU would crumble beside it.

Ultimately if it is a big charade, then the West was stupid for even dancing to Putins tune. Its a lose lose, because ultimately nothing changes. Russia will still have more influence in the East than anyone else. Such is life.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 9:55am by rdmcandie
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#280 Mar 12 2014 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
Elinda wrote:
What does this have to do with insisting that armed Russian guards are not going to intimidate native Ukrains whose desires might be to get to the polls and vote for the anti-Russian position?

On the other hand, you've basically admitted that the 'vote' is just a little democratic decoration and the referendums outcome already determined.


What if one of those native Ukrainians heads to a voter booth with a bomb strapped to his chest. Or a Tartar looking to blow up pro Russian supporters? Door swings both ways.

As for the other hand, I didn't say the outcome is determined. I said the outcome doesn't matter. Russia will still dominate influence in the Crimea, It helps when like 60% of the population is ethnic Russian.

I did say earlier however that the probability is that they will join Russia. If every eligible citizen voted along "expected" lines Then Russia would win with ~60% of the vote (or more). Which makes the whole vote largely irrelevant.

Some of you guys are looking way to much into this Crimea stuff and not about the real effects of whats happened. The vote changes nothing, the "crisis" changes nothing. All that has happened is Barrack Obama appears weaker on the international stage. Harper looks like a lapdog, and the West as a whole looks incredibly hypocritical for predetermining where and when democratic process applies.

I am sure China who hasn't said anything is eating this all up.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 10:03am by rdmcandie

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 10:03am by rdmcandie
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#281 Mar 12 2014 at 8:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
What does this have to do with insisting that armed Russian guards are not going to intimidate native Ukrains whose desires might be to get to the polls and vote for the anti-Russian position?

On the other hand, you've basically admitted that the 'vote' is just a little democratic decoration and the referendums outcome already determined.


What if one of those native Ukrainians heads to a voter booth with a bomb strapped to his chest. Or a Tartar looking to blow up pro Russian supporters? Door swings both ways.
[
As for the other hand, I didn't say the outcome is determined. I said the outcome doesn't matter. Russia will still dominate influence in the Crimea, It helps when like 60% of the population is ethnic Russian.

I did say earlier however that the probability is that they will join Russia. If every eligible citizen voted along "expected" lines Then Russia would win with ~60% of the vote (or more). Which makes the whole vote largely irrelevant.



Edited, Mar 12th 2014 10:00am by rdmcandie
If Ukraine wants to join Russian, I'm fine with that, but stop already with the holier than though Russian defense for democracy. Haven't you already been whipped for that here?
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#282 Mar 12 2014 at 8:14 AM Rating: Decent
Elinda wrote:
[quote=Stalker rdmcandie]If Ukraine wants to join Russian, I'm fine with that, but stop already with the holier than though Russian defense for democracy. Haven't you already been whipped for that here?


I haven't said anything about Russia defending democracy. I have said the West is being hypocritical in their opposition to this democratic process, and im not sure what you mean by whipped? If you mean getting Joph to the point where he had to result to calling me a kid because he couldn't come up with a rational counter argument as to why the West appears hypocritical on the world stage, sure I got right whipped.

Only thing Russia has done is answered a call to provide security for a state that believed itself to be under prejudice from the National government in Kiev. Thats all the facts show, everything else in between has been the people of Crimea and their elected body making a decision on what they feel is best for the future of their state. Thats it.

But continue to parrot Washingtons evil Russian Narrative.



Edited, Mar 12th 2014 10:15am by rdmcandie
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#283 Mar 12 2014 at 8:27 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
[quote=Stalker rdmcandie]If Ukraine wants to join Russian, I'm fine with that, but stop already with the holier than though Russian defense for democracy. Haven't you already been whipped for that here?


I haven't said anything about Russia defending democracy. I have said the West is being hypocritical in their opposition to this democratic process, and im not sure what you mean by whipped?
Elections are part of a democratic process. Invading a territory and putting your armed guards at their polls is not part of the democratic process.

Your over-defense of Russia is skewing your arguments.
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#284 Mar 12 2014 at 8:37 AM Rating: Good
Elinda wrote:
Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Elinda wrote:
[quote=Stalker rdmcandie]If Ukraine wants to join Russian, I'm fine with that, but stop already with the holier than though Russian defense for democracy. Haven't you already been whipped for that here?


I haven't said anything about Russia defending democracy. I have said the West is being hypocritical in their opposition to this democratic process, and im not sure what you mean by whipped?
Elections are part of a democratic process. Invading a territory and putting your armed guards at their polls is not part of the democratic process.

Your over-defense of Russia is skewing your arguments.


But Iraq and Afghanistan count as great victories for democracy! Or does that kind of thing only count if we are the ones doing it?

Also Russia didn't invade they were requested to provide security by the Government of Crimea. If that is an invasion better tell Barrack to get Paris on the line regarding North Mali they have been invading for over a year now.

If you call stating facts over-defense you must not follow the news outside your little security bubble very much. Only people calling this an invasion are Americans. **** even Europe stopped barking up that tree a week ago.

Done restating **** Hit me up when Russia actually violates an International law.



Edited, Mar 12th 2014 10:41am by rdmcandie
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#285 Mar 12 2014 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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What do Iran and Afghanistan have to do with anything? For that matter what does the US have to do with this discussion?

My only claim was that the vote in Crimea would be influenced by the presence of a Russian military force. You claim it won't be. I think you're wrong.

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#286 Mar 12 2014 at 9:00 AM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
Only people calling this an invasion are Americans.
I guess that dozen Russian soldiers kicked out of Canada a couple days ago was due to expired work visas?
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#287 Mar 12 2014 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
Only people calling this an invasion are Americans.
I guess that dozen Russian soldiers kicked out of Canada a couple days ago was due to expired work visas?



They were lost.

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#288 Mar 12 2014 at 9:16 AM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
Only people calling this an invasion are Americans.
I guess that dozen Russian soldiers kicked out of Canada a couple days ago was due to expired work visas?



They were lost.



Russia was running low on maple syrup and bears, so they thought they could make a quick buck by smuggling.
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#289 Mar 12 2014 at 9:32 AM Rating: Good
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Yes and no, the US and EU were never going to actually do anything. **** even the sanctions are softball. Even if Russia rolled right into Kiev you would be hard pressed any foreign entity willing to go to War with Russia (and likely China). You could put sanctions on them, and they would just cut of energy supply to Europe. German Economy would fall to pieces, and with it the EU would crumble beside it.


China would not join with Russia in a war for Ukraine. Are you retarded?

The German economy is not entirely contingent upon oil from Russia. Are you retarded?
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#290 Mar 12 2014 at 9:36 AM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
Quote:
Yes and no, the US and EU were never going to actually do anything. **** even the sanctions are softball. Even if Russia rolled right into Kiev you would be hard pressed any foreign entity willing to go to War with Russia (and likely China). You could put sanctions on them, and they would just cut of energy supply to Europe. German Economy would fall to pieces, and with it the EU would crumble beside it.


China would not join with Russia in a war for Ukraine. Are you retarded?

The German economy is not entirely contingent upon oil from Russia. Are you retarded?
Yeah China has been doing their best to hide from this whole thing. It flies in the face of the whole "not meddling in other countries affairs" thing they've been harping on for the last decade or two. China has seen all kinds of growth since they opened up to the west, and we're all pretty intertwined nowadays. I doubt they'd be able to cut those ties even if they wanted to.
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#291 Mar 12 2014 at 11:40 AM Rating: Decent
Timelordwho wrote:
Quote:
Yes and no, the US and EU were never going to actually do anything. **** even the sanctions are softball. Even if Russia rolled right into Kiev you would be hard pressed any foreign entity willing to go to War with Russia (and likely China). You could put sanctions on them, and they would just cut of energy supply to Europe. German Economy would fall to pieces, and with it the EU would crumble beside it.


China would not join with Russia in a war for Ukraine. Are you retarded?

The German economy is not entirely contingent upon oil from Russia. Are you retarded?


I didn't say China would go to war over Ukraine. I said they would go to war likely on the opposite side as us. Japan didn't go to war in Europe did it?

No but 50% of its Energy is dependant upon Russia, and you need Energy to run an economy so...
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#292 Mar 12 2014 at 1:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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So they should join us and we'll split Russia when we annex it!
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#293 Mar 12 2014 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
Jophiel wrote:
So they should join us and we'll split Russia when we annex it!

I don't think that is a war anyone would walk away from in any position to do any annexing.
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#294 Mar 12 2014 at 1:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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That defeatist attitude is why Canada never does anything cool.
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#295 Mar 12 2014 at 1:41 PM Rating: Decent
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A realist. If Russia wanted to take Crimea by force, then they would have


That's exactly what they have done; they are currently occupying it with their armed forces. The referendum is a way of legitimising the annexation of the territory, one that has little cost and much to recommend it.
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#296 Mar 12 2014 at 1:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
That defeatist attitude is why Canada never does anything cool.
They're just waiting for global warming to make them a temperate paradise while the rest of us bake at these lower latitudes. A nuclear winter would put those plan on ice. Smiley: clown
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#297 Mar 12 2014 at 3:28 PM Rating: Good
Jophiel wrote:
That defeatist attitude is why Canada never does anything cool.

We're not allowed unless big brother and Pops say it is all right first.

Edited, Mar 12th 2014 5:28pm by rdmcandie
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#298 Mar 12 2014 at 4:42 PM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
Quote:
Yes and no, the US and EU were never going to actually do anything. **** even the sanctions are softball. Even if Russia rolled right into Kiev you would be hard pressed any foreign entity willing to go to War with Russia (and likely China). You could put sanctions on them, and they would just cut of energy supply to Europe. German Economy would fall to pieces, and with it the EU would crumble beside it.


China would not join with Russia in a war for Ukraine. Are you retarded?

The German economy is not entirely contingent upon oil from Russia. Are you retarded?


I didn't say China would go to war over Ukraine. I said they would go to war likely on the opposite side as us. Japan didn't go to war in Europe did it?

No but 50% of its Energy is dependant upon Russia, and you need Energy to run an economy so...


Why would China fight us? Especially now?
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#299 Mar 12 2014 at 4:56 PM Rating: Excellent
Meat Popsicle
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Timelordwho wrote:
Why would China fight us? Especially now?
We owe them money, and we're not paying them back fast enough. So they send some goons to rough us up a bit and speed things along.
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#300 Mar 12 2014 at 5:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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China would never go to war with us. Doing so would turn all that loan money into a gift.
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#301 Mar 12 2014 at 5:06 PM Rating: Good
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It would also severely jack up both our economies. It would likely lead to the death of the current CCP faction, and something new taking their place. Maybe in 20-30 years it would be an option.
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