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#52 Aug 02 2013 at 6:06 PM Rating: Default
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The threshold needed to get non-aligned voters to go towards one party instead of the other is far far lower than that required to have members of a party switch sides. Given that those voters are often the deciding factor in elections, that's kinda significant.
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#53 Aug 02 2013 at 6:09 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
The threshold needed to get non-aligned voters to go towards one party instead of the other is far far lower than that required to have members of a party switch sides. Given that those voters are often the deciding factor in elections, that's kinda significant.


Yeah, but you're fooling yourself if you think *** scandals are having any influence on those voters, who are overwhelmingly younger or don't care.

The Republican Party's social issues are what are costing it the youth vote. 18-24 year olds couldn't give two ***** about some guy banging other guys, or sexting some women, etc.
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#54 Aug 02 2013 at 6:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
If that were true, no one would worry about things like party "brand", or whether to call themselves liberal or progressive, or any of a dozen factors which political analysts know influence people's opinions because of associative reasoning.

Again, it's more important how the party deals with it than the individual failing. When the party actively disavows the person and pushes them out, it's seem as a problem with the person. When the party circles the wagons and defends him, it's seen as a systemic trait in the party itself (i.e. the "brand").
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#55 Aug 02 2013 at 7:05 PM Rating: Default
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
gbaji wrote:
The threshold needed to get non-aligned voters to go towards one party instead of the other is far far lower than that required to have members of a party switch sides. Given that those voters are often the deciding factor in elections, that's kinda significant.


Yeah, but you're fooling yourself if you think *** scandals are having any influence on those voters, who are overwhelmingly younger or don't care.

The Republican Party's social issues are what are costing it the youth vote. 18-24 year olds couldn't give two sh*ts about some guy banging other guys, or sexting some women, etc.


Have you seen a picture of the guy? Young people do tend to care about creepy old guys grabbing women and fondling them against their wishes. And if those young voters associate the Democratic party with his image and all that comes along with it? Big win. He's creepy as ****.
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#56 Aug 02 2013 at 7:10 PM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
gbaji wrote:
If that were true, no one would worry about things like party "brand", or whether to call themselves liberal or progressive, or any of a dozen factors which political analysts know influence people's opinions because of associative reasoning.

Again, it's more important how the party deals with it than the individual failing. When the party actively disavows the person and pushes them out, it's seem as a problem with the person. When the party circles the wagons and defends him, it's seen as a systemic trait in the party itself (i.e. the "brand").


Yup. So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel refuse to call for him to resign, what message is being sent? When Democratic political organizations attempt to use tricks to prevent a recall election from succeeding (yeah, despite later ruling by the attorney), what message is being sent?


It's a message that says loud and clear: "The Democrats and their backers don't care about what's right or wrong. They care about holding power for their party. Even to the point of defending/protecting a complete scumbag like Filner". Add in the questions about why it took so long for women to come forward, with the attendant suspicion/fear of use of political power to keep people quiet (not proven, but who cares in a case like this) and it's incredibly toxic to the Dem brand here.
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#57 Aug 02 2013 at 7:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Yup. So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel refuse to call for him to resign, what message is being sent?

If that's the case (again, my following and interest in this are pretty minimal) then that's not good for the Democrats. They should probably do something about that.
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#58 Aug 02 2013 at 7:17 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
gbaji wrote:
The threshold needed to get non-aligned voters to go towards one party instead of the other is far far lower than that required to have members of a party switch sides. Given that those voters are often the deciding factor in elections, that's kinda significant.


Yeah, but you're fooling yourself if you think *** scandals are having any influence on those voters, who are overwhelmingly younger or don't care.

The Republican Party's social issues are what are costing it the youth vote. 18-24 year olds couldn't give two sh*ts about some guy banging other guys, or sexting some women, etc.


Have you seen a picture of the guy? Young people do tend to care about creepy old guys grabbing women and fondling them against their wishes. And if those young voters associate the Democratic party with his image and all that comes along with it? Big win. He's creepy as ****.


Considering I'm sure every single one of them has, at some point, looked into the cold, dead eyes of Sarah Palin or Michelle Bachmann, winced at the disgusting visage of Donald Trump as he spittles all over the camera whilst calling for a revolution, or had a vivid nightmare where Paul Ryan was raping them in a back alley...

... I'm pretty sure the Democratic Party is going to do just fine.
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#59 Aug 02 2013 at 7:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel refuse to call for him to resign, what message is being sent?
Well, the message I'm receiving is that you don't follow the news too closely since seven out of nine of the council members, along with the Democratic Party, have called for him to resign.
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#60 Aug 02 2013 at 7:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Let's be honest here, you are just saying things that you want to be true.
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#61 Aug 02 2013 at 7:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
gbaji wrote:
So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel refuse to call for him to resign, what message is being sent?
Well, the message I'm receiving is that you don't follow the news too closely since seven out of nine of the council members, along with the Democratic Party, have called for him to resign.

I thought that was the case (not the exact numbers but the general wind direction) but am happily willing to admit my ignorance of local San Diego city politics.
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#62 Aug 02 2013 at 7:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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Contrary to what you believe, San Diego isn't the center of the universe, but Google still seems to work.
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#63 Aug 02 2013 at 7:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Goes back to my general lack of interest. The only reason I know the little bit about the story as I do is because updates pop up on Political Wire.
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#64 Aug 04 2013 at 3:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Among other claims, she says he asked her to work without wearing underwear.

No. Just No.
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#65 Aug 04 2013 at 5:12 AM Rating: Default
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Aripyanfar wrote:
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Among other claims, she says he asked her to work without wearing underwear.

No. Just No.


Easy access? Then again, even if you're down with getting it on in the office, how hard is it to slide off underwear? The ease of access isn't worth the lack of comfort, unless you're a Soldier in the field.
#66 Aug 04 2013 at 6:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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Almalieque wrote:
Easy access? Then again, even if you're down with getting it on in the office, how hard is it to slide off underwear? The ease of access isn't worth the lack of comfort, unless you're a Soldier in the field.

Duuude. How busy do you get, in the field?
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#67 Aug 04 2013 at 7:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Some guys are apparently incredibly turned on merely by the thought that a woman is going commando. Since he's a huge perv it seems, he'd love the idea of rubbing his hand on a plump derrier and there being no panty lines.

Yeah, if anyone in a business situation made any commentary regarding my underthings (other than a discreet "Psst your hem is crooked and your slip is showing!") I'd be complaining up the chain of command faster than a **** groper in a Tokyo subway.

Edited, Aug 4th 2013 9:52am by Catwho
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#68 Aug 04 2013 at 3:27 PM Rating: Default
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Arip wrote:
Duuude. How busy do you get, in the field?

Catwho wrote:
Some guys are apparently incredibly turned on merely by the thought that a woman is going commando. Since he's a huge perv it seems, he'd love the idea of rubbing his hand on a plump derrier and there being no panty lines.


You misunderstood. Guys are more likely not to take "showers" in the field than women. Because of that, instead of wearing the same underwear for days at a time, they just choose to change pants and "free ball" it. It's more air. I, on the other hand, just buy more underwear, but that's something that people do.

#69 Aug 05 2013 at 5:49 AM Rating: Good
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It was a fun misunderstanding while it lasted Smiley: bah
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#70 Aug 05 2013 at 6:36 AM Rating: Good
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With today's modern textiles are underwear still necessary?
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#71 Aug 05 2013 at 7:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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How else will people know it's the official home of the whopper?
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#72 Aug 06 2013 at 5:53 PM Rating: Default
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lolgaxe wrote:
gbaji wrote:
So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel refuse to call for him to resign, what message is being sent?
Well, the message I'm receiving is that you don't follow the news too closely since seven out of nine of the council members, along with the Democratic Party, have called for him to resign.


You should have spent a little more time on google then. The two who haven't asked him to resign are both members of the Democratic party: Myrtle Cole and Marti Emerald.

And they're both women. Some Democrats have called for him to resign, and they get a lot of press for doing so, but there are some who have stopped short. Nancy Pelosi (you know, the House Minority leader?) didn't call for him to resign. Obama decided to not comment on this at all (which is strange because he manages to inject himself into every other "local" issue when it suits him). Democrats in general seem more interested in just keeping the whole thing at a distance rather than actually saying he should resign. Ignore it, and it'll go away I guess?

Again, this isn't really about the national party, but it does send a strong message locally about the party and how it deals with things like this. Given the inroads the Dems have made in local politics over the last couple decades, this is hurting them very badly.
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#73 Aug 06 2013 at 6:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
The two who haven't asked him to resign are both members of the Democratic party: Myrtle Cole and Marti Emerald.

And they're both women. Some Democrats have called for him to resign, and they get a lot of press for doing so, but there are some who have stopped short.
I guess Sherri Lightner, the council president pro-tem, a woman, and a Democrat doesn't count as "prominent" enough for you? Then there's Todd Gloria, though I guess that one doesn't count for having a *****. Any other criteria you're going to change after your initial argument fell apart? I mean, "some people support their team no matter what" isn't exactly a got'cha by any measure. Both parties have done it for eleventy million years. You're the only one that seems to believe otherwise.
gbaji wrote:
Nancy Pelosi (you know, the House Minority leader?) didn't call for him to resign. Obama decided to not comment on this at all (which is strange because he manages to inject himself into every other "local" issue when it suits him)
Okay, I wasn't aware they were on the San Diego City Council as well. You know, like your initial talking point?
gbaji wrote:
Again, this isn't really about the national party,
Yet here you are name dropping Pelosi and Obama.
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#74gbaji, Posted: Aug 06 2013 at 8:21 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) In response to other national Dem names that were dropped. I wasn't the one who introduced folks not in the immediate region into the conversation, but if someone does, it's certainly fair to point out that other non-local prominent Democrats have also failed to call for his resignation.
#75 Aug 06 2013 at 8:52 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
I never said that *no* prominent Democrats were calling for him to resign. I said that some prominent Democrats were *not* calling for him to resign
I'll grant you that you didn't say "no" prominent, but you certainly didn't even attempt to imply that you meant "some" either. "So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel" doesn't mean, in any language, what you're now trying to imply you said.
gbaji wrote:
And it's certainly fair to point to the two Democrats sitting on the **** city council who failed to do so.
It would be if you weren't trying to either subtly imply the other two, one of which was the pro tem of the **** council itself, weren't urging him to resign, didn't matter, or simply weren't aware of it. With your track record, I'd believe either.
gbaji wrote:
Cause I don't know what else you were talking about, if that's not the case.
It was a reference to the 34-6 vote by the San Diego Democratic Party committee to urge Filner to resign, not a reference to any particular individual.

Edited, Aug 6th 2013 11:10pm by lolgaxe
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#76 Aug 07 2013 at 4:41 PM Rating: Default
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lolgaxe wrote:
gbaji wrote:
I never said that *no* prominent Democrats were calling for him to resign. I said that some prominent Democrats were *not* calling for him to resign
I'll grant you that you didn't say "no" prominent, but you certainly didn't even attempt to imply that you meant "some" either. "So when prominent Democrats on the city cancel" doesn't mean, in any language, what you're now trying to imply you said.
gbaji wrote:
And it's certainly fair to point to the two Democrats sitting on the **** city council who failed to do so.
It would be if you weren't trying to either subtly imply the other two, one of which was the pro tem of the **** council itself, weren't urging him to resign, didn't matter, or simply weren't aware of it. With your track record, I'd believe either.


No. I made the mistake of assuming you knew as much about the issue as I did. My bad, but around here everyone knows which Democrats came forward initially and called on him to resign, and lots of people are shocked that there are any on the city council who have refused to do so. My comment was in reference to that. It was not at all my intent to mislead you. I honestly didn't realize that someone might think that I was implying that no democrats were calling for him to resign. ****. The woman who initially started this whole ball rolling (Donna Frye) is a Democrat (and was a huge Filner supporter).

I just assumed you knew that.


Quote:
gbaji wrote:
Cause I don't know what else you were talking about, if that's not the case.
It was a reference to the 34-6 vote by the San Diego Democratic Party committee to urge Filner to resign, not a reference to any particular individual.


My bad then. It seemed like you were talking about the national party. Given that most searches about the issue prominently talk about Shultz calling on him to resign, I thought that's what you were referencing.

As to the San Diego Democratic Party? It took them a very long time to do this, and only after serious outrage that they hadn't (and frankly, it's still shocking that it wasn't unanimous). They initially voted not to call on him to resign (and this was several days after specifics about his actions had been released, which itself was several days after Frye revealed the generalities and called on him to resign) and that was a huge story here locally. Finally coming around really is too little too late in this case (like two weeks too late).

What's doubly bizarre about this is that it's not like one could argue that there was some kind of partisan fake scandal thing going on here. It was folks within the Democratic party who brought this to light in the first place. Donna Frye apparently provided him with information about what she had and gave him the opportunity to resign gracefully (presumably with some made up story about why), and he refused. As a result, she publicly announced that she had evidence of his actions and called on him to resign. He still refused. A few days after that, she released some of the data she had, including positions (but not names) of women making the allegations and again called on him to resign. He still refused. Three days after that, the local Democratic Party voted not to call on him to resign. This sparked yet more outrage. And after that, woman after woman has come forward with more allegations. Despite this, it still took the Democrats another couple weeks to finally call on him to resign. And still not unanimously.

I don't pretend to know what kind of party infighting is going on, but it's basically popcorn worthy from the other side of the fence. But this is why I say that the Dems are killing themselves with this. Whatever gains they've made in terms of public perception over the years have been massively wiped out in the last month.

Edited, Aug 7th 2013 3:43pm by gbaji
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