Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

**** your autistic kid, I'm tired of hearing about him.Follow

#152 Mar 24 2013 at 2:33 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Again, you're inferring things about me that aren't true. I don't think of any of you as less than me. I certainly don't see you as insects. If I seem cold about it, it's just because I also don't believe for an instant that any of you care the least bit about me. I don't mean that in a personal way, but just in the way that people don't care about others that they don't know. How many of you really see me as a person?

If you care about me, I am all too happy to care about you. If that deal doesn't interest you, then I am not the least little bit bothered by that, no more than I am by all the other billions in the world to which my existence is meaningless. Isn't that just how people generally work?

I guess the problem is that I don't know how to articulate this kindly: I have for most of my adult life felt as if surrounded by children. That doesn't mean I don't love children, respect them, or think of them as any less entitled to happiness and respect than I. But I also understand the frustration that accompanies it. If I could think of an affirming, supportive way to assert these things about myself, I would love to use those words, but as I admitted, I am something of a social dummy. I am not trying to put others down or lift myself above them--those feelings aren't in me, no matter what words I choose to express myself. I was just attempting to share a sentiment with someone who seemed to be in a plight that I identified with.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#153 Mar 24 2013 at 2:45 PM Rating: Good
Soulless Internet Tiger
******
35,381 posts
Kachi wrote:
How many of you really see me as a person?
I was recently playing an online game and someone was named Kechi. I thought it was you at first and was excited.
____________________________
Donate. One day it could be your family.


An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo

#154 Mar 24 2013 at 2:59 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Sorry, afraid not. Why would you be excited to see me?

I feel it's fair to add that I'm not blaming anyone for making those inferences about me, by the way. I recognize that they're understandable.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#155 Mar 24 2013 at 3:14 PM Rating: Good
****
6,471 posts
Kachi wrote:
Seems to me that you're inferring arrogance where there is none. I was just trying to relate with the person I was talking to by sharing some self perceptions. Do you always perceive it as toolish/defensive when someone explains how they think and feel about themselves to you? Seems like it would make for problematic interpersonal relationships.


Do you not understand that this:

Quote:
I have -never- met someone I considered to be my intellectual equal (you're welcome to think that's hubris; I've learned not to care). e.g., I trounce the MENSA people I know in games of strategy. I was virtually a recluse for seven years just because I couldn't tolerate other people. It wasn't that I didn't know or understand social conventions--I was just miserably frustrated being around normal people. Every time they would open their mouths, the words that came out would bore me at best, and often make me cringe inside.


...refers to people other than yourself?

You're welcome to think what you want about your intelligence and that of others around you, but this all just strikes me as run-of-the-mill sociopathy.
#156 Mar 24 2013 at 3:29 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
I do, but I guess I was lead to feel safe in saying so, as the person that I was talking directly to had essentially raised the point already.

I might not have made it quite clear, but that is how I used to feel. I always cared about and empathized with others. Really, my inclination is to be a very loving person. For example, I have two little sisters who are about 20-25 years younger than I am, and we have a great relationship. We love to see each other, to do things together, and we care about one another deeply. (I'm even their favorite! Shh, that's a secret.) But that doesn't mean that I don't get tired of them if I'm around them all day, every day.

Point being, I don't think I weigh in much more heavily on the sociopath scale than most people that I've talked to candidly. Maybe somewhere above average, but I'm far from a sociopath.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#157 Mar 24 2013 at 3:32 PM Rating: Good
Repressed Memories
******
20,917 posts
Kachi wrote:
If I seem cold about it, it's just because I also don't believe for an instant that any of you care the least bit about me.

No, you're not reacting to antipathy here. You provoked it. No one antagonized you until your comment about being intellectual superior to everyone you've ever met. You're not a victim, you're an assailant.
#158 Mar 24 2013 at 4:06 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
I still don't see how that's antagonizing anyone. Per the discussion we were having, it was merely an anecdote in support of my position.

I mean, the person I was talking to asserted the same thing, you realize. Correction: they may have met people they consider their equal, just that none are here. But that's rather a moot point.

Edited, Mar 24th 2013 3:08pm by Kachi
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#159 Mar 24 2013 at 4:09 PM Rating: Excellent
******
21,720 posts
Kachi wrote:
I still don't see how that's antagonizing anyone.


Not surprising, considering the recent trend of this conversation has done nothing to shed light on any supposed intelligence on your end of the wire.
____________________________
R.I.P. Jessica M. 5/3/2010
This post brought to you by Carl's Jr.
gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#160 Mar 24 2013 at 4:19 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Quack, quack. Right back at you.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#161 Mar 24 2013 at 4:45 PM Rating: Excellent
Supreme Lionator
*****
14,174 posts
Let me talk to you in a way you can understand.

Kachi wrote:
I still don't see how that's antagonizing anyone. Per the discussion we were having, it was merely an anecdote in support of my position.

I mean, the person I was talking to asserted the same thing, you realize. Correction: they may have met people they consider their equal, just that none are here. But that's rather a moot point.


It's probably something to do with the fact that you express yourself in a stilted, priggish manner. Most people you meet regard you as a bit of a tool, quite apart from what you think about how intelligent you are. Smasharoo is quite funny, which makes him more likable. People are more willing to tolerate things that they see as rude or inaccurate from people they like. Your boast will be regarded as more inaccurate, too, and that's another factor we have to consider.

Let's talk a bit more about that. It's difficult to see how anyone without a strong grasp of social dynamics and psychology could be an excellent strategist. More generally, if you accept that you're socially retarded you should expect people to perceive you as unintelligent if all they've done is talked to you. Your claims to genius, even if they are true, will seem wildly implausible. Generally, people will react to someone they see as a boastful idiot with expressions of contempt.

There, I hope that helped you to understand the ways of humans. If you see more behaviour that confuses you, feel free to drop me a line.
____________________________
“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
#162 Mar 24 2013 at 4:56 PM Rating: Excellent
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,360 posts
Kachi wrote:
I also don't believe for an instant that any of you care the least bit about me.
I care about everybody in the Asylum and the OoT. You guys are my besties!
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#163 Mar 24 2013 at 5:39 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Kavekk wrote:
Let me talk to you in a way you can understand.

Kachi wrote:
I still don't see how that's antagonizing anyone. Per the discussion we were having, it was merely an anecdote in support of my position.

I mean, the person I was talking to asserted the same thing, you realize. Correction: they may have met people they consider their equal, just that none are here. But that's rather a moot point.


It's probably something to do with the fact that you express yourself in a stilted, priggish manner. Most people you meet regard you as a bit of a tool, quite apart from what you think about how intelligent you are. Smasharoo is quite funny, which makes him more likable. People are more willing to tolerate things that they see as rude or inaccurate from people they like. Your boast will be regarded as more inaccurate, too, and that's another factor we have to consider.

Let's talk a bit more about that. It's difficult to see how anyone without a strong grasp of social dynamics and psychology could be an excellent strategist. More generally, if you accept that you're socially retarded you should expect people to perceive you as unintelligent if all they've done is talked to you. Your claims to genius, even if they are true, will seem wildly implausible. Generally, people will react to someone they see as a boastful idiot with expressions of contempt.

There, I hope that helped you to understand the ways of humans. If you see more behaviour that confuses you, feel free to drop me a line.


I've considered that a large part of it is probably that I'm seen as taking myself too seriously. But to me, this is just a game of "can we understand one another?" I think it's very amusing. I guess that makes me dreadfully boring and frustrating to others. I suppose it's a convenience to dismiss their feelings when the benefit of the relationship is so one-sided, though I truthfully thought that most of the conflict here was for the purpose of amusement. But I better understand now; thank you for taking the time to explain your perceptions.

Having said that, I still contend that I showed no disrespect to anyone, and yet I elicited disrespect in return. That makes it difficult for me to feel that establishing any emotional investment is warranted.

As for social dynamics and psychology, I do have a strong grasp of them, albeit in a more rigid, technical sense. My PhD is in psychology. And many of the people I've talked to regard me as very intelligent, even brilliant. Even those with established IQs of 150+, like my significant other and certain colleagues. High intelligence runs in my family (as does autism, apparently).

To me, it's just a matter of fact. Suppose you are one in a thousand. That's not so ridiculous, really, is it? There would be nearly 300,000 such people in the U.S. alone. And how many people are subscribed to this board? Would you say that you've actually, really, met a thousand people? Now what if you turn it up a standard deviation, and it's closer to ten thousand? There's nothing so incredulous about asserting that I've never met someone I consider an intellectual equal (and I do mean actually met). At that point, it's just statistics playing out. And that's just intelligence. For some people it's their athletic ability, or another strength. On the internet, exceptional people are all around. Your odds of meeting an exceptional person online are thousands of times more probable than in person, logistically.

I truly didn't mean to sound pompous. If Smash is anything like me, we've endured similar problems. I was only trying to establish a basis with which to empathize and encourage. Clearly, I failed to do that. But even brilliant people have numerous everyday failings.

Edited, Mar 24th 2013 5:05pm by Kachi
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#164 Mar 24 2013 at 5:40 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Friar Bijou wrote:
Kachi wrote:
I also don't believe for an instant that any of you care the least bit about me.
I care about everybody in the Asylum and the OoT. You guys are my besties!


Am I included in that? I'll probably be gone in like, a week.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#165 Mar 24 2013 at 5:44 PM Rating: Good
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,360 posts
Kachi wrote:
Friar Bijou wrote:
Kachi wrote:
I also don't believe for an instant that any of you care the least bit about me.
I care about everybody in the Asylum and the OoT. You guys are my besties!
Am I included in that? I'll probably be gone in like, a week.
And then I'll miss you because that how it works.Smiley: grin
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#166 Mar 24 2013 at 5:53 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,913 posts
Elinda wrote:

What I have a hard time believing is that someone with extraordinary intelligence would be spending their time arguing this unanswerable question with strangers on in internet gaming forum.


The really smart ones get paid to do it!
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#167 Mar 24 2013 at 5:59 PM Rating: Good
Sage
****
4,042 posts
This is how I feel when I read the Asylum: Smiley: crymore
#168 Mar 24 2013 at 6:13 PM Rating: Good
GBATE!! Never saw it coming
Avatar
****
9,360 posts
Guenny wrote:
This is how I feel when I read the Asylum: Smiley: crymore
That's how I feel when trying to read the TG thread...if you add comic headache do-dads to the smiley.
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#169 Mar 24 2013 at 8:09 PM Rating: Good
Everyone's Oiran
*****
15,952 posts
BrownDuck wrote:
Kachi wrote:
I can't mention one of mine in passing without it being seen as me boasting like a tool?



Kachi wrote:
I have -never- met someone I considered to be my intellectual equal (you're welcome to think that's hubris; I've learned not to care). e.g., I trounce the MENSA people I know in games of strategy. I was virtually a recluse for seven years just because I couldn't tolerate other people. It wasn't that I didn't know or understand social conventions--I was just miserably frustrated being around normal people. Every time they would open their mouths, the words that came out would bore me at best, and often make me cringe inside.


This paragraph is what makes you a tool. If you were half as smart as you claim, you would have very little trouble discerning why.

Well, you obviously didn't read http://www.triplenine.org/download/IQ_and_the_Problem_of_Social_Adjustment.pdf, which TL:DR helpfully linked to us. That link says EXACTLY why almost every extremely intelligent person is completely unsocialized, or in other words, lacks any "social intelligence". Being hyper intelligent will NOT explain to them how and why other people act, behave and speak the way that they do. We are literally incomprehensible to them. Unless the hyper-intelligent person stumbles across psychological and behavioral texts in their young childhood.
____________________________
<3

http://www.reddit.com/r/Forum4/
#170 Mar 24 2013 at 8:11 PM Rating: Excellent
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,930 posts
Meh. That's just them trying to make an excuse so they can be ***holes

Edited, Mar 24th 2013 10:11pm by TirithRR
____________________________
Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
#171 Mar 24 2013 at 8:34 PM Rating: Good
Everyone's Oiran
*****
15,952 posts
Lets add Eske, Allegory and Kavekk to the people who didn't read the T9 link, OR who are being **********

Kavekk wrote:
It's difficult to see how anyone without a strong grasp of social dynamics and psychology could be an excellent strategist.
This shows that you didn't read the entire T9 article.
Kavekk wrote:
More generally, if you accept that you're socially retarded you should expect people to perceive you as unintelligent if all they've done is talked to you. Your claims to genius, even if they are true, will seem wildly implausible. Generally, people will react to someone they see as a boastful idiot with expressions of contempt.

There, I hope that helped you to understand the ways of humans. If you see more behaviour that confuses you, feel free to drop me a line.
This is a perfect demonstration, as per the T9 article, of why geniuses don't burn out, they are cremated alive by society at large, and educational institutions in particular.

Edited, Mar 24th 2013 10:40pm by Aripyanfar
____________________________
<3

http://www.reddit.com/r/Forum4/
#172 Mar 24 2013 at 8:50 PM Rating: Good
Supreme Lionator
*****
14,174 posts
Quote:
This shows that you didn't read the entire T9 article.


I didn't and it doesn't.

Quote:
This is a perfect demonstration, as per the T9 article, of why geniuses don't burn out, they are cremated alive by society at large, and educational institutions in particular.


You can be so humourless sometimes, Ari.
____________________________
“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
#173 Mar 24 2013 at 9:10 PM Rating: Good
******
21,720 posts
Aripyanfar wrote:
You can be so humourless naive sometimes, Ari.

____________________________
R.I.P. Jessica M. 5/3/2010
This post brought to you by Carl's Jr.
gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#174 Mar 24 2013 at 9:13 PM Rating: Good
Supreme Lionator
*****
14,174 posts
BrownDuck wrote:
Aripyanfar wrote:
You can be so humourless naive sometimes, Ari.



The old stop hitting yourself gag, eh?
____________________________
“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
#175 Mar 24 2013 at 11:07 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
Quote:
Well, you obviously didn't read http://www.triplenine.org/download/IQ_and_the_Problem_of_Social_Adjustment.pdf, which TL:DR helpfully linked to us. That link says EXACTLY why almost every extremely intelligent person is completely unsocialized, or in other words, lacks any "social intelligence". Being hyper intelligent will NOT explain to them how and why other people act, behave and speak the way that they do. We are literally incomprehensible to them. Unless the hyper-intelligent person stumbles across psychological and behavioral texts in their young childhood.


I wouldn't say that it's entirely due to lack of socialization, but I guess socialization doesn't have the same developmental impact for a child with autism, either. I was fortunate to have a few years where I took properly to socialization (but I was medicated with large doses of speed during those years; gogo ADD diagnosis). As a child, I only knew people by their hair, and in middle school, I would read alone in the library rather than go to lunch. But I had a supportive mother, two younger brothers, and playmates from time to time. All considered, my childhood was relatively normal. Unfortunately when I caught up to my developmental delays in adulthood it was like a second puberty. That was when I started to become noticeably more intelligent, like I just kept growing up and everyone else stayed the same. Before long I was surpassing my professors. So on top of social difficulties in general, I literally ran out of peers. All I could enjoy were autistic playmates, and now I barely enjoy most games. Now I just make my own. Er, anyway...

So I understand social cues relatively well now, but I do have a very difficult time filtering what I say, and generally cannot understand, or let's say, "am not able to agree" why I shouldn't speak my mind.

TirithRR wrote:
Meh. That's just them trying to make an excuse so they can be ***holes

Edited, Mar 24th 2013 10:11pm by TirithRR


I'm sure that's probably true of some people. But for me, all of these things started well before anyone even knew about autism. When I was growing up, autism wasn't even a thing. And no one who knows me in person would describe me as an *******; I am generally a very sweet and affectionate person. Conversely, a large percentage of people I meet on the web seem to think so. I think a part of it is that if you came to know me in person, you'd realize before long that there was something fundamentally different about me, but here in text, a lot of that gets lost in translation. Here's a thoroughly enlightening article on autism:

http://www.jamesmw.com/sixrules.htm

This pretty much sums up the thread in a nutshell, at least for my part, eh? (tl;dr, just skim the bolded) I just found it in the middle of writing this reply. I'm actually not that well-versed on autism. Somehow I never took a great interest in it.

____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#176 Mar 24 2013 at 11:42 PM Rating: Decent
Everyone's Oiran
*****
15,952 posts
Kavekk wrote:
Quote:
This shows that you didn't read the entire T9 article.


I didn't and it doesn't.

Quote:
This is a perfect demonstration, as per the T9 article, of why geniuses don't burn out, they are cremated alive by society at large, and educational institutions in particular.


You can be so humourless sometimes, Ari.

Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean I don't like you anymore, or have stopped wanting you to whisper in my ear while we **** each other's brains out.
____________________________
<3

http://www.reddit.com/r/Forum4/
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 44 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (44)