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War and Peace theory of shopping.Follow

#102 Mar 19 2013 at 8:47 PM Rating: Decent
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You're the one who keeps trying to define this within the context of capitalism,

When did this happen outside of the echoing confines of your skull?
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#103 Mar 20 2013 at 7:36 AM Rating: Good
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When it didn't benefit his political party as much as the opposition.
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#104 Mar 20 2013 at 11:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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ITT: Gbaji doesn't know how free markets work.
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#105 Mar 20 2013 at 11:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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"In this thread", nothin'.
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#106 Mar 20 2013 at 3:38 PM Rating: Default
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Adding the second part of the sentence you quoted, since it's kinda relevant.

Smasharoo wrote:
You're the one who keeps trying to define this within the context of capitalism, while carefully avoiding mentioning the 800lb socialist gorilla in the room.

When did this happen outside of the echoing confines of your skull?


When you jumped into a argument about whether the boycott was an example of capitalism or socialism and repeatedly chose to talk only about capitalism and how it related to the subject at hand. Do you just forget what you wrote earlier or something?
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#107 Mar 20 2013 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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When you jumped into a argument about whether the boycott was an example of capitalism or socialism and repeatedly chose to talk only about capitalism and how it related to the subject at hand. Do you just forget what you wrote earlier or something?

Well not since you quoted them here...oh wait.
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#108 Mar 20 2013 at 10:40 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji used to be smarter than this. Smiley: frown Baby, what caused the brain damage?
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#109 Mar 21 2013 at 2:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Smasharoo wrote:
When you jumped into a argument about whether the boycott was an example of capitalism or socialism and repeatedly chose to talk only about capitalism and how it related to the subject at hand. Do you just forget what you wrote earlier or something?

Well not since you quoted them here...oh wait.


I'm not going to quote the entire conversation.
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#110 Mar 22 2013 at 3:49 AM Rating: Good
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I'm not going to quote the entire conversation.


No, and certainly not the presumably easy to establish parts that make your point. Here, I'll help you out, I think this is what you were referring to:

Quote:

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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a whore. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. @#%^ off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#111 Mar 22 2013 at 7:23 AM Rating: Good
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Aripyanfar wrote:
Baby, what caused the brain damage?
A lot of people who believe themselves good at something end up meeting people that are naturally better than them and it crushes them. All the attention they got for their hard work disappeared when someone does better with less effort. Probably gave up and decided it was easier to just repeat what other people say and become a one dimensional shadow of his former self.
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#112 Mar 22 2013 at 4:27 PM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:

I'm not going to quote the entire conversation.


No, and certainly not the presumably easy to establish parts that make your point. Here, I'll help you out, I think this is what you were referring to:

Quote:



Smiley: lol
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You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#113 Mar 22 2013 at 4:38 PM Rating: Decent
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Smasharoo wrote:

I'm not going to quote the entire conversation.


No, and certainly not the presumably easy to establish parts that make your point.


Like the whole thread? Why quote it? Alla's already collected it into a thread for you to read. You want to pretend that you didn't jump in and defend the "boycott is capitalism in action, so why do you have a problem with it?" argument, you're free to do that. Don't drag me into your delusion though.
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#114 Mar 22 2013 at 4:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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A choice NOT to buy something is just as important to liberty as a choice TO buy something that you like, for whatever reason.

So a boycott is totally a capitalist maneuver, no matter why you are boycotting a product or a store. It might be because the service is bad there. Or their stuff is awful/breaks a lot/is not good value for money. Or it may be any other number of consumer discontents with the product, like you don't want to buy garlic from China that has been bleached white, or diamonds from Africa that are funding a civil war, or it's from a company that has been caught illegally dumping asbestos.

Edited, Mar 22nd 2013 6:57pm by Aripyanfar
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#115 Mar 22 2013 at 7:52 PM Rating: Default
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Aripyanfar wrote:
A choice NOT to buy something is just as important to liberty as a choice TO buy something that you like, for whatever reason.


Correct. But being free to buy or not buy something isn't a defining attribute of capitalism. It's something which may be present under capitalism (or any of a number of other economic systems), but isn't itself "capitalism".

Quote:
So a boycott is totally a capitalist maneuver, no matter why you are boycotting a product or a store.


No, it's not. I'm just not sure how much more clearly I can state this. What you're doing (several of you actually) is confusing a component of something with the thing itself. It's like saying that because a brick house is made out of bricks, that a brick is therefor a brick house. It's not. It's a brick. It can be used to build a brick house, or it could be used for something else.


Quote:
It might be because the service is bad there. Or their stuff is awful/breaks a lot/is not good value for money. Or it may be any other number of consumer discontents with the product, like you don't want to buy garlic from China that has been bleached white, or diamonds from Africa that are funding a civil war, or it's from a company that has been caught illegally dumping asbestos.


Sure, which is why it's far more relevant to look at the motivation for the boycott than to declare that a boycott is an application of capitalism and thus anyone who likes capitalism shouldn't have a problem with the boycott. The boycott is in support of a socialist mandate, thus anyone participating in said boycott is promoting socialism, not capitalism. The motivation matters. It's arguably all that matters in this case.

Edited, Mar 22nd 2013 6:57pm by gbaji
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#116 Mar 22 2013 at 8:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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Correct. But being free to buy or not buy something isn't a defining attribute of capitalism. It's something which may be present under capitalism (or any of a number of other economic systems), but isn't itself "capitalism".


No. It's the free market. You know, as individual agents being free to interact or not interact with the market in a fashion they see fit. For any reason whatsoever. No justification needed, because; freedom.That free market.

So no, it has nothing to do with capitalism. It's a dystopian socialist dream theater.
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#117 Mar 25 2013 at 5:19 PM Rating: Default
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Timelordwho wrote:
No. It's the free market. You know, as individual agents being free to interact or not interact with the market in a fashion they see fit. For any reason whatsoever. No justification needed, because; freedom.That free market.


Kinda like how voting for your king means you live in a democracy, right?

Edited, Mar 25th 2013 4:19pm by gbaji
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#118 Mar 25 2013 at 6:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
No. It's the free market. You know, as individual agents being free to interact or not interact with the market in a fashion they see fit. For any reason whatsoever. No justification needed, because; freedom.That free market.


Kinda like how voting for your king means you live in a democracy, right?

Edited, Mar 25th 2013 4:19pm by gbaji


Right, because you elect a hereditary ruler for who rules for life.
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What if the bird will not sing?
Nobunaga answers, "Kill it!"
Hideyoshi answers, "Make it want to sing."
Ieyasu answers, "Wait."
Timelordwho answers "Just as Planned."
#119 Mar 25 2013 at 7:57 PM Rating: Default
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Timelordwho wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
No. It's the free market. You know, as individual agents being free to interact or not interact with the market in a fashion they see fit. For any reason whatsoever. No justification needed, because; freedom.That free market.


Kinda like how voting for your king means you live in a democracy, right?


Right, because you elect a hereditary ruler for who rules for life.


/whoosh!

Just because you are making a choice doesn't mean that whatever system is applicable to you and your choice is defined by the presence of such choices. Making a purchasing choice doesn't mean that you've got a free market. Making a choice of leaders doesn't mean that you've got a democracy. I didn't think I'd have to spell this out.
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#120 Mar 25 2013 at 8:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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Nor does government regulation or requirements completely negate the concept of a free market. And the customer choice to purchase or not purchase pizza from a specific vendor when all vendors are under the same umbrella of regulation is, in fact, a free consumer decision.

He probably didn't "get it" because your comparison was so heavy-handed as to be absurd.
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#121 Mar 25 2013 at 8:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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@#%^ this noise, I'm on to the Brothers Karamazov theory of shopping.

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#122 Mar 25 2013 at 8:22 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel you just don't get it. The very existence of government is an anathema to freedom. Laws, regulations, and taxes are the cages and bonds that bind you, forever preventing you from being truly free.
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What if the bird will not sing?
Nobunaga answers, "Kill it!"
Hideyoshi answers, "Make it want to sing."
Ieyasu answers, "Wait."
Timelordwho answers "Just as Planned."
#123 Mar 25 2013 at 8:28 PM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
@#%^ this noise, I'm on to the Brothers Karamazov theory of shopping.


I think another of Dostoevsky's works embodies this conversation better.

Edited, Mar 25th 2013 10:29pm by Timelordwho
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What if the bird will not sing?
Nobunaga answers, "Kill it!"
Hideyoshi answers, "Make it want to sing."
Ieyasu answers, "Wait."
Timelordwho answers "Just as Planned."
#124 Mar 26 2013 at 12:08 AM Rating: Good
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The Idiot. Oo, oo, it's The Idiot, isn't it?*


*I didn't like The Idiot at all. It was SO depressing.
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#125 Mar 26 2013 at 8:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
Jophiel you just don't get it. The very existence of government is an anathema to freedom. Laws, regulations, and taxes are the cages and bonds that bind you, forever preventing you from being truly free.
Unless Republican.
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#126 Mar 26 2013 at 11:54 AM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
Nor does government regulation or requirements completely negate the concept of a free market.


Correct. I never said otherwise.

Quote:
And the customer choice to purchase or not purchase pizza from a specific vendor when all vendors are under the same umbrella of regulation is, in fact, a free consumer decision.


Sure. In the same way that moving my arms around is a free decision as well. But if I do so in such a way as to impact my closed fist with someone's face, we call that harmful, while if I do so in order to perform CPR on someone and save their life, we call it helpful. The objective and end result kinda do matter here. Ignoring the objective and desired end result of someone choosing to boycott a store's product and just declaring it "capitalism" is somewhat meaningless. You're attempting to claim that no one who agrees with capitalism should disagree with the boycott, but that's just silly. Why it's being done matters more than what you're doing in this case.
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#127 Mar 26 2013 at 12:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
You're attempting to claim that no one who agrees with capitalism should disagree with the boycott, but that's just silly.

Certainly not on capitalist grounds. One is welcome to disagree with it on political or partisan grounds as you're doing. They're even welcome to try and veil it as arguing "capitalism" is they please. As, again, you're doing.
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#128 Mar 26 2013 at 12:32 PM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
gbaji wrote:
You're attempting to claim that no one who agrees with capitalism should disagree with the boycott, but that's just silly.

Certainly not on capitalist grounds. One is welcome to disagree with it on political or partisan grounds as you're doing. They're even welcome to try and veil it as arguing "capitalism" is they please. As, again, you're doing.


Huh? This whole bit started with this:

Jophiel wrote:
As I said, you should be pleased as punch over it. This is what capitalism is all about right? I can't believe that you're seriously crying about a basic tenet of the capitalist system.


So can we conclude that you were wrong and move on now? Or do we spend 3 more pages circling each other?
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#129 Mar 26 2013 at 12:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Huh? No. I said no one should be denouncing this boycott on "capitalist" grounds.

Try and use your 120-150 IQ to keep up for once Smiley: laugh
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#130 Mar 26 2013 at 2:19 PM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
Huh? No. I said no one should be denouncing this boycott on "capitalist" grounds.


No. You said I should be praising it on capitalistic grounds.
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#131 Mar 26 2013 at 2:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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I originally said that (and stand by it). My second, accompanying remark, was in response to:
Quote:
You're attempting to claim that no one who agrees with capitalism should disagree with the boycott, but that's just silly.


The idea that you should be praising it and should not be denouncing it are in no way contradictory. Quite the opposite. Again, it would help if you tried to keep up.
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#132 Mar 26 2013 at 2:42 PM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
I originally said that (and stand by it). My second, accompanying remark, was in response to:
Quote:
You're attempting to claim that no one who agrees with capitalism should disagree with the boycott, but that's just silly.


The idea that you should be praising it and should not be denouncing it are in no way contradictory. Quite the opposite. Again, it would help if you tried to keep up.


You're seriously jumping all over a typo?
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#133 Mar 26 2013 at 2:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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"Jumping all over"? Smiley: laugh

You're the idiot trying to use this page to prove that I'm admitting I was always wrong or whatever dumbshit stuff you're up to. My argument hasn't changed.
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