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#852 Apr 02 2013 at 6:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Rachel9 wrote:
Not that the average person can determine whether some other random person in the bathroom has a **** or not either.

But they could if they had to, or probably more relevantly, someone like the mall security guard could.

Not that we couldn't make someone a "card carrying" transgender, as proven by a certified mental health expert, or something, of course.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 5:08pm by someproteinguy
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#853Almalieque, Posted: Apr 02 2013 at 6:12 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Cool story bro... That has nothing to do with you saying that my mom was an example of the female gender. How do you know that? How can you say that while ridiculing my list of the female gender, which was based on her?
#854 Apr 02 2013 at 6:16 PM Rating: Excellent
Easy, the things you provided in your list, while characteristic of your mother, who is female, have nothing to do with the female gender. It isn't even a conflict.
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#855 Apr 02 2013 at 6:17 PM Rating: Good
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How do you know that?
I just told you.
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#856 Apr 02 2013 at 6:39 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
How do you know that?
I just told you.
Cool.. if it's that simple, then your gender is male.. wow.. That was easy and here you are making it seem complicated and difficult task that would take over 100 words.
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#857 Apr 02 2013 at 6:47 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
How do you know that?
I just told you.
Cool.. if it's that simple, then your gender is male.. wow.. That was easy and here you are making it seem complicated and difficult task that would take over 100 words.
lol
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#858 Apr 02 2013 at 6:51 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
How do you know that?
I just told you.
Cool.. if it's that simple, then your gender is male.. wow.. That was easy and here you are making it seem complicated and difficult task that would take over 100 words.
lol


As long as you see the contradiction in your statement. Your mom's gender is male and your dad's gender is female. Wow, this is easy. I don't have to know them to know their genders...
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#859 Apr 02 2013 at 7:02 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
How do you know that?
I just told you.
Cool.. if it's that simple, then your gender is male.. wow.. That was easy and here you are making it seem complicated and difficult task that would take over 100 words.
lol


As long as you see the contradiction in your statement. Your mom's gender is male and your dad's gender is female. Wow, this is easy. I don't have to know them to know their genders...
I don't need to know her to know some things about her. I have gotten enough information from you to deduce it.
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#860 Apr 02 2013 at 7:08 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel wrote:
I don't need to know her to know some things about her. I have gotten enough information from you to deduce it.


Likewise with you, your mom and your dad being male, male and female respectively. You made this seem very difficult, but it all comes down to simple "deductions". Nothing difficult about it.
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#861 Apr 02 2013 at 7:10 PM Rating: Good
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Alma, that "list of feminine traits" business is so insulting.
#862 Apr 02 2013 at 7:14 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Rachel wrote:
I don't need to know her to know some things about her. I have gotten enough information from you to deduce it.


Likewise with you, your mom and your dad being male, male and female respectively. You made this seem very difficult, but it all comes down to simple "deductions". Nothing difficult about it.
What exactly made you think that?
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#863 Apr 02 2013 at 7:21 PM Rating: Default
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Belkira wrote:
Alma, that "list of feminine traits" business is so insulting.

I apologize if it offended you; however, that's the reason why I asked Rachel to provide a better list. For whatever reason he is unable to provide one.

On a side note, I'm sure you're misinterpreting the list as "A woman is the following" as opposed to "here is a list of traits that are more common among women than men". Again, being a woman doesn't mean having any of those traits, hence the purpose of the word gender as opposed to sex.

Rachel wrote:
What exactly made you think that?


Think what? Your family's genders or the ability to duplicate your deductions?
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Almalieque wrote:

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#864 Apr 02 2013 at 7:23 PM Rating: Good
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Think what? Your family's genders or the ability to duplicate your deductions?
My family's genders.
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#865 Apr 02 2013 at 7:26 PM Rating: Good
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Belkira wrote:
Alma, that "list of feminine traits" business is so insulting.

Yeah, he left off "Watches Dancing with the Stars", "Plays Bejeweled" and "Enjoys Margaret Cho comedy routines".
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#866 Apr 02 2013 at 7:29 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
Think what? Your family's genders or the ability to duplicate your deductions?
My family's genders.


The same way you deduced my mom's gender. 'Twas that simple.
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#867 Apr 02 2013 at 7:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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She can't provide a list because there isn't one. It's ridiculous. What makes someone a woman or a man has nothing to do with preconceived "feminine traits" or genitals. And if you aren't suggesting that these traits somehow prove that someone is a woman, then what's the point of asking for them?

I honestly can't tell you what makes someone a man or a woman. According to Smash, neurogists can tell a gender simply by looking at brain scans. I just know that I am a woman. It has never crossed my mind that I might not be, I just am. I cannot imagine what it must be like to know you are a woman and to constantly have fu[/i]ckwads like yourself insist on calling you a man.

Breaking the filter on an iPhone is difficult... Smiley: glare. I quit.

[i]Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 8:37pm by Belkira
#868 Apr 02 2013 at 7:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
Think what? Your family's genders or the ability to duplicate your deductions?
My family's genders.


The same way you deduced my mom's gender. 'Twas that simple.
Obviously not, or you would have at least gotten mine right, since i have stated explicitly what my gender is.

For the record, to the best of my knowledge, my dad is a man, and my mom is a woman.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 9:43pm by Rachel9
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#869 Apr 02 2013 at 7:46 PM Rating: Default
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Belkira wrote:
She can't provide a list because there isn't one. It's ridiculous. What makes someone a woman or a man has nothing to do with preconceived "feminine traits" or genitals.


I still think you're confusing the traits defining your sex. Having a female gender, doesn't make you a woman. A man possessing all of those traits is still a man. The whole point is that those stereotypes that correlate with a **** don't define your sex. A "feminine" man is still a man. A "masculine" woman is still a woman.

Belkira wrote:
And if you aren't suggesting that these traits somehow prove that someone is a woman, then what's the point of asking for them?


Rachel is arguing that bathrooms are segregated via gender. If gender is as difficult to determine as posters are making it out to be, HTF is a 7 year old supposed to know which bathroom to use?

All of this is to counter this nonsensical belief that bathrooms aren't based on something simple like **** vs **** as opposed to some complicated, subjective, social-varying state of being that can't easily be expressed in under 100 words with any real meaning.
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#870 Apr 02 2013 at 7:51 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
Think what? Your family's genders or the ability to duplicate your deductions?
My family's genders.


The same way you deduced my mom's gender. 'Twas that simple.
Obviously not, or you would have at least gotten mine right, since i have stated explicitly what my gender is.

For the record, to the best of my knowledge, my dad is a man, and my mom is a woman.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 9:43pm by Rachel9


What female gender traits do you have that makes you a woman?
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#871 Apr 02 2013 at 7:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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A 7 year old can easily tell you what their gender is without needing to look in their pants. And when a 7 year old girl who just knows sh is a girl because she is a girl (regardless of what might be in her pants) it has to be difficult having people telling her that she's a boy and she has to learn to use the boy's bathroom.

Personally, I think you are right. Right now most public restroom are designated for those with a **** and those with a vagina. Which works out fine to people like you and I who happen to have what's in our pants match what's in our hearts and heads. But for those who aren't so lucky, it's an issue. Which is why I suggested 15 pages ago that there just be one large restroom with stalls for everyone to use instead of making it complicated.

Quote:
What female gender traits do you have that makes you a woman?


Smiley: facepalm You hypocrite.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 8:56pm by Belkira
#872 Apr 02 2013 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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If gender is as difficult to determine as posters are making it out to be, HTF is a 7 year old supposed to know which bathroom to use?
It's actually very easy to determine what gender you are. I'm sure you have no more trouble than Belkira does. It's something you just know.

Quote:
All of this is to counter this nonsensical belief that bathrooms aren't based on something simple like **** vs **** as opposed to some complicated, subjective, social-varying state of being that can't easily be expressed in under 100 words with any real meaning.
Well, not that nonsensical. Where i live, and many other places, that's actually illegal.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 10:01pm by Rachel9
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#873 Apr 02 2013 at 8:04 PM Rating: Default
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Belkira wrote:
A 7 year old can easily tell you what their gender is without needing to look in their pants. And when a 7 year old girl who just knows sh is a girl because she is a girl (regardless of what might be in her pants) it has to be difficult having people telling her that she's a boy and she has to learn to use the boy's bathroom.


If you (as a general adult) are unable to provide a list of traits that would qualify you of the female gender, then there is no way that a 7 year old can.

Belkira wrote:
Smiley: facepalm You hypocrite.


No, once again, you're confusing **** with gender. I'm using the term woman in both scenarios because we don't have any other word.
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#874 Apr 02 2013 at 8:05 PM Rating: Good
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If you (as a general adult) are unable to provide a list of traits that would qualify you of the female gender, then there is no way that a 7 year old can.
Why would she need to?

Quote:
I'm using the term woman in both scenarios because we don't have any other word.
Female. If you can't be bothered to use two words (biological female), then female is more appropriate than woman when referring to sex.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 10:07pm by Rachel9
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#875 Apr 02 2013 at 8:06 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
If gender is as difficult to determine as posters are making it out to be, HTF is a 7 year old supposed to know which bathroom to use?
It's actually very easy to determine what gender you are. I'm sure you have no more trouble than Belkira does. It's something you just know.

Quote:
All of this is to counter this nonsensical belief that bathrooms aren't based on something simple like **** vs **** as opposed to some complicated, subjective, social-varying state of being that can't easily be expressed in under 100 words with any real meaning.
Well, not that nonsensical. Where i live, and many other places, that's actually illegal.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 10:01pm by Rachel9



What female gender traits do you have that makes you believe that you're a woman?
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#876 Apr 02 2013 at 8:10 PM Rating: Good
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I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
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#877 Apr 02 2013 at 8:11 PM Rating: Good
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Rachel9 wrote:
I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
Ingredients in chocolate actually give an affect on our brain's neurotransmitter. Chocolate contains three main ingredients: trytophan, phenylethylamine, and anandamide. The trytophan causes the brain to produce very high levels of serotonin which make us have a feeling of extreme happiness. The second ingredient, phenylethylamine, is said to make the brain have feelings of bliss and giddiness. In other words it stimulates our brain's pleasure centres. The last one is called anandamide which is the main psychoactive ingredient. This will cause the chocolate to have a huge significant effect on our mental process, almost making it addicting which is why chocolate tastes so good to us.
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#878 Apr 02 2013 at 8:15 PM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
Ingredients in chocolate actually give an affect on our brain's neurotransmitter. Chocolate contains three main ingredients: trytophan, phenylethylamine, and anandamide. The trytophan causes the brain to produce very high levels of serotonin which make us have a feeling of extreme happiness. The second ingredient, phenylethylamine, is said to make the brain have feelings of bliss and giddiness. In other words it stimulates our brain's pleasure centres. The last one is called anandamide which is the main psychoactive ingredient. This will cause the chocolate to have a huge significant effect on our mental process, almost making it addicting which is why chocolate tastes so good to us.
oh, the things you can learn from yahoo answers.
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#879 Apr 02 2013 at 8:24 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Belkira wrote:
A 7 year old can easily tell you what their gender is without needing to look in their pants. And when a 7 year old girl who just knows sh is a girl because she is a girl (regardless of what might be in her pants) it has to be difficult having people telling her that she's a boy and she has to learn to use the boy's bathroom.


If you (as a general adult) are unable to provide a list of traits that would qualify you of the female gender, then there is no way that a 7 year old can.

Belkira wrote:
Smiley: facepalm You hypocrite.


No, once again, you're confusing **** with gender. I'm using the term woman in both scenarios because we don't have any other word.


One cannot point to something tangible and say "this makes me a (wo)man." You simply are or you are not. It seems that a six year old can understand that better than you can. There are no traits tha make a woman a woman whether you are referring to gender or sex.
#880 Apr 02 2013 at 9:07 PM Rating: Good
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someproteinguy wrote:
So like, we're looking for a way for your average person using the restroom to be able to tell the difference between "legitimate transgender" and "creepy pervert" without unnecessarily involving the relevant authorities? Or at least without the potential perpetrator needing to spend 40 hours with a psychologist?

Or is this thread still about not having a penis?

The average person can tell the difference between a "creepy cisgender pervert"/ "creepy transgender pervert" and a "legitimate cisgender"/ "legitimate transgender" with passable ease, and involve the relevant authorities as needed.
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#881 Apr 02 2013 at 9:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
Isn't it awfully nice to have a penis? 
Isn't it frightfully good to have a dong? 
It's swell to have a stiffy. 
It's divine to own a **** 
From the tiniest little tadger 
To the world's biggest prick. 
So, three cheers for your Willy or John Thomas. 
Hooray for your one-eyed trouser snake, 
Your piece of pork, your wife's best friend, 
Your Percy, or your **** 
You can wrap it up in ribbons. 
You can slip it in your sock, 
But don't take it out in public, 
Or they will stick you in the dock, 
And you won't. Come. Back.

Someone rated this down??

Cretins. Watch something other than "The Real Housewives"
#882 Apr 02 2013 at 9:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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Also, Alma claims to own a penis, yet he's not a man.

Thread over.
#883 Apr 02 2013 at 9:24 PM Rating: Good
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Rachel9 wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
Ingredients in chocolate actually give an affect on our brain's neurotransmitter. Chocolate contains three main ingredients: trytophan, phenylethylamine, and anandamide. The trytophan causes the brain to produce very high levels of serotonin which make us have a feeling of extreme happiness. The second ingredient, phenylethylamine, is said to make the brain have feelings of bliss and giddiness. In other words it stimulates our brain's pleasure centres. The last one is called anandamide which is the main psychoactive ingredient. This will cause the chocolate to have a huge significant effect on our mental process, almost making it addicting which is why chocolate tastes so good to us.
oh, the things you can learn from yahoo answers.

If you want to jump straight to rigorous bio-chemistry, then a neurologist can show you that the majority of "females" have both outward female sexual traits, and inward, "female" neurobiology. The neurologist can also show you a minority of "males" have outward male sexual traits, and inward "female" neurobiology, and it is most of these people who claim to be famale despite having male **** organs, and want gender reassignment hormones and perhaps surgery. The psychology of the situation is complex. When a child is really, 100% sure, and it turns out that she never changes her mind, then the earlier she has hormone therapy and starts living as her desired gender, in mannerisms and presentation, then the most successful her sexual transition will be. It does not detract from these cases that there is a very very small minority of people who experience gender fluidity throughout their lives, who change back and forth, and generally in the end settle on some kind of androgyny, or "hermaphroditism".
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#884 Apr 02 2013 at 9:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
and involve the relevant authorities as needed.

Who will then... do what? Unless you're actively caught doing something overtly wrong, there's no basis to tell anyone to move along.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#885 Apr 02 2013 at 10:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
So like, we're looking for a way for your average person using the restroom to be able to tell the difference between "legitimate transgender" and "creepy pervert" without unnecessarily involving the relevant authorities? Or at least without the potential perpetrator needing to spend 40 hours with a psychologist?

Or is this thread still about not having a penis?

The average person can tell the difference between a "creepy cisgender pervert"/ "creepy transgender pervert" and a "legitimate cisgender"/ "legitimate transgender" with passable ease, and involve the relevant authorities as needed.

And the fervent paranoid people who think what you're doing is "wrong" and are determined to set you straight? Or someone who's a little too panicky for whatever reason? Because, there are plenty of them too.

I'm all for letting someone choose which gender they associate with and from that which restroom they use if that's the case. Just saying without relatively easy way for others to determine whether or not you belong there, you're running the risk of causing an 'incident' or some kind. Which at the very least could be embarrassing, if not get you in trouble with some relevant authority.

I don't know, is there any kind of legal framework here for when these kinds of things are allowed? I'm admittedly in the dark here. Anyone got a light? It's cold and there are scary noises... Smiley: frown
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#886 Apr 02 2013 at 10:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
Aripyanfar wrote:
and involve the relevant authorities as needed.

Who will then... do what? Unless you're actively caught doing something overtly wrong, there's no basis to tell anyone to move along.

$4,000 fine and 6 months in prison?

Yay Arizona... Smiley: rolleyes


Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 10:00pm by someproteinguy
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#887 Apr 02 2013 at 11:23 PM Rating: Good
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Just saying without relatively easy way for others to determine whether or not you belong there, you're running the risk of causing an 'incident' or some kind.
Of course, many of us run that risk no matter which bathroom we use.
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#888 Apr 03 2013 at 12:44 AM Rating: Excellent
I'm confident Alma would be more sketched out if a pre-op male to female tranny peed next to him in the boys room rather than in the bathroom she'd be more comfortable in.

Screenshot


And yes Alma, I'm sure hers is bigger than yours. Honestly, it's par for the course for Alma to be uncomfortable at the thought of anyone but straight men to be around him in the bathroom, and all of his thoughts on homosexuality in any of it's flavors begin and end there.

Most likely 'cause he's feeling guilty about just how much even the thought of **** turns him on.
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#889 Apr 03 2013 at 4:31 AM Rating: Default
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Rachel9 wrote:
Quote:
If you (as a general adult) are unable to provide a list of traits that would qualify you of the female gender, then there is no way that a 7 year old can.
Why would she need to?

How else will she know? If I said that a classmate of mine loves sports (especially football and UFC), beer, women, video games and is a gadget nerd, people would overwhelmingly think that person was a man. They would think so because those are stereotypical male traits whether you want to admit to them or not.

You said that my mom was an example of the female gender, yet that was what my list was based off of. So, apparently you do agree and you're trying to back peddle out of it.

Rachel wrote:
Female. If you can't be bothered to use two words (biological female), then female is more appropriate than woman when referring to sex.

Edited, Apr 2nd 2013 10:07pm by Rachel9
According to what standard?

Rachel9 wrote:
I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
So your answer is "it just is"

Belkira wrote:

One cannot point to something tangible and say "this makes me a (wo)man." You simply are or you are not. It seems that a six year old can understand that better than you can. There are no traits tha make a woman a woman whether you are referring to gender or sex.

How are you defining woman? What's the significance if there is no value, tangible or not?




Edited, Apr 3rd 2013 12:34pm by Almalieque
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#890 Apr 03 2013 at 6:18 AM Rating: Good
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someproteinguy wrote:
Yay Arizona...
Pretty sure it's universally accepted that Arizona is the worst place ever.
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#891 Apr 03 2013 at 6:43 AM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Rachel9 wrote:
[quote=Rachel9]I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
So your answer is "it just is"

Logically speaking, there can be no disputing about tastes.
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#892 Apr 03 2013 at 6:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Logic was thrown out dragged out back and beaten about fourteen pages ago.
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#893 Apr 03 2013 at 6:57 AM Rating: Good
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But sometimes it's fun to notice the new and amazing ways in which Almalieque is wrong. Smiley: grin
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#894 Apr 03 2013 at 7:13 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Yay Arizona...
Pretty sure it's universally accepted that Arizona is the worst place ever.
Nebraska is worse.
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#895 Apr 03 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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Elinda wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Yay Arizona...
Pretty sure it's universally accepted that Arizona is the worst place ever.
Nebraska is worse.

Arizona, Nebraska, Kansas, whatever. Everything between the Rockies and the Mississippi is all the same wheat field anyway.
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#896 Apr 03 2013 at 11:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
How else will she know?
I don't know, how do you know that you are a man?

Quote:
Rachel9 wrote:
I can't explain why chocolate tastes good, does that mean it doesn't really?
So your answer is "it just is"
That is the best answer you're going to get. A better one might exist, but if so, i don't know it.
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#897 Apr 03 2013 at 12:03 PM Rating: Good
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Omegavegeta wrote:
I'm confident Alma would be more sketched out if a pre-op male to female tranny peed next to him in the boys room rather than in the bathroom she'd be more comfortable in.

This was a point I was going to make. What would be more disruptive to civic peace: an apparent woman, wearing a dress, using a woman's stall to urinate from her **** in private...or the same person strolling through the men's room because it's the only one she can legally use?

Not that I think it's so important to appease closed-minded gender normists. But if people arguing for genital-based bathroom usage are citing some sort of indescribable impoliteness, civil unrest, or ick factor, I think allowing transgendered bathroom use actually causes less of those things. After all, if you live in an urban area, you've probably shared a public bathroom with a transgendered person and never knew it, just as we've all changed clothes next to dozens of **** people in gym locker rooms without fistfights or societal collapse.



Edited, Apr 3rd 2013 1:03pm by trickybeck
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#898 Apr 03 2013 at 12:57 PM Rating: Good
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How are you defining woman? What's the significance if there is no value, tangible or not?


You know what a woman is. I can't give you a definition. Its the opposite of a man.

I don't know that there is much significance in being either a man or a woman. You just are. Neither one makes you special. The only time it should make a bit of difference is when it comes down to procreation, and even them that doesn't seem to matter quite so much these days.
#899 Apr 03 2013 at 2:32 PM Rating: Default
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Rachel wrote:
I don't know, how do you know that you are a man?


I meet the biological list of traits that define the male **** along with the list of male gender traits. You said that my mom was an example of the female gender, yet that was what my list was based off of. So, apparently you do agree and you're trying to back peddle out of it.

Rachel wrote:
Female. If you can't be bothered to use two words (biological female), then female is more appropriate than woman when referring to sex.

According to what standard?

Rachel wrote:
That is the best answer you're going to get. A better one might exist, but if so, i don't know it.


Is it "I don't know how or when it occurred, it just is" or "I think therefore I am"?

Belkira wrote:

You know what a woman is. I can't give you a definition. Its the opposite of a man.

I don't know that there is much significance in being either a man or a woman. You just are. Neither one makes you special. The only time it should make a bit of difference is when it comes down to procreation, and even them that doesn't seem to matter quite so much these days.


If there is no definition with no significances, then there is no need for the labels.
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Demea wrote:
Almalieque wrote:

I'm biased against statistics
#900 Apr 03 2013 at 2:41 PM Rating: Good
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Banh
#901 Apr 03 2013 at 2:44 PM Rating: Excellent
Almalieque wrote:
there is no need for the labels.


I label this thread a boring and tedious abomination.
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