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Published Voting Lists (by gun ownership)...Follow

#27 Feb 20 2013 at 8:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hate to break it to you gbaji, but Facebook already has a detailed map of people who own guns (or who are thinking about owning guns). All of your likes and dislikes are thoroughly cataloged. And even if you yourself aren't on Facebook, you're just a minute exclusion from the data. And consequently if you're afraid of people targeting break-ins to steal guns, well, then guns aren't functioning as intended, are they?
#28 Feb 20 2013 at 8:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Why don't we create an interactive map that shows the names and addresses of everyone who currently receives food stamps and wait to see what the ACLU has to say about that. Then you can get back to me about how this is just fine and dandy.

Translation: I can't actually argue this on the grounds of guns, so maybe I can move the debate to something else.

Hey, I've heard *** marriage will lead to pedophile dog marriage! So, you're in favor of pedophile dog marriage now?
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#29 Feb 21 2013 at 8:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, but if you don't think about it at all it sure sounds scary.
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#30 Feb 21 2013 at 11:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Guenny wrote:
Hate to break it to you gbaji, but Facebook already has a detailed map of people who own guns (or who are thinking about owning guns). All of your likes and dislikes are thoroughly cataloged.


So me "liking" a gun manufacturer equates to being a registered gun owner, now? If I like this page, does it indicate I'm a registered tank owner?

No. Facebook may outline some general population demographics, and certainly some people may share their whole life story and possessions with the world, but Facebook most definitely does not have a "detailed map" of gun owners.
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gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#31 Feb 21 2013 at 11:10 AM Rating: Decent
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Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
Edit: Someone isn't a Rocky and Bullwinkle fan...


People still edit posts to comment on rate downs? I thought that was so 00's.
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gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#32 Feb 21 2013 at 11:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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BrownDuck wrote:
Guenny wrote:
Hate to break it to you gbaji, but Facebook already has a detailed map of people who own guns (or who are thinking about owning guns). All of your likes and dislikes are thoroughly cataloged.


So me "liking" a gun manufacturer equates to being a registered gun owner, now? If I like this page, does it indicate I'm a registered tank owner?

No. Facebook may outline some general population demographics, and certainly some people may share their whole life story and possessions with the world, but Facebook most definitely does not have a "detailed map" of gun owners.


Best bet is to ask Visa. They probably have the most accurate list, and are likely making a killing selling that information to advertisers.

Edited, Feb 21st 2013 9:21am by someproteinguy
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#33 Feb 21 2013 at 11:26 AM Rating: Decent
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someproteinguy wrote:
Best bet is to ask Visa. They probably have the most accurate list, and are likely making a killing selling that information to advertisers.


Why Visa?
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gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#34 Feb 21 2013 at 11:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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BrownDuck wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Best bet is to ask Visa. They probably have the most accurate list, and are likely making a killing selling that information to advertisers.


Why Visa?


How'd you buy your gun?



Edited, Feb 21st 2013 9:30am by someproteinguy
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#35 Feb 21 2013 at 11:31 AM Rating: Good
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I don't care about who owns a gun so long as they are a responsible owner and don't threaten others or cause injury. My opinion would be slightly different if I had children. I think that much like knowing that a *** offender is living in your neighborhood, I would like to know who on my block owned a gun so I could exercise caution if my child was going to that residence for some reason. Whether the lists should be published online or by news agencies doesn't really matter to me so long as the information was available through some government agency.
#36 Feb 21 2013 at 11:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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I need this information so I can cross reference my *** offender list with my gun owners list.
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#37 Feb 21 2013 at 11:43 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
I need this information so I can cross reference my *** offender list with my gun owners list.


Forming a local school protection posse, eh?
#38 Feb 21 2013 at 11:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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We're going to ring the school with high-powered weapons at the exact distance the No Gun Zone law allows. At any sign of trouble, we open fire into the building, trusting our ammo to penetrate the interior.

I figure that as long as we aim up at least 4' from the ground, all the kids will be safe and our plan is foolproof.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#39 Feb 21 2013 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
We're going to ring the school with high-powered weapons at the exact distance the No Gun Zone law allows. At any sign of trouble, we open fire into the building, trusting our ammo to penetrate the interior.

I figure that as long as we aim up at least 4' from the ground, all the kids will be safe and our plan is foolproof.


Mmm...sounds almost exactly like a Get Out the Vote Early campaign. That's smart.
#40 Feb 21 2013 at 12:27 PM Rating: Default
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someproteinguy wrote:
BrownDuck wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Best bet is to ask Visa. They probably have the most accurate list, and are likely making a killing selling that information to advertisers.


Why Visa?


How'd you buy your gun?


Oh that's cute. You think everyone in the world buys their guns via CC, and not just any CC, but Visa.
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gbaji wrote:
You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#41 Feb 21 2013 at 12:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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BrownDuck wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
BrownDuck wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Best bet is to ask Visa. They probably have the most accurate list, and are likely making a killing selling that information to advertisers.


Why Visa?


How'd you buy your gun?


Oh that's cute. You think everyone in the world buys their guns via CC, and not just any CC, but Visa.

Yes, that's obviously what I meant...

Smiley: rolleyes

Thinking more along the lines of many people will eventually buy a gun or firearm-related item using something with a VISA logo on it, and from that you could likely deduce many of the gun owners.

Is there another private entity you think would have a better list? Except the before-listed newspaper of course.

Edit: Why the heck is ZAM putting 2 copies of everything I quote up when I post? Is that happening to anyone else? Smiley: confused

Edited, Feb 21st 2013 10:50am by someproteinguy
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#42 Feb 21 2013 at 1:11 PM Rating: Good
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LTG. Chesty Puller, USMC wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
We're going to ring the school with high-powered weapons at the exact distance the No Gun Zone law allows. At any sign of trouble, we open fire into the building, trusting our ammo to penetrate the interior.
So they've got us surrounded, good! Now we can fire in any direction, those bastards won't get away this time!
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#43 Feb 21 2013 at 1:13 PM Rating: Good
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BrownDuck wrote:
Guenny wrote:
Hate to break it to you gbaji, but Facebook already has a detailed map of people who own guns (or who are thinking about owning guns). All of your likes and dislikes are thoroughly cataloged.


So me "liking" a gun manufacturer equates to being a registered gun owner, now? If I like this page, does it indicate I'm a registered tank owner?

No. Facebook may outline some general population demographics, and certainly some people may share their whole life story and possessions with the world, but Facebook most definitely does not have a "detailed map" of gun owners.


It's not just your "likes". Facebook uses everything you type/post/discuss to add to your demographic profile. Like posting pictures with pro-gun sentiments? Facebook knows that. Like to say derogatory things about brown people? Facebook knows that too. Even information posted in "private" groups is collected and used. The information they collect and store is much more intricate and detailed than the current list of "likes" you choose to display.

How many people do you think have come home and updated their status with "I just bought a new gun!!" Likewise, how many people do you think are flagged as having said "I will NEVER own a gun!" Now THAT would be valuable information to criminals. A detailed map of all the pacifist pussies who aren't going to protect themselves if you come to take their loot.

Or, you know, Facebook's just a fun website where you can comment on your friends' baby pictures while letting them know you enjoy using Pledge furniture polish. Harmless and totally worth a 40 billion dollar net worth.



edit: I was totally hit by the double quote bug.

Edited, Feb 21st 2013 1:14pm by Guenny
#44 Feb 21 2013 at 3:40 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:


Because the government is collecting data which may then be used to intimidate those who own, or consider owning, a firearm. What did you think the motivation was for publishing this data? People will now think twice about becoming a gun owner because they will now be on a "list".


Well, paranoia aside, I don't see how it's such a bad thing. Most people will scan the list, not see much of interest or anything that was a huge surprise (we all have one of those ex army guys with the huge stockpile somewhere in town), and move on. The government already had the data it needed to intimidate gunowners if that was the goal, and the rest of us could give a flip.

I'd be interested to see how you handled being in a country that REALLY spied on its citizens and actively intimidated\oppressed\terrorized them. This just isn't that big a deal. A newspaper wants to publish a list. Big freaking whoop.
#45 Feb 21 2013 at 3:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm a little amused by the idea that this list would be used to "intimidate" people who have firearms.

"Hey, I see here you bought a gun! Lemme get up in your face and start trying to scare you!"

If you wish to subscribe to the theory that the government would come after you, fine. But they already have the list. How am I, Joseph Q. Middleclass, going to intimidate anyone?

Quote:
I'd be interested to see how you handled being in a country that REALLY spied on its citizens and actively intimidated\oppressed\terrorized them.

He'd shut up and not say a word. The paradox of freedom is that you can safely ***** and moan at length about how you're not really free since there's no consequences for it.

Edited, Feb 21st 2013 3:44pm by Jophiel
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#46 Feb 21 2013 at 5:16 PM Rating: Good
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Some organization went through the trouble of creating an internet map that will show you every house and who owns it? I'm not aware of such a thing. You can go to a web site and type in addresses and get that information, but that's not the same. I'm pretty sure if someone slurped down property ownership records and assembled it into a google map overlay that allowed you to see information about who lives in each home, you'd hear a pretty huge uproar about that as well though.


Yes, I have an application that does this.
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#47 Feb 21 2013 at 5:50 PM Rating: Default
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An easy compromise is to track who have weapons but only push out the numbers and statistics for EASY public access, i.e. "There are 34 registered guns in X Town".

Gbaji wrote:

Actually, it was a lot easier to track someone down back then than it is right now. You picked up a phone book and looked for the name of the person, and got a list of names and addresses. If you already knew one of the other bits of information, you got the third. It took all of 10 seconds. Today, lots of people just have cell phones, so they aren't in local phone books. Online books are sketchy at best, and again aren't as likely to have complete information. If you want to not show up on those kinds of searches, it's not terribly difficult to do so.


Unless you had every local phone book in the nation, it would be quite difficult to get a person's number without using the Internet. With the increased usage of cell phones, people tend not to change their numbers as they move. So, the Internet makes it a lot easier to track someone today than it would using the phone books in the past.

Edited, Feb 22nd 2013 1:50am by Almalieque
#48 Feb 21 2013 at 5:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
Quote:
Some organization went through the trouble of creating an internet map that will show you every house and who owns it? I'm not aware of such a thing. You can go to a web site and type in addresses and get that information, but that's not the same. I'm pretty sure if someone slurped down property ownership records and assembled it into a google map overlay that allowed you to see information about who lives in each home, you'd hear a pretty huge uproar about that as well though.


Yes, I have an application that does this.


Just as an aside, I was surprised how much information a realtor has access to.
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#49 Feb 21 2013 at 6:23 PM Rating: Default
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I remember people complaining about Facebook's News Feed "violating their privacy" when the only information that was shown was the information provided. Once people realize that their information is easily accessible regardless of their efforts, the complaints will decease.
#50gbaji, Posted: Feb 21 2013 at 7:27 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) This. There's a vast difference between information you volunteer on a public site and information you are required to provide to the government. The government should have an obligation to treat any information it requires us to provide it as personal and private.
#51 Feb 21 2013 at 7:36 PM Rating: Default
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Paskil wrote:
I don't care about who owns a gun so long as they are a responsible owner and don't threaten others or cause injury.


And yet, a newspaper in NY thought it was important to create an interactive internet map with all registered gun owners on it, not just those who are irresponsible.

Quote:
My opinion would be slightly different if I had children. I think that much like knowing that a *** offender is living in your neighborhood, I would like to know who on my block owned a gun so I could exercise caution if my child was going to that residence for some reason.


I would like to think that a responsible parent wouldn't be allowing their child to go to someone's home they didn't know well enough to ask this information of directly if that's really that much of a concern for them.

Quote:
Whether the lists should be published online or by news agencies doesn't really matter to me so long as the information was available through some government agency.


Owning a gun is not a crime. There's no reason to have a "list" at all, much less allowing it to be published. Period. End of story.
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