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#52 Feb 07 2013 at 7:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yes, you are.
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#53 Feb 07 2013 at 7:24 PM Rating: Good
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You guys are so used to Joph Circle-jerks you can't stop thinking about his penis.
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#54 Feb 07 2013 at 7:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Maybe talk of Beyoncé makes people think about my penis.
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#55 Feb 07 2013 at 9:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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You just have to make sure you get the dangly bits out of the way of the bolt when you **** it...
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#56 Feb 07 2013 at 10:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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You just have to make sure you get the dangly bits out of the way of the bolt when you **** it...

Ok, that even hurt *me*.
#57 Feb 08 2013 at 7:25 AM Rating: Good
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You just have to make sure you get the dangly bits out of the way of the bolt when you **** it...

Just one more reason women shouldn't be allowed in combat.
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#58 Feb 08 2013 at 8:08 AM Rating: Good
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Maybe the coffee hasn't kicked in yet, but I can't see how to both pull the trigger and get caught in the bolt on any rifles with the same appendage.
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#59 Feb 08 2013 at 10:53 AM Rating: Decent
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I've never used my **** to fire a rifle, but it sounds like it'd be painful.

When rifle and gun become one....
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#60 Feb 08 2013 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
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Maybe the coffee hasn't kicked in yet, but I can't see how to both pull the trigger and get caught in the bolt on any rifles with the same appendage.


Well, just because you are short doesn't mean everyone else is.
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#61 Feb 09 2013 at 2:58 PM Rating: Good
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.... Beyonce is a niche performer? Smiley: dubious When "Put a ring on it" came out a few years back, you couldn't step into any place that had a radio station playing on the overhead speakers without hearing it at least once. She's one of the modern pop divas, has won multiple Grammies, and has been the subject of gossip rags for a decade.

She sang at Obama's first inauguration ball.

Just because you have not really heard much about a performer does not mean you can extrapolate that "60% of superbowl viewers" had only heard her by name and didn't know her songs either. Even my 70+ year old in-laws knew "Put a ring on it."
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#62 Feb 09 2013 at 8:51 PM Rating: Good
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catwho wrote:
.... Beyonce is a niche performer? Smiley: dubious


Niche as in... I have something I would like to put in her niche.
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#63 Feb 09 2013 at 9:47 PM Rating: Excellent
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catwho wrote:
.... Beyonce is a niche performer? Smiley: dubious When "Put a ring on it" came out a few years back, you couldn't step into any place that had a radio station playing on the overhead speakers without hearing it at least once.

I know. Smiley: motz

MAN I hate that song.
#64 Feb 10 2013 at 9:22 AM Rating: Decent
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I liked Beyonce's appearances on Wow Wow Wubbzy!.
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#65 Feb 11 2013 at 7:17 PM Rating: Default
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catwho wrote:
.... Beyonce is a niche performer? Smiley: dubious


Yes.

Quote:
When "Put a ring on it" came out a few years back, you couldn't step into any place that had a radio station playing on the overhead speakers without hearing it at least once.


What places are we talking about? You do realize that once you get away from the "clothing stores catering to teens", that's a very small percentage of "places", right? Not a huge intersection between that and the demographics of all Superbowl viewers.

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She's one of the modern pop divas, has won multiple Grammies, and has been the subject of gossip rags for a decade.


The fact that I've heard of her at all indicates such, but does not change the fact that her actual music is relatively niche.

Quote:
She sang at Obama's first inauguration ball.


So?

Quote:
Just because you have not really heard much about a performer does not mean you can extrapolate that "60% of superbowl viewers" had only heard her by name and didn't know her songs either. Even my 70+ year old in-laws knew "Put a ring on it."


Battling anecdotes then. Whatever. Her show still sucked though. The sound was so bad, that even if I had happened to have heard one of her songs at some point on the radio, or whilst walking through a store at some point, I'd never have recognized it anyway. I mean, there are lots of songs that I recognize, and could even sing along to, but couldn't tell you the name of the song or the artist. And if the artist of those songs were performing the Superbowl, I might not know what they sing based on their name, but I'd be like "oh. I've heard that song. And that one. And that one", while listening to the performance. There was zero of that during her show.

Edited, Feb 11th 2013 5:21pm by gbaji
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#66 Feb 11 2013 at 8:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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Meanwhile, Gbaji sits alone in a room yelling at the TV to get the Supremes off the stage and bring back the football...
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#67 Feb 12 2013 at 12:37 AM Rating: Excellent
Pop music is not niche. Just because you're not into it Gbaji, doesn't mean it's niche. I'm not a fan of her music either, but it didn't suck more than any of the other "pop" acts they've had during the Superbowl over the last few years.

Obama, Michelle, & their kids like her music so you don't. We get it.

Racist.
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#68 Feb 12 2013 at 1:08 AM Rating: Decent
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gbaji wrote:
catwho wrote:
.... Beyonce is a niche performer? Smiley: dubious

Yes.

No.

Quote:
Quote:
When "Put a ring on it" came out a few years back, you couldn't step into any place that had a radio station playing on the overhead speakers without hearing it at least once.


What places are we talking about? You do realize that once you get away from the "clothing stores catering to teens", that's a very small percentage of "places", right? Not a huge intersection between that and the demographics of all Superbowl viewers.

You must not go anywhere other than "clothing stores that cater to teens". Stop being a perv and get out some more.

Quote:
Quote:
She's one of the modern pop divas, has won multiple Grammies, and has been the subject of gossip rags for a decade.


The fact that I've heard of her at all indicates such, but does not change the fact that her actual music is relatively niche.

Again, your sheltered existence is not proof of the real world.

Quote:
Quote:
She sang at Obama's first inauguration ball.


So?

Yeah, they let any random studio artist perform live for the Prez.

Quote:
Quote:
Just because you have not really heard much about a performer does not mean you can extrapolate that "60% of superbowl viewers" had only heard her by name and didn't know her songs either. Even my 70+ year old in-laws knew "Put a ring on it."


Battling anecdotes then. Whatever. Her show still sucked though.

Why bother saying anything else? You have your opinion on her quality. Her popularity isn't in question anywhere else.
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#69 Feb 12 2013 at 4:30 PM Rating: Decent
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Omegavegeta wrote:
Pop music is not niche. Just because you're not into it Gbaji, doesn't mean it's niche. I'm not a fan of her music either, but it didn't suck more than any of the other "pop" acts they've had during the Superbowl over the last few years.


Yes it did. Sound was terrible no matter whether you liked her music or not. I just think that more people are willing to ignore that poor performance for some reason. I wonder what it could be?

Quote:
Obama, Michelle, & their kids like her music so you don't. We get it.


I think it's that Obama and his family like her music, so many people feel they should as well. Or at least they should not criticize her in any way, since that might also be taken as a criticism of Obama. And they feel they must disagree with anyone who does criticize her music/performance. Perhaps by calling them racist.

Quote:
Racist.


Right on queue.
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#70 Feb 12 2013 at 4:33 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:

I think it's that Obama and his family like her music, so many people feel they should as well. Or at least they should not criticize her in any way, since that might also be taken as a criticism of Obama. And they feel they must disagree with anyone who does criticize her music/performance. Perhaps by calling them racist.

...or an old fart.
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#71 Feb 12 2013 at 4:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Elinda wrote:
gbaji wrote:

I think it's that Obama and his family like her music, so many people feel they should as well. Or at least they should not criticize her in any way, since that might also be taken as a criticism of Obama. And they feel they must disagree with anyone who does criticize her music/performance. Perhaps by calling them racist.

...or an old fart.


Lol! Perhaps. But I have tons of teenage nieces, nephews, and cousins and I'm subjected to their **** rock and roll music (or what passes for it) all the time. Can't say I've ever heard a Beyonce song though. Or if I did, I wasn't aware she was the artist (ie: nothing about her music sticks out for me), and certainly didn't recognize any of the stuff she performed during the halftime show. In contrast, I'd probably recognize half a dozen Lady Gaga songs plus whatever current teen stuff is out there which I probably couldn't name the artist, but would at least recognize as something I'd heard. But nothing I heard on that show was recognizable. Again, part of that could be the horrendous sound work, but that's part of why it was a terrible show.
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#72 Feb 12 2013 at 5:17 PM Rating: Good
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Oh, I realize what it is now. I live in a racially and culturally diverse area of the country and allow myself to be exposed to stuff. Gbaji lives in a culturally diverse area, but holes himself up in his sheltered world and deliberately avoids new things and experiences.

It's okay. You don't have to like Beyonce. You can think she's overrated (she is) and that she gave a terrible performance (I disagree.) All those are perfectly valid opinions and you're welcome to have them.

You cannot, however, argue that she is niche. You want niche? Drive By Truckers is niche. (And you might like them better, for all I know.)
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#73 Feb 12 2013 at 5:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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She's had 29 songs on the Billboard's Top 20 chart and seven #1 spots.

Look, Gbaji's just a dope. There isn't actually an argument for whether or not she's "niche".
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#74 Feb 12 2013 at 5:21 PM Rating: Good
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She's niche... the popular music niche.
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#75 Feb 12 2013 at 5:23 PM Rating: Good
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If I wanted to engage in this argument, I would point that Beyonce/Destiny's Child sold 24 million albums, in the US alone, prior to Obama's 2008 election. That's in the top 10 for artists whose careers have existed entirely in the post-Napster era (since 1999).


Edited, Feb 12th 2013 5:35pm by trickybeck
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#76 Feb 12 2013 at 5:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, but Gbaji's never heard of her so...

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#77 Feb 12 2013 at 5:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Just stuff city folk listen to.

**** hippies. Smiley: disappointed
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#78 Feb 12 2013 at 5:55 PM Rating: Good
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She's tied with Dolly PArton for Grammies. (she has lots)
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#79 Feb 12 2013 at 6:04 PM Rating: Excellent
Y'know who's really niche? The **** Surfers!

/rimshot


















inb4NIXNOT
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#80 Feb 12 2013 at 6:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sloppy seconds?
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#81 Feb 12 2013 at 6:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
She's had 29 songs on the Billboard's Top 20 chart and seven #1 spots.

Look, Gbaji's just a dope. There isn't actually an argument for whether or not she's "niche".


Billboard's relevance as a determinant of broad musical exposure pretty much disappeared sometime in the mid to late 90s. It's significantly less relevant as a measure of what people are likely to be exposed to when listening to the radio due to the use of download and streaming factors in their measurement. Top ranks are more likely to represent artists who have a very fervent following, but not necessarily a broad following. We can debate the merits of those changes, but it does mean that it's quite possible for an artist to consistently rank high on their ratings because her fans are more likely to download or stream her music online despite relatively low or limited radio airplay.

In short, it's a lot more likely today for a top billboard ranked musician to have a much narrower range of fans than it was say 20 years ago. Back then, a top hit was played on the majority of radio stations (cause that's how they measured it). Today, you could be ranked number one even if only a small percentage of stations in any given market play your songs because your fans are listening to and downloading your music online instead. Interestingly, artists who get less broad radio play are more likely to have higher offsetting online numbers (because that's the only way to easily get access to the songs), skewing this even more. Add in that folks who follow the charts online may then also download songs based on those charts (creating a feedback effect) and this factor becomes even stronger. So yes, a "niche artist" can have numbers like that. In fact, that's precisely why billboard changed their chart methodology away from "how many stations are playing this song" to "how many downloads did this song get"? I'm not saying that methodology is wrong or anything, but that it is measuring something different and therefor doesn't mean the same thing.

I listen to about 8 different music radio stations in my car, and flip somewhat randomly through them. If I've ever heard a Beyonce song, I don't recall it and didn't recognize it during the show. She just doesn't get broad radio coverage. The reason she charts so high is because they changed the methodology. She likely would not have more than maybe one song on the top 100 using the old methodology.
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#82 Feb 12 2013 at 6:42 PM Rating: Excellent
Are you trying to say that a small number of fans were buying her music over and over and that's why every one of her albums went to number 1?

Note that Billboard has always been about sales and never about playtime, at least as far as I've been able to find. Radio Stations certainly use the numbers as input into what they should play.

Edited, Feb 12th 2013 6:45pm by Xsarus
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#83 Feb 12 2013 at 6:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Billboard's relevance as a determinant of broad musical exposure pretty much disappeared...

Yeah, you'll have to excuse me if I don't take news on the music scene seriously from the guy who didn't know who the fuck Beyonce is.
Sir Xsarus wrote:
Note that Billboard has always been about sales and never about playtime, at least as far as I've been able to find. Radio Stations certainly use the numbers as input into what they should play.

It's both.
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The Billboard Hot 100 is the American music industry standard singles popularity chart issued weekly by Billboard magazine. Chart rankings are based on radio play and sales; the tracking-week for sales begins on Monday and ends on Sunday, while the radio play tracking-week runs from Wednesday to Tuesday.



Edited, Feb 12th 2013 6:58pm by Jophiel
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#84 Feb 12 2013 at 7:04 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
I just think that more people are willing to ignore that poor performance for some reason. I wonder what it could be?
That ass.
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#85 Feb 12 2013 at 7:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Sir Xsarus wrote:
Are you trying to say that a small number of fans were buying her music over and over and that's why every one of her albums went to number 1?


No. I'm saying that by including online streaming and downloads into their calculation, there is greater possibility of high chart rankings despite relatively low radio station play of the same song. So song A is being played on 10 different stations across 3 different genres in a given market, but because of this fewer people are streaming it online (cause they're hearing it every day in their car). Song B is available on 2 stations in one genre in the same market, but has a much greater volume of downloading and streaming. Song B will chart higher than song A even though song A has a far wider audience.

This means that there's a greater chance of a chart topping song not having been heard ever by a much larger percentage of the radio listening population than in the past.

Quote:
Note that Billboard has always been about sales and never about playtime, at least as far as I've been able to find.


False. Billboard has always been about both radio play and sales. In fact, for some time they limited it to the union of both, meaning if a song was getting massive airplay but wasn't currently on sale as a single, it didn't chart. Over the last 20 years, they've changed to rules to allow for more methods of play to count as well as sales, even when the single isn't for sale at all. Most significantly, they've added online access (downloads and streams) to their chart calculation (in the last decade).

Again, we can discuss why these changes were made (and a lot of it had to do with big labels squeezing out competition by manipulating airplay, so I'm not saying this is a bad thing), but it's foolish to insist that someone must be nuts because they don't think that a chart topping artist has that broad of an audience. She doesn't.

Quote:
Radio Stations certainly use the numbers as input into what they should play.


Radio stations are generally given copies of songs by the label and permission to air them (generates ad revenue for the station, and advertising for the label). Whether a song is played and how often it's played has to do with the audience of the station and what they are requesting (and yes, sometimes what the labels are pushing). That and the genre focus of most radio stations is why you can have artists who get big chart numbers, but only a relatively small percentage of all radio listeners have heard their songs. I honestly think that saying 60% of superbowl viewers could not name or recognize a Beyonce song is not far off at all.

Edited, Feb 12th 2013 5:27pm by gbaji
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#86 Feb 12 2013 at 7:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Song B is available on 2 stations in one genre in the same market, but has a much greater volume of downloading and streaming. Song B will chart higher than song A even though song A has a far wider audience.

As well it should since it's obviously far more popular. Which means more people are into Song B than Song A. Which means someone arguing that Song B is "niche" is an idiot.

If Song A was more popular, more people would be paying for it and it would blow Song B out of the water with its combination of radio play and sales. Of course, I honestly doubt the veracity of your claims regarding Beyonce's radio play (especially versus mythical songs that are getting regular play on four-five times as many stations).

Edited, Feb 12th 2013 7:31pm by Jophiel
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#87 Feb 12 2013 at 7:36 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
She just doesn't get broad radio coverage. The reason she charts so high is because they changed the methodology. She likely would not have more than maybe one song on the top 100 using the old methodology.
Yeah, she gets broad coverage.

But sounds like you've uncovered another liberal plot to subjugate the masses? Do tell.
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#88 Feb 12 2013 at 7:38 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
[quote=gbaji] Which means more people are into Song B than Song A.
It's trickery.

baji's goin' deep.
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#89 Feb 12 2013 at 7:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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A brief survey of San Diego radio stations shows five Top-40 stations (which are all going to regularly play Beyonce by definition), an urban contemporary, an adult contemporary and a rock station that all had her on their front pages or recent play lists. Given that most of the other stations were Public radio, Spanish language and a couple rock/alternatives, I'd say the lady is adequately well represented in the Southern California English-radio sphere.

I have no idea what "eight stations" Gbaji is listening to to avoid her but he must have hit the perfect combination of genres. Or else listens to a lot of reggaeton.
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#90 Feb 12 2013 at 7:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'd say he listens to AM talk radio, but he doesn't get his news from anywhere, so that can't be it.
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#91 Feb 12 2013 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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He listens to those stations that hide in between the regular stations.

They have songs like:
Churrrrrrrrrrrr
by Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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#92 Feb 12 2013 at 8:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Song B is available on 2 stations in one genre in the same market, but has a much greater volume of downloading and streaming. Song B will chart higher than song A even though song A has a far wider audience.

As well it should since it's obviously far more popular. Which means more people are into Song B than Song A. Which means someone arguing that Song B is "niche" is an idiot.


100% popularity among 5% of the population compared to 5% popularity among 100% of the population. You get that total number of downloads doesn't tell us how diverse the audience downloading the songs are. Total number of radio stations and genres playing a song does. Billboard changed their methodology specifically because smaller "niche" artists (like hip hop and rap) were getting big record sales, but were not getting broad radio play. Again, we can discuss those changes as well, but the end result is that it is much more likely (because it's actually possible now) for a musician to chart high on Billboard while only hitting a very small number of radio stations across the US. Which means that a larger percentage of the total population may never have heard their song(s) at all than was possible before.

Quote:
If Song A was more popular, more people would be paying for it and it would blow Song B out of the water with its combination of radio play and sales.


Not necessarily. You're also conflating "more popular" with "broad audience". You could have an artist which appeals to a small audience, but appeals very strongly and every one of that small percentage of the population buys her song. You could also have an artist with broader appeal, but fewer people within that audience are going to actually pay for the song. There are an amazing number of songs I hear on the radio that I don't pay money to buy Joph. I'm sure that's the same for everyone. So saying that because one song was purchased more than another doesn't tell us anything about how broad the audience for that song was.

Quote:
Of course, I honestly doubt the veracity of your claims regarding Beyonce's radio play (especially versus mythical songs that are getting regular play on four-five times as many stations).



I can only provide anecdotal information for this. I listen to a number of stations. I don't recall ever hearing a Beyonce song. Again, it's possible I have, but if so, they didn't make any significant impact on me, and I certainly didn't recognize anything she sang in the Superbowl as something I'd heard before. She does not get airplay on pop or alternative or rock stations. She mostly gets play on R&B and Soul stations, which I don't listen to. Guess what? I also don't listen to country stations. There's a ton of country music stars that I'm sure are *huge* in their genre. But I'd also call them niche artists if they don't get airplay on the more mainstream stations. There's a ton of crossover in music, but if I have to go listen to a genre focused station to hear someone's music, that's when I think of that artist as having a limited audience.
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#93 Feb 12 2013 at 8:03 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
She does not get airplay on pop or alternative or rock stations. She mostly gets play on R&B and Soul stations, which I don't listen to.


No, she gets airplay on pop stations...
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#94 Feb 12 2013 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
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I often find myself wondering how a single person can be on the obvious losing end of so many arguments simultaneously and continue to delude himself into thinking it's everyone else who's wrong. That's a mighty strong (false) sense of self-confidence, there.
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You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#95 Feb 12 2013 at 8:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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Is this the math that Republicans do to make themselves feel better?
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#96 Feb 12 2013 at 8:19 PM Rating: Default
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BrownDuck wrote:
I often find myself wondering how a single person can be on the obvious losing end of so many arguments simultaneously and continue to delude himself into thinking it's everyone else who's wrong. That's a mighty strong (false) sense of self-confidence, there.


Because I'm massively smarter than 99% of the population. I'd explain how that correlates to the various arguments I engage in, but you'd probably not understand it. Smiley: lol
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King Nobby wrote:
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#97 Feb 12 2013 at 8:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
She does not get airplay on pop or alternative or rock stations.

Oh, good lord.

Screenshot



Edited, Feb 12th 2013 8:32pm by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#98 Feb 12 2013 at 9:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Oh, for fuck's sake. Why are we arguing pop music with a reclusive middle-aged IT engineer?
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#99 Feb 12 2013 at 9:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hey, what's wrong with IT engineers?
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#100 Feb 12 2013 at 9:31 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:

Because I'm massively smarter than 99% of the population.
That's heavy.
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#101 Feb 12 2013 at 9:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Debalic wrote:
Oh, for fuck's sake. Why are we arguing pop music with a reclusive middle-aged IT engineer?


Apparently so. Dunno how that happened to be perfectly honest. Smiley: clown
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King Nobby wrote:
More words please
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