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#52 Nov 22 2012 at 2:38 AM Rating: Decent
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I like how quickly they made his window full screen, and then the "breaking news" was slipped in.
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#53 Nov 22 2012 at 3:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm finding it interesting how much range, accuracy and quantity hamas was able to get out of their rockets. I'm almost wondering if we've found where that massive pile of russian made man portable SAM's that went missing from Lybia ended up.

A rocket that can travel a mile in a relitivly straight line with enough of a payload to be useful at the terminal end isn't particularily hard, but it does require certain things, like access to large quantities of propellant (homemade, probably tire rubber and nitrus oxide or something similar), lightweight yet strong pipe sections of some sort for caseings and rocket bodies, and military grade explosives for charges. Possibly a simple servo + heading hold gyro guidance system too ($4 worth of parts from China on ebay) but they've got too many of them, made better than their available assembly conditions should warrant for it to be just homemade inventory.
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#54 Nov 28 2012 at 4:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
I'm finding it interesting how much range, accuracy and quantity hamas was able to get out of their rockets. I'm almost wondering if we've found where that massive pile of russian made man portable SAM's that went missing from Lybia ended up.


Linky, on the chance you hadn't heard already...

Also a little Smiley: tinfoilhat

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On the night of October 23, four Israeli fighter jets reportedly screamed across the skies over Khartoum and bombed the Yarmouk weapons factory, which belongs to Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. It didn’t take long to learn that the weapons the Israelis had allegedly targeted – weapons that one Israeli intelligence official describes as “game changers” – were bound for Hamas in the Gaza Strip. Sudan, after all, is a common point of origin for the smuggling routes that carry Iranian weapons up through Egypt, across the Sinai Peninsula, and into Hamas’ labyrinth of underground tunnels.


Quote:
At first blush, the Israeli response appeared out of character. Hamas and other terrorist groups in Gaza have fired thousands of rockets at Israel in recent years, but only elicited one full-scale response :Operation Cast Lead in late 2008 and early 2009. Since then, one rocket attack out of Gaza has earned one or two Israeli missiles in return. Sometimes, the Israelis didn’t even bother to respond at all.

From all appearances, it was alarming intelligence pointing to the existence of Fajrs in Gaza that drove the Israelis to mobilize this time, not a handful of short-range rockets. The Israelis appear to have learned that some of these “game-changer” rockets from the IRGC plant in Yarmouk had made their way into Gaza. This was a red line: The Fajr-5 rockets have powerful payloads and ranges long enough to strike Israel’s largest cities, bringing millions of civilians into the crosshairs.


Edited, Nov 28th 2012 2:42pm by someproteinguy
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#55 Nov 29 2012 at 4:55 PM Rating: Excellent
So, the UN voted for Palestinian statehood today. The US voted against & its my understanding it now has the same rights as the Vatican.
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#56 Nov 30 2012 at 11:28 AM Rating: Good
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**** ya! Palestine. I am so ashamed in my country voting no. ******* makes me sick that we can sit here in our cozy castle in north america and dictate that others do not deserve the same avenues to freedom that we poses. Absolutely pathetic. I am glad to see however that such powerful nations like Marshall Islands, Micronesia, Nauru and Palau. were also on our side voting against Palestine.

138 countries vs 9. Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Congrats Palestine, this is a large step in progress toward earning your freedom from the tyranny of Israeli persecution.
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#57 Nov 30 2012 at 11:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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rdmcandie wrote:

138 countries vs 9. Makes you wonder doesn't it.

It makes me ashamed. I do not understand why anyone would vote against it.
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#58 Nov 30 2012 at 12:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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Omegavegeta wrote:
So, the UN voted for Palestinian statehood today. The US voted against & its my understanding it now has the same rights as the Vatican.

Yeah, they're not a full-fledged state (the vote for that could be vetoed by UN Security Council nations, i.e. the US) but an "Observer State" which only required a simple majority.
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#59 Nov 30 2012 at 12:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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cidbahamut wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:

138 countries vs 9. Makes you wonder doesn't it.

It makes me ashamed. I do not understand why anyone would vote against it.

Explanation I've heard is that giving Palestine more UN recognition makes a settlement between Israel and Palestine less likely. Somehow. Perhaps because then it makes it more likely that the Palestinians will use the UN as a vehicle to negotiate the terms of their settlement, rather than just having Israel and the US brokering the deal.
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#60 Nov 30 2012 at 12:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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I caught a bit about objection to Palestine's fractured government between Gaza & the West Bank region as well but I won't pretend to be an expert until I can load up Wikipedia.
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#61 Nov 30 2012 at 12:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Makes me sick that Canada jumped on the US bandwagon on this. F'n disgusting.
#62 Nov 30 2012 at 12:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
I caught a bit about objection to Palestine's fractured government between Gaza & the West Bank region as well but I won't pretend to be an expert until I can load up Wikipedia.
Doesn't stop anyone else from being experts.
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#63 Nov 30 2012 at 12:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yodabunny wrote:
Makes me sick that Canada jumped on the US bandwagon on this. F'n disgusting.


51st state! Smiley: tinfoilhat
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#64 Nov 30 2012 at 12:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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LockeColeMA wrote:
cidbahamut wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:

138 countries vs 9. Makes you wonder doesn't it.

It makes me ashamed. I do not understand why anyone would vote against it.

Explanation I've heard is that giving Palestine more UN recognition makes a settlement between Israel and Palestine less likely. Somehow. Perhaps because then it makes it more likely that the Palestinians will use the UN as a vehicle to negotiate the terms of their settlement, rather than just having Israel and the US brokering the deal.

So the problem is that they might have a shot at getting a fair deal rather than being bent over the table by a world super-power?
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#65 Nov 30 2012 at 12:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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cidbahamut wrote:
LockeColeMA wrote:
cidbahamut wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:

138 countries vs 9. Makes you wonder doesn't it.

It makes me ashamed. I do not understand why anyone would vote against it.

Explanation I've heard is that giving Palestine more UN recognition makes a settlement between Israel and Palestine less likely. Somehow. Perhaps because then it makes it more likely that the Palestinians will use the UN as a vehicle to negotiate the terms of their settlement, rather than just having Israel and the US brokering the deal.

So the problem is that they might have a shot at getting a fair deal rather than being bent over the table by a world super-power?

I thought that was what I said? Smiley: laugh
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#66 Dec 01 2012 at 10:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Road to peace.

Glad to see Israel is all about working on that peace.
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#67 Dec 01 2012 at 11:37 AM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
Road to peace.

Glad to see Israel is all about working on that peace.

**** Israel.
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#68 Dec 01 2012 at 11:49 AM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
Road to peace.

Glad to see Israel is all about working on that peace.

In Israel's eyes, "working on that peace" was tossed when Palestine went ahead with the statehood bid rather than negotiating a permanent solution with Israel. If Palestine isn't playing the game, why should Israel pretend to do so?
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#69 Dec 01 2012 at 11:59 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
Road to peace.

Glad to see Israel is all about working on that peace.

In Israel's eyes, "working on that peace" was tossed when Palestine went ahead with the statehood bid rather than negotiating a permanent solution with Israel. If Palestine isn't playing the game, why should Israel pretend to do so?


Because two wrongs don't make a right and actions like this convert Israel from a defender of sovereignty to an aggressor. I don't imagine people would react so nonchalantly if the U.S. suddenly decided to declare a large swath of Canada connecting Alaska to Washington open for U.S. settlement.
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You guys keep tossing facts out there like they mean something.


#70 Dec 01 2012 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
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Israel stopped construction of the settlements as a precursor to arriving at mutually agreed borders and conditions for a permanent solution. Palestine has gone ahead and tried to preemptively declare sovereignty over lands still under dispute. Settling those lands with Israeli citizens is the counter to Palestine just saying "Nope, all ours. See? The UN said so."
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Because two wrongs don't make a right

One wrong doesn't make a right either but you had no issue with Palestine throwing out the previous work and going ahead with a statehood bid instead.

Edited, Dec 1st 2012 12:10pm by Jophiel
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#71 Dec 01 2012 at 12:16 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
One wrong doesn't make a right either but you had no issue with Palestine throwing out the previous work and going ahead with a statehood bid instead.


I have no problem with Palestine going through legal international channels to establish sovereignty that is denied to them only by a handful of nations whose sole reason for opposition is either political, religious, or idealogical. There's no practical reason to deny the Palenstenian state.
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#72 Dec 01 2012 at 12:23 PM Rating: Good
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That's fine so long as you understand that, by doing so, they ended the previous agreements to work with Israel and Israel shouldn't feel bound by their obligations which were based on that agreement.
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denied to them only by a handful of nations

One of which is the holder of that territory via an ill planned war against them and the conquest of the land following. Which is why a negotiated settlement between Israel & Palestine was a better idea than the land-grab Palestine apparently wants instead.


Edited, Dec 1st 2012 12:27pm by Jophiel
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#73 Dec 01 2012 at 1:05 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
Road to peace.

Glad to see Israel is all about working on that peace.

In Israel's eyes, "working on that peace" was tossed when Palestine went ahead with the statehood bid rather than negotiating a permanent solution with Israel. If Palestine isn't playing the game, why should Israel pretend to do so?


Israel has been pretending to play for over 40 years. Its always the same thing. Israel does not wish to negotiate a permanent solution, and why would they. Up until recently Israel could call the shots with pretty much impunity. Yet over the last 40 years Israel has settled more and more disputed land and refuses to return to its 1967 borders. Israel has routinely cut the people of Palestine off from the rest of the world, segregating them from the greater Arab Community and literally fencing them in behind armed guard and restricting their access to the sea.

Numerous time Israel has marched into palestine and murdered thousands, numerous times have they instigated responses. Israel has no lust for peace, they want the land they deem theirs by destiny, and continue to take it through force (or display of force) and have been for 40 years. Israel is the proud holder of the largest free air internment camps in the world. Which is rather Ironic considering the stark similarities to pre-"final solution" internment of Jews in Europe.

Thats not to say that Palestine has not shown they wish to have a diplomatic solution either, they have of course over the years thrown the first stone. But Palestine has always lacked one thing, support in the world body. Throughout history Israel has been able to use the power of the UN to dictate its position in the Middle East, with traditional allies in France, UK, and the US backing them up. Palestine now has an equal opportunity to plead its case on the world stage through its new found ability to access the powers of the UN.

I also find it humorous that the US so adamantly condemns Palestinians efforts to establish their own nation, and attain freedom from the tyrannical Oppression of their local masters in Israel. I mean **** the US was built on a social/political revolution that resulted in a War. These people are referred to in history as patriots, today we call these people terrorists, and radicals.

How hypocritical to say Palestine didn't want to play by the rules Israel demanded they follow...for illusions of peace, still trapped behind a fence, cut off from their greater community, cut off from the world.

**** Israel.
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#74 Dec 01 2012 at 1:21 PM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
How hypocritical to say Palestine didn't want to play by the rules Israel demanded they follow...for illusions of peace, still trapped behind a fence, cut off from their greater community, cut off from the world.

All Israel's fault, too Smiley: rolleyes

There is no hypocrisy. The cessation of settlements was based on an agreement to strike a final agreement. Palestine ended that agreement therefore Israel restarted their program. That this is unfortunate for Palestine is something to have been considered before they ended the agreement. For some reason you think one party should be able to make unilateral decisions about the territory without consequence. That's not reality and this is the consequence.

If you think the ability to stand in a room in New York and make speeches was worth that, then great. Because that's about what their observer state status gains them.

Edited, Dec 1st 2012 1:27pm by Jophiel
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#75 Dec 01 2012 at 1:26 PM Rating: Good
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I'd rather see them build houses than fire rockets. Even if the houses are being built with malicious intent, it's better than the alternative. It's like a large scale sit-in!


Edited, Dec 1st 2012 1:26pm by trickybeck
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#76 Dec 01 2012 at 1:50 PM Rating: Decent
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In this, as in other Palestine threads I read that the Palestinians are poor, cut off, beyond help from their neighbors, etc


OK, I don't claim to be an expert on the Middle East, but I guess I missed the part of history where Israel totaly kept every single oil-rich Arab/Muslim country in the region from pouring in massive amounts of cash for infrastructure/housing, etc, etc for the Palestinians for the past 60 years.

Hmm, must be because the Jews run all the banks, amirite?
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